Euro 2020 Thread (11th June-11th July)

[Duty281]

First topic message reminder :

Starts in under a week. Might be a fun summer of football to lift the gloom of the previous 12 months.

Groups:

Full Schedule:

Outright Odds:

Portugal to defend their title? France to go one better? Germany return to prominence? Belgium finally get it right? England bring football home? Or will Scotland shock the world?

[Soul Requiem]

Mount and Chilwell confirmed as unavailable for today's game. Will be able to come back in the last 16 if England finish first.

I don't quite understand how Mount and Chilwell are classed as close contacts when none of Gilmours team mates are?

[Duty281]

Mount and Chilwell confirmed as unavailable for today's game. Will be able to come back in the last 16 if England finish first.

I don't quite understand how Mount and Chilwell are classed as close contacts when none of Gilmours team mates are?

Yeah, it's a mystery to me as well.

[Duty281]

Sounds like England's team tonight is going to have a few changes:

Pickford; Walker, Stones, Maguire, Shaw; Rice, Phillips; Sterling, Grealish, Foden/Saka; Kane.

Saka starting ahead of Sancho would be disappointing, in my opinion. Don't really see the sense in making another change at full-back. Lot of pressure on Grealish tonight - like many a benched player his ability has been arguably inflated while the starting XI toiled.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/euro-2021/2021/06/22/jack-grealish-set-start-england-against-czech-republic/

[Samo]

Gilmour was excellent against England, however we played well enough against the Czechs without him (despite the result). Im hoping a bit of confidence infront of a home crowd will provide the boost needed. Can still finish 2nd on goal difference if we win and England lose.

All I wanted from this tournament was for Scotland to keep it competitive and play good football. We've managed both of those. As long as we dont get absolutely guffed tonight the fans will be happy and the team can hold their heads high.

[GSC]

England self reported Mount and Chilwell, the inference is that Scotland aren't so they have a full squad available.

[Guest]

Sounds like England's team tonight is going to have a few changes:

Pickford; Walker, Stones, Maguire, Shaw; Rice, Phillips; Sterling, Grealish, Foden/Saka; Kane.

Persisting with Rice & Phillips. Mind-boggling.

We’ve already qualified, just loosen the reigns and play some attacking football.

[BamBam]

Henderson and Rashford are apparently starting

[Guest]

——————-Kane—————
-Rashford—-Grealish—-Foden
—-Henderson—Bellingham—-

What I’m hoping

[Galted]

Shaw Rice Phillips will get a few double takes.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Gilmour was excellent against England, however we played well enough against the Czechs without him (despite the result).  Im hoping a bit of confidence infront of a home crowd will provide the boost needed.  Can still finish 2nd on goal difference if we win and England lose.

All I wanted from this tournament was for Scotland to keep it competitive and play good football. We've managed both of those.  As long as we dont get absolutely guffed tonight the fans will be happy and the team can hold their heads high.

I did find it absurd that the BBC were describing him as a 'key player' this morning. Can someone who's only just made his first start for his country be considered a key player?

[Samo]

Gilmour was excellent against England, however we played well enough against the Czechs without him (despite the result).  Im hoping a bit of confidence infront of a home crowd will provide the boost needed.  Can still finish 2nd on goal difference if we win and England lose.

All I wanted from this tournament was for Scotland to keep it competitive and play good football. We've managed both of those.  As long as we dont get absolutely guffed tonight the fans will be happy and the team can hold their heads high.

I did find it absurd that the BBC were describing him as a 'key player' this morning. Can someone who's only just made his first start for his country be considered a key player?

Its an obscene amount of pressure to put on a 20 year old. No doubt he’ll be a key player some day but not right now.

[Duty281]

Pickford; Walker, Stones, Maguire, Shaw; Rice, Phillips; Sterling, Grealish, Foden/Saka; Kane.

Team news is as leaked earlier, with Saka getting the nod over Foden (who isn't even on the bench). Hope to see:

1) Greater movement and interplay between the attacking four.
2) More overlapping runs from the full-backs.
3) Kane to score and ignite his tournament (hopefully).
4) Southgate not to use pre-planned substitutions, and actually make changes based on what is happening.
5) England to win after a confident front-foot display (haha).

The path to the final is easier if England top the group than finish second, so an England win is crucial. Czechs have been decent so far, Schick is the joint top-scorer at the Euros, and Jankto has looked a quality attacker in the previous two games.

[Guest]

Confirmed : Pickford, Walker, Stones, Maguire, Shaw, Rice, Phillips, Grealish, Sterling, Kane, Saka.

Still not happy with Rice & Phillips together. Not convinced Saka will do much. Foden dropped because of being on a yellow

[Samo]

Nice of Grant Hanley to let Harry Kane out of his back pocket to play tonight.

[Guest]

England 1-0 Czech - Sterling
Croatia 1-0 Scotland - Vlasic

[Samo]

Scotland the better team up until the goal which rattled them. Still showing some good play but definitely lost some composure. Need to calm down and get their heads back in it.

[Samo]

Calum McGregor evens things for Scotland!

[Guest]

England started brightly, but as the half progressed, we reverted back to how we performed in the first couple of games. Czech’s are relatively poor, and really only a threat from set-pieces.

Still don’t understand the need for Rice & Phillips. They offer absolutely nothing.

[GSC]

Much better when England play at tempo, and Grealish/Saka providing direct running.

[alfie]

Well I for one enjoyed watching that half. Plenty of action both ends of the pitch. A good goal - Sterling again. Kane looking sharper. Some lively stuff from Grealish and Saka taking their opportunities...what's not to like ?

I just hope England do not go off the boil after half time as that is something they quite often seem to do. Will be interesting to see what substitutions are made as the game goes on.

[Duty281]

Better from England in attack. Saka justifying his selection with the pace and running he showed, Grealish exhibiting why he should have started v Croatia with brilliant close control and directness, and Sterling making numerous clever runs in behind. Kane's showed a couple of nice touches, but he fluffed the shot around 25mins that he would have usually buried and is looking (again) a bit lethargic. Also like seeing that Shaw and Walker are providing more support to the attackers.

Three main problems:

1) Defence still far too flimsy, struggling to clear simple crosses and unable to shut down dangerous midfielders. Rice and Phillips are mostly useless off-the-ball. Henderson needs to come back in for Rice ASAP.
2) Reluctance to counter. England have the players to launch brilliant counters, it's just they choose not to, with Pickford taking an age to release the ball.
3) Attacking set-pieces...they always seem to end up back at the feet of Pickford.

Overall it's a lot better than the rubbish served up v Scotland.

[Guest]

Rice and Phillips are mostly useless off-the-ball. Henderson needs to come back in for Rice ASAP

We just don’t have a good enough CM, whichever combination is used. Second half gone flat, and the game drifting.

[Samo]

Modric restores Croatias lead with an excellent finish.

[Guest]

England need resuscitating. Absolutely gone to sleep. The step up in opposition for England in the last 16 is going to be huge at this rate.

[Samo]

Peresic increases the Croatia lead, Scotland surely dead and buried now.

[Guest]

Nothing short of abysmal that second half performance.

[Luke]

Other than the few moments in the first half when we moved the ball with pace. This has been a dull game, neither side look lime they can progress past the next rd without massive improvement. 

Croatia winning 3-1, means they are 2nd in the group at the moment.

[Duty281]

Yep, agree that whichever CM combo is used won't be great, but Henderson is a big step up from Rice.

This has been one of the worst halves of football I've seen. England and the Czechs have done nothing. Like the Czechs have resigned themselves to their fate. The referee has also given a totally bizarre performance.

Hope Southgate sticks with this system for the last 16, and doesn't revert to 5ATB or playing Henderson-Phillips-Rice. Saka has been England's best player today, but I'm unsure it'll be enough for him to start in the last 16 with Mount and Foden coming back into contention. He'll probably be used as an impact player off the bench. Grealish faces a similar quandary.

For England to have a chance in the last 16 they'll have to play sizzling counter-attacking football. Will require an effort many levels above that which England have shown so far.

Croatia getting through. Poor tournament for them so far, but they've just about done enough in the end, seems a couple of their goals tonight were good. Very disappointing tournament for Scotland, but the die was cast when they lost to the Czechs in the first game.

[alfie]

Job done

[GSC]

Job just about done. England will have to raise it another level for their next match, but winning the group, getting Maguire and Henderson some minutes and not conceding a goal is not a bad place to start from.

[Samo]

Croatia getting through. Poor tournament for them so far, but they've just about done enough in the end, seems a couple of their goals tonight were good. Very disappointing tournament for Scotland, but the die was cast when they lost to the Czechs in the first game.

Depends on your perspective. Came into the tournament as the third lowest ranked side. We’ve played some good football, and the worst result was against the world cup runners up. We took it to the final game, as opposed to it being a dead rubber like normal.

We might not have won a game but I think the players played well enough that we can go away with our heads held high. Could have been a very different story had we taken our chances. Work still needs done in the final third.

[Cyril]

Pretty comfortable win, with plenty of work to do. Decent in parts and left a couple of goals on the pitch. Big step up now.

Croatia/Scotland as expected.

Best two sides in the top spots.

[Duty281]

Think England will be big outsiders if it's France in the last 16. Narrow outsiders v the Germans or Portuguese based on what we've seen so far. Favourites v Hungary. The one advantage of playing any of the first three teams is they will be vulnerable to the counter-attack and England should be able to exploit that.

If England can somehow, someway, get through the last 16 contest with a win, then the path to the final itself will be free of major obstruction. Italy, Belgium and the French (hopefully) in the other half of the draw. It will take a big effort though and England have been nowhere near a strong 90-minute performance yet.

Hopefully Sir Harold Kane has been saving up his goals for the KO stages.

Finland also knocked out by tonight's Croatia win. Tomorrow the remainder of the group stages is resolved. Group E wide open. Group F also quite open.

[alfie]

Yep, agree that whichever CM combo is used won't be great, but Henderson is a big step up from Rice.

This has been one of the worst halves of football I've seen. England and the Czechs have done nothing. Like the Czechs have resigned themselves to their fate. The referee has also given a totally bizarre performance.

Hope Southgate sticks with this system for the last 16, and doesn't revert to 5ATB or playing Henderson-Phillips-Rice. Saka has been England's best player today, but I'm unsure it'll be enough for him to start in the last 16 with Mount and Foden coming back into contention. He'll probably be used as an impact player off the bench. Grealish faces a similar quandary.

For England to have a chance in the last 16 they'll have to play sizzling counter-attacking football. Will require an effort many levels above that which England have shown so far.

Croatia getting through. Poor tournament for them so far, but they've just about done enough in the end, seems a couple of their goals tonight were good. Very disappointing tournament for Scotland, but the die was cast when they lost to the Czechs in the first game.

Hope Saka does start. Very impressive today. Almost a problem having too many forward options so hopefully Southgate gets the ideal mix up next.

Can't do much about the midfield.  Defence flimsy , Duty ?  Another clean sheet , although there were a few dodgy moments. Pickford is having a fine tournament.

Overall I feel they look one game short of getting really "ready" : if they were playing (without disrespect) say , Austria or Poland next : should be OK .  But it is going to be likely Germany France or Portugal which are unlikely to be easy...

Need to improve , yes. But (as a glass half full type of fellow) I am OK with today.

[Duty281]

Yep, agree that whichever CM combo is used won't be great, but Henderson is a big step up from Rice.

This has been one of the worst halves of football I've seen. England and the Czechs have done nothing. Like the Czechs have resigned themselves to their fate. The referee has also given a totally bizarre performance.

Hope Southgate sticks with this system for the last 16, and doesn't revert to 5ATB or playing Henderson-Phillips-Rice. Saka has been England's best player today, but I'm unsure it'll be enough for him to start in the last 16 with Mount and Foden coming back into contention. He'll probably be used as an impact player off the bench. Grealish faces a similar quandary.

For England to have a chance in the last 16 they'll have to play sizzling counter-attacking football. Will require an effort many levels above that which England have shown so far.

Croatia getting through. Poor tournament for them so far, but they've just about done enough in the end, seems a couple of their goals tonight were good. Very disappointing tournament for Scotland, but the die was cast when they lost to the Czechs in the first game.

Hope Saka does start. Very impressive today. Almost a problem having too many forward options so hopefully Southgate gets the ideal mix up next.

Can't do much about the midfield.  Defence flimsy , Duty ?  Another clean sheet , although there were a few dodgy moments. Pickford is having a fine tournament.

Overall I feel they look one game short of getting really "ready" : if they were playing (without disrespect) say , Austria or Poland next : should be OK .  But it is going to be likely Germany France or Portugal which are unlikely to be easy...

Need to improve , yes. But (as a glass half full type of fellow) I am OK with today.

For the attacking midfield three I'd rather go Saka-Grealish-Foden, but I'm expecting something closer to Sterling-Mount-Foden. Good options, like you say, though.

Three clean sheets in a row, indebted to some decent saves from Pickford. But all three games against fairly toothless opposition. All three opponents barely doing anything on the attack. When some actual attackers assault the English line, they may just break through. Hence why Southgate may pull up the drawbridge, play 5ATB or three holding midfielders (but surely not both!).

I suppose it's good to be optimistic. England are due to strike an upset at a major tournament, Harry Kane's due some goals - hopefully both happen next week.

[Luke]

The result was the important thing today. Win get through top and stay at Wembley.  We've achieved that, were not setting the world alight. But then again Portugal won the last one, and they were poor pretty much all the way.

Think you keep Saka and Sterling for the pace, otherwise would like to see Bellingham as he is a more box to box player.

[BamBam]

I’m still not impressed by our defensive midfield options. Rice / Henderson and to a lesser extent Phillips are not comfortable picking the ball up off the centre backs or goalkeeper regularly, not in the way that most of the top sides DMs are. I hate when I see them standing close to the opposition pressers in that situation and effectively hiding

Just means we’re reliant on GK/CB picking a pass, which Pickford, Stones and Maguire can all do, but it’s a 20-30 yard longer pass than it would be if the defensive midfielders did that instead. Against the top teams it’s the perennial problem.

Further forward Grealish has to start ahead of Mount now. Sterling will keep his place after his goals but I’d start Rashford there, his link up with Shaw looks dangerous. Foden probably just edges out Saka for the other spot, and Sancho is the odd man out, doubt he’ll get many minutes now

[Pr4wn]

Phillips has yet to be in that position, he has been playing a lot further up the pitch so far in this tournament.

Rice really has failed to impress. I don't understand the benefit of having him in the team, particularly when Phillips is already in there.

Might be a controversial opinion but I think Henderson is one of the most overrated England players of the recent generation.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Personally think last night was totally fine - we managed the game effectively second half, can't remember Pickford having anything of note to do really. Maguire coming back into the side is huge, Mings did fine but he's a step up in player and we saw that a few times both on and off the ball I thought.

Rice is a fine player at what he does, he's never going to be Pirlo back there spraying 50 yard passes, but he is a solid screen for the back four and covers very well imo. With Maguire back in defence, we have more than enough to play out from the back.

Not sure why anyone would want to see Sterling dropped, he's been our best player so far for me. His movement off the ball, and runs in behind have basically been the source of most of our best chances through the three games, and you'd figure against a France/Germany/Portugal he'll have even more room behind their defences to make those runs next game.

Saka was fine, but he's not done enough to unseat Foden for me. A good option off the bench at most

I'd go (all being well, and assuming Mount/Chilwell are not available for selection);

Pickford; Trippier, Stones, Maguire, Shaw; Rice, Phillips; Foden, Grealish, Sterling; Kane

Trippier > Walker for his set piece ability, but similarly wouldn't have any issue if Trippier came in at LB for Shaw either. FBs are all pretty similar.
Wouldn't have Henderson anywhere near the pitch, he looked terribly off the pace to me when he came on yesterday (not surprising, the dude has been injured for months!)

[Soul Requiem]

Rice and Phillips is an uninspiring midfield but it's indicative of the issues England have had for decades now and that's not producing enough ball playing midfielders. This century for instance we've had two; Scholes and Carrick, who were either misused or not given a prolonged run in the team. We heavily favour work rate and bustle over technical ability.

[Afro]

Gilmour was excellent against England, however we played well enough against the Czechs without him (despite the result).  Im hoping a bit of confidence infront of a home crowd will provide the boost needed.  Can still finish 2nd on goal difference if we win and England lose.

All I wanted from this tournament was for Scotland to keep it competitive and play good football. We've managed both of those.  As long as we dont get absolutely guffed tonight the fans will be happy and the team can hold their heads high.

I'm of the view that Gilmour's performance v England was being a bit over-hyped. He did some nice things and was tidy, but he was also caught out of position quite a few times. First half he was knackered at times, from having to recover from his own positioning.

There was one clip they showed, raving about how he had chased Mount back, caught him and stopped him in his tracks by bringing him down. What it didn't mention was the fact he was chasing back because Mount had done him, due to Gilmour being badly positioned.

Its not a criticism as he's 20 years old, as those are the kind of things that come with experience and he is still learning the game. I think he will develop into a fantastic player, but I do think his performance was a little over played on Friday

[GSC]

I think Scotland can take participation as a victory for this tournament, but the bar has to be raised going forward.

[alfie]

Rice and Phillips is an uninspiring midfield but it's indicative of the issues England have had for decades now and that's not producing enough ball playing midfielders. This century for instance we've had two; Scholes and Carrick, who were either misused or not given a prolonged run in the team. We heavily favour work rate and bustle over technical ability.

Wouldn't we all love to have Scholes in this team today ! Don't think they'd be settling for ekeing out 1-0 wins with him providing impetus...

[Duty281]

Personally think last night was totally fine - we managed the game effectively second half, can't remember Pickford having anything of note to do really. Maguire coming back into the side is huge, Mings did fine but he's a step up in player and we saw that a few times both on and off the ball I thought.

Rice is a fine player at what he does, he's never going to be Pirlo back there spraying 50 yard passes, but he is a solid screen for the back four and covers very well imo. With Maguire back in defence, we have more than enough to play out from the back.

Not sure why anyone would want to see Sterling dropped, he's been our best player so far for me. His movement off the ball, and runs in behind have basically been the source of most of our best chances through the three games, and you'd figure against a France/Germany/Portugal he'll have even more room behind their defences to make those runs next game.

Saka was fine, but he's not done enough to unseat Foden for me. A good option off the bench at most

I'd go (all being well, and assuming Mount/Chilwell are not available for selection);

Pickford; Trippier, Stones, Maguire, Shaw; Rice, Phillips; Foden, Grealish, Sterling; Kane

Trippier > Walker for his set piece ability, but similarly wouldn't have any issue if Trippier came in at LB for Shaw either. FBs are all pretty similar.
Wouldn't have Henderson anywhere near the pitch, he looked terribly off the pace to me when he came on yesterday (not surprising, the dude has been injured for months!)

Whilst I can see Trippier's value at set-pieces, England need pace on the counter-attack in their next game, meaning it should be either Walker or James - I'd rather James, but Southgate prefers Walker. I wouldn't want Trippier anywhere near the LB spot, Shaw and Chilwell are a lot better in that position than a guy who's barely played there.

I thought Henderson was fine yesterday. He's vital to England's chances of progression as he is a huge boost to the transition play, which is so ponderous with Rice, and covers more effectively than any other midfielder. He has to start if he's fit and able to.

I think Sterling has had three very average performances, masked by his two goals. His decision-making in possession all too often lets him down, and he seems to struggle linking up with England team-mates, especially Kane. I think it's almost certain that he starts, but I'd rather Saka did. Hopefully Southgate uses his bench options well as they do have the potential to change games - it's a shame Sancho is barely getting a look-in while an injured Rashford is.

[Duty281]

I think Scotland can take participation as a victory for this tournament, but the bar has to be raised going forward.

I'd be disappointed if I were a Scotland fan. They came up against an average Czech side at home; they played an England team who put in an utterly dismal performance; then they were home to an in-decline Croatia, who England and the Czechs had little issue with.

From all three games they produced three poor-mediocre performances, only scored one goal, and barely created anything of note in all three games. Scotland are probably happy just to qualify, and it came with a little luck because of getting through on penalties twice, but they landed in a fairly soft group and had home advantage twice.

[GSC]

I agree, but it's at least offset by putting off the string of missed tournaments. Next time there won't be the same mitigation.

Overall I thought they were at least competitive in each game, but really lacked any kind of threat up front. Dykes looked limited at this level, and Adams didn't really get enough support for the areas he managed to get into

[Lowlandbrit]

Like I said after their first game, Scotland looked like what they are, it's just that the combo of not having qualified for so long and getting to play at home probably created a little too much excitement for them going in. Hopefully they can use this to kick on.

[Guest]

The god awful Sweden are currently winning group E as it stands. The draw is opening up.

[dummy_half]

Let's be honest - Scotland don't have great quality of players. Robertson would walk into most teams, Tierney might make the squad of some of the better nations, but otherwise they are reliant on being a team that performs better than the sum of their parts - they do miss a top notch goal scorer in particular.

It's not like the late 70s / early 80s where they had a team based around Hansen, Souness and Dalglish, where they probably did under-achieve on the international stage.

As for England, best you can say so far is job done. Professional if uninspiring wins over Croatia and Czech, with the oddity of the local derby in the middle. Kane looked a bit better yesterday, but still looks slow and ponderous compared with the rest of the attack. Sterling continues to be the second most infuriating player we have (after Kyle Walker and his inability to play a simple 5 yard pass) - makes great runs and really puts defenders under pressure but then too often fails to deliver the end product, whether a shot on target or an incisive pass or cross. A player with his pace and Foden's brain would be an absolute world beater.
Defence has generally looked pretty solid.

[Guest]

Defence has generally looked pretty solid.

So has Pickford. Which tells you everything you need to know about the opposition we’ve faced so far. Expect that to change next Tuesday.

Whoever does win next Tuesday’s match at Wembley, might have a QF against Sweden.

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