Robshaw for Lions Captain?

The guy is immense, a true leader of men.

He has to be in pole position for the Lions captaincy, no one else can touch him on current form IMO.

Who else is there?

Easy choice for Gatland IMO.

He will find it hard getting ahead of Warburton and Rennie, no?

Gatland will find it hard to select Warburton as captain as he'll be accused of favouring the Welsh players, plus let’s be honest when the heat is on the pressure gets to Warburton.

Hey I'm all for it HERSH.... say what's his record in the SH like?

Better than Warburtons!

Everyone knows the back row will be a massively competitive area. At this point you could make a solid argument for about 15 players to tour, or even start. I guess about 8 players will tour, so it depends largely on form between now and then. If I were picking right now he'd only be on the fringes of the tour squad, so would definitely not be a sensible choice as captain. However if he has another big year with Quins and continues to grow into his role with England then he could be a test player, in which case you'd have to consider him as skipper. A rather long winded way of saying I've selected 'maybe'.

Robshaw is in as good form as any of the other 7's who qualify to play for the Lions so is in with a shot at making the squad.

He is also as good a leader as anyone else who might be in the squad, so on that basis, he has to have a half decent chance of being given the Lions captaincy.

HERSH wrote:Better than Warburtons!

Warburton has a 25% win record in matches south of the equator against Tier 1 countries.


Robshaw has **counts fingers*** ***removes socks and counts toes*** 0%

Mind you the one win for Warburton is over Ireland

Ross Ford for captain btw.

But Sam has also seen Red once the pressure was turned on.

A Lions series against Aus is huge, once again I'd fear that the red mist will descend.

He isn't a captain IMO, good player but not a captain.

Richie Gray for captain, may his blonde mop be a beacon to all!

NeilyBroon wrote:Richie Gray for captain, may his blonde mop be a beacon to all!

He's probably the most guaranteed start player at the moment.

Lets be honest if England had played Aus last weekend we would have done a Scotland and won.

So maybe a Scot or an English gent should lead the Lions?

50/50 so far, looks like he would be a good choice for the Lions

I think Robshaw is begining to look a certainty for the Lions squad but I'm still unconvinced he's a particularly good leader and he is still rubbish at talking to the ref which is going to be important when playing against a team containing Pocock. Robshaw is improving as a captain for Quins and England so I see no reason why he shouldn't be given the arm band is he improves to the required level.

HERSH wrote:Lets be honest if England had played Aus last weekend we would have done a Scotland and won.

So maybe a Scot or an English gent should lead the Lions?

Not really. You played a rusty SA and still lost. England looked like they were playing to the best of their abilities and SA won at a canter. Australia would have beaten England as well. All three NH teams that played on Saturday were poor. Wales especially but I don't think England would have beaten Aus.

Not sure the pressure was on when Warburton got red carded as the game was still in the first ten minutes.

I could see Richie Gray getting it but actually I think you might be right. Robshaw has done pretty well since coming in to England but he will have to be awesome to see off Warburton. Gatland likes to go with what he knows...

We own Aus!

It would have been another win for England down-under if we had the good fortune of playing the weakest SH giant.

Even NZ would have struggled against SA at home.

Robshaw would have to be captain, otherwise he won't get in the team. Traditionally the selectors always include the national captains in the Lions squad so Robshaw should at least get on the plane.

Good call Hersh, but Gats has already pencilled in Hartley. Maybe vice-captain for Robshaw.

First he would have to get in th team - and as there are at lest half a dozen back row players lions qualified better than him .........................

Hersh, I bet you also think that Farrell should be starting fly half with Ashton on the wing. Robshaw isn't a definite starting 7 yet, in my opinion he's a 6 mainly, but he has been a good captain and player, but still needs to do more to be Lions captain.

That's why he would have to be captain TJ.

Went for maybe, but most likely no IMO. It will be hard for a backrower to be cap as its so competitive with nobody being a guaranteed starter(maybe Ferris). Also for me he is weakest 7 out of home nations at present, but still a year to go.

In terms of unseen work, Robshaw is right up there. I didn't notice him do too much in the test against SA but the stats came out with him making 21 tackles (0 missed), hitting 33 rucks and making 4 turnovers. All very impressive for a an inexperienced test player and captain.

mckay1402, England played no where near their potential, with Farrell at the helm we looked useless in attack. When Flood came on we started to look far more dangerous and had he started it may have been a different game. The forwards did well for the first 40 but then SA really upped the game and we didnt adjust (I think we can though). 2nd test will show where England really are imo, they will now know what to expect and shouldn't be as shocked like they were in the 2nd half and will show us their true capabilities.

Very good player, but he'll be lucky to be in the squad given the other back row options available.

Has a national captain ever not been in the Lions squad, (barring injury)?

belovedfrosties wrote:In terms of unseen work, Robshaw is right up there. I didn't notice him do too much in the test against SA but the stats came out with him making 21 tackles (0 missed), hitting 33 rucks and making 4 turnovers. All very impressive for a an inexperienced test player and captain.

mckay1402, England played no where near their potential, with Farrell at the helm we looked useless in attack. When Flood came on we started to look far more dangerous and had he started it may have been a different game. The forwards did well for the first 40 but then SA really upped the game and we didnt adjust (I think we can though). 2nd test will show where England really are imo, they will now know what to expect and shouldn't be as shocked like they were in the 2nd half and will show us their true capabilities.

Just love the irony there, frosties

The Great Aukster wrote:Has a national captain ever not been in the Lions squad, (barring injury)?

Aukster, yes, I'm pretty sure that initially in 2009 (before injuries took their toll), only BOD was in the touring party, but was later joined by Mike Blair and Ryan Jones, but not by Steve Borthwick?

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

belovedfrosties wrote:In terms of unseen work, Robshaw is right up there. I didn't notice him do too much in the test against SA but the stats came out with him making 21 tackles (0 missed), hitting 33 rucks and making 4 turnovers. All very impressive for a an inexperienced test player and captain.

mckay1402, England played no where near their potential, with Farrell at the helm we looked useless in attack. When Flood came on we started to look far more dangerous and had he started it may have been a different game. The forwards did well for the first 40 but then SA really upped the game and we didnt adjust (I think we can though). 2nd test will show where England really are imo, they will now know what to expect and shouldn't be as shocked like they were in the 2nd half and will show us their true capabilities.

Just love the irony there, frosties

Haha! Didn't notice that! I was just thinking along the lines of the pundits and how Lydiate won player of the 6N for all his "unseen" work, just pointing out that i hadn't noticed him doing anything, turns out that he did loads though!

I think if you are English you would want Robshaw to be Captain.

But Gatland is in charge of the Lions and Gatland is incahrge of Wales and Sam Warbutton Plays is Rugby in Wales. So even though i voted yes for Robshaw. I do Believe that Gatland will go for Sam Warbutton instead.

HERSH wrote:The guy is immense, a true leader of men.

He has to be in pole position for the Lions captaincy, no one else can touch him on current form IMO.

Doesn't the Lions captain usually come from a good team?

I think there are too many players that on form could be ahead of him for him to make the starting team, so he wouldn't be captain.

He does have two plus points though, as a bench option covering 6 & 7 and the fact that he seems to be very resilient. At a time when more and more backrowers are dropping he's been injury free so maybe he'll be the last man standing? (Or i've put the hex on him...)

welliamwibb wrote:

HERSH wrote:The guy is immense, a true leader of men.

He has to be in pole position for the Lions captaincy, no one else can touch him on current form IMO.

Doesn't the Lions captain usually come from a good team?

Are you saying that Wales are a good team? In the NH maybe, but against SH teams, not so good.

And of course you are not Biased at all are you?

The Great Aukster wrote:Has a national captain ever not been in the Lions squad, (barring injury)?

Ryan Jones 09 I think

majesticimperialman wrote:

welliamwibb wrote:

HERSH wrote:The guy is immense, a true leader of men.

He has to be in pole position for the Lions captaincy, no one else can touch him on current form IMO.

Doesn't the Lions captain usually come from a good team?

Are you saying that Wales are a good team? In the NH maybe, but against SH teams, not so good.

And of course you are not Biased at all are you?

Wales are the best team in Britain and Ireland and those are the only nations that are in the Lions, are they not?

HERSH wrote:The guy is immense, a true leader of men.

He has to be in pole position for the Lions captaincy, no one else can touch him on current form IMO.

Well done Hersh.... the funniest thing I've heard all day....

I'm amazed how many have taken the bait...

But only England Ireland and Scotland can beat Aus.

Definitely not to Robshaw being captain, on current form he would only be 4th choice openside for the lions behind Rennie, O'Brien and Warburton.

No clear choice for captain as yet but some of the contenders come selection time I think will be Warburton, O'Connell, Kelly Brown, Ross Ford, Mike Blair.

i shall try and answer the question ignoring hersh's sad attempt to entise a reaction from most likely welsh fans.

while he has done a good job for england, as many have stated their are far to many quality backrow players ahead of him to have him even considered a starting place.

at 7 there is the likes of Warburton, Rennie, SOB (although more likely included as a 6), Tipuric etc
at 6, there is Strokosch, Denton (more likely an 8), haskel (not a personal favourite but a better player than robshaw), Lydiate, Ferris, SOB


and he isint an 8, so he faces to many challenges to see him start never mind captain, also relatively inexperienced in comparison to the other main contendors.

contendors in my opinon for captaincy are
warburton who is no means a certainty for the 7 shirt with the competition he faces.
Best, who will face competition from another possible captain Ross Ford and also Matthew Rees. also possibly Hartley (not my choicen but a good leader)
Alyn wyn, PoC, Gray all potential captains but none certain starters.
Bod, who again is no means a certainty to start.

also the fact is lions is a year away and anything could happen, injuries, form, new players etc

Barney McGrew did it wrote:But only England Ireland and Scotland can beat Aus.

Against Australia...

Ireland
Played 30
Wins 9
Losses 20
Draws 1

Scotland
Played 27
Wins 9
Losses 18
Draws 0

England
Played 40
Wins 16
Losses 23
Draws 1

Wales
Played 33
Wins 10
Losses 22
Draws 1


So your WUM is completly incorrect, as Wales have a better record than both Ireland and Scotland against Australia, and will have a series win in 2 weeks time....

Obviously I have been championing Robshaw's inclusion for England for about 5 years now. I don't think anyone can argue with me that he is now one of the first names on the English teamsheet.

In defence he has an unbelievable work-rate. He makes tackle after tackle, makes a huge impact at the breakdown and knows when to come out of the line at the right time.

In attack he may not be the most effective ball carrier. However, he always offers himself as a carrier and his distribution ability to play wide balls or use soft hands to put players into space is the sign of a true link-man.

His leadership qualities have been outstanding for both club and country, and he really leads the team from the front. He's the sort of captain you want to follow into battle and consistency is his middle name.

If he was appointed captain of the Lions, I'm sure he would thrive with the responsibility. However, he faces a lot of competition if he wants to make the squad....

Warbuton, Tipuric, Lydiate, Faletau, Heaslip, O'Brien, Ferris, Rennie, Brown, Croft and Haskell will all be competing for 6 or 7 spots.

Oh and of course DENTON!

sirBiggles wrote:

Barney McGrew did it wrote:But only England Ireland and Scotland can beat Aus.

Against Australia...

Ireland
Played 30
Wins 9
Losses 20
Draws 1

Scotland
Played 27
Wins 9
Losses 18
Draws 0

England
Played 40
Wins 16
Losses 23
Draws 1

Wales
Played 33
Wins 10
Losses 22
Draws 1


So your WUM is completly incorrect, as Wales have a better record than both Ireland and Scotland against Australia, and will have a series win in 2 weeks time....

Fixed that for you. Scotland's win ratio of 33.3% is marginally better than Wales' 30.03%. Also Ireland's 30.00% isn't significantly different to Wales', statistically speaking. And all 3 teams have an identical games-not-lost ratio of 33.3%. Which isn't great.

robshaw4england wrote:Oh and of course DENTON!

Oh Jesus Christ

forgot about him

Kiwireddevil wrote:

sirBiggles wrote:

Barney McGrew did it wrote:But only England Ireland and Scotland can beat Aus.

Against Australia...

Ireland
Played 30
Wins 9
Losses 20
Draws 1

Scotland
Played 27
Wins 9
Losses 18
Draws 0

England
Played 40
Wins 16
Losses 23
Draws 1

Wales
Played 33
Wins 10
Losses 22
Draws 1


So your WUM is completly incorrect, as Wales have a better record than both Ireland and Scotland against Australia, and will have a series win in 2 weeks time....

Fixed that for you. Scotland's win ratio of 33.3% is marginally better than Wales' 30.03%. Also Ireland's 30.00% isn't significantly different to Wales', statistically speaking. And all 3 teams have an identical games-not-lost ratio of 33.3%. Which isn't great.

Wasnt trying to "put down" Englands, Irelands or Scotlands achievements against Australia. I was just trying to respond to a pathetic WUM by Barney Mc, who was trying to imply that ONLY England, Ireland and Scotland should be considered as ONLY they CAN beat Australia..... A statement that was incorrect...

... and I agree.... none of them have a record to be proud of.

Hartley for captain, Mouritz Botha for vice captain. Tuilagi the 'defence general.'

sirBiggles wrote:

Kiwireddevil wrote:

sirBiggles wrote:

Barney McGrew did it wrote:But only England Ireland and Scotland can beat Aus.

Against Australia...

Ireland
Played 30
Wins 9
Losses 20
Draws 1

Scotland
Played 27
Wins 9
Losses 18
Draws 0

England
Played 40
Wins 16
Losses 23
Draws 1

Wales
Played 33
Wins 10
Losses 22
Draws 1


So your WUM is completly incorrect, as Wales have a better record than both Ireland and Scotland against Australia, and will have a series win in 2 weeks time....

Fixed that for you. Scotland's win ratio of 33.3% is marginally better than Wales' 30.03%. Also Ireland's 30.00% isn't significantly different to Wales', statistically speaking. And all 3 teams have an identical games-not-lost ratio of 33.3%. Which isn't great.

Wasnt trying to "put down" Englands, Irelands or Scotlands achievements against Australia. I was just trying to respond to a pathetic WUM by Barney Mc, who was trying to imply that ONLY England, Ireland and Scotland should be considered as ONLY they CAN beat Australia..... A statement that was incorrect...

... and I agree.... none of them have a record to be proud of.

Sorry mate, I left the big off the end of my post