England team discussion Vs Argentina

Rules: Can only pick from the World Cup 30. Pick who you would play, and state why.

1. Sheridan
2. Thompson
3. Cole
4. Lawes
5. Palmer
6. Croft
7. Moody (C)
8. Haskell
9. Wigglesworth
10. Wilkinson
11. Armitage
12. Tindall
13. Tuilagi
14. Ashton
15. Foden

16. Hartley
17. Stevens
18. Corbisiero
19. Wood
20. Easter
21. Youngs
22. Flood

Only heard Deacon's name mentioned once against Ireland, and that was for giving away a penalty for not rolling away, otherwise I was impressed with the pack. Moody to come back and lead the team in place of Fourie (who isn't in the 30, and only lasted 20 minutes in this match).

In the back-line, I would have started with Armitage ahead of Cueto. As it happened, Armitage got 60 minutes on the wing against Ireland and looked strong, so I would stick with him. He also scored as many tries in that 60 minutes as Cueto has in a long time in an England shirt! Otherwise the backline did well. I would like to see Youngs in there, but not in such an important game without any test rugby behind him this summer, so I would stick with Wigglesworth for now.

The main battle will be up front, especially the scrum, and with Sheridan and Moody coming off injury lay-offs I've gone for 3 front-row on the bench and 2 back row to cover this. Fresh legs coming on in the forwards around the 60 minute mark should help us close the game out and hopefully secure the win. Youngs can cover scrum-half and the back-three (with Armitage moving to full-back if Foden gets injured), while Flood can cover 10, 12 and 13. Youngs and Flood can also be brought on as potential game-breakers if we're trailing.

This is obviously a must-win game if we are to top the pool, and a bonus point isn't a necessity in my opinion, especially if we can deny Argentina a losing bonus point. If we play exactly as we did against Ireland and come away with a 20-9 win against Argentina, that will be job done and we can move on, which is why I've gone for a consistent team selection.

Injuries aside yes you have picked the starting XV...would have Cueto as extra back cover and drop Corbs off the bench.....this team will blow Argies away, very strong pack, bring on Hartley and Stevens for some rampaging in the loose on the hour. Flood only when game is won. Cracking back 3, huge penetration in the centre and good defensively. Jonny to keep pressure up.

Can't see any weaknesses and believe Eng will walk their group now....their first test will be France.

That is a whole lot of confidence and momentum.

Gatts wrote:Injuries aside yes you have picked the starting XV...would have Cueto as extra back cover and drop Corbs off the bench.....this team will blow Argies away, very strong pack, bring on Hartley and Stevens for some rampaging in the loose on the hour. Flood only when game is won. Cracking back 3, huge penetration in the centre and good defensively. Jonny to keep pressure up.

Can't see any weaknesses and believe Eng will walk their group now....their first test will be France.

That is a whole lot of confidence and momentum.

I'm trying to not get carried away. Yes, Tindall and Tuilagi looked good against Ireland and the England performance was generally much improved, but I've seen this England team blow hot and cold too much to think the group stage is a formality. I think we will top it, but with at least one of the two big games being pretty close (probably dare I say it the Scotland one!).

As for the team the OP suggests, I like it. I would personally start with Easter and put Haskell on the bench though, but I wouldn't be aghast if they were the way around you said.

No one seems to have noticed that Courtney Lawes played most of the game as a back row and yet we still looked good at the breakdown! A great performance (stupid pass notwithstanding)

I do like the look of that team i realy do. How ever how fit is Moody? Will he be fit enough for the Argentina game?

I was thinking after the Ireland game how many of the England team named by Martin Johnson is actualy fit enough to make any sort of start in the First game?

Just out of interest what's the score with Fourie now, is he in or out of the squad.

Why didn't MJ use one of the 30 man squad he had already picked?

robbo277 wrote:
Only heard Deacon's name mentioned once against Ireland, and that was for giving away a penalty for not rolling away

Isn't that what Deacon does? Nothing spectacular - but just plain efficient at it [ed his job that is - not nothing!].

bedfordwelsh wrote:Just out of interest what's the score with Fourie now, is he in or out of the squad.

Why didn't MJ use one of the 30 man squad he had already picked?

Because the back row options were:

Croft - Selected
Haskell - Selected
Wood - Injured 2 days before
Easter - Injured just before
Moody - Already Injured

So he selected Fourie for the one off (he is clearly first choice replacement) and as it turned out, Fourie got injured (and so Lawes played back row).

I don't think Fourie is in the squad still - especially as he's injured now too.

Sheridan
Thompson
Cole
Deacon
Palmer
Wood
Moody (c)
Haskell
Wigglesworth
Wilkinson
Armitage
Tindall
Tuilagi
Ashton
Foden

Big strong pack, solid half backs and an exciting backline.
Around the 50 min-60 mark. Bring on the exciting and more dynamic subs e.g. Hartley, Stevens, Lawes, Croft, Flood, Maybe even Simpson.

Does that mean Robshaw is potentially on standby?

Portnoy wrote:

robbo277 wrote:
Only heard Deacon's name mentioned once against Ireland, and that was for giving away a penalty for not rolling away

Isn't that what Deacon does? Nothing spectacular - but just plain efficient at it [ed his job that is - not nothing!].

Sure, but I'd prefer to have Lawes and Palmer in the team, who contribute positively to the team, rather than just tick along with the team.

Deacon had a good Six Nations and if Lawes or Palmer were injured I'd see him straight in the team. But I don't think he should start over either Lawes or Palmer, and I don't think he can add any value as a sub.

He calls the lineout, Hits rucks, is effective at setting up mauls.
Tigers know about locks, He's an effective player.

I don't disagree, but is he better than Lawes or Palmer? And does he add anything as a substitute?

He can to use the old phrase "close out a game" but he isn't going to make a good break, or use an offload to make a winning try.
I included him in my team as he is a strong physical player, Let Lawes come on after 50 mins and do what he does best.

robbo277 wrote:
16. Hartley
17. Stevens
18. Corbisiero
19. Wood
20. Easter
21. Youngs
22. Flood

It's great to see such a strong looking bench!

I can't argue with your first XV either. Particularly pleased to see that Armitage seems to be getting back to his best too.

flankertye wrote:Does that mean Robshaw is potentially on standby?

potentially, depending on whether fourie's injury is anything serious.

Also, were Easter or Haskell to be injured, they would possibly call up Waldrom as a spare number 8.

God I'd hate to see Waldrom at 8.
I'd much rather see Robshaw called up and Wood moved to 8.

flankertye wrote:God I'd hate to see Waldrom at 8.
I'd much rather see Robshaw called up and Wood moved to 8.

Surely worst things can happen? Or are you against Waldrom playing as he only discovered this English Grandmother this spring?

I've no problem with the residency rule, however his reasons for wanting to represent England, To show New Zealand what they missed out on didn't sit well with me.
Also, I quite like Tigers. Don't want to see them without any number 8 cover now Crane is injured.

It will be Waldrom if Easter gets injured, but I think Narraway should have got the nod for the summer squad.

I think England have made a big error in putting so much faith in Mark Cueto, once again he was in a position to ping his ears back and go for the line and he didn't surely the whole point of a winger is to get the ball in open space and to go for it?

Armitage has to start on the wing IMO, shame Sharples wasn't given a run out in the warm ups.

robbo277 wrote:It will be Waldrom if Easter gets injured, but I think Narraway should have got the nod for the summer squad.

Narraway was injured in the first Churchill cup game wasn't he? Don't know how serious it was but he missed the last two games completely.

I haven't heard anymore about Narraway. Like I said, hope Robshaw gets the nod if an injury occurs.

BATH_BTGOG wrote:I think England have made a big error in putting so much faith in Mark Cueto, once again he was in a position to ping his ears back and go for the line and he didn't surely the whole point of a winger is to get the ball in open space and to go for it?

Armitage has to start on the wing IMO, shame Sharples wasn't given a run out in the warm ups.

Cueto was injured when he received the ball (I've read that he was having back spasms) so probably wasn't up to a full-pitch sprint.

I do agree though that Armitage should start. He's back on form and looks confident.