About v2Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
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hawkeye
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Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by harrpau7 Fri 17 Aug 2012, 1:19 am
Whenever a top player has to withdraw from a tournament, it hurts the event. When Nadal withdraw from Wimbledon in 2009 people said it was the slam with an asterix next to it for Federer, as he won without beating Nadal who had dethroned him the year prior. I know may say that Nadal would not of made the final anyway but at least with him being in the tournament he would have had a chance.
Same for the US Open this year, I am a big Murray fan and would love to see him break through and win the US Open, but I feel personally that a slight edge may be taken off it due to the fact Nadal isn't there, Nadal has winning head to head recods against Federer, Djokovic and Murray, and beat Murray in 3 consecutive grand slam semi-finals last year. Even if Murray beats Federer and Djokovic back to back it will still be a slam victory in a slam wothout Nadal, one of the big 3/top 4. Same for Federer, he hasn't defeated Nadal in a major since 2007.
Is it right to look at it this way?
Same for the US Open this year, I am a big Murray fan and would love to see him break through and win the US Open, but I feel personally that a slight edge may be taken off it due to the fact Nadal isn't there, Nadal has winning head to head recods against Federer, Djokovic and Murray, and beat Murray in 3 consecutive grand slam semi-finals last year. Even if Murray beats Federer and Djokovic back to back it will still be a slam victory in a slam wothout Nadal, one of the big 3/top 4. Same for Federer, he hasn't defeated Nadal in a major since 2007.
Is it right to look at it this way?
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by socal1976 Fri 17 Aug 2012, 1:45 am
I think it is very wrong to look at that way harpau, Nadal is a great champion but he would at best be the third or 4th favorite to win the tournament he has not played on the hardcourts since miami in the spring. I agree it hurts the event but the event will decided the number 1 ranking this year and the talent pool is still immense when considering all the talent on the tour, so if anything I am more hotly anticipating the USO. Because unlike past years we have a very close year end #1 that will most likely be decided by this tournament.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by Guest Fri 17 Aug 2012, 3:54 am
No it doesn't take the prestige off. Nadal's style of play makes him more likely to be injury prone. It's won him 11 slams so far (seven on the red clay), but if it wasn't for the medical advances in knee repair treatment (platelet rich plasma treatment) he wouldn't have been able to come back from his injury in 2009.
The surprising thing with this latest injury was that he looked perfectly fine at Wimbledon, almost beating Rosol in the second round. I assume that he must have either had a reaction afterwards or he injured something in training. The signals from his camp is that he is nearly back injury free, but not good enough to risk aggravating it at US Open.
The surprising thing with this latest injury was that he looked perfectly fine at Wimbledon, almost beating Rosol in the second round. I assume that he must have either had a reaction afterwards or he injured something in training. The signals from his camp is that he is nearly back injury free, but not good enough to risk aggravating it at US Open.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by time please Fri 17 Aug 2012, 9:39 am
Rubbish!
There is still a very high quality field, though of course he will be missed.
There is still a very high quality field, though of course he will be missed.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by Guest Fri 17 Aug 2012, 9:45 am
It's like saying that McEnroe would asterix his Slam victories post 1981.
If he was a multi US Open winner, I could at least entertain the logic slightly. If this was RG the concept could be understandable.
The best players of that surface will be there. I am hoping this tournament will exceed all expectations and that maybe some new blood could give the tennis landscape something to think about. It shouldn't be considered a gimmie for Murray because of the events at Wimbledon. With his current injury niggles and form, he has a lot to do.
If he was a multi US Open winner, I could at least entertain the logic slightly. If this was RG the concept could be understandable.
The best players of that surface will be there. I am hoping this tournament will exceed all expectations and that maybe some new blood could give the tennis landscape something to think about. It shouldn't be considered a gimmie for Murray because of the events at Wimbledon. With his current injury niggles and form, he has a lot to do.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by Danny_1982 Fri 17 Aug 2012, 9:51 am
It's a shame for Rafa and a shame for the open that one of its big stars won't be there.
But will it take the shine off for the victor? Not one little bit.
But will it take the shine off for the victor? Not one little bit.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by luciusmann Fri 17 Aug 2012, 12:34 pm
I'm not sure it does simply for the reason that unlike the other slams, there's been a different winner of the USO for the last 5 years (since 2008): Federer, Del Potro, Nadal & Djokovic. There's a reasonable chance that there could be a different winner (Murray) and if there was going to be one at any slam, it would be most likely @ the USO.
Also, Nadal has said himself that the USO is his hardest slam so if he was going to skip a slam, it would be here. So overall, his withdrawal isn't a big hindrance to the tournament but naturally it is saddening when a top player has to withdraw.
Also, Nadal has said himself that the USO is his hardest slam so if he was going to skip a slam, it would be here. So overall, his withdrawal isn't a big hindrance to the tournament but naturally it is saddening when a top player has to withdraw.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by daraghj82 Fri 17 Aug 2012, 3:03 pm
it does take the shine off it a little bit alright as some will no doubt wonder if rafa would have beaten andy if its his first slam win or if novak or fed win.its always nice to have the big four competing hard. e.g. when rafa missed wimby in 09 we still have had a memorable final between fed and roddick
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by reckoner Fri 17 Aug 2012, 3:10 pm
No, it won't.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by hawkeye Fri 17 Aug 2012, 3:15 pm
"Prestige" is a difficult thing to quantify a bit like trying to judge how shiny a gold medal is.
But Nadal's withdrawal does remove a huge obstacle between players and the US Open trophy. Even the top players will see the task as easier knowing they will not have to face Nadal. Federer hasn't beaten Nadal in a slam for longer than I want to say including two losses on hard courts. Djokovic has lost the last three matches against Nadal so Nadal's confidence wouldn't be a problem if they met again. The last match that Djokovic won against Nadal at the AO was not something he would relish repeating. And Nadal has beaten Murray in more slam semi's than I can remember.
It also removes the possibility of a few of the most exciting match ups in tennis taking place. A US Open with no chance of seeing Nadal/Federer or Nadal/Djokovic is just not as exciting for spectators. Even earlier rounds won't be as exciting as Nadal against anyone is a guaranteed show court match.
So of course the US Open is a lesser event without the participation of one of the best players...
But Nadal's withdrawal does remove a huge obstacle between players and the US Open trophy. Even the top players will see the task as easier knowing they will not have to face Nadal. Federer hasn't beaten Nadal in a slam for longer than I want to say including two losses on hard courts. Djokovic has lost the last three matches against Nadal so Nadal's confidence wouldn't be a problem if they met again. The last match that Djokovic won against Nadal at the AO was not something he would relish repeating. And Nadal has beaten Murray in more slam semi's than I can remember.
It also removes the possibility of a few of the most exciting match ups in tennis taking place. A US Open with no chance of seeing Nadal/Federer or Nadal/Djokovic is just not as exciting for spectators. Even earlier rounds won't be as exciting as Nadal against anyone is a guaranteed show court match.
So of course the US Open is a lesser event without the participation of one of the best players...
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by reckoner Fri 17 Aug 2012, 3:25 pm
Nah, the event itself is unsullied. There will still be exciting, close matches. Nadal's style isn't so jaw-droppingly good as to be irreplaceable - we have Murray and Djokovic who are just as entertaining to watch.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by time please Fri 17 Aug 2012, 3:32 pm
hawkeye wrote:So of course the US Open is a lesser event without the participation of one of the best players...
I am sorry H_E but that is a ridiculous statement. You might say it won't be so enjoyable for a number of people without him (though sport does tend to survive) or say that his absence does present opportunities for other players to reach the later rounds - the same as it would if any top player was absent or knocked out early on
I think you should produce a graph, a la LF, to show the comparative standing from year to year, decade to decade of the Open to back up that absurd claim.
Perhaps when Nadal hangs up his racquet, it should be absorbed into the ATP tour as just another 500? double and treble
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by Josiah Maiestas Fri 17 Aug 2012, 3:44 pm
Was the prestige taken away when Delpo missed the USO in 2010?
Both players only won this once.
Both players only won this once.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by The Special Juan Fri 17 Aug 2012, 3:56 pm
Josiah Maiestas wrote:Was the prestige taken away when Delpo missed the USO in 2010?
Both players only won this once.
Ah very well said. Is Federer's FO title "tainted" because Nadal got beat before the final etc? The answer is no.
If, for example, a player was to win it who was only going to win 1 major title, would everyone be saying, in 30 years time, "Oh his title doesn't count because Nadal wasn't there!". At the end of the day, the titles are all that matters, not who they were won against. You could arguably make a case against a good number of major titles that are "diminished" or whatever.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by hawkeye Fri 17 Aug 2012, 4:20 pm
This is what Federer has to say about Nadal's withdrawal from the US Open
I hope in hindsight this is a very smart decision by him. But it's obviously a big blow and disappointing news for the tennis world."
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/tennis-busted-racquet/top-player-miss-rafael-nadal-least-us-open-181308912--ten.html
Of course it is a "big blow and very disappointing for the tennis world". Anyone who claims Nadal won't be missed is talking from their own biased perspective.
I hope in hindsight this is a very smart decision by him. But it's obviously a big blow and disappointing news for the tennis world."
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/tennis-busted-racquet/top-player-miss-rafael-nadal-least-us-open-181308912--ten.html
Of course it is a "big blow and very disappointing for the tennis world". Anyone who claims Nadal won't be missed is talking from their own biased perspective.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by reckoner Fri 17 Aug 2012, 4:25 pm
Yeah I saw that quote. It doesn't mean that the USO is diminished, or the value of winning it is any less like you're trying to make out.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by The Special Juan Fri 17 Aug 2012, 4:28 pm
"Roger Federer: "It's not a surprise, because I wrote him and he told me like it wasn't looking good at all."
I have a copy of that letter here (courtesy of http://pseudofedblog.com/ )
I have a copy of that letter here (courtesy of http://pseudofedblog.com/ )
- Dear Rafa:
- "Dear Mr. Rafael,
How are you? I am fine.
A lot has changed since I last saw you on the tennis courts. I had My birthday which was nice, I went on two holidays, I achieved Olympic finalist status, I had My hair cut (just a little trimmings), I discovered the BBC employ John McEnroe as an expert not only for tennis, but also swimming, running, diving, javelin, shot-put, high jump, long jump, triple jump, cycling, volleyball, handball, table tennis (a very small version of big tennis), weightlifting, fencing, disco dancing, singing… and more.
I understand you are having problems with the knees. I am sorry to hear this. During Wimbledon I had the little back problems but this went away. Do your doctors know why this is happening? Thank you for pulling out of so many tournaments. As they say, “It is better to be safe than make the apologies”. If you want My advice I am suggesting you relax a bit more. You work so hard. It’s OK. The Little Guys don’t listen to Me much but maybe you have the influences? I mean, make the little word with Murray and Djokovic and ask them to take some time off too? There is more to life thanalways beating Metennis. Enjoy yourselves. This way when you come back in 2019 you will feel much more fresh.
No other news. Mirky says ‘Hola’ and wanted to send you a care package but I told her I am already sending something from Me. She shouted something in Spanish and made the slammings with the door.
I am enclosing several suitcases of Lindt chocolate. I promise this will not affect your recoveries. Please eat as much as you can. Don’t worry about the U.S. Open, nor the Australian and actually give Roland Garros a miss too.
Miss you.
Hasta luego!
PF xxx"
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by reckoner Fri 17 Aug 2012, 4:30 pm
Ha ha that's pretty good...
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by hawkeye Fri 17 Aug 2012, 4:34 pm
Ha ha! Sometimes I don't know who I like best. Fed or Pseudo Fed...
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by reckoner Fri 17 Aug 2012, 4:37 pm
I thought of doing a Pseudo Rafa twitter feed, but I guess it wouldn't be funny right now - my timing sucks! 
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by time please Fri 17 Aug 2012, 4:50 pm
The Special Juan wrote:"Roger Federer: "It's not a surprise, because I wrote him and he told me like it wasn't looking good at all."
I have a copy of that letter here (courtesy of http://pseudofedblog.com/ )
- Dear Rafa:
How are you? I am fine.
A lot has changed since I last saw you on the tennis courts. I had My birthday which was nice, I went on two holidays, I achieved Olympic finalist status, I had My hair cut (just a little trimmings), I discovered the BBC employ John McEnroe as an expert not only for tennis, but also swimming, running, diving, javelin, shot-put, high jump, long jump, triple jump, cycling, volleyball, handball, table tennis (a very small version of big tennis), weightlifting, fencing, disco dancing, singing… and more.
I understand you are having problems with the knees. I am sorry to hear this. During Wimbledon I had the little back problems but this went away. Do your doctors know why this is happening? Thank you for pulling out of so many tournaments. As they say, “It is better to be safe than make the apologies”. If you want My advice I am suggesting you relax a bit more. You work so hard. It’s OK. The Little Guys don’t listen to Me much but maybe you have the influences? I mean, make the little word with Murray and Djokovic and ask them to take some time off too? There is more to life thanalways beating Metennis. Enjoy yourselves. This way when you come back in 2019 you will feel much more fresh.
No other news. Mirky says ‘Hola’ and wanted to send you a care package but I told her I am already sending something from Me. She shouted something in Spanish and made the slammings with the door.
I am enclosing several suitcases of Lindt chocolate. I promise this will not affect your recoveries. Please eat as much as you can. Don’t worry about the U.S. Open, nor the Australian and actually give Roland Garros a miss too.
Miss you.
Hasta luego!
PF xxx"
Brilliant!
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by barrystar Fri 17 Aug 2012, 10:25 pm
Answer to OP - no, but he will be missed for certain.
You win a tennis match if you turn up in better form than your opponent and with sufficient fitness to make it count. If you don't you lose and it was ever thus with tennis. Just because you are a great player when on tip top form there are no guarantees. That's why slams are such a measure of greatness - they come by with their own immutable routine and it's up to players who aspire to greatness to combine their peaks of form and fitness to score there.
It's a different thing to acknowledge along with everyone else that Nadal's presence in the draw as a major threat will be missed.
You win a tennis match if you turn up in better form than your opponent and with sufficient fitness to make it count. If you don't you lose and it was ever thus with tennis. Just because you are a great player when on tip top form there are no guarantees. That's why slams are such a measure of greatness - they come by with their own immutable routine and it's up to players who aspire to greatness to combine their peaks of form and fitness to score there.
It's a different thing to acknowledge along with everyone else that Nadal's presence in the draw as a major threat will be missed.
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Re: Nadal's withdrawal takes slight prestige off winning US Open?
by Henman Bill Sat 18 Aug 2012, 5:39 pm
It does take the gloss of a bit, but really only a lot it he were the clear favourite, or maybe if two of the big 4 were out.
It's also the hardest slam for Rafa to win anyway. If he misses the FO it will take more gloss off.
It's also the hardest slam for Rafa to win anyway. If he misses the FO it will take more gloss off.
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