Wales TH options

I am not one of those who is even worrying about the pragmatic, attritional manner of the GS. The style it was won in places us in a far better place going forward that the swashbuckling slams of the past. This championship win represents a sizeable building block for the next 3 years. The style will come Mr Barnes!!!
The strength is there in considerable depth - except - probably the most important position on the park.
On sat we saw a decent English scrum absolutely destroy Ireland especially after Mike Ross went off. So the lack of depth in just one position can be crucial.

Where is the next Adam Jones? At the moment we are relying on his fitness and someday he will be hanging up his considerable boots and taking a well deserved rest. We are unlikely to find anothe phenomenon in the principality like him but there doesn't seem to be any backup who could even do just a decent job at international level. Without that I don't think we can realistically put up a sustained long term challenge to the big 3

Well there is Mitchell who needs to be brought on and I'm interested to see what Gardiner can do if given a season or two to develop and then there's Adam's protege at the Ospreys - Joe Rees isn't it?

But I agree compared to all our other positions it is a problem, but on the plus we've got Adam for another few seasons yet and we thought we'd struggle hugely when Martyn hung up his boots, yet Warbs came along, so you never know...

Is it possible to coach a player to become a quality TH or are they just born that way. I remember Gethin Jenkins telling a story about the Welsh squad in the early 2000s training with a bunch of young up and coming guys and coming up against this bloke from Neath. By the end of the first day, none of the Welsh squad props wanted to train against him because he was embarrassing them all with his strength.

I think Adam Jones said in an interview once, that for a front row player, what really helps is just playing. Think he said, the younger, the better, because it's such a technical position, you need all the experience to become more than just good.

There is talk of the Scarlets perhaps trying rhodri jones at TH, but he's such a good loose head, I'm a bit dubious about taht plan.

rugbydreamer wrote:I think Adam Jones said in an interview once, that for a front row player, what really helps is just playing. Think he said, the younger, the better, because it's such a technical position, you need all the experience to become more than just good.

There is talk of the Scarlets perhaps trying rhodri jones at TH, but he's such a good loose head, I'm a bit dubious about taht plan.

That's worrying news and the only reason can be that we're in dire straights at TH. I hope he doesn't move as he's looking good at LH and seems a natural successor to Iestyn.

Agree Priest, but there's talk of Manu leaving, so we'll only have Peter Edwards as a TH as Simon Gardiner doesn't seem to be getting a look in/is not interested enough, so we shall see.

If we keep hold of Manu, I can see Rhodri playing mainly at LH.

I do not think you can teach a player without the basic building blocks to become a good prop. However coaching and experience is vital to turn the raw materials into the player.

All young players need to play regularly and they need to be playing against men to learn. This is especially so in the front row where experience of the position is key to performance.

The Welsh premiership should be littered with young men on secondment from the regions playing every week.

I sometimes think that the English Academy system keeps the players in a hermetically sealed age group level for too long. I would much rather see these young players appearing in the championship and Nation 1 at 18/19 than in their academy side. (Assuming they are not ready yet for their first team squad)

I guess the main challengers at the moment are Craig Mitchell and Scott Andrews. I was always a fan of Rhys Thomas but he probably won't play rugby again, does anyone have any more information on his medical situation?

The other options coming through are

Aaron Jarvis who is already a pretty solid scrummager and hes only 25, he will also improve with age.

Adam Jones thinks Joe Rees could be an international tight head so we need to look at him at some point

And there's some red haired fella at the Scarlets who's been hyped up a lot.

But apart from that the cupboard's pretty bare.

not heard of this red haired fella at the Scarlets?

And nope no more news on Rhys T, the family have asked for things to be kept private. Guess no news is good news though.

It would be great for each of the 4 regions to have a welsh qualified TH playing on a weekly basis. Maybe one of the upsides of the financial meltdown in our domestic rugby is that young talent will get more of an opportunity of playing against a higher standard of opposition.

Maybe not red haired fella, but he has some gypsie relations

I think it might be Samson Lee

hmm, perhaps, his name hasn't really been doing the rounds this season though. perhaps in the next couple of years or so then.

RT won't be returning to rugby. As mentioned, Samson Lee looks the real deal. The other props in the U20s don't look too bad either tbh. Bit of strength, conditioning and coaching in the right direction and any of them could be the next Adam Jones. The worst prospect has to be Scott Andrews, the guy can't do anything at all.

There is also Gill and Mitchell currently playing in a league that prides itself on dominant front rows, what better place to learn?

Andrews could do with a season in the Aviva

Yup it's such a shame about R Thomas and I'm still keeping my fingers crossed that he'll recover to play at least some level of rugby (be that amateur/semi pro or what).

On the other side of the scrum - Dreamer have you heard anything else about Iestyn's injury?

Weybridge - I think we're already pretty close to 4 WQ TH's playing regularly as we'll have Andrews at the Blues, A Jones and Jarvis at the Ospreys, we did have R Thomas at the Scarlets but will hopefully have Gardiner coming through soon, and the Dragons have Buck. So it's not too bad

No more news on Iestyn, just that he's got a neck injury. Could be that he'll have an op in the summer and come back next season. Although that'll all depend on if he gets a contract renewal I guess.

if he can continue to play I would love to keep him, he'll be a great help in developing Rhodri.

Def like to keep him for another season to help Rhodri along and he's been such a stalwart for the Scarlets he'll be a real loss

Looking at the under 20s this weekend, the front row didn't seem to shabby (or most of the pack). So i guess it is just seeing if those boys can get any came time regionally to develope.

The front row and back row of the U20s look very good prospects don't they SS? It is a damn shame that the rest of that team is useless and the team cohesion was exceptionally poor.

And the front row are all Scarlets!

I think it goes to show (that and everything else Nige has done in the past two seasons) that Scarlets have the best academy. Which Regions are Baker (6/8) and Dan Thomas (7) attached to?

Dan Thomas is a Scarlet., not sure about Baker.

ARRGHH!!!! everytime I write a really long informative post (no jokes) in response it disappears and doesn't post!

It's so frustrating.

Baker is a Blue and so's WillGriff and a few locks, Jordan and Owen Williams are Scarlets

Jo Rees has had a great season at the Ospreys while a young Welsh / Irish Scarlet called Lee Sampson is supposed to be a hot prospect.

The problem is at the moment that we arent actually giving Adams back ups any game time. I thought the Italian game would have been perfect to give Mitchell a run out and continue his development he could well be our first choice in 3 years and he needs more experience.

Dare I say it AGAIN get our A Side back up n running and some of these guys will at elast get game time at that level.

Bedford your probably right but if they are only playing a couple of games a year what's the point?

Yep, get your A side back. How the heck it isn't there is a complete mystery!

A side rugby is below regional level. Watching players week in week out should give us a good idea what level they are at and if they are International standard.

Cymroglan wrote:A side rugby is below regional level. Watching players week in week out should give us a good idea what level they are at and if they are International standard.

Not together as a side though. It beggars belief that you don't want an 'A' side!

A side rugby below regional rugby... really?

Cymroglan wrote:A side rugby is below regional level. Watching players week in week out should give us a good idea what level they are at and if they are International standard.

I agree.

I used to want a return of the A-Side but what is the point of playing four games once a year compared with the cost.

Wales would be better making use of the Baabaa's.

maestegmafia wrote:

Cymroglan wrote:A side rugby is below regional level. Watching players week in week out should give us a good idea what level they are at and if they are International standard.

I agree.

I used to want a return of the A-Side but what is the point of playing four games once a year compared with the cost.

Wales would be better making use of the Baabaa's.

Cost?! It's allegedly your national sport for God's sake!

gowales wrote:A side rugby below regional rugby... really?

Yes by a country mile ,,,,, Playing the likes of Munster & co who are experienced units is much more difficult than taking on a experimental side that rarely plays together..

Cymroglan wrote:

gowales wrote:A side rugby below regional rugby... really?

Yes by a country mile ,,,,, Playing the likes of Munster & co who are experienced units is much more difficult than taking on a experimental side that rarely plays together..

I agree the players gain a lot more playing against full internationals in the HEC and the Rabbo 12. The pressure is more intense, especially in the HEC.

Mitchell has been very good for the and improving every game under the tutelage of Budgie. He's part of a very strong pack that play their hearts out for each other and would be an excellent back-up for Adam Jones. Will it be held against him that e is playing in England?

I'd definitely say HEC is but most of the Rabbo games not

I don't think we can be selective in what country they play in but Gatland said that players must have a release clause in their contract.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Mitchell has been very good for the and improving every game under the tutelage of Budgie. He's part of a very strong pack that play their hearts out for each other and would be an excellent back-up for Adam Jones. Will it be held against him that e is playing in England?

Mitchell was the starting Tighthead last year while Adam jones was injured. He was in the larger welsh squad but released during the six nations.

I don't think Exeter or Mitchell have any problems with release, it's the PRL that do unfortunately.

SafeAsMilk wrote:
Cost?! It's allegedly your national sport for God's sake!

Yeah, it is the national sport, as Wales is defined as a nation by Rugby. But what has that got to do with the cost? Are you familiar with Thatcherism?

Smirnoffpriest wrote:
Baker is a Blue and so's WillGriff and a few locks, Jordan and Owen Williams are Scarlets

Yeah, those guys in the front row and back row stand out. The 2nd row and backs however, do not. I think we are covered at 2nd row for the time being! Nice to have 5 guys of international standard (if you count Reed).

If worst comes to worst, I can cover tighthead.

Looseheaded wrote:If worst comes to worst, I can cover tighthead.

Have you informed the relevant people mate?

Looseheaded wrote:If worst comes to worst, I can cover tighthead.

Are you Tom Court?

Here are the lads lining up to try to get Adam Jones' Shirt.


Joe Rees
DOB 31st Aug 1990
Birthplace Neath, Wales
Height 1.86 m (6' 1")
Weight 120 kg (18 st 12 lb)
Position Prop
Club Tonmawr / Swansea / Ospreys

http://www.ospreysrugby.com/rugby/fixtures/squad_seniors.php?player=87997&includeref=dynamic

SIMON GARDINER

DOB 10th Feb 1990
Birthplace Haverfordwest, Wales
Height 1.85 m (6' 1")
Weight 118 kg (18 st 8 lb)
Position Prop
Club Llanelli / Scarlets

http://www.scarlets.co.uk/eng/rugby/people.php?player=89102&includeref=dynamic


RHODRI JONES
DOB 23rd Dec 1991
Birthplace Aberystwyth, Wales
Height 1.90 m (6' 3")
Weight 120 kg (18 st 12 lb)
Position Prop
Club Llanelli / Scarlets / Wales

http://www.scarlets.co.uk/eng/rugby/people.php?player=94635&includeref=dynamic

Scott Andrews

DOB 1st Aug 1989
Birthplace Church Village, Wales
Height 1.88 m (6' 2")
Weight 118 kg (18 st 8 lb)
Position Prop
Honours Wales (2 caps)

http://www.cardiffblues.com/rugby/blues_squad.php?player=62075&includeref=dynamic

We seem to have an abundance of hookers - as has been suggested already is there any mileage in looking at Hibbard, Bennett and/or Burns in this position as they are all strong front row players. John Schmidt seemed to do OK. I have been very impressed with Gill this season for Wales and the Saffacens

There are four decent Hookers at the Scarlets alone.

The WRU could do more to share the wealth a bit. Dragons could easily use a couple of players from each region. Then more would be getting game time and experience.

The 4 hookers at the Scarlets: 3 have been away on Wales duty, if the WRU had moved our other one, we wouldn't have had any hookers at all!

Tis a dangerous road to take players from regions and dish them out, solely just down to call ups and injury cover.

The WRU should really consider replicating the NZ style draft system they've got over there.