Mike Ruddock (OBE) in the Frame for next Ireland coach?

First topic message reminder :

Mike is currently coaching Ireland under-20's. He is responsible for tutoring and promoting the plethora of talent pouring forth from our respective Academies - to the full squad. He is doing a great job.

He has form on the Big Stage. Won the SLAM in his 1st year with Wales. Just like Kidney with Ireland. But, as he has a hands-on handle, on the best talent coming through, it would seem that the man would have the edge on any outsider replacing Kidney. Who will be replaced in 2 years. Please Allah.


So. What do Irish (or Welsh) posters think? Is he the man on the Inside, to take over? Or,do we need more objectivity and an SH coach to take this squad up to where it belongs?

Could Mike be part of all that?

Unlike Kidney, The IRFU really need to plan ahead.

Thoughts?

DOD wrote:Buckley!...I am talking about Ross. Buckley was always flakey...so who else was there....what about TOL brilliant in 09 we were left with an ordinary Redden and Boss until Murray came along...guess what a couple of games for Munster and then he was catapulted into the irish set up and is now streets ahead of the others. What about Fitz he is playing well and no one would begrudge a call up now, but was jetisoned when required.

If you feel comfortable about having Wallace there instead of Darcy thats fine but not sure how you could say he is better than darcy. Regardless of ROGs form what about Sexton when he gets flakey which happens a lot (and hopefullly wont happen this season). The best players we had were playing with one or two possible discussion points...but they were still rubbish on occassions...but sure that was DKs fault....

Yes Buckley was flakey but he was persisted with for longer than was needed too,TOL was great in 09 but wasn't dropped until just before the WC about 1 and a half years too late,Reddan and Boss are nothing special but they were still better than TOL but steady Deccie wouldn't drop him.

Fitz was another player who was persisted with for far longer than he should have been.Yes he's playing well now and deserves another chance but he was brought back too early and played out of position because Kidney persists with his favourites too long.

On D'Arcy if anyone can mention a performance he has given since Kidney took over that comes close to Wallace when he played in the SH tours against NZ and Oz both when Bradley brought us down there and the 2010 tour you night start to convince me.

Finally yeah the poor performance of the good players consistently over 4 years definitely has something to do with the coaches,I don't see how anyone can argue differently,or do you think our struggles v Italy and Scotland (who were very poor for a while) had nothing to do with the coaches?

You never answered my question on why these player can do so well against the top european clubs but struggle against poor international sides home and away,I don't think anyone could argue that Toulouse aren't good enough to make it to the top 8 in international rugby.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

DOD wrote:Buckley!...I am talking about Ross. Buckley was always flakey...so who else was there....what about TOL brilliant in 09 we were left with an ordinary Redden and Boss until Murray came along...guess what a couple of games for Munster and then he was catapulted into the irish set up and is now streets ahead of the others. What about Fitz he is playing well and no one would begrudge a call up now, but was jetisoned when required.

If you feel comfortable about having Wallace there instead of Darcy thats fine but not sure how you could say he is better than darcy. Regardless of ROGs form what about Sexton when he gets flakey which happens a lot (and hopefullly wont happen this season). The best players we had were playing with one or two possible discussion points...but they were still rubbish on occassions...but sure that was DKs fault....

Yes Buckley was flakey but he was persisted with for longer than was needed too,TOL was great in 09 but wasn't dropped until just before the WC about 1 and a half years too late,Reddan and Boss are nothing special but they were still better than TOL but steady Deccie wouldn't drop him.

Fitz was another player who was persisted with for far longer than he should have been.Yes he's playing well now and deserves another chance but he was brought back too early and played out of position because Kidney persists with his favourites too long.

On D'Arcy if anyone can mention a performance he has given since Kidney took over that comes close to Wallace when he played in the SH tours against NZ and Oz both when Bradley brought us down there and the 2010 tour you night start to convince me.

Finally yeah the poor performance of the good players consistently over 4 years definitely has something to do with the coaches,I don't see how anyone can argue differently,or do you think our struggles v Italy and Scotland (who were very poor for a while) had nothing to do with the coaches?

You never answered my question on why these player can do so well against the top european clubs but struggle against poor international sides home and away,I don't think anyone could argue that Toulouse aren't good enough to make it to the top 8 in international rugby.

First up TOL...thats a matter of opinion. Some people think a badly playing TOL is still better than Redden. Plus he was injured quite a bit so not sure the point there. Boss is a has been.

Wallace in the SH was ok...not sure he you could say he was brilliant. Outside of mose ulster supporters you are the only person I know of who thinks Wallace has been a better option than Darcy....

Regarding performances....maybe it was because the players didnt play very well or didnt execute on the game plan. You also have an opposition playing in a certain style...it can also be down to the opposition as well and outside of the defeat to Scotland we have still beaten most teams. Not sure what you are expecting exhibition rugby. Secondly HC is completely different to International. There is no comparison in the speed and intensity and is completely different the quality level of the players is different. You seriously think Toulouse are good enough to make the top 8 in intl rugby. Are you frickin serious....after last night....

Sure Kidney has some questions to answer and maybe Luke Fitz is a case in point, but the lad has so much talent and is showing it again now he of course deserved a chance. However to completely exhonerate the players is rediculous. BOD, POC, Sexton, Kearney, ROG etc have all had nightmare games. Regardless of other aspects of the Welsh QF game our much vaunted backrow were very much second fiddle on the day. Rory Best summed it up that for a bunch of experienced players they played dumb rugby in that they themselves were not able to sort out the problem...and if you know anything about Kidney he allows the players to decide these things themselves....

DOD wrote:Regardless of other aspects of the Welsh QF game our much vaunted backrow were very much second fiddle on the day. Rory Best summed it up that for a bunch of experienced players they played dumb rugby in that they themselves were not able to sort out the problem...and if you know anything about Kidney he allows the players to decide these things themselves....

I'm not just talking about the QF,I'm talking about Kidney's entire tenure as Ireland coach.I can accept a one off bad performance as being down to the players but it's not a one off,it's 4 out of 5 games we vary from average to inept.This is why some people say the Oz match was down to the players and not the coach,the players can pull off a big game every once in a while but it's up to the coach to bring a team consistently to their best.I don't agree I think Kidney had a masterplan for that Oz game that came off perfectly,however I think he sacrificed 2 years of results planning for that one game and then once we won it he had no clue of what to do next.

Kidney has still not fixed the problems that existed in the Irish team in 2010 but more damning is that he's hardly even tried,the team that won the Grand Slam has hardly changed and any changes that have occured have been almost exclusively down to injury or retirement.

I think you are talking through your rear end to be honest. The team that won the grandslam has changed rather a lot new front row, and SOB, Murray who else would you change over the years, Darcy or BOD maybe, Kearney, Earls,Bowe, POC, DOC...Sexton and ROG have been interchangable (due to sextons inability to play well for Ireland)

maybe you would like to have some of the u20's playing in the senior team.

The players are given the opportunities. Look you dont like Kidney thats fine...dont make up stuff like it was the players in the game against Aus. Of course it was, but it was also the players against Wales, or Scotland etc. Try to put some intelligence into the arguement rather than making stuff up.

DOD wrote:I think you are talking through your rear end to be honest. The team that won the grandslam has changed rather a lot new front row, and SOB, Murray who else would you change over the years, Darcy or BOD maybe, Kearney, Earls,Bowe, POC, DOC...Sexton and ROG have been interchangable (due to sextons inability to play well for Ireland)

maybe you would like to have some of the u20's playing in the senior team.

The players are given the opportunities. Look you dont like Kidney thats fine...dont make up stuff like it was the players in the game against Aus. Of course it was, but it was also the players against Wales, or Scotland etc. Try to put some intelligence into the arguement rather than making stuff up.

Sigh have you read my post,I never said it was the players that won the game against Oz,it's very hard for me to debate with someone who isn't listening to my side of the argument.You accuse me of not arguing intelligently but you're the one making stuff up.

The entire front row have been replaced because of injury and retirement,SOB is in because of an injury to Wallace,Murray is in because TOL was brought back every time he had a semblance of fitness and persisted with despite playing like a drain time after time.Kidney doesn't like Reddan that's obvious so he was quick to replace him when Murray came through but we suffered 2 years of TOL being parachuted back as soon as he was fit before that happened.It's not even his fault he was never given the chance to recover properly and so was bound to fail.

I did like Kidney,I was delighted when he got the job and felt he was the right man to take us forward but my faith has been eroded as game after game he has not fixed the problems in the team.The final straw was 2010 when the worst S.A. team I've ever seen blew us off the park for 60 minutes,after that I knew he was never going to get this team to play to their potential consistently.

DOD wrote:
First up TOL...thats a matter of opinion. Some people think a badly playing TOL is still better than Redden. Plus he was injured quite a bit so not sure the point there. Boss is a has been.

A good playing O'Leary is not as good as Reddan

If the players aren't good enough to play the way kidney wants than they shouldn't have been picked. If that is the way kidney wants us to play then he should not be in charge of Ireland any longer. Either way its down to coaching. We've had two years of us playing poor rugby that doesn't even win us games, if we had the results it would be debatable but 2 or 3 good games in 2 years is not good enough!

Mike Ruddock had the under 20s playing some poor rugby. It shouldnt be about winning or losing at that level yet the team looked afraid of making mistakes. Maybe hed do better with the national squad but i don't liked the way he approached the under 20s.

oh look lads..stick to the rugbu games on playstation....its about right for you.

DOD wrote:oh look lads..stick to the rugbu games on playstation....its about right for you.

Lol you need to take lessons from Sin when he loses an argument he changes the subject instead of just giving up and pretending he knows best,at least try to address my point about how you completely misread my post and then went off on one accusing me of making things up.