Disappointing

I understand England may feel aggrieved, but the general reffing yesterday was poor, the bbc are reporting as if there was some injustice that England lost because the English physio says the ball was down

It's all ifs and buts again

George north knocking the ball out - you can do that in goal area - which he would claim he was - scrum to England.

Would flood have kicked the goal?

Should robshaw missed a chunk of the game?

The headlines should be Wales winning in twickenham because that's a fact

I agree, one strange thing was he did not come back to the penalty advantage,

That happened in the Scotland match as well after they went to Video ref - is it they just forget about it

An enjoyable, but not a very high quality game to watch from a neutral - and yes the ref was pants for both sides

George north knocking the ball out - you can do that in goal area - which he would claim he was - scrum to England.

I'm pretty sure you can't. I've seen a yellow card and penalty try given against Tommy Bowe doing in the in-goal area. If it was in the in-goal area then it's a penalty try (I don't think it was however) - and before anyone complains, yes Robshaw should have been yellow carded and no it wasn't the reason England lost, Wales were the better team

Good Morning slarti.

How's the hangover? Did you have fun in Richmond with the ladies?

HammerofThunor wrote:

George north knocking the ball out - you can do that in goal area - which he would claim he was - scrum to England.

I'm pretty sure you can't. I've seen a yellow card and penalty try given against Tommy Bowe doing in the in-goal area. If it was in the in-goal area then it's a penalty try (I don't think it was however) - and before anyone complains, yes Robshaw should have been yellow carded and no it wasn't the reason England lost, Wales were the better team

I think you're right but as you say it clearly wasn't in the in goal area. Lee Byrne was correctly sin binned for a blatant knocking the ball into touch in Dublin 2 yrs ago. However, this was a far more marginal incident. It was difficult enough to call that it was North rather than Strettle (?) who touched the ball (the touch judge was clearly unsure), it would be very harsh to say that he deliberately knocked it into touch.

disapointed with the english media. before the match it was all grand slam this and grand slam that. only inverdale has been taLKING OF GRAND SLAMS.
sorry caps

i havent been talking of GSs, nor have my friends. only the media

and the headline this morning, ';strettle grounded the ball' not trip crown for wales.

Cowshot wrote:Good Morning slarti.

How's the hangover? Did you have fun in Richmond with the ladies?

Head not too bad... Just off to get full English breakfast

Lots out and about in Richmond including some old stars- shook hands with dalalio (sp) and jiffy

My estimation of LD goes up the more I see of him.

Happy days, shame it soured by England (not all) whinging. Hope wales just keep quiet and get on with it.

How much Flip advantage do you need for a penalty FFS! He got over the line - advantage over res ipsa loquitor

Morning all good game!

Some headlines were always going to be about the last second try/no try because the decision was critical to the potential result.

Add onto that a very good performance from the 'underdogs' any fans & associated media would react the same.

Don't be disappointed enjoy your win & Wales played their part in a close contest.
Well done.

It's certainly common place in the AP to hear a ref say "Try, yes or no?". Followed by "If it's not a try I'm coming back for the penalty over there". I think Walsh got that wrong.

I also think it's try video ref facilities were upgraded so a split screen with different angles but the same time-signature could be shown. I'm pretty sure that would have demonstrated a try had been scored. I'm not sure Flood would have scored the conversion though.

It was a very even game, and could have gone either way. England certainly didn't get 'smashed', but then this was never going to happen. The best 6 Nations game England have been involved in for a while.

North definitely should have been given a yellow card or at least a penalty... c'mon you can't be that biased guys.

slartibartfast wrote:

Would flood have kicked the goal?

It always amuses me when people question whether the conversion would have gone in if the diallowed try had been given. Just let's focus on the disallowed try, shall we? That's more than enough 'if's for now.

I think the game almost had the chance to be a legitimate draw, but for a bad call from TMO...and a draw is what that game would have deserved.

I think it was a try and should have been advantage anyway, but I understand why it wasn't given, and if had drawn the game with that after giving away such a soft try and blowing all our chances, it'd would have been very lucky indeed. North appeared to knock the ball into touch but it is hard to say whether he meant to or if it brushed his hand on the way across. Either way, the try wasn't given, just have to wait till next year where I hope we have gelled enough to send the Millennium Stadium home in tears

Mornin , gents.
Great game. Tough, physical, even character sucking match.

End was tough on England, starting with the the Wales try. But Wales took their chance and won. England came within a whisper of potentially pulling out a draw. But didn't.

This match is what knowlwdgeable Rugby folk might refer to as:
Good For Rugby.

It was a close contest, very few expected england to come out and give wales a real challenge, and that is what they did for the most part.

Somewehre one mistake was going to cost a team the match, and viola, Wales got the match winning score.

Walsh in my opinion was at least consistent.

(At least it wasn't a Bryce Lawrencesque type of performance. )

sorry had to get that in somewhere during the Six Nations.

The simple fact is either team could have won that match and as a neutral that is all we want, a close contest where both teams challenge for the win.

It is inevitable that somewhere a decision is questioned when a match was that close.

How could he have possibly had downward pressure when his own arm was under the ball when he got anywhere near the goal line.
There was no downward pressure in the goal area.

Strettle North deliberate or not ? In real time there is no way anybody could defiantly say who touched it.

Personally i thought that it would have been difficult o award the try. Its one of those occasions when if its your team its a try if its not, no try. I also think that the advantage was over.

As for Norths knock into touch, we ll that could very well have been a yellow but in real time it didnt look that bad. One of those cases where video evidence makes it look worse.

As for Robshaw, it was purely an accident, he even appeared to try and help Warbs down safetly. Sure he could have seen yellow but that would have been very harsh.

Cymroglan wrote:How could he have possibly had downward pressure when his own arm was under the ball when he got anywhere near the goal line.
There was no downward pressure in the goal area.

.

Not sure you need downward pressure, just need to make contact - I think

Cymroglan wrote:How could he have possibly had downward pressure when his own arm was under the ball when he got anywhere near the goal line.
There was no downward pressure in the goal area.

You can have downward pressure with any part of your body as long as you have control of the ball at the same time.

The reason why I think the try was correctly not given was the foot of a Welsh player (can't remember who)that was cleverly placed just before he went dove down to score.

He did land just short of the tryline and would have had to roll his body over so that the point of the ball that stuck out in front could get a touch over the line and I didn't see that happening.

In my view fair decision.

Whats a game of rugby without controversy eh

Walsh is rubbish, end of. Not biased, just rubbish. Not only rubbish, but inconsistant with his rubbish. Players do not know what thay can do or get away with as he refs every incicent differently.

One minute, a player on his feet picks the ball out of a ruck "good steal" was his remark, 10 minutes later exactly the same thing, penalty.

I disagree with a number of posters here, Strettle's "try" could not be given; it was inconclusive, but he should have gone back for the penalty as no advantage had come to England.

What I could not believe was the knock on that led to the Wales try, Farrell passed the ball and it suddenly went backwards effectively over his head. The TV replay clearly shows that it was a knock on, possibly a deliberate knock on, but nothing was given. From that Lawes got isolated and Jones scored.

How could neither the ref of the touch judge not see such a blatent knock on. It defied the laws of physics for Farrell to have passed it back like that.

As I said at the start, Walsh is rubbish.

Well done Wales!

Great game. I'm not fussed about any controversy (I don't think there's enough evidence available to give Strettle's 'try' and North's incidence happened pretty quickly). Wales probably played well enough to pinch it, but I'm just glad England seem to be making progress and have the makings of a good side here.

That said Walsh is still a plonker!

The decision was made. Wales won.

But, like virtually every game this season, issues have arisen that give people ammunition to question decisions made during a game.

Inevitable yes... but in this instance, I question the footage the TMO kept going back to when it was clear there was only one certain piece of footage that showed a try being scored (from directly behind the tryline - 90% to the tryline; ball grounding for an instance..but that's more than enough for a judgement in favour)

I question why the TMO resolutely evaded the angle that gave the clearest view and was determined to make his judgement based on the lack of clarity in other angles. I saw a perfectly legitimate try being scored. But then, I'm not ref or TMO so my opinion don't count.

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:WELL-PAST-IT

I disagree with a number of posters here, Strettle's "try" could not be given; it was inconclusive, but he should have gone back for the penalty as no advantage had come to England..

How much advantage should he give ? England were given advantage but unfortunately failed to capitalise on it that means advantage over.
It's not that long ago that Strettle's try would have been given as would Ryan Jones try in Ireland.
TMO is not always our saviour especial when the decision goes against us.

Cymroglan wrote:

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:WELL-PAST-IT

I disagree with a number of posters here, Strettle's "try" could not be given; it was inconclusive, but he should have gone back for the penalty as no advantage had come to England..

How much advantage should he give ? England were given advantage but unfortunately failed to capitalise on it that means advantage over.
It's not that long ago that Strettle's try would have been given as would Ryan Jones try in Ireland.
TMO is not always our saviour especial when the decision goes against us.

Plenty of sides take a drop kick, miss & the play goes back for the penalty additionally Walsh never stated 'advantage over'.
He also failed to stop the clock when Strettle had grounded not grounded the ball of course then when he queried with the TMO about the clock it was too late.
Tough refereeing isn't it?

AS I recall, after the 'inconclusive' verdict was given Walsh asked the TMO if the disallowed try had been occurred after the 80 mins or before. TMO said after so Walsh called no side. That was his reason, rightly or wrongly, not to go back to the penalty.

In tight games which could easily have gone either way there will always be controversial calls that would have changed the result. It's inevitable. However the fact remains Wales won and well done for that. They now have a slam in their sights and good luck to them.

For me, I am very happy that England put in a great performance against a side that could potentially have really humbled them. The France and Ireland games are going to be huge but I now believe the results are not a foregone conclusion which was what I thought before yesterday. France will watch that game and see very clearly how to spoil Wales' game and it could be a hummdinger. This is a good Wales side but not yet world beating. That said, the championship is still wide open albeit with Wales in the hot seat.

Really looking forward to this afternoon. Come on Scotland! you're due a result.

Cymroglan wrote:

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:WELL-PAST-IT

I disagree with a number of posters here, Strettle's "try" could not be given; it was inconclusive, but he should have gone back for the penalty as no advantage had come to England..

How much advantage should he give ? England were given advantage but unfortunately failed to capitalise on it that means advantage over.
It's not that long ago that Strettle's try would have been given as would Ryan Jones try in Ireland.
TMO is not always our saviour especial when the decision goes against us.

So if you are defending for your life with 30 seconds to go, 10 yards from your line, committ a penalty offence as, as long as the attacking side come close to scoring in the following phase of play you'll get away with it? Never mind that they might have scored if you hadn't committed the offence.

Why would you not committ an offence under those circumstances?

Play should have been called back and a yellow card issued.

slartibartfast wrote:I understand England may feel aggrieved, but the general reffing yesterday was poor, the bbc are reporting as if there was some injustice that England lost because the English physio says the ball was down

It's all ifs and buts again

George north knocking the ball out - you can do that in goal area - which he would claim he was - scrum to England.

So George North is admitting he did it deliberately? He (and you) is wrong about being allowed to do it in the in goal area. If he did it deliberately, then it's a yellow card and penalty try, whether he thought it was allowed or not.

10.2 (c)

Throwing into touch. A player must not intentionally knock, place, push or throw the ball
with his arm or hand into touch, touch-in-goal, or over the dead ball line.
Sanction: Penalty kick on the 15-metre line if the offence is between the 15-metre line and
the touchline, or, at the place of infringement if the offence occured elsewhere in the field of
play, or, 5 metres from the goal line and at least 15 metres from the touchline if the
infringement occured in in-goal.
A penalty try must be awarded if the offence prevents a try that would probably otherwise
have been scored.