England Pre 2023 6Ns and Beyond.

First topic message reminder :

Continued.......

mountain man wrote:I'd say Halfpenny as slow or slower than Steward.

Goode too.

As said I don't think Steward is slow at all, his running from deep is pretty good and has produced a few tries. He isn't a speedster and his acceleration is somewhat pedestrian. There are always compromises.

But he can improve his speed and agility...he can work with sprint coaches, gymnast coaches etc...hes only 22.

Isnt Arundell a 15 for Irish?
Him and Stewart are 2 very different players - but could be very complimentary when working as a tag team.

mountain man wrote:I'd say Halfpenny as slow or slower than Steward.

I don't think it's about speed per se but about acceleration and agility. Steward has a high top speed, but it takes him a while to hit it and he does not change direction well. I think I've said here before that it's the same issue that Mike Brown had when he first broke into the England setup in 2007; the extra pace of everyone at international level exposed how his running style was taking too long to get up to speed. Brown fixed that by paying Margot Wells to change his style.

FKA Sam I think mentioned that Steward has been working with the sprint team at Loughborough, so that may bear fruit in time, but for now he still lacks the change of direction in defence, and I think that then compounds his relative immaturity in positioning as an international fullback. Teams are starting to work out how to catch him out of position and exploiting that. I think he will benefit hugely from having Brown alongside him at Leicester as a player who has had to work hard on his movement and is exceptionally good at positioning.

(Being a little cheeky, if Brown sees out the season at Leicester in the kind of form he's currently showing, he could even force himself back into England contention...)

Interesting conundrum there. Steward moved to 12 on the nod from the current England boss to his new assistant. Let's Brown play 15. Sure that would go down great with Leicester if it turns out to be a disaster.

Geordie wrote:We have 4 really good young players coming through at 12 now...all different styles. Why move an outstanding young 15 to 12 when we have these on the horizon? i dont get it.

Dan Kelly (Leicester, 21) 6'1, 16st
Ollie Hartley (Saracens, 20) 6'4, 15st
Seb Atkinson (Gloucester, 20) 5'10, 14.5 st
Max Ojomoh (Bath, 22) 5'11, 15.5 st

Only Hartley is not playing regular...playing in the cup etc...but that will soon change as he has everything...size and skills...and Saracens will develop him well.

Are you thinking for the RWC or after? We are going to either trust a few more young'uns for the RWC or put plasters on the older veterans and hope. Unfortunately, England Rugby is neither the most trusting organisation on earth nor comfortable with risk.

When I put that Halfpenny as slow as or slower than Steward it was purely in reply to a comment that Steward is slowest ever 15, I dont think he's that slow. He's not rapid like Arundell or LRZ etc but he's not slow either.

I agree with Watson, Arundell and Steward as back 3 then working together could be very productive. Arundell hardly got a sniff on Saturday but in future if that back 3 selected could be good.

doctor_grey wrote:

Geordie wrote:We have 4 really good young players coming through at 12 now...all different styles. Why move an outstanding young 15 to 12 when we have these on the horizon? i dont get it.

Dan Kelly (Leicester, 21) 6'1, 16st
Ollie Hartley (Saracens, 20) 6'4, 15st
Seb Atkinson (Gloucester, 20) 5'10, 14.5 st
Max Ojomoh (Bath, 22) 5'11, 15.5 st

Only Hartley is not playing regular...playing in the cup etc...but that will soon change as he has everything...size and skills...and Saracens will develop him well.

Are you thinking for the RWC or after?  We are going to either trust a few more young'uns for the RWC or put plasters on the older veterans and hope.  Unfortunately, England Rugby is neither the most trusting organisation on earth nor comfortable with risk.

Very much after...only Kelly would be ready for the WC and hes barely had any experience at this level. Sadly the 6n would have been perfect. Seb Atkinosn playing very well for Gloucester aswell at the moment. So plenty to watch over the next 12 months i would say.

mountain man wrote:When I put that Halfpenny as slow as or slower than Steward it was purely in reply to a comment that Steward is slowest ever 15, I dont think he's that slow. He's not rapid like Arundell or LRZ etc but he's not slow either.

I agree with Watson, Arundell and Steward as back 3 then working together could be very productive. Arundell hardly got a sniff on Saturday but in future if that back 3 selected could be good.

Halfpenny was never slow in his day.....no way he's slower off the mark from Steward, not a chance.

Next thread.....

https://www.606v2.com/t71010-england-2023-post-6n-and-beyond#4081968