Tip tackle bad,head butt good.

Sam Warburton got a ban for a pretty reckless piece of play,
yellow or red whatever but we all knew a ban would come,fair enough!

BJ Botha head butts Richard Hibbard in last weekends Pro 12 Munster v Ospreys game and gets let off because..and i quote...

"An independent Rabo Direct PRO12 Disciplinary Committee...considered the video evidence and listened to the player's explanation of the incident and found that, on the balance of probabilities, the incident that was cited was not an act of foul play under Law 10.4 (a).



Says it all really.

What does it say?

I don't understand what point you're making either. The citing committee haven't ruled that head-butting is allowed. They've ruled that it wasn't a head-butt.

Jeez...

If this world cup does nothing else it's helping to hone the research skills of amateur Welsh detectives.

I hope the 606v2 server can cope with discussions comparing Warburton's offence with every single piece of foul play ever.

Did you watch the game thou?
He walked up to him and head butted him!!!
pure and simple,
BJ crying off because he got done over at scrum time drops the nut on Hibbard

viewtothegym wrote:
He walked up to him and head butted him!!!

Were there witnesses?

So why was he let off?

I mean this in an honest question way, not in an "I want to hear a conspiracy theory" way, if that helps.

Tupric gets a ban for a tip tackle on Keatley in the same game "and rightfully so"
But BJ gets a well a???? erm pat on the back.

So many strings being pulled behind the scenes by the IRFU?

greybeard wrote:So why was he let off?

I mean this in an honest question way, not in an "I want to hear a conspiracy theory" way, if that helps.

intent

Did you watch the game?

He head butted him in front of James Jones the ref and in full view of the cameras,
im just stunned that he can get out of it.

View, I suggest Wales spend less time worrying about scoring tries and kicking goals. They need more time practicing how to deal with refs - we're ace at it in Ireland. Thats our whole gameplan

Actually now that I think about it maybe it wouldn't hurt to do a bit of goal kicking practice. Leaving 17 points behind in missed kicks at goal in a semi final isn't acceptable.

on the balance of probabilities i love that line from this "independent committee"

what balance of probabilities?

Hibbard walked into Bothas head?

The Earth tilted by 0.002 degree on its axis and pushed Bothas head into Hibbards?

Botha got done in the scrum so went for a chat with his pal Hibbard had the wrong boots on with the shorter studs causing him to slide into Hibbards head?

Every season the rich and powerful prosper whilst everyone else has to sit down and accept it when they throw their weight around,the HC is a curse and goes to the head of the teams that win it,
they think they have the divine right to have it their way or the high way.

Ah, those poor penniless Galacticos.

viewtothegym wrote:
Every season the rich and powerful prosper whilst everyone else has to sit down and accept it when they throw their weight around,the HC is a curse and goes to the head of the teams that win it,
they think they have the divine right to have it their way or the high way.

The paranoia is strong in this one

This isn't the example you're looking for.

Ospreys may have money but they have zero say on how things pan out at the top table,
the exclusive clubs who like to keep it exclusive will never let the Ospreys in with them.

Course it is mate.

You did see the bit I mentioned about not looking for baseless conspiracy theories, yes? Just checking.

Personal issues and thoughts aside ok,

Warburton = tip tackle = ban

Turpric = tip tackle = ban

Botha = head butt = nothing

See the problem in this chain?

Go on S4c and rewatch the game if you want and you will see he walks up to him and drops the nut.

Well if N.Z. win on sunday then GreyGhost will no longer have any reason to sound off about Barnes in 2007 cheating them out of a WC.
It looks like we've found his replacement.

Do you find brand name tin-foil makes for a better hat, or is generic supermarket tin-foil just as good?

greybeard wrote:Do you find brand name tin-foil makes for a better hat, or is generic supermarket tin-foil just as good?

as protection from a head butt?

So your going to avoid talking about Botha clearly head butting Hibbard and turn this into a "if you don't agree with me you must be stupid" chat.

Im hear to talk rugby lad,so catch up and get on the same page.

Again did you see the match?

greybeard wrote:Do you find brand name tin-foil makes for a better hat, or is generic supermarket tin-foil just as good?

View all jokes aside I though Hibbard had butted Botha when I saw it. Botha certainly did his nut - I assumed as Hibbard had butted him. It was too long after the scrum had ended to be mere frustration I thought.

So any thoughts on how to get the Ospreys involved in the secret IRB Irish Politburo Meetings?

I didn't say you're stupid.

Having a moan and a whinge is all part of the fun isn't it. Great stuff. You get to find problems that aren't there, you can invent all sorts of theories, you can even pretend that a multi-Celtic League title winning team is one of the 'have nots'. That's not the same as being stupid, dear me.

It's fun to pretend.

View

You could argue that BJ pressed his head against Hibbard and in football that would have been a straight red i agree. Certainly couldnt be described as a 'butt' though.

SafeAsMilk wrote:If this world cup does nothing else it's helping to hone the research skills of amateur Welsh detectives.

I hope the 606v2 server can cope with discussions comparing Warburton's offence with every single piece of foul play ever.

Do you ever talk about your own team?

You are obsessed.

You love us.

greybeard wrote:Do you find brand name tin-foil makes for a better hat, or is generic supermarket tin-foil just as good?

Quite possibly the best post on 606v2 history

If you really want to compare decisions, when Rolland sent off Florian Fritz last season, the tackle was no where near as severe as Warburtons but it had actually involed Fritz driving the player to the ground

The RabD2 doing anything to Botha would involve censure of James Jones as it happened under his nose...

...we all know the begelled one is untouchable.

I think you are ignoring the fact that the disciplinary hearings in the RDP12 are a complete and utter farce.

There is no relation between it and the World Cup. If you want to talk about how much reform is needed for the disciplinary hearings in that competition I'm happy to indulge you, but what does it have to do with the World Cup? They are run by different bodies with, seemingly, different standards.

What I'm trying to say is i don't understand what Warburtongate has to do with this.

It hasn't anything to do with this. However it was a deliberate if ineffective headbut.

Glas a du wrote:The RabD2 doing anything to Botha would involve censure of James Jones as it happened under his nose...

...we all know the begelled one is untouchable.

Its kind of a guilty pleasure to admit this but i actually think James Jones has improved immensely. Dare i say it i think he is one of the leagues better refs.

Notch has a point regarding the disciplinary process in the Magners/Pro12 though

As i said it certainly couldnt be described as a 'butt' Glas, but it was certainly deliberate.

Well, I haven't seen it but if thats true I'm kind of disappointed he's gotten off. The disciplinary process in the RDP12 lacks credibility due to a long line of questionable rulings. We need an independent disciplinary panel set up to deal with incidents.

The whole episode looked more like something you would see at a football game. Thats what disappoints me.

Do you mean it was just a bit of macho posturing, guys squaring up to each other?

I don't think we need worry about that. A genuinely forceful headbutt could cause serious harm and would need to be dealt with seriously. Two guys squaring up to each other... well, they'll shake hands at the end and we'll all get on with our lives surely?

Standulstermen wrote:The whole episode looked more like something you would see at a football game. Thats what disappoints me.

Hear, hear. It was unedifying.

Notch

Substitute Botha and Hibbard for Ashley Cole and Cristiano Ronaldo and it would have seemed more likely. Put it that way

I think Gareth Davies made a good point in the commentary, Jones whistles a lot and makes a lot of noise, but if he were a teacher he would never really have control of the classroom.

"View all jokes aside I though Hibbard had butted Botha when I saw it. Botha certainly did his nut - I assumed as Hibbard had butted him. It was too long after the scrum had ended to be mere frustration I thought."

I saw the match and thought so too. As I recall, so did the commentator.

But he wasn't tipped above the horizontal

Naughty Ospreys for beating Munster at Thomond, at least they got a ban on Turpric even if they couldn't get the win at home.

Childish

Regarding the wording of the directive that we discussed a lot on the other thread, there's a good discussion of the "no regard" concept in relation to the incident by current and former players here:

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/worldcup/highlights.html?3084675,3084675,flash,257

Is that the Clive Norling interview Osprey. I thought he spoke very well.

The fact that Botha got off lightly (allegedly) and Warburton didn't does not make it right that Warburton wasn't sanctioned. Two wrongs don't make a right and all that. And I say that as someone who finds the lack of consistent enforcement in all areas of rugby law irritating.