Haskell puts the boot into team mates

Interesting post-match press conference today:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/14965366.stm

A career in PR surely beckons for James Haskell.

Some of Big Jim's carefully worded, non-inflammatory words as follows:

"People have got to start pointing some fingers and saying 'This is not acceptable'.

"Johnno is not happy, the coaches are not happy - the players need to look at themselves and realise they are not working as hard as they should be.

"People should be excited about this team, excited about our performances, but we are letting ourselves down. We are stuck in a bit of a mire.

"Look at the good sides - they have that control. Whatever happens, you feel they are going to win. With England at the moment it is, 'This could go either way'.

"We are not in control and there is uncertainty which makes everyone go: 'Christ what's going on?'."

"You can't even begin to play your game if every time you do something there's a penalty.

"You are just on the back foot, tackling, get up, penalty. It is like banging your head against the wall. That is not acceptable with the players and talent we have got."

As a neutral, this is just plain weird.

England may not have put 40 points on each opponent, but they've won each match to date and currently top the group on points difference, having already beaten the highest ranking seed in their group.

What in the name of Oprah does he think the squad has to gain by squirting vitriol in public?

Why show a lack of unity in a squad? Surely it cannot be gamesmanship.

I'm no expert on the English squad management so I'd be grateful for some of the regulars' best guesses at what the smeg is going on.

I've never known a team get so much stick for a 31 point victory. We will step up when we have to.

"Look at the good sides - they have that control. Whatever happens, you feel they are going to win. With England at the moment it is, 'This could go either way'.

"We are not in control and there is uncertainty which makes everyone go: 'Christ what's going on?'."

I think he has a point there . I am never confident watching England these days and constantly think that the opposition is going to score through a daft mistake caused by a forced offload or a rubbish kick

Maybe Haskell has got the go ahead from "the management" to express displeasure at the pointless giving away of stupid penalties

Really, that was the only downside to the England performance today. I don't really see Haskell as a mouthpiece for the management - to do their dirty work, but who knows

I for one am happy one of the players has come out and said something to this effect. At least we know the players and the team want to perform better and know in part where they are going wrong. Im expecting a huge performance against Romania and hopefully more game time for Simpson as well

Well i dont know what Haskell was expecting from England today.

A win is a win, does not matter if you win by 1 point or 31 points, the point is you win.

Maybe some player/s was trying a bit to hard, Mat Banahan for example trying them Sony Bill Willialms off load out of the back door.

England so far winning, so let save the moaning and groaning for when England are not winning.

EnglishReign wrote:I've never known a team get so much stick for a 31 point victory. We will step up when we have to.

England expects.

Surprised by Haskell's naive outburst, if players have issues they need to stay in camp. It gives succour to the enemy to know that England are not functioning as they would like.

The stick is because you guys are successful at RWC and have a ton of talent but seem somehow disjointed.

Still got the win and the bonus point. I hope Scotland game is a test because you need a stern one before quarters.

Argentina was the stern test

I expect a more disciplined performance against Romania and a big win. Then England will go back to their own ways against Scotland and it being a much closer match than world rankings dictate

You just know Haskell is going to have a mare in his next game - who the feck does he think he is

Compared to what went on at the last world cup, albeit behind closed doors this s pretty mld.

Also think about Steve Borthwick interviews

I cant Imagine Johnno has a problem iwth him saying ths, its exactly what he will have been telling the players, thy need to take responsibility for sloppy penalty heavy play.
Part of it is down to them being too easily bullied at the breakdown, but they have to stop reacting by losing their heads and giving away stupid penalties.

Fair play to Haskell. I used to think he was a muppet but he's really grown in my estimation this season. He's not the brightest spark or most talented footballer but hes a great athlete and really works hard for the side.

A few of the younger guys, namely Ashton and Hape seemed to be in cloud cuckoo land in the post match interviews. Scoring a load of late tries against a tiring tier 2 side does not put a positive spin on a poor and amateurish performance.

Johnson was rightly furious as a lot of those penalties were just idiotic and he knows that against a better side that they would have been punished.

I think those are very valid points from Haskell and he deserves respect.

I agree with Haskell.

Yes, England got the win. However, the game was too close at half time, and Georgia had had far and away the better possession. Georgia would have been ahead at the break if they'd had any sort of backline. In fact, if they'd landed their kicks, they would have gone in in front anyway. A good team shouldn't get dominated like that by the likes of Georgia.

England were always going to be stronger in the second half. Especially when Georgia needed to make quite a few changes to injury.

The fact is that if England get dominated like that in the first half by a decent team, there's no coming back. Top teams won't tire. It's complacent to say that 'a win is a win.' Where's the evidence that England have it in them to step up when it counts?

I think it's right from Haskell to say this. The players should be honest in their appraisal.

The English discipline in this world cup has been appalling so far and a better side than Argentina and Georgia would have punished England for it.

It is good to see that England acknowledge their flaws. Papering over the cracks helps nothing.

Haskell http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/14965366.stm

And some commentary on R5 by Flood seem to indicate that there are headless chickens inside the English fold.

The penalty count is mounting and some English players are getting frustrated.

Are the lunatics going to take over the asylum again?

And will they yet again get to another RWC final?

I'm more confident England will get better and better at the RWC with each passing hour.

It was a great result yesterday, one which will have the other teams wake up and take notice of England once again.

The Webb Ellis Cup is heading back to the NH.

Well, Ireland have handed them a huge favour this weekend (who would've thought?)

England's odd's of reaching the final have now been slashed, making them odds-on to occupy one of the final births.

Barring further up-set, and ill-advisedly predicting an AB victory over France next weekend (I'm not saying I am, I'm saying the bookies are), then SA and Aus will be squared off against each other in a knock-out, followed by (as the bookies predict) NZ v the Winner to face the victor of England, Ireland, Wales or France. All likelihood is that Ireland have played their final already, France are too erratic to win two knock-out games and Wales, well, are Wales. Which puts England up against SANZAR opposition in the final.

England now third favourites to win the tournament based on performance-weighted calculations and despite poor pool form. We also can't ignore the number of NH refs likely to be responsible for determining the finalists.

Well done game to game:

Aus should beat SA really considering SA injuries and general form Sat aside)

NZ should be Scot/Argentina no real surprise there

Ireland should beat Wales. If they play the way they can. Some things to fix but overall a better team than Wales.

England vs France is not very clear cut. England do well against France and have WC tempermeant, so ENG???

So NZ vs Aus. = NZ realistically unless there can be an upset

Eng vs Ire. = England's world cup tempermeant versus Ireland generally always playing well against England.

I think if Ireland get to the semi's and it is against England they should get to the final if it against France I reckon France will then.

hmm it looks like there's a few chickens being counted here before they've hatched.....

If there's two things I've learn't never to do in all the years I've been watching Ireland at rugby, it's to write them off or back them

yes but Ireland (unfortunately) have only ever had one good game in them per rwc, all the passion and firing up of the players only works as a one-shot and the irish are pretty much the best at this.

Finding a personal grudge or an emotional hook is their way of winning one off games, it works, but they're never consistent enough. Mind you with possible Wales in their quarter final its all to play for .

PS: unlike hersh Im NOT happy with englands performance, all i could see in that game were areas where Wales, Ireland, SA and NZ would kill us in

Its good to see the other home nations starting to pull their weight in the Rwc, bless them everyone likes an underdog

Actually I don't mean to be obtuse but Ireland usually don't have any big performances in them per RWC..... ....and if what usually happens had any sigificance to the present situation then Ireland would have lost

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Well done game to game:

Aus should beat SA really considering SA injuries and general form Sat aside

It would depend on which SA team and which Ozzie team pitched up, based on the last few weekends.

back on topic, I'm glad to read what Haskell said (the full interview, not the excerpts the press are pedalling) it good points being rammed home.

Haskell, Shaw, Foden, Ashton and Flood all fronted up in that match. Tommo and Croft did well too.

Banahan looked good in his two chrges up until he tried to off load behind and reverse without looking ....twice.

at his height he has no excuse for not getting his elbows above the tackle and offloading propely

Wood was AWOL, Hartley needs a kick up the arse and Manu needs to use his eyes and brain more.

After the Ireland result I think Wales, England, Ireland and France will now secretly be fancying their chances.

Irelands' confidence will be high after their win.

Wales will know they can play to a level to challenge the big boys and beat England last time out.

France are just France who knows.

England will think they can beat them all and would most probably go into any potential quarter or semi final game as favourites.

BUT could they be to big for their boots. One thing that England need to be wary about is he penalty count.

Depsite all the talk about the WC ball you can guarantee that when they face Scotland in the pool if they give away all those penalties then Paterson won't miss as many kicks as the Pumas or Georgians did.

One little thing WIN your group before crowing,,Scotland may well have something to say about that.A France win would mean by your Calculations
a NZ v England qtr final.
Assuming Canada do`nt do a number on them and knock them out of the Tournament.NOW that would be an upset as to other combinations Australia on form so far the Boks will be feeling very confident,unless Ireland stuff up against Italy.
Ireland have the game to strangle you,Francethe goal kickers to punish your indsicipline.Yachvili and Parra are currently among the RWCs most successful kickers.
Theres five games before the Final for ALL teams,and a lot of Rugby and maybe a few more surprises to come.
Wales have a recent win over you too,take NOTHING for granted England have a long way to go yet.

I don't think it's quite 2007 revisited. England were REALLY poor in the lead up to the 2007 WC and even worse during the group games. 36 - 0 anyone???

Though England have had their fair share of poor games in the past year or so they have also beaten Australia twice, beaten Ireland and France and won the Six Nations. I'm certainly not saying this England team are anywhere near a great team - but they have shown that they can be a very good one on their day.

England in the final? Maybe, I'm certainly not complaining about the potential run in....No chicken counting yet....but three cup finals in a row would be a remarkable achievement considering they have been relatively poor since 2003.

but they have shown that they can be a very good one on their day.

Ahh, but on OUR day, we can BEAT..................

andy powells minder wrote:but they have shown that they can be a very good one on their day.

Ahh, but on OUR day, we can BEAT..................

not what I was saying - in fact I don't think England would be NZ or SA in this competition, but I'd fancy their chances against anyone else..

I'd have to say that at the minute, I think everybody thinks that they can beat just about anyone else. Usually i'd add a pinch of salt to that, but seriously with the weekends results, its open wide as far as I'm concerned.

Good luck everyone, well almost everyone.......................

rugbyfan wrote:in fact I don't think England would be NZ or SA in this competition

Doesn't stop us from trying.....get it? Hartley, Hape, Stevens....any more? I thought there were more than that?

HammerofThunor wrote:

rugbyfan wrote:in fact I don't think England would be NZ or SA in this competition

Doesn't stop us from trying.....get it? Hartley, Hape, Stevens....any more? I thought there were more than that?

must remember to check my posts before pressing send!!

actually has anyone read the full interview, not the cut n past of the BBC..?


He makes sense and most of what he's saying I think fans agree with

Italy could beat Ireland, so nobody is counting chickens.

If Ireland do beat Italy we would have Wales in the Quarters. This is as it stands a 50-50 game and would be a real cracker!!!

England will top a poor group and head into a match against France as underdogs. France will blow them away.

If its an Ireland France SF, you'd back France.

I can see it being a repeat of the 1987 final.

Could you pop up a link to the full interview? Is it on the RFU site?

http://www.rfu.com/News/2011/September/News%20Articles/190911_Haskell_post_Georgia.aspx

via the RFU tweets

http://sport.uk.msn.com/blog/james-haskell.aspx

and on MSn

Remember the last time France blew England away? Me neither.

Boyne wrote:
England will top a poor group and head into a match against France as underdogs. France will blow them away.

England may top an exceptionally physical pool. And I hope that Scotland will prevail.

England must prevail over over their shortcomings. As for France - their history is not too bad. To them France is an unstable side - but I'd far rather meet them than Ireland.

But the point of the post is that there is a possible schism in the England side where the players are likely to enforce their view on the management. Hence the 2007 analogy.

1st time for everything- as Ireland demonstrated by beating the 2nd favs for the competition.

France were class against Canada in the driving rain and have better players than England.

Then again, there is that "world cup pedigree" England fans are always on about... that might pull ye through.

Wouldn't bet on it though...

Cheers! I follow the tweets myself but haven't bothered to look for a couple of days. Should've looked there first...



Very good interview, felt he really addressed the main concerns well. Could this be Haskell putting his marker down as a future captain?

Boyne wrote:1st time for everything- as Ireland demonstrated by beating the 2nd favs for the competition.

France were class against Canada in the driving rain and have better players than England.

Then again, there is that "world cup pedigree" England fans are always on about... that might pull ye through.

Wouldn't bet on it though...

I wouldn't bet on anything - apart from the ABs to scoop the pot.

As an England fan, I'm not that pleased Ireland beat Australia and now look likely to win that group.

We've beaten Australia home and away in our last two matches, including our best performance of recent years, whereas our record against Ireland is abject. As such, I think our chances of making the final have actually gone down a bit in light of Ireland's well deserved win.

Oh, and I'm with Portnoy in that the only thing I'd bet on based on what's gone so far is that the ABs will win in the end.

I really don't have a problem with this. I am finding it hard to revise my previous opinion of Haskell, I haven't been a fan. Over the warm ups and into the tournament I have grudgingly had to accept he is a massively improved player and has every chance of becoming indispensable to England. Nothing in his comments is undermining of his team mates and shows an honesty that is very refreshing. This is a squad with enormous potential with relatively few exceptions and they have a great chance to prove something to themselves and the rugby world if they can grow quickly in self control and confidence. This might just suggest they are capable of that.

IF England win their group am I right in saying that the (likely) line up for the quarter finals would see NZ, SA, OZ and ARG/Scotland on the same side? Do we yet know who would likely play who in the quarters?

Irish fans getting carried away again after one decent win. Mind you when aren't they getting over-excited?

I'm with Portnoy, I haven't seen anything to suggest NZ won't be the winners, only that the team who they meet in the final may not now be the team we were expecting.

SA are starting to rumble into form though and I wouldn't rule Australia's out yet.

On the other half of the draw, if the remaining games go to form then we'll have 4 teams all capable of beating each other so who knows what will a happen?

Two more rounds of the group stages to go so things could look very different in 2 weeks time.

Possible future upsets/unexpected results could well change the quarters layout

Example

Italy beating Ireland

England loosing to Scotland

Wales to Fiji

SA to Samoa

Samoa to Fiji

NZ to France

All possibilities...!

I've always said that the toughest game for England will be the Scots and on current form neither team is going to run away with it.

But I still think we'll top the group even if we lose, Oh and win the RWC