SILLY SEASON TRANSFER RUMOURS 20/21

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mikey_dragon wrote:

y ddraig goch wrote:Jac Morgan is leaving the Scarlets for the Ospreys to go and learn his trade off Tipuric. Big loss for the Scarlets but makes sense with Dan Davies, Josh Macelod, and James Davies still on the books. Jac looks like a future Welsh international so it might be a good move for Wales in the long run with the Ospreys finally starting to live up to their potential with a return to the top level of Europe given the players on their books.

Davis and Davies aren’t that good, McCleod is very good but has awful luck with injuries lately. Scarlets’ supporters can’t see why Jac is being let go. Boyde was another good 7 that they let go.

Ospreys are a long way off their potential if last night is anything to go by.

He isn't 'being let go', he's apparently an Ospreys fan and wants to leave despite the offer on the table.
Considering the conditions, the young players in key positions, and the momentum killing refereeing performance (for both sides), Ospreys came out of it with a victory which is what they needed to help secure champions cup rugby next season.
I think it would be better to judge them as of next season when, if all the murmurs are to be believed, we will have a higher proportion of games played with full strength sides.

I just don't see why Ford wants to move. Leicester are on the up, they're playing great rugby infront of a full house and he is loved. I don't know if he's going to get any of that at Sale.

His dad must have massive pull over him, or he really wants to live in Manchester.

Phil wrote:I just don't see why Ford wants to move. Leicester are on the up, they're playing great rugby infront of a full house and he is loved. I don't know if he's going to get any of that at Sale.

His dad must have massive pull over him, or he really wants to live in Manchester.

His home town is apparently 24 miles away and he owns a cafe there next door to which his girlfriend is opening a restaurant. Sanderson has already suggested the club will help with the restaurant refurbishment which might interest the salary cap auditors though Sanderson doesn't half talk some rubbish.

The security of a three year deal (cool £1.6m) plus the ability to focus on those business opportunities and be closer to family all a draw for him particularly if he wants to start a family (maybe). I don't think rugby was the sole focus in the decision.

A lot is made about his dad but at Bath his dad was forced out the club by senior players. If you were George would you want to play under a captain that had fairly publicly stabbed your dad in the back professionally? I'll review that view of his dad rocks up at Sale shortly.

That's all fair points I guess Sam. I wonder how his career will go now, will we look back on this in years to come and think what might have been? With all respect to Sale, Ford's now unlikely to be competing in as many finals as he may have with Tigers in the future.

On a side note I've never liked Sanderson, and the more I hear and see of him the less I think of him. Just comes across as an bumhole tbh. I'm sure he's a good coach but his personality is like pantomime villain at times.

It's too early to say who will win anything this season, Quins didn't show up until January last season, finished fourth a distance off the top yet dominated the playoffs.

Sale have a big and mobile pack, if they keep it together and keep their best players fit around the squad there's a lot going for them. Particularly now Ford is at the helm. Keep Faff out of the hands of whichever Japanese club is fishing around and that's quite the combination.

Whether Tigers will win anything it's far to early to contemplate. We've seen a HUGE improvement under Borthwick but how we comeback from the first loss this season will tell us possibly more than the unbeaten start and there will be a loss sooner or later. Could well be the next game Vs Quins. I hope Ford opting to leave isn't a destabilising factor because that will scupper silverware chances this season. I'm sure Borthwick will push improvements consistently but the recruitment team will need to pull another rabbit out the hat as I'm not convinced a combination of Burns/Lancaster/Hegarty is a flyhalf set that will deliver a title. Burns is an ideal back up 10, Hegarty a solid option outside of Steward at the back who can be a secondary playmaker or drop in at 10. Lancaster not sure if he'll be more of a 10 or a 12 yet. At least all three are reliable off the tee.

Steve Diamond is off to Worcester on a consultancy style role to advise on recruitment and review all things rugby by the sounds of it. Worcester spend plenty apparently and never seem to do that well so looks a good move.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Steve Diamond is off to Worcester on a consultancy style role to advise on recruitment and review all things rugby by the sounds of it. Worcester spend plenty apparently and never seem to do that well so looks a good move.

Agreed. Diamond is an underrated DOR in my view. Worcester look like they need some direction and he will help provide that. He was always good at developing the young talent at Sale and bringing in some additional talent to supplement it.

Joel Kpoku to Lyon. For playing time. Good for him.

Is that a loan move 7.5?
Certainly looked like a great U20s prospect - but must be struggling for gametime at Sarries as you said.

Lets hope he isn't another young talent like Mercer that will get lost from the English game.

No Kpoku has signed out there for a couple of years I think. Hasn't kicked on at Sarries so might make sense to go and get some game time and experience elsewhere. He's young enough to come back post world cup and stake a claim. He's still only 22.

Euan Ashman to Glasgow on loan for the rest of the season.

Good move for both, Sale not giving him any game time atm and he needs to kick on now he has been capped. Glasgow also a bit light in the hooker stakes and Turner/Brown are no strangers to the physio table.

BigGee wrote:Euan Ashman to Glasgow on loan for the rest of the season.

Good move for both, Sale not giving him any game time atm and he needs to kick on now he has been capped. Glasgow also a bit light in the hooker stakes and Turner/Brown are no strangers to the physio table.

Makes a lot of sense with Sale having three senior hookers all fit and available. If it gets him game time before next season when Sale are likely to offload their current first choice (cost saving) and that will give Ashman more opportunities.

If Glasgow have a need then he's a good injury cover loan.

As people have said Ford is an interesting one.

Sale have been a bit poor but not terrible.  Part of that might be the loss of Faf.   Having a 9/10 combo of Faf/Ford is up their with the best in Europe which is probably Toulouse.

I would wonder without Ford who seems to run the Tigers show will they the the great team they are now.  We saw the change in standards in the Past at Tigers when he was missing but that was pre coaching changes.

I would also feel that like most professional players Ford would look at Sale who are nearly there and that he is the person to get them there.

It would be easy to assume Smith is in the England squad because he lead Quinns to the title.  If (a big if) Ford can win with Tigers and Sale and knows Faf inside out how can Jones leave him out of the WC especial as Quinns are built on running rugby while Tigers and Sale are much better suited to the England/Jones game plan and is working with Tullagi.

If Faff stays at Sale then they'll have excellent starting half backs with international experience and then a set of young up and coming halfbacks with bags of potential in Quirke and Wilkinson, Quirke's already capped.

What Tigers do is a bit uncertain. There's lot of rumours surrounding the negotiations with Ford and over possible replacements. Tigers do have other options in the squad but none near Ford's quality. Burns and Hegarty are good journeymen with Burns offering more flair and Hegarty more stability. Young Lancaster has a bit about him but could end up as a creative secondary playmaker at 12 as much as he could be the next flyhalf so signing another option is likely.

Apparently Scott Cummings was listed in the Scotland vs Japan programme as a Sarries player. Typo? Or them letting something slip that is yet to be announced?

Kpoku out and Cummings in?

No chance it would work in terms of cap space for cap space. Cummings is a really strong international lock these days. If they are struggling to quite find room for Kruis I could see Cummings coming in to strengthen the pack. Sarries will surely qualify for Champions Cup next season so will need a stronger lock than Swinson.

If Vunipola x 2 left then they will have a ton of cap space to play with.

With Kpoku I think he's just stalled a bit hence the lack of game time. It happens with naturally massive players like Kpoku sometimes when adjusting to playing against other gigantic forwards in senior rugby. He's got all the time to improve as a player in France and come back though.

Didn't Kpoku re-sign at a time he was highly rated and Saints were allegedly very keen on signing him? Might have inflated his earnings and explain why Sarries were not fussed about letting him go to Lyon mid season.

Denny Solomona has left Sale with immediate effect. Apparently he's going to pursue an opportunity in the SH.

formerly known as Sam wrote:Denny Solomona has left Sale with immediate effect. Apparently he's going to pursue an opportunity in the SH.

Quick impact of the new eligibility rules? Such a good finisher; we'll always have Argentina.

No 7&1/2 wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:Denny Solomona has left Sale with immediate effect. Apparently he's going to pursue an opportunity in the SH.

Quick impact of the new eligibility rules? Such a good finisher; we'll always have Argentina.

Think more that he's out the team at the minute and was leaving at the end of the season anyway. Something has come up down in the SH so the club have let him go early. Might also free up some cap for them to maybe sign a bit of injury cover if they need it.

Will Solomona stay in rugby union or go to the NRL?

I think Solomona might go back to league. His Sale contract was signed when he was around the England squad with a lot of hype and Premiership wage inflation was getting out of control. Re-signing now his value would be lower but his finishing could entice a very good wage in the NRL.

An interesting player with the new eligibility rules is Lozowski. He was Italy qualified through parents or grandparents before playing for England. Crowley will surely be in touch there. 10.Garbisi 12.Canna 13.Lozowski would be a really strong midfield.

There's the new Super Rugby Team to represent Samoa isn't there? I'd assume he'd head there with the hope to then represent Samoa on international level.

Re Lozowski, yes that would be a very creative midfield but I doubt Lozowski would go for that because he'd surely know that would limit his potential earnings in the Prem with the RFU pushing for ever greater EQ favouring rules. Having an international quality player who's not getting selected but qualifies his club for the RFU bonus is worth more than an Italian international. Unless of course Italy are going to pay well in match fees.

Liam Williams to Blues is a rumour doing the rounds on WalesOnline. A fullback replacement for the retiring Hallam Amos. Would be a real surprise as LW is a West Wales Scarlet through and through.

The Oracle wrote:Liam Williams to Blues is a rumour doing the rounds on WalesOnline.  A fullback replacement for the retiring Hallam Amos.  Would be a real surprise as LW is a West Wales Scarlet through and through.

Nice to see Dai knows how to sign other players than back row forwards. Thought the rate he is going he was planning to play 15 back row forwards for most of the season. Signing both Young and Faletau seem like weird signings for them. They already had Navidi, Jenkins and Botham at openside. Given currently I would imagine Basham will continue to start for Wales if fit, I'm not entirely sure how all these opensides will get enough game time to get any form going.

Faletau has been another one. Ratti is probably the second best 8 in Wales at the moment (behind Morgan). Not exactly why you would prioritize Faletau as a signing. They already have quality on the books with Lewis-Hughes, Turnbull & Lawrence covering Ratti at 6 and 8. No doubt Faletau will take valuable development minutes from one of those guys. I can only think Cardiff must be losing some back rows this summer or this transfers make little sense.

Some times less is more Dai.....

Welshmushroom wrote:

The Oracle wrote:Liam Williams to Blues is a rumour doing the rounds on WalesOnline.  A fullback replacement for the retiring Hallam Amos.  Would be a real surprise as LW is a West Wales Scarlet through and through.

Nice to see Dai knows how to sign other players than back row forwards.  Thought the rate he is going he was planning to play 15 back row forwards for most of the season.  Signing both Young and Faletau seem like weird signings for them.  They already had Navidi, Jenkins and Botham at openside.  Given currently I would imagine Basham will continue to start for Wales if fit, I'm not entirely sure how all these opensides will get enough game time to get any form going.  

Faletau has been another one.  Ratti is probably the second best 8 in Wales at the moment (behind Morgan).  Not exactly why you would prioritize Faletau as a signing.  They already have quality on the books with Lewis-Hughes, Turnbull & Lawrence covering Ratti at 6 and 8.  No doubt Faletau will take valuable development minutes from one of those guys.  I can only think Cardiff must be losing some back rows this summer or this transfers make little sense.

Some times less is more Dai.....

Other players than backs and back-row is what Dai needs to sign, IE front 5. Still not sure why Turnbull is rated so highly there, but if push comes to shove, he should be one of the ones to move on. Who's Morgan? I can only think of Jac and he's a 7 (again).

Full-back is somewhere I think Cardiff were covered already, they could have put Adams there, if not then they could probably find someone cheap and more availe to play there. Lee-lo is looking old, they need to find a decent replacement for him. All the other options look quite average.

Pollard rumoured to have signed on the dotted line at Tigers. Borthwick has given him a presentation on the club's vision for development going forward. Salary an alleged £600k less than Ford was on though if you believe the rumours slightly more than he's accepted up in Sale. 

There's also been a rumour that Tigers initially tried to get Ford to come down to a lower salary which apparently didn't go down well. Sale came in much closer to what Ford wanted and had sold him on the project so that by the time his agent got Tigers to raise their bid to more than Sale it was too late and he and his girlfriend had already bought into the idea of heading home. Which sounds a particularly dumb move by the Tigers board/negotiating team.

Am I reading that right?!  Pollard will be on 600k LESS than Ford?!  What???

Was Ford on close to a million??? Or have they got Pollard to sign up for (relative) peanuts?!

Hang on. Do you mean Pollard’s salary is 600k which is less than Ford was on? Probably makes more sense!

The Oracle wrote:Am I reading that right?!  Pollard will be on 600k LESS than Ford?!  What???

Was Ford on close to a million???  Or have they got Pollard to sign up for (relative) peanuts?!

Sorry bad grammar on my part. Ford was rumoured to be on £650k. I missed a comma out there.

No worries! I genuinely read it as Pollard being on 600k less and it got me doing all sorts of weird and wonderful calculations in my head! Thought Tigers had managed to get Pollard on the cheap!

Pollard is an excellent fly half with the ability to mix up his game, I don't think Tigers would be able to get anyone better tbh (on paper anyway). I dare say, he may even offer a bit more than Ford in terms of attacking play.

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Pollard is an excellent fly half with the ability to mix up his game, I don't think Tigers would be able to get anyone better tbh (on paper anyway). I dare say, he may even offer a bit more than Ford in terms of attacking play.

See that's the only area that concerns me in regards to Pollard over Ford. Ford has had us ticking along nicely this season, scoring tries and directing our attack often setting up multiple phases to pull defences open. His performance Vs Saints is genuinely one of the best I've seen from a flyhalf in the Prem.

Pollard will bring some added physicality, a bigger boot and we'll have someone who can match Ford's excellent game management. However, SA generally sub Pollard for the mercurial Jantjies when they want to chase a game and at Montpellier he has tended to play with a secondary playmaker at 13 which he won't get at Tigers. The Tigers attack puts a lot onto the shoulders of the flyhalf so one way or the other he'll be answering the questions over his attacking skills.

The Oracle wrote:No worries!  I genuinely read it as Pollard being on 600k less and it got me doing all sorts of weird and wonderful calculations in my head!  Thought Tigers had managed to get Pollard on the cheap!

No it's only Sarries that can get top-class players on the cheap

JP du Preez confirmed from Sale to Glasgow for next season.

A good signing for the Warriors.

BigGee wrote:JP du Preez confirmed from Sale to Glasgow for next season.

A good signing for the Warriors.

A big signing, pun intended. If Glasgow can keep him fit and on the pitch he'll be a useful addition. Big lad that's surprisingly mobile for his size, don't expect many 80 minute performances.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Pollard is an excellent fly half with the ability to mix up his game, I don't think Tigers would be able to get anyone better tbh (on paper anyway). I dare say, he may even offer a bit more than Ford in terms of attacking play.

See that's the only area that concerns me in regards to Pollard over Ford. Ford has had us ticking along nicely this season, scoring tries and directing our attack often setting up multiple phases to pull defences open. His performance Vs Saints is genuinely one of the best I've seen from a flyhalf in the Prem.

Pollard will bring some added physicality, a bigger boot and we'll have someone who can match Ford's excellent game management. However, SA generally sub Pollard for the mercurial Jantjies when they want to chase a game and at Montpellier he has tended to play with a secondary playmaker at 13 which he won't get at Tigers. The Tigers attack puts a lot onto the shoulders of the flyhalf so one way or the other he'll be answering the questions over his attacking skills.

Something to bear in mind is Pollard has managed 16 appearances for Montpellier over the last 2 and a bit seasons (with a torn ACL in there). Leicester will lose him over the Rugby Championship as well so will need to have a good couple of back-ups to manage his game time.

Hazel Sapling wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Pollard is an excellent fly half with the ability to mix up his game, I don't think Tigers would be able to get anyone better tbh (on paper anyway). I dare say, he may even offer a bit more than Ford in terms of attacking play.

See that's the only area that concerns me in regards to Pollard over Ford. Ford has had us ticking along nicely this season, scoring tries and directing our attack often setting up multiple phases to pull defences open. His performance Vs Saints is genuinely one of the best I've seen from a flyhalf in the Prem.

Pollard will bring some added physicality, a bigger boot and we'll have someone who can match Ford's excellent game management. However, SA generally sub Pollard for the mercurial Jantjies when they want to chase a game and at Montpellier he has tended to play with a secondary playmaker at 13 which he won't get at Tigers. The Tigers attack puts a lot onto the shoulders of the flyhalf so one way or the other he'll be answering the questions over his attacking skills.

Something to bear in mind is Pollard has managed 16 appearances for Montpellier over the last 2 and a bit seasons (with a torn ACL in there). Leicester will lose him over the Rugby Championship as well so will need to have a good couple of back-ups to manage his game time.

Well Tigers have got three passable backups. The injury history has got to be a big concern though Tigers do have the S&C guru who was a factor in SA winning the world cup working with them so he must know how to get Pollard in the best physical shape and believe he can keep him there otherwise he would be advising Tigers to look elsewhere.

Ford could be great value if he continues to be left out of England squads, do Prem matches go on during the 6N?

chris_501 wrote:Ford could be great value if he continues to be left out of England squads, do Prem matches go on during the 6N?

Partly. The Prem Cup takes away some of that time but that is also a bonus because then you have a key player getting a couple of weeks rest during each set of international windows. Certainly the deal for Ford will be better value for money if he isn't selected. I suspect he'll be back in for the 6N though given Farrell's injury so might play his way back into the squad.

Putting aside the injury issue for the moment, even if Pollard misses club games during the AIs, he will be available for what is arguably the more important part of the season, the winter/spring run in to the playoffs.  Loosely speaking, he would be available for the second half of the season.  

However, if we add in the injury risk which, again loosely speaking, increases with each injury, it adds risk to the signing.  

For me, however, I would be glad to see him in the Premiership.  Nothing helps the gate everywhere like a world class out half.

Strong SA contingent now at Tigers, all of them top players too.

Pollard is off to Leicester. Best kept secret that one.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Pollard is off to Leicester. Best kept secret that one.

I'm in shock, never saw that one coming.

The most high profile flyhalf available is a bit of a statement signing. Interesting that he's said in his welcome interview that he had bigger offers on the table, I wasn't expecting him to openly admit that.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Pollard is off to Leicester. Best kept secret that one.

I'm in shock, never saw that one coming.

The most high profile flyhalf available is a bit of a statement signing. Interesting that he's said in his welcome interview that he had bigger offers on the table, I wasn't expecting him to openly admit that.

I wonder what made the difference. Playing alongside Lenny?

The ultimate test of his quality.

If you offered me Ford or Pollard I would choose Ford any day. They could have signed a worse replacement though.


I presume Pollard took a lower offer so he could continue playing with the Boks.

The rumours were the bigger deal was in Japan and he may have wanted to remain in Europe.

Ford in his current form is quite frankly a match for any 10 in world rugby. Pollard is going to have to arrive in good form because he'll be arriving late and expectations will be high. Freddie Burns will no doubt be wanting to use the delayed arrival to try and show what he can do. If Pollard isn't up for it he'll find it tough. It's a good chance for him to show there's more to his game than defence and kicking.

Bath sign Tom Prydie on a short term deal and Jordan Venter from Edinburgh on a deal to the end of next season.

Tom Prydie was let go from Scarlets last month. Guess he will help with the wing positions.

Jordan Venter was an 18 year old centre signed from SA schoolboy rugby at the end of last season and was seen as having the talent for a senior contract. With Edinburgh having a fair few decent centres and a change from Cockerill to Blair, chances have not been available. Disappointed to see him go so soon as he could turn into a good player fairly quickly.