Olympic Stadium could be World Cup venue

http://www.espnscrum.com/2015-rugby-world-cup/rugby/story/166456.html

London' Olympic Stadium may be used in the 2015 World Cup after the company managing the venue submitted an application for it to host matches during the tournament.

The Olympic Stadium is set to be reconfigured from an 80,000 capacity athletics venue to a 60,000 multi-use arena. The Olympic Park Legacy Company is currently deciding who will be awarded anchor-tenant status, with a decision due to be announced after the Olympic Games. England Rugby 2015, the World Cup organising committee, currently has three London stadiums on their short-list of 12 for the tournament in the shape of Twickenham, Wembley and Arsenal's Emirates Stadium. If the Olympic Stadium's bid is accepted it is expected that the Emirate Stadium will be removed from the short-list.

"It would be great to have a world-class event in a world class venue," Paul Vaughan chief executive of ER 2015 told The Daily Telegraph. "It will help the Olympic legacy as well, so we are very keen to work on them with that, particularly because rugby is going into the Olympics in 2016 in Brazil."

ER 2015 will name the stadium it intends to use during the World Cup early next year. Manchester United's Old Trafford, Liverpool's Anfield and Cardiff's Millennium Stadium are also on the short-list.

Not a bad idea because of the size however having the atheletics track around the side of the pitch means supporters will be further away from the action, which can also affect the atmosphere in the stadium. So maybe not such a good idea.

Yep that's exactly what we need, more games in London. Wembley and Twickers will already be hosting games with all the England games at Twickers (probably any other other big money spinners as the RFU will want to maximise their own ticket sales). Sod London this is the chance for the whole country to enjoy international rugby, let's spread it around a bit. Newcastle, Lancashire, Yorkshire, East Midlands and West Country should all be hosting matches as well. There's good rugby stadiums in all of those that would draw good crowds, why ram more of it into London? It's bad enough no one outside of London will set an England game without venturing into the capital.

I'm still hopeful at least one Samoan game will take place at Welford Rd as we've had at least one Samoan international in the team for the last decade or so and it would be great to welcome the national side to WR.

So far as I'm aware, WR is still on the schedule of grounds. As are many more.

According to wiki
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Rugby_World_Cup#Venues

That was at the last announcement Portnoy and I wasn't particularly impressed to see the Millenium Stadium on the list then. Would rather see that replaced by Sandy Park as there are enough big venues already for the big games and a stadium closer to the South West would spread it around England a bit more. There are always a good number of smaller scale games which will only attract 10k or so fans so to my mind it makes sense to have those at club grounds where the 10k or so fans plus the local rugby neutrals can pack the place out and create an atmosphere for the players.

formerly known as Sam wrote:That was at the last announcement Portnoy and I wasn't particularly impressed to see the Millenium Stadium on the list then. Would rather see that replaced by Sandy Park as there are enough big venues already for the big games and a stadium closer to the South West would spread it around England a bit more. There are always a good number of smaller scale games which will only attract 10k or so fans so to my mind it makes sense to have those at club grounds where the 10k or so fans plus the local rugby neutrals can pack the place out and create an atmosphere for the players.

Well I can't disagree with that. Whenever the MS is used and doesn't host Wales, they stay at home in their droves.

Am i right in thinking that this would not be an additional London venue but rather one which displaces the emirates?

Also agree that Sandy Park would be a great venue for some of the lower profile games.

Carpe Diem wrote:Am i right in thinking that this would not be an additional London venue but rather one which displaces the emirates?

Also agree that Sandy Park would be a great venue for some of the lower profile games.

The article suggests that the Emirates would be dropped, CD

Thanks Port wasn't sure i'd read that right. Do you think the Olympic stadium (or whatever it's called by then, probably the 'Bovril Bowl' or something) will be cheaper to rent than the Emirates?

AM I right in thinging that the Millenium Stadium has to be used (at least once) as that was part of the WRUs deal with the other home nations (and France) when during RWC99 (when the pool games were spread everywhere)? So I would assume the MS would home Wales Vrs Bigest Name In Pool (well biggest second seeds in pool, seeing as we will be top seeds ), and then maybe one QF or 3/4 play-off.

As for the Wendyball stadiums, I am not too sure they are a good idea, especially Old Traford etc, as the football season will be well under way, and they play mid-week matches etc so I assume dummies will be spat over damaged pitches etc.

I don't think there is anything that says the MS has to be used.

RFU have agreed to lease it from the WRU to ensure a decent spread of games in proper rugby stadia.

Using Olympic Stdium instead of some club footy grounds makes sense. I still doubt we will see matches at Old Trafford etc.

To be honest I'd prefer they ditched all the football stadiums other than Old Trafford and Wembley and utilised rugby stadiums for the rest. That would give three massive stadiums for the games where big numbers are expected and the knock out rounds and then move a lot of the smaller games e.g. Tier 1 vs Minnow or Minnow vs Minnow to proper rugby stadiums and have them full and swinging.

LondonTiger wrote:I don't think there is anything that says the MS has to be used.

I am pretty sure there is, can't find any evidence, but that was why in RWC07 (in France) there were two games (i think only Wales/Aus group, France/NZ semi) played in the MS.

I remember reading the bumf when the WC was awarded and it said RFU may choose to hold games at MS, but that it would be leased and managed under the auspices of RFU.

I may of course be going senile.

LondonTiger wrote:I remember reading the bumf when the WC was awarded and it said RFU may choose to hold games at MS, but that it would be leased and managed under the auspices of RFU.

I may of course be going senile.

Yeah tehre may well be some sort of handing over the reigns to the RFU to use it as they see fit, but it htink it must be used some how.

I would see them use- Wembley, Twickers, the Olympic Stadium, WR, Old Trafford, Kingsholm, Franklin Gardens, Sixways and maybe some other AP stadia. If they use the MS, Wales shouldn't be allowed to play matches there.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:I don't think there is anything that says the MS has to be used.

I am pretty sure there is, can't find any evidence, but that was why in RWC07 (in France) there were two games (i think only Wales/Aus group, France/NZ semi) played in the MS.

Wasn't that the WRU's bribe to vote for the French application? Also, I think Fiji v Japan was played there. I've got a feeling it was 3 group games and one quarter final

HammerofThunor wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:I don't think there is anything that says the MS has to be used.

I am pretty sure there is, can't find any evidence, but that was why in RWC07 (in France) there were two games (i think only Wales/Aus group, France/NZ semi) played in the MS.

Wasn't that the WRU's bribe to vote for the French application? Also, I think Fiji v Japan was played there. I've got a feeling it was 3 group games and one quarter final

16 September:
Fiji 29-16 Canada, Cardiff, Pool B
Att 21,175.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/sep/17/rugbyunion.rugbyworldcup200713

Pretty much the only match with empty seats.

Portnoy wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:I don't think there is anything that says the MS has to be used.

I am pretty sure there is, can't find any evidence, but that was why in RWC07 (in France) there were two games (i think only Wales/Aus group, France/NZ semi) played in the MS.

Wasn't that the WRU's bribe to vote for the French application? Also, I think Fiji v Japan was played there. I've got a feeling it was 3 group games and one quarter final

16 September:
Fiji 29-16 Canada, Cardiff, Pool B
Att 21,175.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/sep/17/rugbyunion.rugbyworldcup200713

Pretty much the only match with empty seats.

That is going to be a problem if they decide to use the bigger football stadiums this time around. They would be better off trying to keep it to rugby stadiums, and try to arrange the fixtures so that the lesser games (canada v namibia or the likes) are played in lower cap grounds. That way even thought he attendances will still be low it won't look as bad. And after all the RWC in England will be an advert for the game, and hopefully busy stadiums (albeit smaller ones) would give off a far better atmosphere than larger ones (possibly with a large attendance) with empty seats. That is something the Rabo sides (esp welsh and scottish) have learnt over the last few years.

It would be nice to have certain teams play their group matches in a certain area so that there is the opportunity for the smaller sides to try and court some local support for their group games. Namibia for instance have got an under 20s utility back at Loughborough Uni if they were to play all their games in the midlands (at either WR or Gardens) they could play on that and try to big up the local support in their favour etc.

I wouldn't mind the Olympic Stadium being used, but 4 stadiums in London would be too many.

No problem with England playing all our games at Twickenham. We are at home, we've got to use our home advantage and play at our home ground. If there were more dedicated rugby stadiums with larger capacities I wouldn't be averse to seeing England playing more games outside of Twickenham outside of the World Cup and developing several "home" grounds, but we don't have them.

No problem with the Millenium Stadium being used (I've gone back and forth on this one), but if you put Wales against their 4th and 5th seeds they should be able to fill the stadium without offering Wales a real advantage (they should get 5 points against both their 4th and 5th seeds anyway). Makes sense from a fiscal perspective and won't effect much from a rugby perspective.

I like the idea of basing teams somewhere, but it will take a bit of thought logistically for the whole tournament (and nothing can be considered before the draw). But I guess the organisers are being paid for something.

I really hope the RFU can get this right, because it could be a fantastic tournament. I went to a game in '99, but I don't really remember them (I think I saw England thrash Tonga 101-10, reviewing the fixtures).

4 stadia in london isnt two much it has a quarter of the poulation in and around it and many others very close by- London is also very central

Its a tough balance.
The RWC is a huge money maker for the IRB and RFU, so larger stadia will max out the income. And more money for the RFU means more money filtering down to the grass roots which grows the game.
But we also need to see Rugby interest grow across England. And playing important matches in the North could be huge.
Not sure the right mix.

I don't mind seeing more London stadia used - as long as the total number of London based matches is not increased. Spreading the London matches across more buildings will ease stress on the pitches. If it is an unduly rainy period, this might keep the pitches in more playable shape.

If the aim is to grow the game up north maybe having the All Blacks playing in Old Traford for their groups, and their expected QF. That way a large stadium can be used to house the many fans that would turn up to watch them (and I bet there will probably be a handful of non-rugby folk turn up to see the All Blacks) as well as playing outside of a real strong hold of rugby union

The article says the Emirates will drop off the short list IF the Olympic stadium is added. So it will still be 3 stadiums.

I suppose Rugby league is dominant up north- but lets be honest guys- there are so many peops in east london and many dont even know what rugby is- The oylimpic stadia will be a good thing

Great, lets use the Olympic stadium and remove Millenium Stadium.
The RWC was won by England not Wales.

propdavid_london wrote:Great, lets use the Olympic stadium and remove Millenium Stadium.
The RWC was won by England not Wales.

Problem is that dodgey deals have been done and palms greased, and evelopes exchanged etc etc.

On another note, anyone ever had a good experience watching rugby at an oval ground? Certainly hope they make drastic changes to the seating lay out!

4 stadia in london isnt two much it has a quarter of the poulation in and around it and many others very close by- London is also very central

London is very central? Have you seen a map of England recently? Personally I'd like to see only 2 London stadia used and then as many other games as possible taken to the other parts of the country. It's a great opportunity to grow the game and it's not like Quins, Sarries, Wasps and LI don't offer enough cheap ticket affairs with the double headers etc to encourage people to come and watch rugby. Show international rugby to the north and the south west where interest is in need of a little boost (though Exeter have done good things in the south west). Take it to the midlands and the west country where the smaller games will sell out. Make it about England, there's enough airports dotted about.

Problem is that dodgey deals have been done and palms greased, and evelopes exchanged etc etc.

You got any article links etc on that SS, I believe that the RFU probably did some dodgey deals as is their want but I wouldn't mind seeing the details.

Sam - I can't find anything concrete, but I do remember that there was talk of deals being made with all the other 5 nations sides at the time (RWC 99) that we will allow them their 'home' groups in exchange for tehm returning the favour when their turn rolls around. I really wish I could find a link to a beeb page from back then, but I aint that good a jeyboard jockey.

That said I fully understand what people are saying about it being 'RWC 15 England', and not 'RWC 15 England (and a few game in Wales)'. And to be perfectly honest if Wales were as cack as we were in the mid nighties nobody would even be talking about the MS being used being an advantage or not.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

4 stadia in london isnt two much it has a quarter of the poulation in and around it and many others very close by- London is also very central

London is very central? Have you seen a map of England recently? Personally I'd like to see only 2 London stadia used and then as many other games as possible taken to the other parts of the country. It's a great opportunity to grow the game and it's not like Quins, Sarries, Wasps and LI don't offer enough cheap ticket affairs with the double headers etc to encourage people to come and watch rugby. Show international rugby to the north and the south west where interest is in need of a little boost (though Exeter have done good things in the south west). Take it to the midlands and the west country where the smaller games will sell out. Make it about England, there's enough airports dotted about.

Problem is that dodgey deals have been done and palms greased, and evelopes exchanged etc etc.

You got any article links etc on that SS, I believe that the RFU probably did some dodgey deals as is their want but I wouldn't mind seeing the details.

off course london is very central. from south west to north(the two places you bring up!!!!). it has the best links in- it is the fairerst place to have more stadia for the whole country. England isnt rectangle in shape you know

I see no problem with the Olympic Stadium being used, in fact I think it's a great idea. I'd like to highlight mystiroakey's excellent point about bringing rugby to East London, an area with vast population but no top class rugby. I remember reading recently that Essex has the largest number of amateur clubs bar Yorkshire (which is much bigger), does that not justify some inclusion? East London is traditionally a strong footballing area so it would be nice to also try and win a few fans over there, the ones who would probably turn up to a game on their doorstep but wouldn't bother travelling across London to see a match.

Sam I like your point about spreading it around to get the whole country involved but I think you go a bit too far, it wouldn't make financial sense to neglect so many of the larger stadiums. By the way, rugby in the South West is in no need of "a little boost". 5 big pro clubs and probably the only region where rugby rivals football in participation/supportership. There are due to be games at Kingsholm - the largest of the club grounds - and London is within easy reach for big matches.

While I like the idea of basing big teams in other cities to generate a bit of a community buzz, this neglects the obvious supporter base they all have in their ex-pats around London. Australia, NZ, SA and Ireland all have large ex-pat communities in London and it would seem a bit foolish not to capitalise on this. It would also create a great atmosphere with travelling support plus ex-pats giving a real home feel to a lot of the games. The only one of these teams that it could make sense to move away would be Ireland. As we saw with the HC final that they will travel across in large numbers anyway, somewhere like OT could be a good base for them.

I think 3 London stadiums is about right. One third of England's population is in the South-East and I would guess that at least half the population can get to London in less than a couple of hours.

There do need to be some games in big grounds up North, Old Trafford is the obvious one, and perhaps it may be a good idea to have one or two big games in a football stronghold to really build up and try and give rugby a boost up there, where it is needed. St. James Park and Elland Road perhaps? That would get people interested and may give the Falcons and Leeds a bit of a boost. It might also be a good idea to have Scotland based somewhere up North to get their fans down.

It's supposed to be England's world cup so why use the Millennium Stadium? Wales shouldn't always get to have a couple of home games every time the RWC is in the Northern Hemisphere. Either spread it across the whole UK or keep it in one country at a time. This time it's England, so just use England.

I'd use Twickenham, Wembley, Olympic Stadium, Old Trafford, Welford Road, Kingsholm, St. James' Park and Elland Road. 8 seems about right, it isn't a massive competition in terms of number of games played.

Portnoy wrote:http://www.espnscrum.com/2015-rugby-world-cup/rugby/story/166456.html

London' Olympic Stadium may be used in the 2015 World Cup after the company managing the venue submitted an application for it to host matches during the tournament.

The Olympic Stadium is set to be reconfigured from an 80,000 capacity athletics venue to a 60,000 multi-use arena. The Olympic Park Legacy Company is currently deciding who will be awarded anchor-tenant status, with a decision due to be announced after the Olympic Games. England Rugby 2015, the World Cup organising committee, currently has three London stadiums on their short-list of 12 for the tournament in the shape of Twickenham, Wembley and Arsenal's Emirates Stadium. If the Olympic Stadium's bid is accepted it is expected that the Emirate Stadium will be removed from the short-list.

"It would be great to have a world-class event in a world class venue," Paul Vaughan chief executive of ER 2015 told The Daily Telegraph. "It will help the Olympic legacy as well, so we are very keen to work on them with that, particularly because rugby is going into the Olympics in 2016 in Brazil."

ER 2015 will name the stadium it intends to use during the World Cup early next year. Manchester United's Old Trafford, Liverpool's Anfield and Cardiff's Millennium Stadium are also on the short-list.

Remembering that all stadium in the RWC must be "scrubbed" from all marketing so this impact a lot of private owned stadium like whoever take Olympic stadium after and place like "Emirates" will not agree for it is my mind.

I think the oylimpic stadium will be sold off to a sports club soon enough anyway