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A chance to improve away records

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dallym
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Post by blackcanelion Fri 1 Jun - 12:17

This has got to be a chance for teams to improve their away record. I think it's something everyone has to do if they want to improve their world ranking, and their seeding for the next world cup. The thing that strikes me is the poor record most sides have.

What follows is a summary of the away records of the sides involved in the 6 nations and up coming rugby championship. It's for the last 10 years (i.e. from 1 june 2002) and only includes games between the side that occur at oppositions ground (i.e. no neutral grounds).

Italy: 3 wins in 41 games. Obviously, they've struggled against almost everyone. The only brightspot is that they share the spoils with Argentina.
Scotland: 5 wins in 37 games. They've had the wood on Argentina, but that's it.
Wales: 12 wins in 43 games. Competative with Scotland and Italy, struggled against England and Ireland and been more or less out of their depth against France, Argentina and the SANZAR boys.
Argentina: 11 wins out of 29 games. Dominated Scotland and Italy. Competative with England and France. No vicories against the rest.
South Africa: 20 wins in 52 games. 100% record Italy, Wales and Argentina, competative with England and Scotland, struggled aagainst the others. No victories in France.
Ireland: 17 wins in 45 games. Dominated Italy and Scotland. Competative with England and Wales. Monstered by the rest.
Australia:21 wins out of 56 games. Dominated Argentina, Italy, and Scotland. Generally had the wood on Wales. Competative with England and France. Struggled against Ireland and South Africa. Haven't won in NZ in over 10 years.
France: 20 wins in 50 games. Have generally dominated Italy, Scotland. Have won more times than they've lost in wales and Ireland and been competative in South Africa. Struggled England and NZ. haven't won in Australia or Argentina in over 10 years.
England: 20 wins in 47 games. Have dominated Italy. Shared the spoils with Wales, Scotland, Argentina and Australia. Struggled in France, Ireland and NZ. Haven't registered a win in SA in more than 10 years.
NZ: 39 wins in 53 games. Shared the spoils with the boks and Wallabies, dominated everyone else.

It may be yesterday's news. But most sides struggle away. I was surprised at how much. Even during mid season tournements. What I'm taking out of this is, if someone wins give them credit.


Last edited by blackcanelion on Sat 2 Jun - 21:59; edited 1 time in total

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Post by dallym Fri 1 Jun - 12:51

NZ 39 wins. Next best is 21.



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Post by Biltong Fri 1 Jun - 14:57

When you consider SA played 25 of those matches in Oz and NZ and Oz has played 26 of those matches against SA and NZ with SA only winning 4 and Oz winning 3 of them, their records are misleading as half their away matches are against top 3 teams.
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Post by maestegmafia Fri 1 Jun - 23:25

Interesting post mate

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Fri 1 Jun - 23:53

Well same for us Biltong. 39 out of 53 is unacceptably low. Considering we haven't lost up north in a few years. That's too many losses to SA, Australia and France. Sad

Any chance BC of getting the home records as well? Nice post. It is indeed surprising how poor some teams' away record is.

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Post by blackcanelion Sat 2 Jun - 20:39

Biltongbek. Good point roughly half the games NZ, Aus and SA played during that period were against easch other. However part of SA's problem over this period was it's struggle to win in Europe against the likes of: France (0 from 3), Ireland (1 from 4) and England (3 from 6).

I know it's been a bit of a golden era for the AB's, coninciding with increasing games. So I'm sure that it will come back into balance (I'm dreading it).

Kiakahaaotearoa. OK. same thing for home games (same deal last 10 years ,doesn't include neutral or away grounds, only games between 6 nations and rugby championship sides):

Italy: 7 wins from 37 games. Generally beat Scotland. Competative with Wales, and struggled against France. but that's it.

Scotland:16 wins from 45 games. Generally beats Italy. Competative with England, Wales and South Africa. Has struggled against Ireland, Australia and France. No wins against NZ or the Pumas.

Wales: 23 wins from 52 games. Hasn't lost to Scotland or Argentina and generally beats Italy. Competative with Ireland and England. Has struggled against Australia and France. No wins against SA or NZ.

Argentina: 13 wins from 24 games. Hasn't lost to France or Ireland and generally beaten Wales. Competative with England and Italy. Struggled against Scotland. No wins against NZ, Australia or SA.

England: 31 wins from 50 games. Hasn't lost to Scotland or Italy. Generally beats Wales and France. Competative with with the boks, Pumas, Wallabies and Irish. Has struggled against NZ.

Ireland: 30 wins in 45 games. Hasn't lost to Italy or Argentina. Generally beats Scotland, South Africa, Wales and England. Competative with Australia and France. No wins against NZ.

France: 33 wins in 48 games. Hasn't lost to South Africa, Italy or Scotland. Generally beaten Wales, Ireland. Competative with England, Argentina and Australia. No wins against NZ.

Australia: 42 wins in 54 games. No losses to Italy, Scotland, Ireland, Wales, Argentina or France. Generaly beaten South Africa and competative with England and NZ.

South Africa: 37 wions from 48 games. No losses to Italy, Scotland, Argentina, Ireland, Wales or England. Generally beaten Australia. Competative with France and NZ.

New Zealand: 46 victories from 50 games. No tour by Scotland. No losses to Italy, Argentina, Ireland, Wales or Australia. Generally beaten the boks, England and France.

My take: It's hard to win away. Only NZ do it consistently. However most teams have their bogy teams that they struggle with. If recent history is anything to by a win down under is going to be hard.



Last edited by blackcanelion on Sat 2 Jun - 21:52; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : spelling)

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Post by Pot Hale Sat 2 Jun - 21:37

"England: 31 wins from 50 games. Hasn't lost to Scotland or Ireland. Generally beats Wales and France. Competative with with the boks, Pumas, Wallabies and Irish. Has struggled against NZ."


England haven't lost to Ireland at Twickenham?

Really? Seem to recall Ireland beating the RWC champions in their first match in 2004. And again in 2010.
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Post by blackcanelion Sat 2 Jun - 21:55

Oops. Should have been Italy at the start. Obviously mentioned them being competative with Ireland at Twickenham (2 wins out of 5) at the end.

Pot Hale wrote:"England: 31 wins from 50 games. Hasn't lost to Scotland or Ireland. Generally beats Wales and France. Competative with with the boks, Pumas, Wallabies and Irish. Has struggled against NZ."


England haven't lost to Ireland at Twickenham?

Really? Seem to recall Ireland beating the RWC champions in their first match in 2004. And again in 2010.

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Post by Guest Sat 2 Jun - 22:12

Good posts these, very interesting. The AB's 'away' record reads like a 'home' record when compared with some teams. And ABs, SA and oz haven't lost to their respective upcoming opponents at home for over 10 years. Will it be any different this year I wonder?

Like the use of the word 'generally' beaten, very humble. The ABs don't play eng/france enough at home. I presume they've won one each with SA x2 wins? How many times have we played eng/france over the last 10?

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Post by blackcanelion Sat 2 Jun - 22:50

Yep. Loses in NZ were to England in 2003 (by 2pts), France in 2008 (by 5 pts) and South Africa in 2008 (2pts) and 2009 (3pts).

Played England a total of 11 times (6 in UK - 5 here), which is up there. It's as much as Ireland, Scotland or South Africa. Played France a total 14 times in the last 10 years (7 in NZ, 5 in France, 2 in Neutral venues). Only England have played them more.


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