How times have changed!!

This must be one of the first victories over England since the 1970's where the opposing fans the next day were (the majority of them) having quite unbiased and intellectual debates about the match.

Wales who have been consistently shocking from the 1980's league exodus to around the last year or so have finally turned a corner. There were blips of form in 2005 and 2008 showing that the future did have some light at the end of the tunnel.

Normally beating England is the be all and end all and other results are not considered as important. I am glad to see that Wales have finally overcome that big psychological hurdle and have managed 2 wins in Twickenham out of their last 3 Six Nations attempts (2011 warm up not a 6N match).

We seem to have a bit of a mental toughness now and can snatch victory in the dying minutes just as teams have done to us many times. Ireland and yesterdays games being good examples. We seem to have a bit of strength in depth and inexperienced players who can step up to the mark. We have angry, passionate, big and tough forwards who can actually tackle. Wales no longer squander a 2nd half lead due to poor fitness. So much has changed. The most pleasing aspect at the moment is that Wales can have a dip in form, play relatively poor attacking rugby and STILL win away at a place that was recently deemed impossible to win at.

In the last 10 years there has been a massive change. Started with Graham Henry who took a bunch of unfit, useless and unprofessional players and at least showed them how to play some rugby. During the end of the 1990's we were starting to really see the effects of the professional game moving a lot faster in England compared to Wales. The size, pace, strength and fitness of the English players was frightening. Things like fitness, bulk, professional attitudes and player psychology are just a few parts of the professional game that have taken almost a generation to develop in Wales and make us competitive once again.

I don't know if Wales will become a top 3 ranked side any time soon, but it's nice that we are close and that it is a possibility. I think Wales will be 4th in the rankings come Monday after yesterdays match.

When you look at results like these you will understand how far Wales have come:

1998 - England 60-6 Wales
1998 - Wales 0-51 France
1998 - South Africa 96-13 Wales
2000 - Wales 3-36 France
2000 - England 46-12 Wales
2002 - England 50-10 Wales
2002 - Ireland 54-10 Wales
2003 - WOODEN SPOON
2006 - England 47-13 Wales
2007 - England 62-5 Wales

As a die hard rugby fan the last 2 decades have left me with some horrible mental scars that are now only starting to fade (slightly)!

Since 2005 Wales have beaten England 6 times and England have beaten Wales 5 times and that is a sign that at least one psychological hurdle is out of the Way. Normally beating England is something we would only do every 4-6 years.

2012 WALES
2011 WALES
2011 ENGLAND
2011 ENGLAND
2010 ENGLAND
2009 WALES
2008 WALES
2007 ENGLAND
2007 WALES
2006 ENGLAND
2005 WALES
*
*
*
*
*
1999 WALES
*
*
*
*
*
1993 WALES
*
*
*
1989 WALES

idris wrote:This must be one of the first victories over England since the 1970's where the opposing fans the next day were (the majority of them) having quite unbiased and intellectual debates about the match.

We're a superior quality of English fans Idris. Possibly the best ever. A grandslam of magnanimous post-match comments on the cards.

Is it not a fact tha most of Wales wins over England have come in the 6ns straight after the Rugby World Cup?

Wales are playing some great rugby of late their is no doubt a bout that.

And even though they have won a couple of Grand Slams, and the Triple Crown yesterday, they still find it hard to win against SH team either at home or away.

But like you say take nothing away from Wales they have played 3 won 3 so a Grand Slam for them is possible.

But i would take it one game at a time.

And try not to get too confident just yet.

I think Wales have been out of sync with everyone else in terms of World Cup preperations.

In 2003 we put a new squad together BEFORE the world cup, and did it again last year. As a result we seem to have a small advantage of having a tighter squad after the world cup, where as a lot of other teams are rebuilding from scratch.

I do think Gatland is a big difference though, he seems to have figured out Kidney and I think Wales have stolen a small march as a result.

Though to be fair Andy Robinson seems to out smart Gatland, it's just Scotland don't have the quality to take Wales out.