Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
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liverbnz
two_tone
Ent
Gordy
GSC
Crimey
The Special Juan
Gregers
Josiah Maiestas
TopHat24/7
Stella
chewed_mintie
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The v2 Forum :: Sport :: Football :: Premier League
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Who Do You Blame?
Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Well my beloved team are down after a pain-staking campaign. I have to admit this is the worst season I can recall. I have been a fan for over 20 years and it hurts to see my team in the position they are. I want to get fans thoughts from across the board. Who do you lay the blame with for Rovers struggling so badly?
Just want to say that Martinez and Whelan showed a touch of class on a night that the home team lacked a lot of.
Just want to say that Martinez and Whelan showed a touch of class on a night that the home team lacked a lot of.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I personally blame Kean. Way out of his depth and should've gone end of last season. Taking a team that was relatively safe in December in 2010 to last day relegation fight in 2011 showed he was not cut out for top flight management. Only good things will then come if we can get someone with some umph!
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I wouldn’t call myself a fan of football but being a kiwi I have followed Blackburn since they signed Nelsen back in 2004. It’s a sad conclusion but it’s been like watching a car accident occur in super slow motion.
What I don’t get is that Nelsen was ‘injured’ for the first half of the season; then at the end of January Spurs come in and whisk him away and then he plays that week? Made no sense to me, even if I was pleased for him to go to a bigger club. It would appear that he was at odds with the way the club was being run and the ‘injury’ was being used as an excuse to not play him and hide the bigger issue. I’ve read somewhere that at the end of last season Nelsen wrote personally to Venky’s to outline his concerns that Kean was not up to standard for managing a Premier League team. Obviously, Venky’s had other ideas because Nelsen would’ve stayed with Blackburn until he retired I feel.
In any case, you’ve got to blame Venky’s not Kean. They employed him, they took Blackburn from being a well run club under John Williams to a joke. Dreams of Champions League were a mirage.....trying to sign Ronaldinho, Beckham, Roberto Carlos but instead landing Goodwillie and.......?
From my perspective, Kean has battled hard to try and prove himself after getting his big break. The tragedy is he’s probably ruined his career as a manager now. The simple fact is Venky’s should not have promoted him in the first place.
What I don’t get is that Nelsen was ‘injured’ for the first half of the season; then at the end of January Spurs come in and whisk him away and then he plays that week? Made no sense to me, even if I was pleased for him to go to a bigger club. It would appear that he was at odds with the way the club was being run and the ‘injury’ was being used as an excuse to not play him and hide the bigger issue. I’ve read somewhere that at the end of last season Nelsen wrote personally to Venky’s to outline his concerns that Kean was not up to standard for managing a Premier League team. Obviously, Venky’s had other ideas because Nelsen would’ve stayed with Blackburn until he retired I feel.
In any case, you’ve got to blame Venky’s not Kean. They employed him, they took Blackburn from being a well run club under John Williams to a joke. Dreams of Champions League were a mirage.....trying to sign Ronaldinho, Beckham, Roberto Carlos but instead landing Goodwillie and.......?
From my perspective, Kean has battled hard to try and prove himself after getting his big break. The tragedy is he’s probably ruined his career as a manager now. The simple fact is Venky’s should not have promoted him in the first place.
chewed_mintie- Posts : 1225
Join date : 2011-05-09
Location : Cheshire
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
The fans didn't exactly help matters. They were on his back nearly all season.
Stella- Posts : 6671
Join date : 2011-08-01
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Those chicken-farming clueless parasites without a doubt.
Came to England giving the club a £5m transfer budget and, when challenged that that was pathetic and showed a complete ignorance of football and the transfer system, then said they would 'lease' players.
'lease'??!! Not even using the right terminology!! No wonder they got rid of a proven prem manager, expert in keeping ugly teams up who has now guided Hammers to promotion.
Came to England giving the club a £5m transfer budget and, when challenged that that was pathetic and showed a complete ignorance of football and the transfer system, then said they would 'lease' players.
'lease'??!! Not even using the right terminology!! No wonder they got rid of a proven prem manager, expert in keeping ugly teams up who has now guided Hammers to promotion.
TopHat24/7- Posts : 17008
Join date : 2011-07-01
Age : 40
Location : London
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
The hammers ain't up yet. I agree that he would have done better than Kean though.
Stella- Posts : 6671
Join date : 2011-08-01
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Blackburn were still competitive when they had Samba and Nelsen. Whoever decision it was to not keep them, is at fault.
Josiah Maiestas- Posts : 6700
Join date : 2011-06-05
Age : 35
Location : Towel Island
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I blame those that persuaded the Venky's to buy the club, profiting from the transaction, and the regulators for allowing it to happen.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
The Venky's without a doubt have showed lack of knowledge and understanding of running a football club. I will make a claim that Williams was wrong to sell the club to the Venky's. Williams always prided himself in declining offers in the past that were not in interest of the club.
The fans if you can call them that showed utter disrespect to the club. Look at when United, Liverpool, Pompey were bought out. They didn't boo their teams to the hilt. Protest against the owners after the games, not during them!
Venky's, well I haven't anything to add that hasn't already been said about them.
The fans if you can call them that showed utter disrespect to the club. Look at when United, Liverpool, Pompey were bought out. They didn't boo their teams to the hilt. Protest against the owners after the games, not during them!
Venky's, well I haven't anything to add that hasn't already been said about them.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Venky's with the Fans second, Venky's for being awful and having no idea at how football works. The fans for being disgraceful at times.
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Everyone is to blame.
Fans - Never got behind their team. Not to blame but not blame free either.
Steve Kean - Utterly clueless. Should never have got the job but it was wrong to pass it up. Show go now before Blackburn find themselves sinking.
Players - Blackburn have 2 good players: Robinson and Hoilett. The rest are pretty terrible. Samba jumped ship before it was too late.
Venky's - No idea how to run a football club. If they keep running it they will find themselves in League 1 before too long.
Fans - Never got behind their team. Not to blame but not blame free either.
Steve Kean - Utterly clueless. Should never have got the job but it was wrong to pass it up. Show go now before Blackburn find themselves sinking.
Players - Blackburn have 2 good players: Robinson and Hoilett. The rest are pretty terrible. Samba jumped ship before it was too late.
Venky's - No idea how to run a football club. If they keep running it they will find themselves in League 1 before too long.
The Special Juan- Posts : 20900
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Location : Twatt
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Venky's have bought Blackburn to sell them, they've seen the rewards past owners of Portsmouth got, and want to make some easy money. If you are in Kean's position, 99% would take the job (pay rise, could be his only opportunity).
Josiah Maiestas- Posts : 6700
Join date : 2011-06-05
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Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I voted for all four.
The players are much better than they played, people like Scott Dann for example really underperformed and it's a shame for the players like Paul Robinson, Hoilett and Yakubu who actually put in a lot more effort. Christopher Samba didn't help matters either.
Steve Kean obviously didn't do the best, he seemed a bit lost in the job and made some really odd decisions.
Venkys are bad because they promised so much but have delivered nothing, they shouldn't have sacked Sam Allardyce, a proven Premier League quality manager and they certainly shouldn't have played him with Steve Kean. I can understand why they tried to stick with Kean, sticking with a manager worked for Wigan while sacking failed for Wolves, but the problem is Kean clearly wasn't the right man for the job.
The fans have to take part of the blame, the players were going to find it hard to motivate themselves when the fans weren't behind them and when the fans are clearly not on the side of the manager, the players won't have the faith in the manager either.
The players are much better than they played, people like Scott Dann for example really underperformed and it's a shame for the players like Paul Robinson, Hoilett and Yakubu who actually put in a lot more effort. Christopher Samba didn't help matters either.
Steve Kean obviously didn't do the best, he seemed a bit lost in the job and made some really odd decisions.
Venkys are bad because they promised so much but have delivered nothing, they shouldn't have sacked Sam Allardyce, a proven Premier League quality manager and they certainly shouldn't have played him with Steve Kean. I can understand why they tried to stick with Kean, sticking with a manager worked for Wigan while sacking failed for Wolves, but the problem is Kean clearly wasn't the right man for the job.
The fans have to take part of the blame, the players were going to find it hard to motivate themselves when the fans weren't behind them and when the fans are clearly not on the side of the manager, the players won't have the faith in the manager either.
Crimey- Admin
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Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I can't really blame Kean, yes he was out of his depth, but how many of you would pass up an amazing promotion?
Venkys for appointing him in the first place, and then not moving on when it was clear he was out of his depth.
Venkys for appointing him in the first place, and then not moving on when it was clear he was out of his depth.
GSC- Posts : 43496
Join date : 2011-03-28
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Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
GSC,
I think if Kean had some sense he may have seen those who have failed. So many have tried and failed. Sammy Lee, Les Reed, Brian Kidd, Gareth Southgate, Avram Grant just to name a few. With no management experience why on earth would you think you could manage a premier league team???
He should've learnt from his 2010/11 campaign when they went from being safe to nearly relegated on the last day of that season.
Agree with much of what Crimey has summarised.
I think if Kean had some sense he may have seen those who have failed. So many have tried and failed. Sammy Lee, Les Reed, Brian Kidd, Gareth Southgate, Avram Grant just to name a few. With no management experience why on earth would you think you could manage a premier league team???
He should've learnt from his 2010/11 campaign when they went from being safe to nearly relegated on the last day of that season.
Agree with much of what Crimey has summarised.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
The following should be added to the list
1) Jerome Anderson
2) John Williams
3) The FA
4) The British Government
5) Foghorn Leghorn
1) Jerome Anderson
2) John Williams
3) The FA
4) The British Government
5) Foghorn Leghorn
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I selected "the fans". When you are scrapping it out for your very survival in a closely fought situation you need every advantage you can get. Surely no one can argue that the awful atmosphere and abuse from the fans undermined the team and lessened their chances of survival?
They should have got behind their team and aired their greivances after the season of over. Now it too late and they can look forward to a season in the Championship which is what they deserve.
They should have got behind their team and aired their greivances after the season of over. Now it too late and they can look forward to a season in the Championship which is what they deserve.
Gordy- Posts : 788
Join date : 2011-11-14
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Gordy wrote:I selected "the fans". When you are scrapping it out for your very survival in a closely fought situation you need every advantage you can get. Surely no one can argue that the awful atmosphere and abuse from the fans undermined the team and lessened their chances of survival?
They should have got behind their team and aired their greivances after the season of over. Now it too late and they can look forward to a season in the Championship which is what they deserve.
They have been protesting since big Sam was sacked and replaced with a useless yes man who took a squad who finished 10th the year before and currently sitting in 13th to survival on the last day and now relegated in 19th place.
Would you have done any different if it was your club?
Ent- Posts : 7337
Join date : 2011-05-02
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Some further information regarding whom to blame:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/jan/15/blackburn-rovers-board-dismay-venkys
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/jan/15/blackburn-rovers-board-dismay-venkys
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
One of those players was the then 19-year-old Rubén Rochina, who was signed for €450,000 (£372,000) from Barcelona. His agent, Manuel Salamanca Ferrer, received a £1.65m fee. Anderson worked on the deal with Ferrer but has said he made no money from the transfer.
A £1.65m fee for a £372k transfer? Agents are the real parasites of the modern game.
TopHat24/7- Posts : 17008
Join date : 2011-07-01
Age : 40
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Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Gordy wrote:I selected "the fans". When you are scrapping it out for your very survival in a closely fought situation you need every advantage you can get. Surely no one can argue that the awful atmosphere and abuse from the fans undermined the team and lessened their chances of survival?
They should have got behind their team and aired their greivances after the season of over. Now it too late and they can look forward to a season in the Championship which is what they deserve.
Couldn't have put it better myself.
two_tone- Posts : 818
Join date : 2011-08-19
Age : 38
Location : Brighton
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
The leaked letter has led to the sacking of Blackburn Rovers' deputy CEO Paul Hunt:TopHat24/7 wrote:One of those players was the then 19-year-old Rubén Rochina, who was signed for €450,000 (£372,000) from Barcelona. His agent, Manuel Salamanca Ferrer, received a £1.65m fee. Anderson worked on the deal with Ferrer but has said he made no money from the transfer.
A £1.65m fee for a £372k transfer? Agents are the real parasites of the modern game.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18005433
I think the Anderson-Kean-Venky triumvirate will lead to more problems for Blackburn Rovers.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Venkys for me. They've caused this whole mess. The Salgado affair should tell you everything you need to know about these bunch of clowns.
And as much as I loathe the man, Sam Allardyce was the right man to keep Blackburn in the division. Instead, the Venkys appointed a rookie manager, who unfortunately looks out of his depth and that was pretty evident a year ago.
The fans aren't to blame at all, in my opinion. "All it takes for evil to succeed, is for good people to do nothing" is a pretty prevelant quote in this case. What exactly do people expect them to do? Sit back and watch their club fall down around their ears?
And as much as I loathe the man, Sam Allardyce was the right man to keep Blackburn in the division. Instead, the Venkys appointed a rookie manager, who unfortunately looks out of his depth and that was pretty evident a year ago.
The fans aren't to blame at all, in my opinion. "All it takes for evil to succeed, is for good people to do nothing" is a pretty prevelant quote in this case. What exactly do people expect them to do? Sit back and watch their club fall down around their ears?
liverbnz- Posts : 2958
Join date : 2011-03-07
Age : 40
Location : Newcastle, County Down
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Blasting the manger from day one is not the best way. Most supporters would be unhappy but most would also back the manager at the beginning.
Stella- Posts : 6671
Join date : 2011-08-01
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I think it is difficult to back a manager who was 'rumoured' to have engineered the sacking of Allardyce. That is only rumour that I heard from fans much nearer to the club than me. I think the fact that Allardyce was sacked for no apparent reason what so ever is never going to go down with the fans. Similar with Pardew at West Ham, Ancelotti at Chelsea. I think Chelsea have been fortunate to have stumbled on Di Matteo by chance.
I think Kean should've seen what had happened last season and stepped down. Some people are just de-illuded beyond belief.
I think Kean should've seen what had happened last season and stepped down. Some people are just de-illuded beyond belief.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
All for me.
FANS- I have no problem about the protesting, at all, before and after games .Just think that they should have stopped during the 90 mins the games on and supported the team during games more.
PLAYERS-Win at Old Trafford, put in credable performance at Anfield, and then don't turn up when most required, alot of them should be ashamed of there performances this season.
MANAGER-Talked a good game, shame he couldn't reproduce it. Disillusioned most of the time, really he was the wrong man from the start.
VENKYS- For reasons stated above.
FANS- I have no problem about the protesting, at all, before and after games .Just think that they should have stopped during the 90 mins the games on and supported the team during games more.
PLAYERS-Win at Old Trafford, put in credable performance at Anfield, and then don't turn up when most required, alot of them should be ashamed of there performances this season.
MANAGER-Talked a good game, shame he couldn't reproduce it. Disillusioned most of the time, really he was the wrong man from the start.
VENKYS- For reasons stated above.
Luke- Posts : 5201
Join date : 2011-03-16
Location : Wst Yorkshire
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
tigerrobins wrote:All for me.
FANS- I have no problem about the protesting, at all, before and after games .Just think that they should have stopped during the 90 mins the games on and supported the team during games more.
PLAYERS-Win at Old Trafford, put in credable performance at Anfield, and then don't turn up when most required, alot of them should be ashamed of there performances this season.
MANAGER-Talked a good game, shame he couldn't reproduce it. Disillusioned most of the time, really he was the wrong man from the start.
VENKYS- For reasons stated above.
good post.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18005433
more developments.
CEO sacked for leaked letter, Kean determined to stay on.
Soap opera stuff this.
more developments.
CEO sacked for leaked letter, Kean determined to stay on.
Soap opera stuff this.
Ent- Posts : 7337
Join date : 2011-05-02
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
The fans, a complete disgrace how they treated Steve Kean. Deserve relegation for that alone
jimbohammers- Posts : 2463
Join date : 2011-05-04
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
tigerrobins wrote:All for me.
FANS- I have no problem about the protesting, at all, before and after games .Just think that they should have stopped during the 90 mins the games on and supported the team during games more.
PLAYERS-Win at Old Trafford, put in credable performance at Anfield, and then don't turn up when most required, alot of them should be ashamed of there performances this season.
MANAGER-Talked a good game, shame he couldn't reproduce it. Disillusioned most of the time, really he was the wrong man from the start.
VENKYS- For reasons stated above.
Perhaps you are right. Maybe the better question would be which party holds most of the blame.
Gordy- Posts : 788
Join date : 2011-11-14
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Ent wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18005433
more developments.
CEO sacked for leaked letter, Kean determined to stay on.
Soap opera stuff this.
It is embarrassing as the club further un-ravel.
As a fan it is distressing to see such turmoil and chaos.
The only things that are certain is that Kean and the Venkys are not budging. It needs change, not sure their is a buyer out there who would come into this car wreck because the Venkys no doubt will over-value the club.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
In that case Gordy, i think the players should take most of the blame.
They are not a bad squad, but other than a few performances badly underperformed, seemed disintrested quite a few games, but we're quite happy to pick up there pay check. Showed very little desire, and didn't seem ready to fight. But were quite happy to blame everything else for there problems.
Plus if the players were performing, the other things wouldn't have become such major issues.
They are not a bad squad, but other than a few performances badly underperformed, seemed disintrested quite a few games, but we're quite happy to pick up there pay check. Showed very little desire, and didn't seem ready to fight. But were quite happy to blame everything else for there problems.
Plus if the players were performing, the other things wouldn't have become such major issues.
Luke- Posts : 5201
Join date : 2011-03-16
Location : Wst Yorkshire
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Anderson - Venky's with their yes man Kean, have the club in an iron vice. In a few years time the stadium will be replaced by a Venky's Chicken processing factory.legendkillarV2 wrote:Ent wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18005433
more developments.
CEO sacked for leaked letter, Kean determined to stay on.
Soap opera stuff this.
It is embarrassing as the club further un-ravel.
As a fan it is distressing to see such turmoil and chaos.
The only things that are certain is that Kean and the Venkys are not budging. It needs change, not sure their is a buyer out there who would come into this car wreck because the Venkys no doubt will over-value the club.
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I must admit, it does make wonder what the motives and interests for these foreign owners that are taking over the game here are? What could an Indian poultry business have a vested interest in an English football club for? How are they qualified to run it? Should there be a rule in England that foreign owners should have to provide a certain amount of investment before buying a club? Foreign owners taking over clubs with rich histories simply as part time hobbies or playthings is not something that sits well with me. Even huge clubs like Liverpool and Manchester Utd have not been immune from this.
Gordy- Posts : 788
Join date : 2011-11-14
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
I blame the fans who have been nothing short of a complete Joke this season.
It has been absolutely shocking to see the lack of support in some stages throughout the season.
I am a Stoke fan, and i know that if our team had been taken over, new manager, etc etc and we were not doing well in the league, id like to think we would have 26,000 every week trying to get behind our team!
Standing and hurling abuse at a manager who was selected by Indian owners is pathetic.
Shame on you lot
It has been absolutely shocking to see the lack of support in some stages throughout the season.
I am a Stoke fan, and i know that if our team had been taken over, new manager, etc etc and we were not doing well in the league, id like to think we would have 26,000 every week trying to get behind our team!
Standing and hurling abuse at a manager who was selected by Indian owners is pathetic.
Shame on you lot
mobilemaster8- Posts : 4302
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Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Stoke fans did boo Aaron Ramsey...
Crimey- Admin
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Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Every now and then an appiontment is made in football that is completely baffling with the most recent being Steve Kean. Nobody blames him for taking the job - and the money that comes with it - but it became increasingly evident just a few months in that he wasn't up to the task. His comments going into the Wigan match, where he said he was surprised Blackburn were in the position they were, took more than the buscuit. A fish out of water? He's been space bound for the entire season.
So what if the fans boo. As paying customers they are entitled to voice their frustrations in whatever way they see fit, within reason. The fans are the fabric of the football club and if the players can't deal with a little disgruntlement then they need to toughen up. Supporters don't relegate football teams poor performances do. I'm not gonna slag off the Blackburn fans anyway.
And now we have Kean saying he's in it for the long run. Oh dear...
Kean can do alot worse than take the knife out of Big Sam's back when passing him on the way down.
So what if the fans boo. As paying customers they are entitled to voice their frustrations in whatever way they see fit, within reason. The fans are the fabric of the football club and if the players can't deal with a little disgruntlement then they need to toughen up. Supporters don't relegate football teams poor performances do. I'm not gonna slag off the Blackburn fans anyway.
And now we have Kean saying he's in it for the long run. Oh dear...
Kean can do alot worse than take the knife out of Big Sam's back when passing him on the way down.
Last edited by FreekShow on Fri 11 May 2012, 5:49 pm; edited 1 time in total
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
Jerome Anderson seems to have an enormous influence on Blackburn Rovers - he is Steve Kean's agent as well as the agent for the Venkys. Kean even signed Jerome Anderson son onto the team. An Agent (Jerome Anderson) is running Blackburn Rovers - it is believed that he told the Venkys to sack Allardyce, sign Kean and recently sack the deputy CEO for the "leaked" letter - which shows they can act fast when "needed" - suggesting that Blackburn Rovers is being tightly supervised (by Anderson).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerome_Anderson_(football_agent)#Blackburn_Rovers
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerome_Anderson_(football_agent)#Blackburn_Rovers
Guest- Guest
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
It is interesting to see that going by this poll the only people who had any direct influence on results are getting away scott free!
Ent- Posts : 7337
Join date : 2011-05-02
Re: Blackburn Rovers - Who Do You Blame?
fans and venkys for me
fans got on the teams/managers back when they needed them most
kean wasnt up for it, but it i get the feeling he did his best cant ask more of him than that. do we ask the mcdonanlds worker who cant get there order right to step down and give up a job? i dont blame him for not walking away its his livelyhood
players werent good enough, but like kean they were giving it there best go. simply not good enough but leads me to the
venkys- responisble for sacking a proven manager in big sam then appointed his coach as manager. gave lots of promises of big players but didnt bring in any, in fact lost thier biggest players
fans got on the teams/managers back when they needed them most
kean wasnt up for it, but it i get the feeling he did his best cant ask more of him than that. do we ask the mcdonanlds worker who cant get there order right to step down and give up a job? i dont blame him for not walking away its his livelyhood
players werent good enough, but like kean they were giving it there best go. simply not good enough but leads me to the
venkys- responisble for sacking a proven manager in big sam then appointed his coach as manager. gave lots of promises of big players but didnt bring in any, in fact lost thier biggest players
compelling and rich- Posts : 6084
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