Guys who could have been THE man.

Just been thinking about Vader, and it occurred to me that not only did he never win the E's strap, he was never the main man either.

Got me wondering, who else could have been a John Cena type face-of-the-company wrestler?

For me, there's 3, Yokozuna, Mick Foley and Rikishi.

Yoko won the strap and was a big draw but was never THE man in my eyes. I think he could have been had he not piled weight on.

Mick Foley for me was one of the hottest wrestlers ever at his peak. He's a 3 time champ but was never the company's main guy. I suppose he was unlucky in that Rock and Austin were already established, HHH was coming through and it seemed like they had big plans for Show, Kane and Taker.

Rikishi is another one who was a victim of circumstance. Like Foley, there were too many guys around the main event scene for him to really break away, and he never even got a run with the belt, which he should have in my opinion. After the Austin hit and run angle, he was one of the hottest heels in the world. Shame he couldn't keep his weight under control like Yoko couldn't.

Problem for Yoko was he was around when wrestling was on drop, same with Bret Hart the best guy of a bad era, when people were turning away. His weight was part of the character, I couldn't take him seriously after Hogan beat him in 3 minutes at Mania. Still probably the last serious monster heel of the time, no big guy barring Undertaker has really been taken that seriously since.

Never been a Rikishi fan, he only seemed popular in Too Cool, after the hit and run storyline with Austin he never gained his popularity back. But like you said so many were ahead of him anyway. Undertaker made him famous for a while.

Foley was one of the men, and was the man for about 3 weeks after the "that'll put butts in their seats" line, there were about 7 guys who were all in the same bracket back then. Pretty much all above Rikishi.

Vaders character and look just would never have worked as a main company guy, talent back in his day though.

Umaga very much they should have pushed the button on him and put him over Cena but once again they destroyed a promising talent by feeding him to the cash cow.

In regards to Vader, I think it is one of those instances where being with the WWE didn't evolve a character that was huge elsewhere. Vader is one my top 3 "big guys". He was huge in WCW with Harley Race, and had match after match with Sting for the title.

This is also someone who was huge in Japan and made a successful career over there. Oh and he could do a moonsault

Umaga, Carlito, Chris Masters, MVP and Matt Morgan are the ones that spring to mind

Possibly Kennedy and Albert as well

Ken Shamrock could have been the man, he was unlucky that he was at his best around the time Austin was reaching his peak

Without a doubt Owen Hart, always heard that he was due to getHHHs gimmick of The Game and receive a huge push after the Blue Blazer was done

Matt Morgan was one that could have been it, I remember reading an article on Morgan in OVW where he was the Blueprint and pulling out high flying moves then comes up to WWE with a stuttering gimmick

I always thought Mr. Ass was better than the level he attained.

If Billy Gunn could cut a promo he'd have been a World Champion

Electric Demon wrote:I always thought Mr. Ass was better than the level he attained.

I remember his feud with Eddie Guerrero it was some great stuff brought the best out of both guys and started Latino Heat

I think I'd agree with that Gaff.

I don't think he was bad at promoing, but he certainly wasn't great. A shame really. He had a good look. Good gimmick. Good moveset. Just shows how if even one element of the package lets you down, you'll never get to the top.

Another could be Bobby Lashley he was built up to probably be the next Lesnar then disappeared quickly after a loss to Cena.

Electric Demon wrote:I think I'd agree with that Gaff.

I don't think he was bad at promoing, but he certainly wasn't great. A shame really. He had a good look. Good gimmick. Good moveset. Just shows how if even one element of the package lets you down, you'll never get to the top.

Demon great promo skills can get the poorest worker over its been seen time and time again

marty2086 wrote:Without a doubt Owen Hart, always heard that he was due to getHHHs gimmick of The Game and receive a huge push after the Blue Blazer was done

Matt Morgan was one that could have been it, I remember reading an article on Morgan in OVW where he was the Blueprint and pulling out high flying moves then comes up to WWE with a stuttering gimmick

I've the rumours about Owen but I never really believed them, Hunter was well on his way to becoming a main man anyway, his Game gimmick didn't really push him, Owen was past it for me by 99, sure he could still go in the ring but he was difficult to work with due to his beliefs and the lack of morals that where rife back then, I've no doubt he could still have had a great few years left as far as performing goes but in terms of character he was languishing well behind Rock, Austin, HHH, Foley, Taker and Kane, thats not counting Vince too, he would always be respected but I think in wrestling terms he'd always just be Bret Hart's brother

WWE really dropped the ball with Morgan, he has got everything required to be a top star and world champion. It's interesting that Morgan was released and Sheamus hired, pushed and given two world tittle reigns within 18 months of being signed. Although very talented, IMO Sheamus isn't as talented, charismatic or athletic as Morgan, infact I think if you compare the two (top trumps style) Morgan would outscore Sheamus in every catorgary. I just believe that if they were going to push one of the two morgan would have been my pick.

does anyone think of ziggler when talking about billy gunn and what could of been?

I was thinking Kennedy when he was with the WWE, Due to cash in MITB at WM.....injured, was due to be named Vince's son which would have given him a big push, suspended (?) never seemed to happen for him but could have easily been at the top of WWE

All sorts of random names being thrown around here!!

Vader was a star made in WCW I think Vince sabotaged his WWF run because of this

Rikishi? Seriously.... They pushed him to the moon with the Who ran over Austin angle then had to give gig to Triple H when it became apparent he wasn't getting over

Yoko? How can you make a guy who build as being from Japan & not being able to speak English the face of the company?

I think you need to seriously ask yourself if you know what the term means

Billy Gunn had the look but not the IT factor...

Matt Morgan is a decent shout if the WWE marketing machine had got behind him he could of been massive.

I think they really dropped the ball on Goldberg he could of been the face of the company.

Of the current roster I think The Miz is the guy to take Cenas as the face of the company if & when Cena turns

big show.

In wcw he had a mean drop kick, and he could hit a moonsault which was damn impressive. Soon as he signed the ten year contract with wwe he gave up working out and took up eating burgers, he just stopped trying.

Fit, healthy and giving a damn, Paul Wight could have been huge, if you pardon the pun

Billy Gunn had a great gimmick? A reworking of Ed Leslie's Booty Man is a great gimmick?

Never rated him, never been impressed by him in the ring or on the mic. I've got no idea what his name is even doing in this thread.

Vader definitely should have been given a run with the WWF strap, perhaps the 'MOVE!' thing with Shawn counted against him?

Bret Hart in WCW would be my shout - they didn't really try to do anything with him for more than a week at a time. Classic WCW short-term shock booking but no ideas about character arcs.

The alpha-face will surely be The Miz - as Brady says.

He's got the X Factor for sure

Gregers wrote:Umaga, Carlito, Chris Masters, MVP and Matt Morgan are the ones that spring to mind

Possibly Kennedy and Albert as well

As in Prince Albert - are you kidding?

I always thought Test had it in him to be a World Champion. Good look, dominant big guy, could have used Steph as the heel mouthpiece.

Mr H wrote:I always thought Test had it in him to be a World Champion. Good look, dominant big guy, could have used Steph as the heel mouthpiece.

And now like too many hes in the big Royal Rumble in the sky!!

i think rikishi was mentioned in this topic.. one of his best moments.. cant believe i forgot about this!! crowd went ape!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHR36wY0e6c&feature=related

Bret Hart in WCW would be my shout - they didn't really try to do anything with him for more than a week at a time. Classic WCW short-term shock booking but no ideas about character arcs.

Agree that WCW just didn't have a clue but Bret's head was all over the place itself, he was a shadow of himself and Montreal 'screwed' him over in more way than one.

As in Prince Albert - are you kidding?

He went to Japan and improved tenfold, wrestling wise he's a lot better than most big guys in the industry.

Right back to one I always wished things had turned out differently for...

Brian Pillman. For me everyone goes on about Owen Hart and Eddie Guerrero as the most tragic deaths due to how big they could have been. Pillman could have eclipsed them both, he was the perfect foil to Austin, their chemistry was off the scale and as high as Austin's face rose a Pillman heel could have matched him.

Rob Van Dam back in 2001.

He was a breath of fresh air in the WWF and the fans took to him immediately. He should have won the title at No Mercy in my opinion.

Roddy Piper?

He only won the intercontinental title. Problem was being in Hogan's era, but you could draw comparisons with him and Austin.....he could have been the heel the fans love to cheer for.

Pillman is a great shout Hero..

Piper is another one although he was born in the wrong era had he been in his prime during the attitude era he'd of been a megastar

I always thought the ringmaster and Rocky Mavia could of been huge, just never got the push/gimmick they needed....

William Regal for me, he would of been a great heel similar to a JBL/ADR type who gets to the top and stays there by being cunning, smart and ruthless. He never would of worked as a face but as a heel I think he is one of the best of the 00's

currently the guy that screams out to me is Ziggler - I still don't really know where they are going with his association with Vicky?! Ziggler should be in the main event by now instead he was buried for no apparent reason when they drafted him from SD to Raw!?

In TNA I think Daniels deserved to become world champ at least once - his return run in ROH was superb and proved he can still put on great, entertaining and technical matches but then he came back to TNA only to lose again to AJ who is currently in limbo as far as his career is going. Now Daniels is back in the rut he was in before he left TNA.

I really think they set up Sheamus to fail even though he's a X2 WWE champion. Neither of his title reigns were impressive and he was booked as weak and cowardly. They should have maintained his monster heel gimmick far longer making him a real threat to Cena and Orton. I hope if he wins the WHC as a face that they keep the strap on him for several months and allow him to prove himself as a champion.

Dolph Ziggler is only 31, he has plenty of time to move up the ladder, and I think he will do just that. I think his time with Vickie is coming to an end now, and the fact that WWE trusted him to wrestle two matches in one night at Vengeance shows their faith in him.

Supposedly the head booker of Raw wasn't a fan of Sheamus hence his poor booking, but since his move to Smackdown he has been booked really well and now he is face, I think he can take the space left by Batista.

I wouldn't class Piper in this list, Roddy Piper did more for Pro Wrestling goin main stream than anyone else, Vince McMahon was the brains and Hulk Hogan was the recognisable hero but it was Piper's brilliance with Lauper & Mr T that gripped America that really got the ball rolling

I don't think Piper was ever suited to be the hero good guy man, he was born to be the antagonist bumhole who needed to be put in his place

Pillman is a fantastic shout. I really rated him back in the day, and the whole is he or isn't he crazy question could have been absolutely huge. The gun thing with Austin for me kicked off the Attitude Era.

I forgot to mention, though I'm sure someone has beaten me to it by now - but Shaun Staziak could have been immense!

Billy Gunn. Hell no. As well as not being able to talk very well, the guy was awful in the ring unless carried by someone else. Plus his gimmick revolved around him being obsessed with his own backside in a time when Stone Cold, the Rock, HHH and BikerTaker were all certifiable ass kickers. He wasn't even real IC title material.

While I agree that Matt Morgan would be a useful guy to have around, its a bit of an insult to Sheamus to compare the two. Sheamus has had good to great matches with lots of opponents and most importantly in various different styles of matches. Morgan has only really looked good against Angle and Styles, and frankly who doesn't? Taking into account that Sheamus has a unique look and charisma, and its not even close.

Vader was the man in WCW 1992-1993, but by the time he got to the WWF, Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels had changed the mould of what the WWF World Champion should be. I'm not saying Vader couldn't go because he could, but Hart and Michaels looked like well tuned athletes. Vader looked like a Hogan monster trapped in the wrong decade. Again, I want to reiterate that Vader was great, but North American wrestling had passed him by. Ironically, if he showed up on the scene now, you could slot him into Henry's spot and he'd be better at it too.

The three I'd say that could have been big players were Carlito, Kennedy and RVD. But they have themselves to blame as much as anyone for why they didnt make it all the way to the top.