Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[super_realist]

First topic message reminder :

Should we be there?

Well if you dont mind whats happening now and support sharia law then I guess not.

[super_realist]

So, does anyone know why our energy is so much more then European countries on day ahead prices?

It isnt, but even if it was then look as to why this might be. Forst of all taxes, second of all imported oil and gas requires a costly undersea pipeline. Furthermore UK produced gas is geologically challenging and more costly to produce than say imported gas from Russia.

Also, stop starting sentences with So..... It makes you look like a millenial imbecile.

[beninho]

https://thecurrent.lcp.uk.com/europe

So, Are these figures not correct?

[super_realist]

I remember the days we were told brexit woukd mean cheaper energy bills.

When? You sound like a BBC "comedy" panelist lile Nish Kumar.
Why are you still going on about Brexit?  Why not get over it and crack on?

Energy prices are dictated by the global market, not Brexit.
I voted to remain, i've accepted the result, why cant you?

What you mean by accept the result?

Should we just accept the result of the most recent general election and abandon our democracy?

Yes, if the party you voted for is defeated in an election then you accept the result, thats how democracy works, are you morphing into Fuhrer Sturgeon?

I'm pretty sure I've heard you criticise the Scottish government?

Im highly critical of the Scottish government. I was making an analogy between Mac and Sturgeon in that it appears that neither can take the result of a democratic process and respect the outcome.

[super_realist]

https://thecurrent.lcp.uk.com/europe

So, Are these figures not correct?

The price of oil and gas is the same the world over. Its dictated by the market and the price of barrel of Brent or any other equivalent gas/condensate in any European country is the same as it is in the UK to both buy and sell.

Whatever this "day ahead" thing is is not related to what we can buy oil and gas at.

[beninho]

I think the site shows the current prices, in half hourly blocks across europe, which shows, unfortunately it's more expensive to buy for the UK. Electricity.

[super_realist]

I think the site shows the current prices, in half hourly blocks across europe, which shows, unfortunately it's more expensive to buy for the UK. Electricity.

Its not the fault of Brexit though if thats what youre getting at.

[beninho]

I think the site shows the current prices, in half hourly blocks across europe, which shows, unfortunately it's more expensive to buy for the UK. Electricity.

Its not the fault of Brexit though if thats what youre getting at.

I'm not. And I haven't at all said it is. We just have people on here who seem to be experts in deciding why sonething isn't the reason, so I asked what is the reason. If its not brexit, fine, I don't know then why is it more expensive here then elsewhere in Europe?

[super_realist]

I already said that infrastructure is an issue. Onshore pipelines which serve mainland Europe are far cheaper than offshore pipelines. Pipelines domt transport oil and gas for free, imagine it like the Suez canal for example where cost of getting through are a factor.
UK imports most of its gas, hence it is more expensive to transport it from Russia to UK, than it is to transport from Russia to Italy for example.

We shall see how much the UK public cares about "the environment" if prices go higher and supply is under threat.

We need gas for the energy transition, its undeniable, so we should have been fracking and prioritising domestic gas supply to protect us from this very position. We also need gas for future hydrogen production.
For information this month wind has only supplied 9% of electricity needs, whereas last September it was 22%, therefore the reliability  of renewables is an issue.

These Energy "suppliers" that are going bust isnt really an issue. Its their short term business model which doesnt work. They only work if the orice ofngas stays significantly lower than the price cap. This cap was a Labour policy, so if Starmer blames the government for their demise, then it will show his ignorance

[beninho]

Has Starmer blamed the price cap? Surely a price cap is a very good idea. Though depends on what the cap is. Unsure what the reasoning was for a 12% increase in the cap in August?

[JAS]

I already said that infrastructure is an issue. Onshore pipelines which serve mainland Europe are far cheaper than offshore pipelines. Pipelines domt transport oil and gas for free, imagine it like the Suez canal for example where cost of getting through are a factor.
UK imports most of its gas, hence it is more expensive to transport it from Russia to UK, than it is to transport from Russia to Italy for example.

We shall see how much the UK public cares about "the environment" if prices go higher and supply is under threat.

We need gas for the energy transition, its undeniable, so we should have been fracking and prioritising domestic gas supply to protect us from this very position. We also need gas for future hydrogen production.
For information this month wind has only supplied 9% of electricity needs, whereas last September it was 22%, therefore the reliability  of renewables is an issue.

These Energy "suppliers" that are going bust isnt really an issue. Its their short term business model which doesnt work. They only work if the orice ofngas stays significantly lower than the price cap. This cap was a Labour policy, so if Starmer blames the government for their demise, then it will show his ignorance

That's quite peculiarly selective and about as equally banal and unconstructive as saying privatisation of the energy sector was a Conservative Policy. Incase you've missed it the Tories have been in power for ELEVEN years, if they didn't like it they could have changed it...duh!!

This is an example of the market working for the few, not the many (because the many will be the ones forced to pay more). Or then again maybe not, we're being assured all will be ok. Kwarteng sounded very much like Hancock circa Feb 2020 "We have this Covid-19 under control and there is nothing to worry about" Aye...Always trust a Tory minister reassuring us that all will be ok!!

[super_realist]

Has Starmer blamed the price cap? Surely a price cap is a very good idea. Though depends on what the cap is. Unsure what the reasoning was for a 12% increase in the cap in August?

No, he hasnt, but i can see him blaming the government for companies going to the wall.

The increase in the price cap is related to a rise in the price of gas. You cant have a cap lower tham the cost of the gas itself can you?

[super_realist]

I already said that infrastructure is an issue. Onshore pipelines which serve mainland Europe are far cheaper than offshore pipelines. Pipelines domt transport oil and gas for free, imagine it like the Suez canal for example where cost of getting through are a factor.
UK imports most of its gas, hence it is more expensive to transport it from Russia to UK, than it is to transport from Russia to Italy for example.

We shall see how much the UK public cares about "the environment" if prices go higher and supply is under threat.

We need gas for the energy transition, its undeniable, so we should have been fracking and prioritising domestic gas supply to protect us from this very position. We also need gas for future hydrogen production.
For information this month wind has only supplied 9% of electricity needs, whereas last September it was 22%, therefore the reliability  of renewables is an issue.

These Energy "suppliers" that are going bust isnt really an issue. Its their short term business model which doesnt work. They only work if the orice ofngas stays significantly lower than the price cap. This cap was a Labour policy, so if Starmer blames the government for their demise, then it will show his ignorance

That's quite peculiarly selective and about as equally banal and unconstructive as saying privatisation of the energy sector was a Conservative Policy. Incase you've missed it the Tories have been in power for ELEVEN years, if they didn't like it they could have changed it...duh!!

This is an example of the market working for the few, not the many (because the many will be the ones forced to pay more). Or then again maybe not, we're being assured all will be ok. Kwarteng sounded very much like Hancock circa Feb 2020 "We have this Covid-19 under control and there is nothing to worry about" Aye...Always trust a Tory minister reassuring us that all will be ok!!

More claptrap JAS. It doesnt matter what policy is in, youll always say it benefits the rich and punishes the poor.
You cant have a gas cap lower than the cost of gas.

[beninho]

It's funny that tge tories thought a price cap was living in a Marxist universe when Labour announced it as a policy.

[super_realist]

It's funny that tge tories thought a price cap was living in a Marxist universe when Labour announced it as a policy.

Im fine with a cap. The problem is the word "cap". It needs to be similar to "above base rate" as demand increases price as does a lack of supply of renewables

[beninho]

I think with energy, people are just guilty of just paying what it is. With my Mortgage I fix for 2 years, and then months before look into the next best deal. So it rolls over. I've been in my house for 5 years, i changed supplier once, that supplier then became part of EDF and I've not done anything since. Its an economy 7, and I've never changed that or installed a smart meter. I think a rise of 150 a year, just doesn't seem lots, when your mortgage goes up 500 a month!

[JAS]

Claptrap = Something Super doesn’t agree with….got it.

[McLaren]

I remember the days we were told brexit woukd mean cheaper energy bills.

When? You sound like a BBC "comedy" panelist lile Nish Kumar.
Why are you still going on about Brexit?  Why not get over it and crack on?

Energy prices are dictated by the global market, not Brexit.
I voted to remain, i've accepted the result, why cant you?

What you mean by accept the result?

Should we just accept the result of the most recent general election and abandon our democracy?

Yes, if the party you voted for is defeated in an election then you accept the result, thats how democracy works, are you morphing into Fuhrer Sturgeon?

I wasn't clear or you misunderstood the point. You seem to be suggest that we just get on with brexit and never think about changing the decision. This isn't how democracy works. Hence, would you be happy to have a last ever general election?

[dynamark]

Super seems to have some knowledge on the gas subject.Did we use all the North sea gas? Do we get anything from fracking as yet? Is the gas being used for domestic boilers or is it going to generate elec.Im reading we are well down on wind and nuclear power and you cannot easily store elec so presume switching on the gas turbines as needed is happening.
By coincidence I have a friend who I saw last night and he was head of purchasing gas for british gas back in the day (retired nearly 20 years ago) but he said they purchased from a mix of sources and did buy well in advance ,Bit like potatoes McCain will buy up crop maybe 6 years in advance. Companies in trouble now are at the mercy of the current high prices

[super_realist]

I remember the days we were told brexit woukd mean cheaper energy bills.

When? You sound like a BBC "comedy" panelist lile Nish Kumar.
Why are you still going on about Brexit?  Why not get over it and crack on?

Energy prices are dictated by the global market, not Brexit.
I voted to remain, i've accepted the result, why cant you?

What you mean by accept the result?

Should we just accept the result of the most recent general election and abandon our democracy?

Yes, if the party you voted for is defeated in an election then you accept the result, thats how democracy works, are you morphing into Fuhrer Sturgeon?

I wasn't clear or you misunderstood the point. You seem to be suggest that we just get on with brexit and never think about changing the decision. This isn't how democracy works. Hence, would you be happy to have a last ever general election?

Reverse the decision? Are you Ed Davy now too?

Of course i wouldnt be happy to have a last ever general election, i accept that we have 5 year maximum terms for governments. The decision to leave Europe wasnt based on any such term just like Scottish Independence wasnt held on the basis that if the Nats didnt like the result they get another referendum, it was a decision to leave the EU, hence as the leave side won, ive accepted the result. Why havent you?

[super_realist]

Super seems to have some knowledge on the gas subject.Did we use all the North sea gas? Do we get anything from fracking as yet? Is the gas being used for domestic boilers or is it going to generate elec.Im reading we are well down on wind and nuclear power and you cannot easily store elec so presume switching on the gas turbines as needed is happening.
By coincidence I have a friend who I saw last night and he was head of purchasing gas for british gas back in the day (retired nearly 20 years ago) but he said they purchased from a mix of sources and did buy well in advance ,Bit like potatoes McCain will buy up crop maybe 6 years in advance. Companies in  trouble now are at the mercy of the current high prices

There is still plenty gas in the North Sea specifically in the South North Sea in English waters. A couple of large fields have come online in recent years which make a decent contribution to our domestic supply. Trouble is its getting more geologically challenged.
The Environmentalists made enough of a fuss about fracking wothout understanding the subject to effectively put a moratorium on it at the current time whilst any offshore field takes about 5-6 years to get from discovery to production.

[beninho]

I remember the days we were told brexit woukd mean cheaper energy bills.

When? You sound like a BBC "comedy" panelist lile Nish Kumar.
Why are you still going on about Brexit?  Why not get over it and crack on?

Energy prices are dictated by the global market, not Brexit.
I voted to remain, i've accepted the result, why cant you?

What you mean by accept the result?

Should we just accept the result of the most recent general election and abandon our democracy?

Yes, if the party you voted for is defeated in an election then you accept the result, thats how democracy works, are you morphing into Fuhrer Sturgeon?

I wasn't clear or you misunderstood the point. You seem to be suggest that we just get on with brexit and never think about changing the decision. This isn't how democracy works. Hence, would you be happy to have a last ever general election?

Reverse the decision? Are you Ed Davy now too?

Of course i wouldnt be happy to have a last ever general election, i accept that we have 5 year maximum terms for governments. The decision to leave Europe wasnt based on any such term just like Scottish Independence wasnt held on the basis that if the Nats didnt like the result they get another referendum, it was a decision to leave the EU, hence as the leave side won, ive accepted the result. Why havent you?

What do you mean by accepting the result? Everyone accepts the result. That doesn't mean you just sit back and cheer it on. If an election is won by a group you have issues with, peopke shouldn't sit back and just say oh well, I'll accept the result. And if people who want brexit accepted the result, we wouldn't have had another referendum.

[super_realist]

Nobody is saying "cheer it on" but pretending that theres a possibility of it being reversed is stupid. You DO accept the result, thats democracy.

There's a lot of things i dont like the result of, doesnt mean i should lament them. You can't change the past. The last referendum was in the 70's. Its ridiculous to make a comparision with that and how you are acting now and a referendum that took place just a few years ago.

Acting like Jo Swinson or Jolion Moran wont change anything.

[beninho]

I know people say energy prices are nothing to do with brexit, but I saw something about the EU internal energy market, which we left. Again, I'm no expert, but many are saying this has had an impact on the increase for energy in the UK, along with the under investment over the years.

This is am interesting article.

https://westenglandbylines.co.uk/energy-prices-rise-after-uk-leaves-eu-energy-markets/

I'm sure people know more though.

[beninho]

Nobody is saying "cheer it on" but pretending that theres a possibility of it being reversed is stupid. You DO accept the result, thats democracy.

There's a lot of things i dont like the result of, doesnt mean i should lament them. You can't change the past. The last referendum was in the 70's. Its ridiculous to make a comparision with that and how you are acting now and a referendum that took place just a few years ago.

Acting like Jo Swinson or Jolion Moran wont change anything.

Who is pretending it will be reversed? Brexit is a massive shi$tshow, but its here to stay at the moment but until I see any tangible benefit I will still think of it as nonsense and call out what I see as daft.

[beninho]

It seems the internal energy market had some sort of algorithm Europe wide, keeping areas relatively the same for day ahead electricity. With the UK choosing to leave, it removes us from this, and means we are basically on our own. This seems to be part of the reason our electricity charges are higher then Europe.

Happy to be proven wrong though.

[Soul Requiem]

So Ireland and Romania as part of the EU would have day ahead prices in line with the rest?

[beninho]

https://www.next-kraftwerke.com/knowledge/market-coupling

Ireland don't seem to be in it, no idea where Romania is on the map.

[beninho]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.greentechmedia.com/amp/article/irelands-energy-market-is-unexpected-brexit-victim
https://www.current-news.co.uk/news/brexit-has-reduced-trading-with-ireland-sending-power-prices-rocketing

https://www.mhc.ie/latest/insights/the-irish-electricity-market-at-the-end-of-the-brexit-transition-period
Here's some info on Ireland, as you were asking. Seems Ireland have been screwed.

[beninho]

Ww were 1 up on city! Then De Bruyne.

I enjoyed those few minutes.

[beninho]

Just to clarify, as I know sone on here are easily confused. I don't think the energy issues are purely to do with brexit. Obviously not, just that nothing seems to indicate that brexit has benefitted the uk in any way.

[super_realist]

Just to clarify, as I know sone on here are easily confused. I don't think the energy issues are purely to do with brexit. Obviously not, just that nothing seems to indicate that brexit has benefitted the uk in any way.

Apart from the vaccines eh? I dont see anyone on here claiming that Brexit has been positive, but similarly you dont need to aporoach every negative thing and imply that Brexit is the cause.

I was hearing yesterday that the NHS employ diversity officers on £235,000 a year. Considering thats more than people actually in charge of the NHS, do you think thats a good way to spend money?
Shouldn't nurses etc be protesting about this sort of money spunking, when you could employ 9 nurses for the cost of this ludicrously overpaid position

[beninho]

https://www.jobs.nhs.uk/xi/vacancy/916710869

61- 70k. For this job.

Even Guido couldn't find 235k https://order-order.com/2021/03/15/nhs-hiring-8-diversity-managers-on-50000-salaries/

[beninho]

And, whike the govt did well with the initial vaccination, I don't think anything indicated it was because of brexit. And, I'm not saying things are bad with brexit being the cause, but with brexit includes its generally made bad situations worse.

It seems that removing the country from the internal energy market was always going to have an impact on UK prices over Europe, but if people are fine to accept that as its the brexit they want, then fine.

[JAS]

https://www.jobs.nhs.uk/xi/vacancy/916710869

61- 70k. For this job.

Even Guido couldn't find 235k https://order-order.com/2021/03/15/nhs-hiring-8-diversity-managers-on-50000-salaries/

Got to say, that I find utterly abhorrent, symptomatic of a society that seems to have totally lost the plot...unless said diversity managers are going to ensure that frontline healthcare workers are included in the NHS gravy train that seems to keep on running for some.

Furthermore I'd suggest that if such posts are required then there could be a LOT more money saved by a mass sacking of people in management posts because that should be part of every managers responsibility.

[Soul Requiem]

And, whike the govt did well with the initial vaccination, I don't think anything indicated it was because of brexit.  And, I'm not saying things are bad with brexit being the cause,  but with brexit includes its generally made bad situations worse.

It seems that removing the country from the internal energy market was always going to have an impact on UK prices over Europe, but if people are fine to accept that as its the brexit they want, then fine.  

Aside from being able to fast track approval and not having to co-ordinate the rollout with 27 other countries, aside from that nothing.

[beninho]

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/blog/covid-vaccine-decisions-brexit

Wasn't the approval done under the legislation in place at the time? As the MHRA said at the time, in response to the claim of Hancock, the vaccine rollout wasn't anything to do with brexit.

And the EU vaccine scheme was a choice, but, again it all happened before the official brexit, which shows it was irrelevant.

Why would you believe Hancock over the actual medicine agency?

[beninho]

https://www.jobs.nhs.uk/xi/vacancy/916710869

61- 70k. For this job.

Even Guido couldn't find 235k https://order-order.com/2021/03/15/nhs-hiring-8-diversity-managers-on-50000-salaries/

Got to say, that I find utterly abhorrent, symptomatic of a society that seems to have totally lost the plot...unless said diversity managers are going to ensure that frontline healthcare workers are included in the NHS gravy train that seems to keep on running for some.

Furthermore I'd suggest that if such posts are required then there could be a LOT more money saved by a mass sacking of people in management posts because that should be part of every managers responsibility.

Handelsbanken are looking for an equality, diversity and inclusion manager, as are Lloyd's,
In fact so are others. Its a standard job in big organisations.

[Soul Requiem]

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/blog/covid-vaccine-decisions-brexit

Wasn't the approval done under the legislation in place at the time?  As the MHRA said at the time, in response to the claim of Hancock, the vaccine rollout wasn't anything to do with brexit.

And the EU vaccine scheme was a choice, but, again it all happened before the official brexit, which shows it was irrelevant.

Why would you believe Hancock over the actual medicine agency?

Provisions that existed up until January 1st 2021 so do not apply to the rollout of the Astra-Zeneca vaccine which was rolled out after the emergency provisions ended.

[beninho]

So, we could only roll out Astrazeneca, which was approved in December because of Brexit. Doesn't that ho against what the mhra said? And I'm struggling to see anything to state this is the case.

[Soul Requiem]

The emergency provisions ended on January 1st as stated by the chief executive of the MHRA in early December before approval of the Astra-Zeneca vaccine was approved. The comments you're clinging to refer to the Pfizer vaccine which had approved on December 2nd and was rolled out December 8th.

[beninho]

Astrazeneca was approved 30th December for emergency supply in the uk. Are you saying this only happened because of brexit?

Regulation 174 of the Human Medicine Regulations 2012, seems to what was quoted, I've not read it, but I'm sure you have. But, im unsure why we had a regulation that was from 2012 which approved astrazeneca, because that's well before brexit?

[beninho]

Modern was in January, under the same regulation.

[beninho]

It seems the mhra confirmed in November 20. That vaccines would be licensed by the Ema during the transition period. But that also countries could authorise there own vaccines based on public health. This seems to be the case with Pfizer and Astrazeneca before the transition ended, and that's why since January other vaccines are still authorised the same way.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine-mhra-statement

[JAS]

https://www.jobs.nhs.uk/xi/vacancy/916710869

61- 70k. For this job.

Even Guido couldn't find 235k https://order-order.com/2021/03/15/nhs-hiring-8-diversity-managers-on-50000-salaries/

Got to say, that I find utterly abhorrent, symptomatic of a society that seems to have totally lost the plot...unless said diversity managers are going to ensure that frontline healthcare workers are included in the NHS gravy train that seems to keep on running for some.

Furthermore I'd suggest that if such posts are required then there could be a LOT more money saved by a mass sacking of people in management posts because that should be part of every managers responsibility.

Handelsbanken are looking for an equality, diversity and inclusion manager, as are Lloyd's,
In fact so are others. Its a standard job in big organisations.  

Which I suppose reinforces my point, modern society seems to have lost the plot if this kind of post is deemed necessary and even more so at that sort of pay level. I totally get why they have them, arse covering to ensure they are insulated from the possibility of being sued and/or investigated/fined for being non-compliant.
Banks are somewhat different from the NHS though, they are private not state owned for a start and they can spunk out for an EDI manager with little or no impact on the customer base. whereas such a post in the NHS is taking budget away from the front line which is flat out and under pressure to service the needs of it's clientele - end result of that can in some cases mean death.

[McLaren]

I don't agree with Jas's general take on this topic but it is hard to argue with;

if such posts are required then there could be a LOT more money saved by a mass sacking of people in management posts because that should be part of every managers responsibility

If you need a layer of management to specifically enforce or think about diversity then clearly the wrong managers are in place. Just hire new people who get it.

[McLaren]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-58661931

Would have thought this would have got more attention in the media/social media. What a horrific incident.

[incontinentia]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-58661931

Would have thought this would have got more attention in the media/social media. What a horrific incident.

Horrible crime no doubt mac. Sadiq Khan and others seem to want to place the blame for these murders of women at the door of all men, which is flawed thinking imo. The men who do these things are a tiny, mainly mentally ill minority and not representative of all men.

[beninho]

I dont think anyone is blaming all men, and it sure as hell isn't blamed on mentally ill. The copper who killed Sarah Everard wasn't mentally ill.

Unfortunately it's men letting the men side down. Men aren't murdered in the street by women.

[Soul Requiem]

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/articles/homicideinenglandandwales/yearendingmarch2020#the-relationship-between-victims-and-suspects

A link that highlight the disproportionate rate of women killed by their partners.

I've never once understood why men abuse their partners let alone kill them. As a male i've never once felt worried about being the victim and had a partner many years ago who was beaten by an ex, every time we argued you could see her recoil expecting something to happen, took a long time for her to acclimatise shall we say to a non abusive relationship.

[super_realist]

https://www.jobs.nhs.uk/xi/vacancy/916710869

61- 70k. For this job.

Even Guido couldn't find 235k https://order-order.com/2021/03/15/nhs-hiring-8-diversity-managers-on-50000-salaries/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1493931/Prerana-Issar-nhs-diversity-head-salary/amp

Didnt look very hard did you? Why are the NHS paying this sort of money for such a role?

[Sponsored content]