Good luck Martyn Williams

Legend of a guy and player. Started his career when Wales were diabolical, but finished it when they were a professional outfit.

The nicest international player I've had a chat with. I hope he gets a cap for Wales against Baabaa's, but I know he would only want a cap on merit. It would be nice to see him get 100 though!

Always felt sorry for him being stuck on 99! Top player and bloke. I think it shows when he came out of international retirement prior to the 2007 RWC when his country needed him. All the best to him for the future.

Outstanding openside flanker in Wales for years, I'll always remember his brace that swung the game in Paris in 05. One of the best in the world in his heyday. In the end I suppose I wouldn't begrudge him a century against the Baabaa's. An exemplary representative of the Welsh setup over his illustrious career.

Best of luck for the future Nugget, you've done us proud

Is it only the Welsh that cap Baa Baa's games? I've not heard of anyone else doing it.

One of those players that fans of all countries liked and respected. Top player and a genuine gentleman. I really hope that he gets the 100 caps, he deserves it. Superb servent to Welsh Rugby and a great ambasadore of the game.

sugarNspikes wrote:Is it only the Welsh that cap Baa Baa's games? I've not heard of anyone else doing it.

Only special anniversary games against the baa baa's are awarded caps. Wales have only awarded caps against the Baa Baa's on 3 occasions 1990, 1996 and 2011. I may be wrong but i didn't think this years game would be capped

Cheers ieuan. I thought it was fairly unusual.

I wouldn't be surprised if Howley ask's him to come to Australia as an advisor as his experience and know how would be a great help with Gatland out of the tour.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/rugbynation/rugby-news/2012/05/08/martyn-williams-to-win-100th-cap-v-barbarians-as-sam-warburton-given-all-clear-to-lead-wales-in-australia-91466-30923095/

According to Howley (or the Western Fail depending on how cynical you are) Maryn will be on the bench against the Barbarians and will come on as a sub. With the Wales first XV not being selected I think this is a good call as he's been up there with the best 7's in Wales this season, and we haven't a pressing need to blood another youngster as Warbs is still young and Tupric and Shingler behind him have experience and are both young (we can afford to wait to blood Navidi).

Howley also said Warburton will be available for the Oz tour as well!!!

http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/22206.php

Martyn Williams is set to become the third Welshman to reach 100 caps for his country after Wales caretaker coach Rob Howley confirmed he would be involved in the match day squad to face the Barbarians.

The Cardiff Blues flanker has been stranded on 99 caps since the emergence of Sam Warburton and Justin Tipuric but the fans favourite is set to become the first forward to reach the magical milestone following in the boot steps of backs Gareth Thomas and Stephen Jones.
Wales caretaker coach Rob Howley was adamant that the decision to bring Williams back into the Welsh training squad for the Barbarians game was purely on rugby reasons and not sentimental ones.

"It is a common sense approach with the Barbarians game and tour of Australia in mind," explained Howley.

"With two games in two hemispheres in seven days, rest, recuperation and recovery going to be at an absolute premium to our Test players.

"We will be sending key players on the Thursday prior to the Barbarians game but there is no doubt that over the last 12 months the integrated approach Warren Gatland has been part has given us strength of depth in rugby - particularly in the back row."

Williams will have to be content with a starting spot on the bench as Howley said the coaching setup want one of the up and coming players to experience the 'match day experience' but the Blues flanker will still figure prominently in the pre-match routine.

"The easy thing for you to do is talk about sentiment but I assure you it was based on reasonable common sense because Sam [Warburton] hasn't played a lot of rugby since the France game and it is important that we give Sam every opportunity in his rehab to actually play.

"He has an able deputy in Justin Tipuric and along with Josh Turnbull and Aaron Shingler - we feel we have strength in depth in that area. Martyn has been great player and a great ambassador but the decision is based on rugby reasoning and by no means a sentimental one for him to reach 100 caps. I'm looking forward to Marytn's involvement in the game.

The WRU have reported it aswell. So if fit I'd start with Tipuric then bring Williams on within the first 10 minutes of the 2nd half. He can get his standing ovation but winning is still the top priority. I assume there would have been a full house but Martyn being involved might ensure that.

So Wales are capping another Baa Baa's game?

Sorry this should be in the International section, though I can't see any Mods online yet to move it.

I don't think having Martyn in the team (off the bench) will in anyway effect our ability to win the match, and it will be good for him to get a standing ovation much like Shane had.

I wonder if they'll send Tipuric to Oz before the Barbarians game and consider him 1st choice until Warbs is actually fully fit, or whether they'll just send Warbs down on the Thursday, and play Tipuric against the BaaBaas

Obvs.

Topics merged.

It's shocking that he will get his 100th cap in this manner, IMO it will be worthless.

I wonder if the Baa baas will let him score too?

and I also wonder if he'll try and out do his name sake with a triple forward roll followed by a back flip and a dosido?

I also wonder if he'll try and out do his name sake with a triple forward roll followed by a back flip and a dosido?


Martin Ashton didn't make the squad

Well, I have never understood why Wales do actually grant international caps for matches vs the Barbarians, but i suppose at the end of the day t is up to them.

Doesn't make any sense though, does it?

No, no it doesn't Bil,

at the end of the day t is up to them.
i
Yes it is, I'm intrigued why so many of you have a problem with it. Wales is our nation and for certain games against the Baa Baas we decide to award caps. We give caps to welsh players for playing for Wales, novel concept eh! Some nations give away caps to foreign players!! Now, that's another thing altogether worth discussing.

I don't have a problem with it rubyguby, I just don't understand why.

Well Bill, International Rugby is a celebration, especially when you are playing against the Barbarians.

Williams has been a wonderful player all his career and has done countless great deeds for Welsh rugby.

If the WRU chose to celebrate and commemorate a hero of our game in this way then so be it. It would be harsh to deny he deserves it. Lets hope it is as wonderful a day as it is planned to be.

Do you get a free cap in the match programme for a Wales/Baa Baa's game?

The reason people have issues with this is that it’s not a full blown international, the Baa baas will be playing for fun and the WRU have gone all sentimental, this is why Wales will never dominate world rugby.

maestegmafia wrote:Well Bill, International Rugby is a celebration, especially when you are playing against the Barbarians.

Williams has been a wonderful player all his career and has done countless great deeds for Welsh rugby.

If the WRU chose to celebrate and commemorate a hero of our game in this way then so be it. It would be harsh to deny he deserves it. Lets hope it is as wonderful a day as it is planned to be.

The caps are given for special anniversaries rather than to commemorate certain players - according to fans more knowledgable than me this will be the 4th time a Baabaas game has been capped in a hundred odd years

Smirnoffpriest wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Well Bill, International Rugby is a celebration, especially when you are playing against the Barbarians.

Williams has been a wonderful player all his career and has done countless great deeds for Welsh rugby.

If the WRU chose to celebrate and commemorate a hero of our game in this way then so be it. It would be harsh to deny he deserves it. Lets hope it is as wonderful a day as it is planned to be.

The caps are given for special anniversaries rather than to commemorate certain players - according to fans more knowledgable than me this will be the 4th time a Baabaas game has been capped in a hundred odd years

Well there you go...!

Bilton - do you award caps against The Lions?

Fair play Martyn has been a real legend of Welsh rugby, and I wish him all the best in his retirement. There is no arguing his contribution to Welsh rugby over the years. I did feel sorry for him that he would be stuck on 99 caps, however I agreed with what he has said himself, that he has earnt 99 caps, and that is a real achievement. I do not agree that he should be put on the bench, just so he can get to a nice round number, especially as he has retired from rugby. I appreaciate that it will be lovely for him to get a final see of in the MS, just like it was for Shane, and that we will want some experience in the squad. But going by that arguement then Stephen Jones should be on the bench too, after all it would be cap 105, a nice round number, and he would bring experience to the squad, and he has not retired from rugby union full stop.

I understand that the first choice squad (whether it is just the 22 or full 30 man squad, I don't know) will already be in Aus and we will be lacking in backrow options. However if it is just he match day squad that is missing, then we should feild a back row of Shingler, Tipuric, R Jones, with Turbull/Lewis Evans on the bench. And if we are missing the whole squad and feilding an A team, then why not play it as an exhibition, in the spirit of the Baabaas and have a back row who want to run the ball, something like Evans, Navidi/Edwards, Murphy.

HERSH wrote:The reason people have issues with this is that it’s not a full blown international, the Baa baas will be playing for fun and the WRU have gone all sentimental, this is why Wales will never dominate world rugby.

No HERSH, the reason Wales would never dominate World Rugby would be if they started losing lots of international matches. So far this year they are winning more than they lose.

I think it's the 1st team (ie 15 players) who will be in Oz - I still think M Williams has played better than Turnbull, Edwards and Evans this season, but just my opinion

RubyGuby wrote:Bilton - do you award caps against The Lions?

Yes, all three teams that play against them do. whereas the baabaas, are not a collection of players from one country or the home unions.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Fair play Martyn has been a real legend of Welsh rugby, and I wish him all the best in his retirement. There is no arguing his contribution to Welsh rugby over the years. I did feel sorry for him that he would be stuck on 99 caps, however I agreed with what he has said himself, that he has earnt 99 caps, and that is a real achievement. I do not agree that he should be put on the bench, just so he can get to a nice round number, especially as he has retired from rugby. I appreaciate that it will be lovely for him to get a final see of in the MS, just like it was for Shane, and that we will want some experience in the squad. But going by that arguement then Stephen Jones should be on the bench too, after all it would be cap 105, a nice round number, and he would bring experience to the squad, and he has not retired from rugby union full stop.

I understand that the first choice squad (whether it is just the 22 or full 30 man squad, I don't know) will already be in Aus and we will be lacking in backrow options. However if it is just he match day squad that is missing, then we should feild a back row of Shingler, Tipuric, R Jones, with Turbull/Lewis Evans on the bench. And if we are missing the whole squad and feilding an A team, then why not play it as an exhibition, in the spirit of the Baabaas and have a back row who want to run the ball, something like Evans, Navidi/Edwards, Murphy.

Nalvidi and Murphy are definitely worthy of a run out... They have excelled my expectations this season.

maestegmafia wrote:

HERSH wrote:The reason people have issues with this is that it’s not a full blown international, the Baa baas will be playing for fun and the WRU have gone all sentimental, this is why Wales will never dominate world rugby.

No HERSH, the reason Wales would never dominate World Rugby would be if they started losing lots of international matches. So far this year they are winning more than they lose.

Hersh, I have to disagree with you on that feeble reasoning. what has wales vs baabaas have to do with dominating world rugby?

Where is the facepalm symbol when you want it?

Wales have made massive steps in terms of their development since the RWC warm up games because they went with youth, this is a huge step backwards IMO.

Don’t get me wrong Williams has been a great servant to the game but to win his 100th cap like this in an Exhibition match is wrong.

RubyGuby wrote:Bilton - do you award caps against The Lions?

The Lions and the Baabaas are slightly different things. NZ opted decided not to award caps for matches against New South Wales in the 1920s (even though NSW was the only part of Aus playing rugby at the time, and I think Aus may have since capped players). But NZ did award caps for the centenary series vs the World XV in 1992 as it was a special occasion (and IIRC a pretty handy world XV - they won the 1st test). I'm not sure, but SA may have awarded caps vs the rebel NZ Cavaliers in 1985?

Given that this is two years in a row that Wales are awarding caps for the fixture, and given the current sorry state of the Baabaas I think it is somewhat cheapening test caps.

In addition, I think finishing on 99 caps isn't a bad thing - it adds to talking points around a player's career, much like Bradman's 99.94 test batting average.

+1 Kiwi

99 isn't that bad.

biltongbek wrote:I don't have a problem with it rubyguby, I just don't understand why.

Think you do have a "problem" with it, mate

1. Martyn has been one of the best 7s in Wales this season, better than Turnball (who has been at 6) and Navidi.

2. There should still be sentiment in rugby, Martyn deserves 100 caps

3. This is great marketing for the WRU, capping Navidi would not have been worth the 10,000 extra ticket sales and more money for the game in Wales

4. Shingler will apparently start at 7, so Martyn will only be on for 20/30 minutes - which is taking hardly any gametime from another

Good luck Martyn and good on Howley if you ask me.

I don't know why the BaaBaas is being capped this year tbh. I suppose it is just for Martyn, but you know what...I don't care.

Wales 606 - I think that you hit the nail on the head with your third point. If the first teamers are not there, and the rugby comunity are well aware they won't be, then the WRU need to find a way to get bums on seats. And it is not exactly a fitting tribute to a player who has served so well to exploit then to get an extra few quid in your back pocket.

Also I would argue with you on points 1 and 4. Turnbull plays 6/7 and has played both this season, where as Shingler players 4/6 and has only played 7 once (to my knowledge). So out of the two I would expect Turnbull to start. And I would expect Williams to eitehr get a half, or just a token 5 mins at the end.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Wales 606 - I think that you hit the nail on the head with your third point. If the first teamers are not there, and the rugby comunity are well aware they won't be, then the WRU need to find a way to get bums on seats. And it is not exactly a fitting tribute to a player who has served so well to exploit then to get an extra few quid in your back pocket.

Also I would argue with you on points 1 and 4. Turnbull plays 6/7 and has played both this season, where as Shingler players 4/6 and has only played 7 once (to my knowledge). So out of the two I would expect Turnbull to start. And I would expect Williams to eitehr get a half, or just a token 5 mins at the end.

Howley says that Shinger will start (Turnball has not impressed me the season and I don't think will make the squad)

Apparently Navidi has been called up by the BaaBaas which is great news.

wales606 wrote:Apparently Navidi has been called up by the BaaBaas which is great news.

So that will be a welsh 7, 9, 10, and 11 (Navidi, Peel, Jones, Williams). Surely we should just cancel the Baabaas and make it a seconds v thirds match.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Wales 606 - I think that you hit the nail on the head with your third point. If the first teamers are not there, and the rugby comunity are well aware they won't be, then the WRU need to find a way to get bums on seats. And it is not exactly a fitting tribute to a player who has served so well to exploit then to get an extra few quid in your back pocket.

Also I would argue with you on points 1 and 4. Turnbull plays 6/7 and has played both this season, where as Shingler players 4/6 and has only played 7 once (to my knowledge). So out of the two I would expect Turnbull to start. And I would expect Williams to eitehr get a half, or just a token 5 mins at the end.

Why would you have Turnbull at 7 over Shingler or Williams when he hasn't played as well as either of them?

Why are Pro players becoming obsessed with stats?

Is it so they can demand more money for after diner speeches?

I would have had more respect for Martyn if he turned it down, played for the Baa baas and finished his career on 99 caps rather than adding one more to his total, unless of course he still wants to play on for both Cardiff and Wales.

Sorry I mean the Blues

Smirnoff - this is one of those we will never really see eye to eye on I think. I think Turnbull is a brilliant scavenger of the ball, and wins more than his fair share of turn overs. He is a very strong runner with ball in hand, and quite often works as a link man between backs and forwards. Due to the fact he is not getting slow due to age, and being caught more often than not doing naughty things at the break down, I would put him above Williams.

That said it is a tough call between him Shingler, as Aaron has to be one of the quickest backrow forwards I have seen, and has brilliant hands too.

HERSH wrote:Why are Pro players becoming obsessed with stats?

Is it so they can demand more money for after diner speeches?

I would have had more respect for Martyn if he turned it down, played for the Baa baas and finished his career on 99 caps rather than adding one more to his total, unless of course he still wants to play on for both Cardiff and Wales.

You really should write to him and tell him. I am sure he values your opinion just as much as the rest of us do.

They prefer fan mail to go to the following address:

Rugby Cardiff
Athletics Stadium
Leckwith Road
CARDIFF
CF11 8AZ

Or maybe one of your former professional Welsh Rugby colleagues knows his personal address, you could try that too... Do you know him yourself even?

7 Ginger Terrace
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RubyGuby wrote:7 Ginger Terrace
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wales606 wrote:

RubyGuby wrote:7 Ginger Terrace
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Funny...!