What should Haye have done?

I had Haye down to win by KO

I thought "the plan" He and Booth had worked out would have been to damage Wlad inside, I thought Haye would have been working on catching him with uppercuts inside and body shots, ala Tyson, and keeping a fierce pace

How wrong I was!

Thought Haye lost it in the opening seconds when Wlad walked straight across the ring and marched him back to the corner, I thought it might be over there and then

Broken toe and bravado aside what tactics would you have like to seen Haye use and what were you expecting?

Exactly what you said - get inside and put Wlad under pressure then, using the words of Russell Crowe, "Unleash hell!"

I think the enormity of the situation got to him.

I don't think there's any secret on how to beat Wladimir; aside from his brother, there's simply nobody on the planet right now who can stand off him and box expecting to win. It's all about getting inside that jab, and Haye and Booth will have known this as well as anyone. I honestly think that Haye, once he realised that Wladimir is a lot quicker than he thought, simply went in to survival mode and decided that he was going to lose on points and make an excuse afterwards, rather than simply try the aforementioned tactic of attempting to pressure Wladimir and work his way inside at the risk of being knocked out himself, as a knockout loss really would have blown out all the candles with regards to Haye wishing to be seen as any kind of challenger to the Klitschko's throne.

Took a gun in their with him.....However whether he could shoot straight with his poor little toe who knows...

Bob and weave your way in...keep low and then let your fists....go!!!

Takes bottle though.....probably need someone else to try it.

Unfortunately even with all the magnificent modern training techniques, organic foods etc...A heavyweight strap holder hasn't learned the art of slipping and countering the jab.

Jimmy Stuart wrote:Unfortunately even with all the magnificent modern training techniques, organic foods etc...A heavyweight strap holder hasn't learned the art of slipping and countering the jab.

But it was an organic, free range jab that was locally sourced.

Bob wrote:

Jimmy Stuart wrote:Unfortunately even with all the magnificent modern training techniques, organic foods etc...A heavyweight strap holder hasn't learned the art of slipping and countering the jab.

But it was an organic, free range jab that was locally sourced.

Ha ! Nice one Bob.

Very generous on the portion as well.

How about training to throw punches for 3 minutes of a round.

Haye went at Wlad with venom with about 3 or 4 proper punches a round.

Wlad is a big guy and can only set a slow pace.

Think of the volume of punches the greats were able to throw.

And that was before organic food. A hunger in the belly is good for a fighter.

Try having a plan based on boxing rather than knocking the guy out. Haye made Wlad miss enough times to at least land left hooks downstairs but it seems using his left hand was not an option.

Bigger punch out put, two handed attack and mix his work between head and body a lot more than his has done in his career.

Can not say this would definitely work but as David showed his will not crumble at the first shot that Wlad lands, I think he will be a little more confident about standing in the danger zone and try to make Wlad fight.

It still astounds me that he didn't seem to have a plan other than to telegraph overhand rights from 10 feet away and fall on the floor when lent on

The way he let Wlad walk him back at the start of the fight, it was as if there and then he realized what he'd let himself in for

He will say that his toe stopped him blah blah but the best thing he did on the night was move around, he looked pretty good on his feet for me

Guess he did just freeze, and a rematch or fight with Vitali is a joke but I can see it happening

I think the obvious things were he needed to be more aggressive and take more risks. He fell into the same net as all the other Klitschko opponents of the last 8 years insofar as he just couldnt get his own offence going. For me, after a few rounds he realised the task was too tough, he felt the sting of Wlads jabs and decided to lose on points and try avoid as much punishment as possible rather than put himself in the firing line of Wlads right hand.

On thing that did surprise me was the excessive falling and trying to con the ref. Obviously Hayes tactic was to avoid being manhandled by Wlad but there were a couple of occasions where he actually got in range and rather than focus on trying lo land a big one when he was close he was content to slip. I could understand if Wlad was genuinely crushing him but in many cases he had barely touched him. Surely with Haye actually getting in range it would be a good opportunity to throw a few a combinations.

Instead it looked to me like the sole gameplan was to stay as far away as possible and try catch Wlad with a singles from distance which was every bit as limited as Wlads jab policy, and far less effective.

Booth and Haye insisted prior to the fight that Haye's style and personality were a nightmare for Klitschko, but it turned out to be the other way around. I think they thought they could walk in, outspeed him and knock him out.

Haye never has, and never will be a fighter that throws lots of punches per round or that throws combinations. He's a mover/pot shotter/power puncher similar to a latter-career Hamed.

He lacks the fundamentals to compete with a big competent heavyweight like Wlad. Like eezer says, he realised straight away what he'd let himself in for and that Klitschko was a lot faster than he'd anticipated.

Not sure he could have done a lot more to be honest.

Thing is - once Haye decided to follow a pot-shot strategem - it guaranteed that Wlad would continue his jab-jab-jab-jab-jab-jab-jab-jab-rightcross-jab-hold stratagem.

Wlad was racking up the rounds, everyone knew it - and so he wasn't forced to be more aggressive. If Haye had thrown more combinations and punches in bunches - Wlad would have had to retaliate in kind. He didn't so the fight didn't catch light.

Just watch a load of clips from the past 2 days with Haye being interviewed.

Its absolutely ridiculous!

He is now in the delusional bracket with his friend Mr Harrison.

I agree I thought Haye needed to get inside and throw body shots, hooks, uppercuts etc. I also thought he needed to throw punches in 4 and 5’s missing with the first couple but getting himself in range.

Think is this isn’t his style, he likes to keep his hands low, stay on the outside and use single counter shoots, which is what he has always done and he couldn’t change.

I saw Booths interview outside the hotel on Sunday and he said from round 6 or 7 onwards he was telling Haye to do things and he just couldn’t or wouldn’t do them but was stuck in the same style throwing the odd optimistic hayemaker.

Just try to be busier throwing more punches.

He had the chances as he was making Wlad miss a lot with the Jab throughout the fight, which was the most frustrating part.

Of course becoming more open could of ended with Wlad catching him, and KO'ing him but I cannot for the life of me see why he wasn't throwing more leather.
Wasn't like Haye was gassing going into the 12. To me he finished with the fight a fair bit of energy left.

for me haye just didnt start anywhere near fast enough, thats when wlad would be most vunerable, he needed to work inside and explode and yes he needed to rick being caught and ko'd himself but if he had lost that way afeter 4/5 rounds of thunder and maybe rattled wlad then people might avtually ask for a rematch, haye really did telegraph those long shots and wlad was able to just step back or parry them with his left arm. Size was a huge factor but hayes gameplan needed to be riskier, you cant treat wlad like valuev he is a hundred times better at boxing.

www.maineventboxing.wordpress.com

I don't understand why he didn't go to the body?

He is a shorter fighter, get round the jab (easier said than done) and throw 3-4 body shots. If it starts having an effect throw 1-2 and add a hook or uppercut.

Hell throwing anything would have been an improvement.

What was he allowed to do as well though? lets not get carried away this guy told us and alledgedly thought he was the second coming of Ali/Frazier and ran all night and fell over repeatedly every time Wlad closed in, an absolute disgrace of a guy and fighter in my eyes who i hope retires and keeps it shut in future, or better still anyway just talk and look a bit of a plonker like he looks now!.

I cant believe he didn't try the upper cut.

Wlad expertly maintained arms length distance from Haye going forwards and backwards... If Haye got inside Wlad leaned on and smothered him, forcing him onto the mat. If Haye backed off Wlad chased to keep him on the end of the jab.

If Haye had come in with lateral head movement , Right hook over the jab and timed the uppercut as Wlad leans in he would have unlocked Wlad's game plan.

I actually think Haye would be better off against Vitali because he doesnt control the distance as clinically. However, he'd be more likely to be counting sheep too. An easier tactical but more dangerous fight in my opinion.

eezerthegeezer wrote:It still astounds me that he didn't seem to have a plan other than to telegraph overhand rights from 10 feet away and fall on the floor when lent on

~ Why sir, it beggars belief that the WBA actually allowed their greatest superchampion ever to put his title on the line after Mr. Audley held him at bay with no more than a bad shoulder and feints for near 3 rounds.

Mr. Haye certainly deserves respect for showing up for the British national anthem so as to give all the soft lads a proper cry which is all they really wanted.

huw wrote:I don't understand why he didn't go to the body?

He is a shorter fighter, get round the jab (easier said than done) and throw 3-4 body shots. If it starts having an effect throw 1-2 and add a hook or uppercut.

Hell throwing anything would have been an improvement.

I agree about the body. Lennox mentioned throwing in bunches of 4 and 5 and he should have started on the body. Wlad is so tall and had such a high guard, pawing the left to block Haye's overhand rights as he came in, the body was wide open! He should have mixed up the shots, not relentless pressure but at least thrown a variety. I'd have found that more favourable than tumbling to the ground at every opportunity; he could have been digging at the ribs!

Haye will have some major regrets about the fight i'm sure. Gaps were there but his myopic, overhand right approach was never going to test them, let alone exploit them.

qc2 wrote:

huw wrote:I don't understand why he didn't go to the body?

He is a shorter fighter, get round the jab (easier said than done) and throw 3-4 body shots. If it starts having an effect throw 1-2 and add a hook or uppercut.

Hell throwing anything would have been an improvement.

I agree about the body. Lennox mentioned throwing in bunches of 4 and 5 and he should have started on the body. Wlad is so tall and had such a high guard, pawing the left to block Haye's overhand rights as he came in, the body was wide open! He should have mixed up the shots, not relentless pressure but at least thrown a variety. I'd have found that more favourable than tumbling to the ground at every opportunity; he could have been digging at the ribs!

Haye will have some major regrets about the fight i'm sure. Gaps were there but his myopic, overhand right approach was never going to test them, let alone exploit them.

He did go to the body a few times but realised this was leaving his head and chin exposed - he was terrified of being kayoed.

ThrowingLeather wrote:I cant believe he didn't try the upper cut.

Wlad expertly maintained arms length distance from Haye going forwards and backwards... If Haye got inside Wlad leaned on and smothered him, forcing him onto the mat. If Haye backed off Wlad chased to keep him on the end of the jab.

If Haye had come in with lateral head movement , Right hook over the jab and timed the uppercut as Wlad leans in he would have unlocked Wlad's game plan.

I actually think Haye would be better off against Vitali because he doesnt control the distance as clinically. However, he'd be more likely to be counting sheep too. An easier tactical but more dangerous fight in my opinion.

Throw the uppercut? you winding me up?
If your not in range, which Haye never was that punch is totally ineffective, and leaves you hugely off balance, and open to any counter punch, baffled by that comment in all honesty.

YOung_Towzer

Are you for real?

Are you seriously saying I suggested he throw an uppercut whilst out of range?!

If you read carefully, with your eyes I mean, you'll see that I suggested an upper cut on the inside... which is where Haye should have been... I also suggested he get there by lateral head head movement and moving in off the right hand over Wk's jab.

Strongback wrote:How about training to throw punches for 3 minutes of a round.

Haye went at Wlad with venom with about 3 or 4 proper punches a round.

Wlad is a big guy and can only set a slow pace.

Think of the volume of punches the greats were able to throw.

And that was before organic food. A hunger in the belly is good for a fighter.

Wlad is quite a busy fighter. He has thrown an average of 53 punches a round over his last four fights (so I read), which is way above average for the division. Vitali holds the heavyweight record for punches thrown over twelve rounds.

Klitschko battered him, he'll be known as a huge mouthed plonker who got humbled

1) thrown more punches
2) gone to the body more
3) not blames a toe injury afterwards

Haye is a big mouth but has had a v good career up untill saturday night .

It would be wrong just to judge him on that display still his pre fight antics have proably helped people make their minds up about him.