England's Winter

First topic message reminder :

As per LT's original post:
New Zealand

T20 Internationals

Friday November 1st - Christchurch
Sunday November 3rd - Wellington
Tuesday November 5th - Nelson
Friday November 8th - Napier
Sunday November 10th - Auckland

Squad
Eoin Morgan (Middlesex) captain
Jonny Bairstow (Yorkshire)
Tom Banton (Somerset)
Sam Billings (Kent)
Pat Brown (Worcestershire)
Sam Curran (Surrey)
Tom Curran (Surrey)
Joe Denly (Kent)
Lewis Gregory (Somerset)
Chris Jordan (Sussex)
Saqib Mahmood (Lancashire)
Dawid Malan (Middlesex)
Matt Parkinson (Lancashire)
Adil Rashid (Yorkshire)
James Vince (Hampshire)


Tests

Wednesday November 20th - Tauranga
Thursday November 28th - Hamilton

Squad
Joe Root (Yorkshire) captain
Jofra Archer (Sussex)
Stuart Broad (Nottinghamshire)
Rory Burns (Surrey)
Jos Buttler (Lancashire)
Zak Crawley (Kent)
Sam Curran (Surrey)
Joe Denly (Kent)
Jack Leach (Somerset)
Saqib Mahmood (Lancashire)
Matthew Parkinson (Lancashire)
Ollie Pope (Surrey)
Dominic Sibley (Warwickshire)
Ben Stokes (Durham)
Chris Woakes (Warwickshire)



South Africa

Tests

Thursday 26th December - Centurion
Friday January 3rd - Cape Town
Thursday January 16th - Port Elizabeth
Friday January 24th - Johannesburg

Squad
Ill


ODI
Tuesday 4th February - Cape Town
Friday 7th February - Durban
Sunday 9th February - Johannesburg

Squad
Ill

T20 Internationals

Wednesday 12th February - East London
Friday 14th February - Durban
Sunday 16th February - Centurion


Sri Lanka

March 7th - Warm up 1, Katunayake (3 day)
March 12th - Warm up 2, Colombo (3 day)
March 19th - 1st Test, Galle
March 27th - 2nd Test, Colombo

Gooseberry wrote:Curran was barely used as a bowler in the two tests he played in Sti Lanka last time, so whilst he will almost certainly be in the squad I dont think anyone expects him or any other medium pacer to do what Anderson couldnt there. The raw pace of Wood and Archer has some chance of being effective, although it would be a huge surprise to see more than one make a side.

Talk is Archers net sessions were down on pace and hes even further back than Wood, so Woakes is a probable for the next test. Not the most inspiring or threatening of bowling attacks.

4 bowlers (5 if you count Mo) and a batsman down England will do well to get another result from the third test even if Root can get himself off the toilet.

You are right about Curran being barely used, 16 overs in 2 Tests. I wonder if Root was too busy with his 3 spinners to find out if there was reverse swing to be had. Stokes 12 overs in the 1st Test, 1 over in 2nd Test.

I hope Wood plays. He is more exciting to watch than Woakes, who has only bowled 11 overs since New Zealand.

Broad - ‘But if I miss out at Port Elizabeth for the third Test because they think it’s going to be slow and reverse and Woakesy reverses it better than me but they say “Get fit and fresh for the Wanderers because you are bowling there”, then cool.’

Broad in SA 25.15 Woakes 98.50

I guess you can depend upon one thing : If England change the bowling around on an assessment of the likely pitch conditions you can just about guarantee their assessment will turn out to be wrong.

Seriously I obviously concede you need to give due consideration to the prevailing conditions (extra spin in Sri Lanka , etc) But too often England seem to develop a theory about a pitch which leads them to make odd selections... and goes on to influence their whole plan of attack even when it clearly isn't working... In general I am in favour of seeing who is fit and who has the form on the board rather than trying to get too cute . So I am hoping they don't pick Overton

Very confused article on cricinfo where on one hand they are talking to Woods fitness ( apparently he bowled very fast yesterday) and on the other saying England are still hedging their bets on Woakes for Anderson.
Also cites an interview with Collingwood where he talked about the possibility of playing 5 seamers, but that seems to be a pu dit les theory based on it being very green on Monday, Collingwood said they'd look at the pitch closer to the game and make any decisions. The last test here was won by a spinner.
Root as suspected was just held back as a precaution.

So a bit of uncertainty about the make up of Englands bowling attack, for me a fully fit 90mph Wood would be great. But you could see why they'd consider the 5 seamers if they did have an out and out pace man who hasn't played a game since July, plus Stokes who's workload needs managing. Bess has done a job as a holding bowler but yet to see him bring any real wicket taking threat to tests ( and is really at best their third choice spinner) so if it is still looking like a seam wicket with little help for spinners you can see the logic.
But as Alfie says you can pretty much guarantee the pitch will do the opposite of what England expect, and picking two players whonhavent bowled red ball cricket in ages seems a risk. So Parkinson and Bess ronopennthe bowling. Alfie will be glad to know that Overton is the one name not cropping up at all in this!

Leach has flown home to continue his recovery in the UK.

Worryingly in the ECB statement Silverwood says; "I have no doubt he will return to full fitness in the medium-term and hopefully he will recover in time for our tour of Sri Lanka in March"

Doesn't sound promising that...

At least hes talking about returning to full fitness rather than getting over the illness. It reads to me like hes just very weak after the effects on him, that would have been multiplied by his Chrones disease, and that he needs time to get his body in shape through returning to gradual physical training rather than beating further infection. 
Hopefully makes it sound like he should, but given his long term health complications I guess his recovery and return to playing fitness is a lot more difficult than it is for the likes of Root. 

The spinners are key to Sri Lanka for sure. On a more positive not Rashid is playing in the BBL so at least hes game fit, no indications of any shoulder issues persisting. Mo hasnt played any cricket since November though, but they both should be back for the white ball stuff here and have the chance to press for test spots (if they want them)

Gooseberry wrote:On a more positive not Rashid is playing in the BBL so at least hes game fit, no indications of any shoulder issues persisting.

He is?

LondonTiger wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:On a more positive not Rashid is playing in the BBL so at least hes game fit, no indications of any shoulder issues persisting.

He is?

 You know what I saw the name Rashid on a scorecard...its the other one 

Gooseberry wrote:At least hes talking about returning to full fitness rather than getting over the illness. It reads to me like hes just very weak after the effects on him, that would have been multiplied by his Chrones disease, and that he needs time to get his body in shape through returning to gradual physical training rather than beating further infection. 
Hopefully makes it sound like he should, but given his long term health complications I guess his recovery and return to playing fitness is a lot more difficult than it is for the likes of Root. 

The spinners are key to Sri Lanka for sure. On a more positive not Rashid is playing in the BBL so at least hes game fit, no indications of any shoulder issues persisting. Mo hasnt played any cricket since November though, but they both should be back for the white ball stuff here and have the chance to press for test spots (if they want them)

Guardian
Silverwood will be especially anxious about Leach’s fitness for that Sri Lankan tour. Leach has looked likely to be the only survivor of the trio of spinners from the successful series of 14 months ago since both Adil Rashid and Moeen Ali are likely to be unavailable this time.

Feel really sorry for Leach. Guardian reporting he has Sepsis in NZ - which is horrific, and then gastroenteritis and flu in SA. Which is a horrible combo with his Crohn's. Just get right Jack! As being in SL in that heat when you aren't recovered fully would be horrible.

Not sure who the next SLA off the ranks would be?! Although, the pitches were a lot more seam friendly when NZ were over there last year than when England were... So might not be a three spinner team needed.

If it was Sepsis he's lucky to be alive especially having Crohn's, not sure he's got a long term future as a touring member of the England team.

Sepsis, that really is bad and he is best away from tours at the moment, get right for the start of the County season. I'd imagine the next SLA in waiting has to be Liam Dawson. Think we will see England struggle in Sri Lanka this time, as the form and excellence of Leach, Moeen and Rashid was key to the win last Winter. This time it could be Dawson, Bess and Parkinson, not quite as good!

Crumbs he really has had rotten luck, I guess once your immune system is down all this just piles up. Hes had bad luck with injuries rob him of caps back when he first got in the side too. Very sad for a guy who gave his all when he was able to play.

Noises from SA suggest Mark Wood may play. Bit Lot of a risk, but Archer apparently not yet at full whack in the net sessions and Woakes not looking threatening.

LondonTiger wrote:Noises from SA suggest Mark Wood may play. Bit Lot of a risk, but Archer apparently not yet at full whack in the net sessions and Woakes not looking threatening.

The annual Mark Wood test match!

By all accounts he has been bowling rockets in the nets, and like you say Archer apparently not hitting full pace yet. He should be able to last one game...(he says trembling with fear)

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:Noises from SA suggest Mark Wood may play. Bit Lot of a risk, but Archer apparently not yet at full whack in the net sessions and Woakes not looking threatening.

The annual Mark Wood test match!

By all accounts he has been bowling rockets in the nets, and like you say Archer apparently not hitting full pace yet. He should be able to last one game...(he says trembling with fear)

If he can replicate his performance from his last test I will be happy.

Stokes deservedly wins ICC player of the year while the sublime Cummins won the test award. Sharma named one day player of the year but when it really mattered he failed.

England win the toss and decide to bat first again.

Wood in for Anderson. Onwards.

Seems Faf is getting a bit of stick for getting less runs than Bavuma did and not being black. I dont see his place as being under immediate threat by any stretch when SA are struggling for form and quality batsmen in all positions (sound familiar?) but its additional stress for him and the team management that wont exactly help. SA are vulnerable and the way thing are shaping up this is Englands best home for a series win this winter.

Hype machine on Wood is in full flow, as is his bowling apparently. Back to his best in the nets by all accounts which we have so rarely seen,  despite him talking down his own chances of being ready a few days ago.

Stokes, well he was certainly the headliner of the year so far as magic moments go across all formats (but then not many players will have played as many games as him and the latest one was in this year), so not a great surprise. His overall career stats hide the impact he has on games. Had a quick glance at Cummins' record and what really stands out is his consistency, 18 innings in a row with a wicket (and all but one were two wickets or more) and I assume the leading wicket taker in world cricket by a margin...the anti Stokes in that sense. Other thing that stands out ...all but 7 of his 57 career innings have been played in Aus, SA or England which youd think might explain how hes averaging 21, except his record in Asia is almost as good. The death of fast bowling was greatly exaggerated.

Duty281 wrote:England win the toss and decide to bat first again.

50/50 call though right

Gooseberry wrote:

Duty281 wrote:England win the toss and decide to bat first again.

50/50 call though right

Yes. Heads or tails I believe

Paterson, not Rabada, opening the bowling for SA

Suggestions that the pitch is a bit on the slow side?

Slow pitch so you want your genuine pace bowler on with the new ball to try and extract anything he can.

Maybe they felt Paterson would make Sibley play more by bowling nearer the stumps than Rabada does? Also he will get more reverse with the older ball. But from what I can follow England look pretty comfortable ignoring the new ball and boring Boycott to death.

Root get a bit of - perhaps justified ? - criticism as a captain. But you can't deny he's a lucky beggar when it comes to winning the toss.

Shame he then sometimes wastes it with the wrong decision

But no messing about here : batting first on what looks like a road.
Just hope England have learnt from the mistakes in that first Test in NZ where they seemingly lost interest about when they passed three hundred...they ought to make this a big score.

Why the devil didn't Rabada take the new ball ?

Lifeless old wicket. England need 400+, that rarest of things, and pile scoreboard pressure on the hosts.

Seemed daft that Rabada -averages 17 on this ground in tests - was ignored for the new ball.

This pitch really is slow... Reckon the bowlers who haven't been selected for this match might be grateful.
Might be reverse later I guess. But not sure it is going to be particularly easy for any type of bowler to get results.

If it weren't for the fact that both these teams have very questionable batting lineups I'd be tempted to bet on the draw already...

This is the type of pitch where Stokes is invaluable; Broad and Curran however are going to be in for a long game.

Mark Wood is 100% going to be broken for another 10 months by this pitch

Pitches like this are not good for test cricket, nothing in it for the bowlers and so slow it makes batting a grind.

Yes not exhilarating viewing as fifty from 22 overs attests...

These two are playing as they should : nothing silly (although Crawley has shown a bit too much of a desire to play cross bat shots in the direction of mid on...got away with it so far)

SA seem to be sitting in waiting for the ball to start reversing...or England to lose patience.

Apart from the effect on this match , this flat pitch is giving these two young batsmen an opportunity to enhance their reputations. The flip side is that it doesn't really show whether or not they can do a job on a livelier surface : perhaps the Wanderers will do that ...

Spin for Maharaj ? Interesting.

It’s like one of those dead tracks from the UAE or India. Just have to hope some deterioration happens at some point otherwise this could be an extremely dull game. Expect Bess and Maharaj to get through plenty of overs (and Denly come to think of it).

I obviously understand the concerns being voiced here about the pitch but we need to be patient and see how it develops. Much might happen yet.

Meanwhile, a sensible and effective start from Crawley and Sibley. Important England build substantially over the next day and a half / two days on the patience displayed so far.

I've no doubt that du Plessis would have been heralded as a genius if Paterson had taken a wicket in his opening spell but surely experience and the odds greatly favoured the new ball going to Rabada. Alfie has sometimes and rightly criticised Root for being too funky with his bowlers - this seemed Faf's turn!

As for Wood - if he's fit enough to be on the tour and by all accounts bowling well and on fire in the nets, I guess he's fit and suitable for inclusion here. However, never mind the track, I still worry he'll do himself an injury doing up his bootlaces!

Whilst moaning about the pitch great stand from Crawley and Sibley...how many times have we seen england fold on dead pitches in the last few years. Genuine positive steps for our top 3 despite this not even being the first choice pairing.

Poor, disappointing dismissal. Fell right into the trap.

Sorry!

Missed the early post-lunch play...but I see SA have come back into it : wicket was a bit of a give away ? (Yet to see a replay)

Scoring seems to have ground to a halt. Good bowling or lack of urgency from the bats ? I get the need to consolidate but you need to show a bit of intent too. A fraction over two per over sounds positively 1950's

alfie wrote:Missed the early post-lunch play...but I see SA have come back into it : wicket was a bit of a give away ? (Yet to see a replay)

Scoring seems to have ground to a halt. Good bowling or lack of urgency from the bats ?  I get the need to consolidate but you need to show a bit of intent too. A fraction over two per over sounds positively 1950's  

Bit of both to these pair of eyes Alfie - Maharaj is bowling alright, but not to extent he should be going at an economy just over 1 run per over!

Lack of urgency is working for england. Denlys time at the wicket and runs scored have improved massively since he started playing like this. Stoke can hit a 50 ball hundred in the second innings if we are struggling for time.
I'd rather England weren't 100 4 at lunch than they would've been under bayliss

Thanks , Olly. Yes he is achieving a remarkable economy rate ! I get the impression Crawley really wants to get after him but isn't too confident - he's made a couple of false moves and got away with it but is probably consciously reining in his instincts now...

Denly is just very patient by nature.

Obviously I don't want to see a wicket ; but I am sure Root would have the score ticking over with his "busy" style. Guess if these two stay in there will be scope to push things along after tea against weary bowlers...

Good catch ! Van der Dussen better at leg gully than slip !

SA plan has paid off. Crawley will be disappointed to fall for 44 but he is showing some good signs

Now : 103/2 and another wicket would see the home team on top...interesting patch to come.

Fair play to South Africa - they’ve got some clearly defined plans and are bowling persistently to them. Not easy to score quickly on such a slow pitch.

Root nearly top edging a sweep to the fielder, very ill advised.

Game right in the balance. England might make 400 but it’ll take them until Saturday!

Scratchy old start for Root ! Top edged sweep and now an edged boundary off Nortje...

Stroke play difficult it seems ...pitch just too slow.

Is going to be a Test of Patience ...for all of the players ; and us , I suspect.

Is there a half tracker from Maharaj that Denly won't just hit straight to extra cover?

The sparingly used Philander back on...

As he's conceded just 1.5 per over you'd expect more pressure on the scoring rate now. Really trying the England bats' patience. Root will still look to score though.

Hope England don’t try to force the pace in the final session and collapse in an unseemly heap. Crucial they stay the course and wear down the wicket and wear down the opposition bowlers.

It's a good foundation set by Crawley and Sibley but they do need to put the bad balls away still.

Rabada a bit over-excited after tea...releasing the pressure on Denly with a couple of rank long hops that the batsman gratefully puts away to the fence...

Denly nearly doubles his score in a couple of overs ...but is he gone here ?

Yes...lbw on drs call !

Three bats got in ...none gone on.

Joe Denly getting a start, then getting out, is it?

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Is there a half tracker from Maharaj that Denly won't just hit straight to extra cover?

Denly against Maharaj - 3 runs from 62 balls.

Really not good