A different perspective on Haye

Greeting to you all. First time poster here and like everyone else I am extremely excited about the upcoming fight, or as Haye would put it “leaking with anticipation”.

I have a couple of observations to make that don’t seem to have been touched on elsewhere in this excellent forum.

1. Haye’s physical condition. Haye is in the shape of his life, he is looking full and cut and those pecs in particular seem to have seen a pneumatic pump since his last fight. I have absolutely no doubt Haye and Booth have gone into the training leaving no stone unturned, and to combat the size deficit have purposefully built Haye into the meanest and most intimidating physical specimen possible.

I have two concerns about this though. If we look at the world of bodybuilding, the awesome specimens we see on competition day are actually close to collapse due to an excessive high protein/low carb diet that has placed muscle growth and definition at the expense of energy (and of course being drained of water). And the larger the muscles in comparison to body size, the greater share of oxygen is needed to work them. Now Haye isn't at the level of a bodybuilder but he is close enough to make me worry that his training has forgotten all about endurance, favouring instead an all or nothing strategy of blasting Wlad out within the first few rounds. This could leave Haye badly exposed if Wlad doesn’t fold as easily as expected.
My other concern is that Haye has been looking ripped for the past month now, giving me the impression he has placed undue strain on himself too early. It is very hard to maintain peak condition for such a long period without suffering exhaustion or injury. Haye's eagerness to be in the shape of his life is commendable, but it risks leaving him a spent force on his biggest night.

2. Haye’s press performances are eerily similar to Hatton in the build-up to his Mayweather fight. Nervous, edgy, and as Wladimir himself has put it “full of adrenaline”. No doubt Haye wants this more than anything, but his performances at the pressers have shown too much nervous energy for my liking. He could barely look at Wladimir in the yesterday's staredown without moving, twitching or talking. I can well imagine Haye has been struggling to sleep at night without assistance, and can barely blink without replaying the fight in his mind for the 0000th time. Good up to a degree, but too much nervous energy will also take its toll eventually.

My pick is still Haye by Kayo, but the above is certainly giving me cause to worry.

only time will tell but i think haye always stays in great shape, and more than likely only has a maximum of 12 rounds left boxing as a pro anyways, so unless he burns out in that time i think he be fine.

i wouldn't read to much into the press moments, haye will be focused on fight night. interest point about haye maybe training for a game plan of getting it over early, would be the best idea, and we know that booth is a man with a plan.

Hatton's diet and Haye's diet are poles apart. He doesn't drink (?) and only eats organic healthy food. Haye loves himself, and his physical apoearance and looks are of prime motivation. Can't see him being under or overdone.

It's an interesting point you raise. Haye has always been in great shape since he was a kid. Between fights he stays in great shape also, probably out of vanity as much as anything else. I wouldn't have thought having too much muscle would be any more of an issue in this fight than any of his others. For example he gassed a bit after the 3rd against Ruiz but was still fighting hard come the 9th. I know Hayes training is based more around speed and explosiveness, working the fast twitch fibres, so lots of plyometrics etc and he doesn't do a great deal of roadwork but loads of short sprints - which burns fat quicker than long cardio sessions which may explain his ripped appearance. However he will undergo long sparring sessions which will massively increase stamina. If he has any sense - which he clearly does - he will train for a 15 round fight to go 12. His diet is of the highest quality, almost completely organic foods and lean meat (kangaroo meat being a favourite - there's a piece about his diet with Gareth A Davies on talksport this Friday afternoon if you're interested). I imagine haye will look to come in about 210 -215lbs, as he knows speed and explosiveness are the key to unsettling wlad, size and bulk are an irrelevant hinderance. He may be excited about the fight but he's a cool customer, highly focused, and come fight night when he's in the zone he'll be very calm as always.

Don't think there's any cause for concern at all.

When Vitali confronted him about appearing at the post fight presser he turned the tables and made him look very very silly. Not the actions for a nervous guy - was quick witted and on the ball.

And the point about adrenaline is a good one - adrenaline heightens your senses, it's not a bad thing as long as you can mentally cope with it. He's a professional sportsman with a very good thinker of a trainer, once the first round goes i'd fully expect Haye to go into an almost hyper sensitive state of concentration utilising the massive surge in adrenaline rushing through him.

Zero cause for concern, he's tried to ruffle Wlad and to be fair - When was the last time Wlad has spent this much time questionning another fighter and the stuff he's said? If anything Wlad appears to be flustered and keeps going over the same "shows no respect, i will teach him a lesson"..... For me the plan is working brilliantly as i really do think Team Haye have got under Team Wlad's skin - if they hadn't why was Vitali so vocal at the presser?

Think they're trying to make Wlad fight a bit loose by getting in his head, and the only thing i see is Wlad getting flustered by Haye's lack of manners.

Coxy - agree they've definitely got under team wlads skin. The t-shirts, the handshake, the lateness, the iPhone app, the general verbal abuse. The way they accused steward of cheating in the Brewster fight, then yesterday haye comes out and says steward would like to work with him which shows his lack of faith in wlad. Haye wants to get wlad as riled as possible as he's looking for ways to make wlad make mistakes in the ring which will give haye his openings. On the surface it appears to be working, but wlad is too smart for that and once the bell goes will stick to his safety first approach.

Regarding Haye's wind-up tactics - what is Wlad meant to do when the guy is constantly digging him out and insulting him at every opportunity? It would get under anyone's skin. Personally I think Wlad has dealt with it very well and remained calm and said all the right things. If he did nothing then everyone would say he was rattled, he can't win.
To me it speaks volumes that Haye is trying to grab any advantage he can.

Also, all of a sudden, everyone has decided that Haye is this infallible He-Man/Incredible hulk cross with a mind as impenetrable as Hannibal Lector's. If anything I think Wlad has got under Haye’s skin a little bit with his calm approach. Be in no doubt, come fight time Haye will be very nervous, and that’s a good thing. He is very convincing when he talks and always says he will come out brawling, but when has he ever fought like this?

No doubt he has the power to win, but let’s just see what happens as the fight unfolds.

An interesting perspective but I don't think Haye is close enough to the type of bodies the bodybuilders have.

They tend to do crazy things as you say before competitions (not drinking fluids etc) to emphasise their muscles.

Haye is in amazing shape for a boxer but would look out of place among the hardcore bodybuilders. Basically he just has very low body fat (probably between 0-5%), I really don't think he'll be dehydrating himself though.

huw wrote:
Haye is in amazing shape for a boxer but would look out of place among the hardcore bodybuilders. Basically he just has very low body fat (probably between 0-5%), I really don't think he'll be dehydrating himself though.

I can't imagine Haye's bodyfat being at 0-5%. Thats usually the amount a bodybuilder would carry during a competition.
8-12% would be more realistic.

J.Benson II wrote:

huw wrote:
Haye is in amazing shape for a boxer but would look out of place among the hardcore bodybuilders. Basically he just has very low body fat (probably between 0-5%), I really don't think he'll be dehydrating himself though.

I can't imagine Haye's bodyfat being at 0-5%. Thats usually the amount a bodybuilder would carry during a competition.
8-12% would be more realistic.

Medically you need less than 10% to have visible abs.

Huw; pro bodybuilders have as little as under 3% body fat. Haye's not that low.

Haye's body fat will be around 8-10%, I would have thought.

My body fat is at 11% and my abs are just about visible when not tensed, but quite clearly visible when tensed. Haye's appear visible at all times (unless he is always tensing, wouldn't put it past him).

He'll give himself a hernia doing that...

huw wrote:

J.Benson II wrote:

huw wrote:
Haye is in amazing shape for a boxer but would look out of place among the hardcore bodybuilders. Basically he just has very low body fat (probably between 0-5%), I really don't think he'll be dehydrating himself though.

I can't imagine Haye's bodyfat being at 0-5%. Thats usually the amount a bodybuilder would carry during a competition.
8-12% would be more realistic.

Medically you need less than 10% to have visible abs.

This is true. An athlete in Hayes condition probably has about 7 or 8% body fat. I think pacquiao had about 6% going into the Cotto fight. Anything below 5 and you're entering the realms of unhealthily low, as the body needs a minimal amount of fat to sustain life. For example, one of the more accepted theories about Bruce Lee's death was that he had been over training, had dropped from about 145lb to 125lb and his body fat was about 2%. The allergic reaction he had to the analgesic he took was made hyper allergic because he did not have the fat cells to absorb it's content safely.

One original point is true though, the higher the muscle mass the more oxygen is required to fuel the body, which has a detrimental effect on stamina. Most boxers do not do weight lifting partly for this reason, bulky mass is not beneficial to a boxer.

Actually, I think you make a really good point in mentioning the lack of endurance that could be to Haye's detriment.He doesn't do roadwork,which I think is an error.Seeing as there are the stamina doubts he is being a bit too cutesy,perhaps, in ignoring this.

Never seen him piling on the pounds like Hatton though to be honest and constantly staying in shape hasn't done B-Hop too much damage...

andygf wrote:Actually, I think you make a really good point in mentioning the lack of endurance that could be to Haye's detriment.He doesn't do roadwork,which I think is an error.Seeing as there are the stamina doubts he is being a bit too cutesy,perhaps, in ignoring this.

i see where you're coming from but both him and booth look at training very scientifically. in recent years it has been proven that sprint training is better for boxers than mile after mile on a road at 5am.

long runs hurt legs, knees, joints and ligaments. haye does many fast sprints, interval training, intense bursts of speed with little recovery time.

anyone who has ever done these know that this builds endurance better than road work.
i can run for 20 mins no problem, but ask me to do a few sprints and im knackered.