South African form players for the English tour.

These are the super wrap selections for the Bok barometer for the first six weeks of super Rugby.

15. Riaan Viljoen (twice), Joe Pietersen, Zane Kirchner, Jaco Taute,, Hennie Daniller
14. Akona Ndugane (twice), Gio Aplon (twice), Odwa Ndugane (twice)
13. Robert Ebersohn (three times), JP Pietersen (twice), Francois Venter
12. Jean de Villiers (three times), Wynand Olivier (twice), Tim Whitehead
11.Bjorn Basson (three times) Bryan Habana (twice) Willie le Roux
10. Johan Goosen (twice), Morne Steyn (twice), Elton Jantjies, Pat Lambie
9. Francois Hougaard (three times), Charl Mcleod (twice) Jano Vermaak
8. Nick Koster (twice), Pierre Spies (twice), Keegan Daniel, Duane Vermeulen
7. Derick Minnie, Jacques Potgieter (twice), Marcel Coetzee, Duane Vermeulen, Willem Alberts
6. Heinrich Brussouw (three times) Siya Kolisi (twice), Marcell Coetzee
5. Juandre Kruger (four times), Franco van der Merwe . Andries Bekker
4. Eben Etzebeth (five times), Steven Sykes
3. WP Nel (three times) Pat Cilliers (twice), Jannie du Plessis.
2. Chiliboy Ralepelle (three times) . Bismarck du Plessis (three times)
1. Steven Kitshoff (twice). Dean Greyling (twice), Coenie Oosthuizen (twice)

Looking at Heyneke Meyer I expect him to consider a good big player is better than a brilliant small player. There are some smaller players he will not be able to ignore though, both Bjorn Basson and Gio Aplon has been looking very good, the problem is though Meyer won’t play them both and I certainly hope he doesn’t as they may be very brave in defence especially Aplon, but it will not be wise.

Robert Ebersohn is staking a claim, but I doubt that Meyer would consider him over a possible availability of Jaque Fourie. At inside centre Jean de Villiers has been regularly nominated, but I am pretty sure that is mainly for his solid defence, hopefully Frans Steyn comes into play there.

Morne Steyn is a shoe in, Lambie with a few weeks off for injury should still have time to prove his worth, but Johan Goosen is really looking good in my view and it is good for SA rugby that Lambie and Goosen can push Morne Steyn to better performance.

Francois Hougaard is certainly in top form and should only be left out if Meyer somehow decides to bring Fourie du Preez back, which in my opinion will be the wrong thing to do.

Backrow selection might be more about combinations than individuals, but Jacques Potgieter and Nick Koster is pushing hard for places. The likely backrow of Spies, Brussow and Alberts could be the obvious.

On lock Etzebeth and Juandre Kruger are standing out like sore thumbs, and I doubt you need to look further than that. Andries Bekker will have to up his game.

Front row might have a new look to it, With Beast injured and Dean Greyling, Kishoff and Coenie all sharing honours this could get interesting, on tight head Jannie du Plessis will have to raise his game.

There will definitely be a familiairty to the Bok side, I don’t expect Meyer to experiment too much during the English tour, there are however a few new names I wouldn’t mind to see get a few minutes off the bench though.

Kitshoff and Oosthuizen may both be young, but both show promise, WP Nel is screaming his name from the hilltops, Nick Koster and Jacques Potgieter will be hard to ignore, Marcel coetzee as well.

In the backs you need not look further than Johan Goosen, absolutely brilliant for a 19 year old, Robert Ebersohn is stating a case and Hennie Danniler in my opinion deserves a shot.

Stay away from Nel! He is coming to Edinburgh and wants to play for Scotland when his residency comes through!

No, no and NO!

Amigo,
I haven't seen as much of the South African sides in the Super Rugby because here in the NY area they are usually on in the middle of the day when I am out and about. But, from what I have seen (which is limited, to be fair):

Props might be all new. J. Du Plessis hasn't played so well in the matches I have seen. WP Nel and Oosthuizen lookd pretty good to me. I like Nel. Nice push and energy.

As a Saints fan, I am very familiar with Kruger and his his play is not a surprise. Although Etzebeth is playing very well, I have also seen him read plays incorrectly and I am not sure you are doing him any favours with the quick promotion to the Boks at this point. He does appear to have all the potential in the world.

I would agree about your back row. But is Spies really playing that well? I agree that Potgieter is doing what he can to get attention. Nice player.

Your out half is probably etched in stone. Shame about Lambie because I would like to see your back brought into the game more, and that's not Steyn's game (as an English fan, I feel this about our own team, too). I'd agree about Hougaard at 9. He is terrific at the moment, but I feel he can be a tad erractic still, which can lead to errors. But the only way for him to get past that is to play. And he is fast.

I am a big fan of settled centre combinations. And De Villiers and Fourie are very good and work well together.

I always want to see Habana play. He has been one of my favourite players for quite a while, and from a technical point of view is the best runner in Rugby. Anywhere. But, I think he is starting to show a little wear and tear and urgently needs time away to let his legs recover. I wouldn't play Habana as a favour to him (also England). Basson should play but is he still a little hot headed? I can't play Aplon because I think if the wind becomes more than a breeze he will be blown off the pitch. Willing but too small. Either of the brothers should be fine.

Joe Pietersen is playing well and is another kicking option. I haven't seen Kirchner play that well so far.

Are there going to be mid-wek matches? If so, that's the place for the young talent. And if England feels the same, those matches might be more entertaining than the proper Internationals.

Eben Etzebeth is a great looking prospect, but agree with Dr in that it might be slightly too early

Yeah, Look, I am not selecting the performers here, this is as Supersport selected them over the last 6 weeks. The problem is when you look at his consistent performances he does challenge the position with bakkies being gone. He is the form 4 in SA.

Bilt - I was talking to a S African friend of mine on the weekend and he has told me you have a 19 year old prop who is the real deal - big and dynamic, who is he?

Sure do make them big in South Africa Biltong. There something in your water down there?!

Regarding Etzebeth. There are an unusual number of younger players being brouight to the top levels lately everywhere. I am not sure I am a fan of this in general. The lads are just settling into their bodies and can suffer longer term injuries which can seriously curtail the end of their careers later on. I also wonder about the maturity of these 18, 19 or 20 year old kids playing with men.

Etzebeth has obvious potential to be a terrific player. Give him a year, mate. Do the lad a favour.

Yes Rubyguby it is Kitshoff.

bluestonevedder wrote:Sure do make them big in South Africa Biltong. There something in your water down there?!

We have an underground lab, where these guys are genetically modified, then fed a lot of red meat, and gets exposed to the Sun for 12 hours a day.

bluestonevedder wrote:

Jealous much?

Haha, a little!

bluestonevedder wrote:Sure do make them big in South Africa Biltong. There something in your water down there?!

The Netherlands is statistically the tallest nation in the world. Perhaps this has something to do with the size of South Africans many of whom would have a similar genetic make up. Just a guess.

http://m.askmen.com/top_10/travel/top-10-tallest-countries.html#1

leinsterbaby wrote:
The Netherlands is statistically the tallest nation in the world. Perhaps this has something to do with the size of South Africans many of whom would have a similar genetic make up. Just a guess.

True, just got to look at the size of Visser- he's a big boy, especially on the wing. Could be a real asset to Scotland when he qualifies.

But we don't even make the top ten countries?

Unless they don't go by race, but by population?

biltongbek wrote:But we don't even make the top ten countries?

Unless they don't go by race, but by population?

Isn't SA rather diverse though? In that the Dutch genes in your pool produce some giants of men, but also there are also quite a large amount of smaller individuals? i.e, 5'6-5'9?

Yes our races are very mixed.

The "coloureds" like Aplon and Basson are generally smaller.

The whites are from Dutch, French and UK decent.

Then there are many different black races as well, Zulu, Xhosa, Sotho eyc.

That must be it then Biltong. Detective work done for the morning. Time for a

Schalk Burger is fairly overgrown. Must have some Dutch Genes.

it is something SA seem to produce regularly, very big guys who are athletic aswell as powerful. must be all that biltong eh!

on a bit of a random note, i actually tried biltong a few days ago after seeing some in a shop and a previous conversation we'd had, its wonderous stuff! im pretty sure i could increase my size eating that all day

Biltong

You have missed several out....

Brad Barrit
Mouritz Botha
and the ragingly in form Matt Stevens

Personally i hope you play your oldest most gnarled side against our young thrusters. If we did then nick a win you will have nowhere to run and nowhere to hide. It would be a no lose situation for us.

I heard Mike Catt's still up for playing the warm up games as well

Comfort wrote:it is something SA seem to produce regularly, very big guys who are athletic aswell as powerful. must be all that biltong eh!

on a bit of a random note, i actually tried biltong a few days ago after seeing some in a shop and a previous conversation we'd had, its wonderous stuff! im pretty sure i could increase my size eating that all day

Biltong

What is the secret?

Do you raise your young on raw red meat ?

Please explain.

One word.......Braai

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vq2SOmwzjUU

I would have added Barritt and Botha to the OP's list, both are starting to show up well

Triangulation wrote:

Comfort wrote:it is something SA seem to produce regularly, very big guys who are athletic aswell as powerful. must be all that biltong eh!

on a bit of a random note, i actually tried biltong a few days ago after seeing some in a shop and a previous conversation we'd had, its wonderous stuff! im pretty sure i could increase my size eating that all day

Biltong

What is the secret?

Do you raise your young on raw red meat ?

Please explain.

I am not sure the reason, but if you want my personal opinion, it could be a combination of the following, genetics, outdoor activities, diet, Photosynthesis.

We are from dutch decent, and some Frnech and some english.

Our children spend a lot of time outside and hence probably develop muscle mass early in life.

We eat meat a lot becuase it isn't as expensive in SA as compared to europe, we do eat fish but it isn't a big thing here, I eat fish once a month and then it is mainly shellfish and not really fish, we do eat vegetables but in lesser portions, we also enjoy stywe pap en sous (maize meal and sauce), we also like bread.

We do enjoy beer and brandy, although with more mature men we enjoy whisky.

We spend a big amount of time in the Sun as we don't get the rainfall europe gets, in Gauteng I think our aerage rainfall is about 600 mm per year, usually from March to October we have 95% sunny days.

Regarding the Dutch being the tallest nation on earth a certain cretin of a tv presenter also pointed out that they are supposedly the largest uses of recreational drugs as well and wondered whether it was a contributing factor

I think Bekker is getting some unfair stick and is being unfairly compared to his form pre injury. He was arguably one of the top second row's worldwide in the lead up to the WC and it will take him time to recapture that kind of form, but it still doesn't mean he's playing badly. He does need to stop trying stupid off loads but I think he would just about get into any other international teams engine room. Elsewhere the Juan Smit news probably makes the backrow combination a little easier to guess.

I really don't rate JDP at 3 and actually think props are one of the weaker area's of the squad in terms of depth. As others have said there are plenty of great prospects coming through so it certainly won't stay that way for long but I honestly think that Cole may cause the Beast a few problems if both are selected. However it is probably the only area I feel that the English are maybe marginally stronger and depending on who is available it could easily change.

RubyGuby wrote:I would have added Barritt and Botha to the OP's list, both are starting to show up well

Beat you to it Rugby grub. See above. Stole your lightning. Too slow. Weakest link. Goodbye!

I think Bekker is getting some unfair stick and is being unfairly compared to his form pre injury. He was arguably one of the top second row's worldwide in the lead up to the WC and it will take him time to recapture that kind of form

Yes, he definitely is aclass player.

but the good thing is there were a lot of specualtion that SA will suffer due to the retirement of Bakkies and Victor, but yet the new crop is already making a case for themselves.

The fact is we never have a shortage of forwards, and spots are never vacant for long