The Leicester Tigers thread

[Portnoy]

2012/3 may well prove to be a memorable one.

For once, there seems to be (albeit not unplumbable) strength in depth, a fairly healthy squad and a straightforward, uncomplicated international season.

[Effervescing Elephant]

NURSE!!!!!

[Portnoy]

Watching the sales of season tickets http://www.tigers.talent-sport.co.uk/PagesPublic/ProductBrowse/standAndAreaSelection.aspx?stadium=S2&product=ST1213&campaign=Y6&type=S , I have noted that sales appear to be stubbornly stuck on ~13000.

As the majority of un-sold spaces are at the corners (esp upper stands) and the goal ends, does this suggest that:
1. These STs are initially over-priced
or
2. A second tranche of sales should be withheld until August 1st?

In any case the site could be improved by having a sight shot for each seat rather than a token block shot taken from the best seat. And like Worcester, the price of each seat could be shown at a mouse click.

[doctor_grey]

2012/3 may well prove to be a memorable one............Beware swift dissing responses as they have a tendency to resurface on your <my posts>.

A team can't win a championship wearing kit which looks similar to the clothes worn by Mister Blobby.

[HongKongCherry]

If I were HERSH I'd be feeling quite threatened

[Portnoy]

Cockerill is taking advice to sort out the Tigers' finals jinx:

http://www.espnscrum.com/premiership-2012-13/rugby/story/167425.html

The Tigers have lost five of the last eight Premiership finals and have also failed to climb the final hurdle in their last two Heineken Cup finals. With this in mind, Cockerill will now seek some expertise from some figures who have Tigers links but have left to take on challenges in other sports.

One of these is former Tigers boss Pat Howard and Cockerill has already sought his counsel. "I am going to start to investigate and go and see different people in different sports," Cockerill told the Leicester Mercury. "I want to just go and see if we can add to what we do and perhaps find something that will make the small differences. There are all sorts of possibilities.

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

NURSE!!!!!

Where's my pills?

Dai

[doctor_grey]

Watching the Premiership 7s eight now.
Looks like the Tigers players are wearing the new away kit: Bone-feckin-ugly.
Talent be damned.
Depth be damned.
Tigers are doomed.

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

The main problem with the new kits is they make several of the players look like they have ladies breasts.

[doctor_grey]

That's so true!!!!
You are a genius.
Never thought about it that way til now. So if Tigers beat someone this season, did they win by a ***?

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

Have you been at Portnoys tranquillisers Grey?

[doctor_grey]

Nah, I perscribe my own.
Comes in a bottle.
Rather amber in colour.
Comes from Scotland.
Two fingers at a time.
Over and over.

[Rava]

Another Premiership Final but an early exit from the HC.

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

Nah, I perscribe my own.
Comes in a bottle.
Rather amber in colour.
Comes from Scotland.
Two fingers at a time.
Over and over.

Portnoys wife?



http://www.espnscrum.com/premiership-2012-13/rugby/story/167425.html
Apparently Cockerill has been seeking advice on how to stop losing finals.... from Pat Howard who apparently was over with the Aussie cricket team who errrr lost 4-0, and SCW whos record of post 2003 victories speaks for itself (very quietly)

[Ozzy3213]

Oh no, Tigers have lost in the 7's, this surely means the world will come to an end.

No, sorry, I mean, this must be the fault of the international window we are currently in.

Sorry, what do you mean we're not? We must be.

Ok, well it's the salary cap, yes that's it, how else can you explain other teams beating the mighty Tigers?

They were better on the night, don't be so stupid, the Tigers are greatest sports team of all time, come on get with the program!!!!!

[doctor_grey]

Tigers lost because of their new kit.
Clearly.

[Portnoy]

Calling London-based Tigers

London and South East Supporters Club meeting

http://www.leicestertigers.com/news/14299.php
Will anyone be going?

[Trench Foot]

Leicester Tigers are probably the most successful English club side in history. Its only natural that a few lean seasons falls way below team and supporters' expectations. And, do they really make more excuses than any other team? That is the impression you get from reading this article. One thing is for sure, Tigers have a lot more to be proud of in terms of history and achievements than, oh I don't know, London Irish for example.

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

Leicester Tigers are probably the most successful English club side in history. Its only natural that a few lean seasons falls way below team and supporters' expectations. And, do they really make more excuses than any other team? That is the impression you get from reading this article. One thing is for sure, Tigers have a lot more to be proud of in terms of history and achievements than, oh I don't know, London Irish for example.

Welcome to v2, Trench Foot - you are of course right, but you may be missing some of the context behind certain comments

[Trench Foot]

Can you explain?

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

Can you explain?

It would take too long to explain, but hang around for a while and I'm sure you'll get tae grips with it

[formerly known as Sam]

Portnoy occasionally posts tongue in cheek style threads that some posters take more seriously than others. Generally they run from the themes of the RFU are incompetent/evil or Tigers are the ideal model for English club rugby etc.

[ScarletSpiderman]

Also due to some other more vocal fans (that seem to be gone from these boards) the Tigers have taken on a bit of the panto villan on here (along with Saries, Ospreys and London Welsh).

[Ozzy3213]

Leicester Tigers are probably the most successful English club side in history. Its only natural that a few lean seasons falls way below team and supporters' expectations. And, do they really make more excuses than any other team? That is the impression you get from reading this article. One thing is for sure, Tigers have a lot more to be proud of in terms of history and achievements than, oh I don't know, London Irish for example.

Welcome to v2 Mr Foot sir. A Tigers fan I presume, or merely a sympathiser with their current plight of finishing below the mighty Samurai Welsh?

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

Calling London-based Tigers

London and South East Supporters Club meeting

http://www.leicestertigers.com/news/14299.php
Will anyone be going?

Maybe they should consider setting up and exiles club down there, theres bound to be a spare ground in the Richmond area they could use for London Tigers.

[Portnoy]

Cockerill: Tuilagi greater threat at 13
http://www.espnscrum.com/premiership-2012-13/rugby/story/167559.html

OK. It's a statement of the bleedin' obvious. Personally I'd rather SL dropped him completely from the England squad than play him at 12. For a year or two anyway until he develops more subtlety.

[ed] Or Cockers to try him out at six.

[formerly known as Sam]

Nah if he was being trialled in the backrow you'd want him at 8. That pace and power he has from a standing start bursting from the base of a scrum? Yes please. Steffon Armitage moves to 8 on Toulon scrum possession for a similar reason. I wonder if Tigers could do similar. Move Crane to 6 Croft to 13 and have Manu exploding from the back of the scrum.

Anyway, I agree with Cockers. Manu is the best 13 in the AP, only England would mess about with his positioning when given such a gift by the rugby gods. By all means have him make runs off the 10s shoulder down the 10/12 channel and certainly use him as a decoy runner but don't restrict his running in the outside channels. Not many men his size have that good an outside break or decent footwork.

Agree with Portnoy some subtlety in the handling department over the next season or two would be good to see.

[pjm1]

I think it could be a good season, although as always we'll suffer during the windows - hopefully we have enough depth this time though.

In particular, I'm hoping for:

1. Tom Youngs to get a proper test at hooker and for him to push on for international honours pretty quickly (given England's lack of experienced depth there)
2. Our second row problems (injury-led, largely) to be fixed
3. Mix & match options to be explored more in the back row - e.g. Croft when it suits, Mafi when it need to be kept tighter etc.
4. Harrison to push on and we get some game time out of Mickey Young
5. Ford to develop and flourish
6. Bowden / a.n.other to offer cover for Allen as IC is probably our weakest position, depth-wise
7. Tuilagi to pick himself up after a quieter season in 11/12
8. Our new wings to click and give us both pace and power - we'll miss Alex and Horacio
9. Murphy to last another season

[formerly known as Sam]

I'm not sure we'll miss Alex and Horacio actually. We've got better strength and depth in winger now that we had last year.

Goneva and Benjamin are big boys with pace and big work rates. They'll put themselves around, chase everything and offer a carrying options continuously to the 10.

Thompstone and Lewington are a bit more explosive. Thompstone is another big boy with pace and seems to be able to create space for himself with a good injury free season his reputation could rocket. Young Lewington is perhaps a big rash sometimes and whilst definitely smaller is still pretty physical with solid footballing skills and great acceleration.

Hamilton and Morris are both great all rounders with decent pace, solid skills and enough bulk for the defensive stuff.

I really don't see wing as an issue, especially not when the academy boys Belak and Hudson this year and El Mahdi last year looked good (if inexperienced) in the 7s tournament.

Now hooker, that's a worry and we badly need Tom Youngs to step up and make that shirt his own. A decent development season from Stevens would also be a real blessing with Chutes winding down and no one knowing the full extent of the damage to Hawkins.

[pjm1]

fkaS, It sounds like we're mostly in agreement, except for phrasing... I do think we'll miss both Alex and Agulla, but that's not to say we don't have talented replacements coming in with real potential.

Agulla, for me, was one of those mercurial players who could - and did - conjure something from almost nothing. Some of his tries this last season were genuinely sublime. Benjamin and the others have obvious talents, but they're different.

Alex, on the other hand, was a pretty one-dimensional player but that didn't make him any easier to deal with! I remember one game against Bath when Abendanon played out of his skin but took an absolute pounding off both Tuilagis - but the effect they had in combination must have been utterly demoralising for the Bath team.

You're right, wing shouldn't be a weakness and we have a lot of cover there. I do hope Hawkins is ok and recovers quickly - for himself, rather than for "us".

[Guest]

According to his twitter, you've signed Richard Thorpe from LI:

http://twitter.com/RichardJAThorpe

[Guest]

Tweet now taken down.

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

sounds like someone mates got hold of his phone in the pub

[SirBurger]

sounds like someone mates got hold of his phone in the pub

Think more likely that Cockerill has had words about announcing his arrival through unofficial channels. Pretty sure he will be off to the Tigers.

[formerly known as Sam]

I'd be suprised if he signs now. Tigers announced the cover signings on Wed/Thurs. They brought in Phibbs to cover for Ben Youngs for 4 months and brought back Brett Deacon to cover the various injury and international call ups in the backrow.

With Deacon back I don't think Thorpe will be coming as Phibbs is noted as being signed as an injury dispensation which shows that Tigers haven't got any salary cap left. Plus Thorpe would only cover 6/8 same as Deacon. I'd have thought he was in the running with Deacon for a one year deal but Cockers has gone for Brett and Thorpe jumped the gun with the announcement.

Having said that Cockers does love his squad depth.

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

TRP was reporting that Deacon was signed for depth, whereas they're looking at Thorpe as cover for Croft who is much further away from starting than hoped for

[formerly known as Sam]

Taken from the Tigers official website:

"Deacon, who came up through the ranks at Tigers, returns to Welford Road after two years at Gloucester.
The 30-year-old arrives as an injury dispensation signing following long-term injuries to Tom Croft (neck) and Craig Newby (knee) and will provide cover in the back row."

To be honest even without Croft and Newby I'm not sure we need another signing. As the options are:

6.Mafi, Deacon
7.Salvi, Woods
8.Crane, Waldrom

Crane might not be back straight away but there is still ex-England Uni 8 and Former England 7s Richard de Carpienter in the squad as well as young lock Joe Cain who could play in the backrow if required (be good for his development and our lineout options).

[Guest]

The rugby paper also had you looking at Waldrom's elder brother Scott. Not sure how that fits.

[formerly known as Sam]

That rumour did the rounds after Waldrom initially signed. Can't see it to be honest as I think Scott Waldrom is an openside with 7s experience. We are currently well stocked at 7 with Salvi, Newby and Woods and I'm not sure Cockers will bring in another flanker as squad cover, especially, one who is 32 and seemingly past his best.

If we sign another openside I expect it to be a younger Mafi/Slater style project player as a replacement to either Woods or Newby who will be learning on the job from the more experienced players ready to force their way in, in a couple of seasons time. Worcester, Newcastle or Leeds are more likely hunting grounds in that regard.

[Portnoy]

More likely the Tigers need more depth at 9 and 10 as injury and international call-ups may leave them exposed. Especially as Cockers will be looking for a truly emphatic seasonal performance.

[formerly known as Sam]

Well Portnoy we have good options at 9 and 10 now:

9.Young, Harrison, Young, Phibbs, Steele
10.Flood, Ford, Bowden, Cornwall, Lynn

[funnyExiledScot]

What are the Tigers' back three options this coming season?

Thompstone and Benjamin have come in, and personally I think both will be huge hits, and I'd assume Hamilton will play 15. Who else is there though? Is Ambrosino still knocking around? Any other new kids on the block?

[Portnoy]

There is still the option of picking the inexperienced Geordan Murphy fES.

Going back to Sam's

Well Portnoy we have good options at 9 and 10 now:

9.Young, Harrison, Young, Phibbs, Steele
10.Flood, Ford, Bowden, Cornwall, Lynn

I don't know much about Phibbs (and to be honest I completely forgot about Young. but I know nothing about Steele, Cornwall and Lynn. Are these people capable of taking up any first team duty?

You know how it goes - England feed off Jeff leaders and before you know it Youngs, Harrison, Flood and Ford will be called up if fit..

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

There is still the option of picking the inexperienced Geordan Murphy fES.

Going back to Sam's

Well Portnoy we have good options at 9 and 10 now:

9.Young, Harrison, Young, Phibbs, Steele
10.Flood, Ford, Bowden, Cornwall, Lynn

I don't know much about Phibbs (and to be honest I completely forgot about Young. but I know nothing about Steele, Cornwall and Lynn. Are these people capable of taking up any first team duty?

You know how it goes - England feed off Jeff leaders and before you know it Youngs, Harrison, Flood and Ford will be called up if fit..

Really?

No hard feelings as SRU reject Scott Steele shows his mettle among the Tiger cubs

NEVER mind the aesthetics, just sit back and admire their success. Leicester Tigers have won more Premiership titles than any other club (eight and counting) and they will be hoping to add to that number next Saturday at Twickenham, writes Iain Morrison. The Midlands giants take on the surprise package of the season, Harlequins, in an Aviva final that promises to be a contrast in styles.

If Quins can blunt Leicester’s power then they have the all-round attacking game to trouble anyone but it’s a big ask. With the timing of a thoroughbred, Richard Cockerill’s side have made a run on the rails and are firm favourites after winning 11 straight matches in all competitions including a 43-33 victory over next Saturday’s opponents at the Stoop.

There are no Scots involved but at least one young lad from Dumfries will be watching the game on television after getting plastered – in a manner of speaking. Scott Steele broke his leg a couple of weeks ago in the very last game of the season, although he is too honest to claim that a fractured fibula is all that stands between him and an appearance at Twickenham.

The apprentice scrum-half is probably fifth in the Tigers’ pecking order but he still managed two first team appearances this season and another two games where he sat on the bench, including a key Aviva match against Saracens and the LV= Cup final.

“Ben Youngs was away on international duty with England,” says Steele, reeling off the competition one by one. “Micky Young was banned I think. Sam Harrison had an injury so it was just me and James Grindal left. I got 13 minutes against Newcastle in the league and I came on at the death in an LV game against Bath. It was pretty scary to be honest.”

With so many front-line scrummies missing in action, Cockerill resisted the temptation to sign Peter Stringer as cover, instead putting his faith in the youngster.

“If Scott has to play, he has been really good for us,” said the Leicester coach in the same week he selected Steele to sit on the Tigers’ bench. “He has played some cameo roles for the second team and we picked him up when the Scottish regions were not picking him. He came down on trial and did really well in the second team. The lad will have to step up and have a crack and I know he is not shy of having a go.”

While 15 minutes of first team action for Leicester may not appear the stuff of legend, it was quite an achievement given that Steele was playing schoolboy rugby just last season. While he was in the SRU’s system he was told that they didn’t see him making the next step up and he was released one year ago. Rather than mope he lined up a season with Watsonians but, egged on by Corey Venus, a Scotland age-group exile buddy from Leicester, he wrote off to the Tigers on the off-chance. He was invited to play in the pre-season JP Morgan sevens at Sale and was impressive enough to merit a one-year academy deal.

“I thought that I might as well give it a shot,” he remembers. “It’s been a good option to come down here because I wasn’t going to get offered a professional contract in Scotland. I have no grudge against the SRU, they made their decision and you just have to get on with it, there are no hard feelings.”

Steele turned out for the first two matches in the Scotland under-20 Six Nations team before being called back to the English Midlands to take his place in the Tigers’ matchday squad. He is still young enough to play for the under-20s again next year and, if selected, he will do so as a fully fledged Leicester Tiger. Cockerill was sufficiently impressed to offer the Scot a proper, full-time, professional, two-year contract which he signed back in March.

“He is obviously an intimidating kind of guy,” says Steele of the Tigers coach, “but, as soon as I made the squad, he was very, very helpful in making me feel a part of things rather than just an apprentice. He was really good but so were all the players, they made me very welcome.”

So, underneath all that aggression, Richard Cockerill has a heart of gold! It sounds about as probable as an 18-year-old Scottish reject turning out for England’s premier club.

Steele's a useful young lad

[funnyExiledScot]

I thought Murphy had retired, but perhaps that was just from international duty.

On Steele - you can't go wrong with a Scottish scrum half!

[Portnoy]

Oh dear. Are Scotland trying out the old Ireland trick of getting the Tigers to prepare players for action at the sharp end As? He'd better be as good as POC, Jennings et. al. or he'll fade away like Jim Hamilton.

[formerly known as Sam]

Steele has a very good skill set and some pace. However, he is tiny and needs to up his physicality in order to be considered for selection. He could do with more A League experience as well as he has looked incredibly raw in the matches I've seen. In a few years he could be a good option, just don't expect move than emergency cover and A League appearences this year.

I don't know much about Phibbs (and to be honest I completely forgot about Young. but I know nothing about Steele, Cornwall and Lynn. Are these people capable of taking up any first team duty?

Steele is already explained. Lynn is the academy 10 most likely to step up and cover the first team if needed. That would be a pretty desperate time but he seems a good place kicker and with no Ford around he will be getting lots more game time.

Cornwall is Matt Cornwall. Former England under 20s and Tigers centre who also played at Exeter and Saints. Was nominated for the player of the year in Italy last season whilst playing at 10. Will cover 10,12,13,15 this season and captained the Tigers 7s team.

Cornwall will be called on during the international windows, the youngsters only in emergencies.

What are the Tigers' back three options this coming season?

Wings - Benjamin, Thompstone, Goneva
Wings/Fullbacks - Tait, Morris, Hamilton, Lewington
Fullbacks - Murphy

Amorosino is at Montpellier these days.

[funnyExiledScot]

Oh dear. Are Scotland trying out the old Ireland trick of getting the Tigers to prepare players for action at the sharp end As? He'd better be as good as POC, Jennings et. al. or he'll fade away like Jim Hamilton.

If the Tigers still had Jim Hamilton they might be able to compete better and win things again. People used to fear that Tigers pack once upon a time

[funnyExiledScot]

Thanks Sam.

Know very little about Goneva, Morris and Lewington. I think Tait may see some time at 15 for you guys this season though. Always thought 15 would suit Tait.

Benjamin and Thompstone are cracking signings. You'll get value for money off that pair.

[formerly known as Sam]

Yeah, he left in the days when Louis Deacon was fit for an entire season and so the enforcer role was covered. Now of course we need him back but sadly the Swindon boy is happily ensconed at Gloucester.

Oh well, sounds like we could do with drawing a Scottish team in the HEC. Seems we need to remind a few of the skirt wearers of what a Tigers pack can do (should they actually be bl00dy fit for a change).

Know very little about Goneva, Morris and Lewington

Goneva is built like Tom Youngs but plays on the wing and is a Fiji international (plays OC for them as well) and he scored a load of tries in a RWC game last summer (hattrick or 4). Morris is a solid wing/fullback we got from Leinster last summer, he is basically a younger Hamilton so he is a good squad player but unlikely to demand a wing slot and will find it tough to get in at 15. Lewington is an academy graduate (20 or 21) he is pacey with a good footballing game and is starting to look physical enough to make it. Cockers likes Lewington but thinks he is rash at times (as said in an interview), he played very well in the LV Cup last season with a sensational try against Quins (collected a grubber without breaking stride just past the half way line, chipped over Chrisholm and then collected his own chip to dot down in the corner) and against Bath he caused headaches for their defence. Fingers crossed he might be able to get into the first team more regularly on the wing this season and move back to his favoured full back position next season when the great Geordan Murphy finally retires.

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