Report on latest ideas for The Royal Rumble and Wrestlemania 29

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An idea discussed recently was for CM Punk to beat The Rock at The Royal Rumble.

This is because if The Rock was to win, the title wouldn't be defended at house shows for at least 2 months and also the problem of whether or not The Rock would appear at the Elimination Chamber PPV.

Creative have discussed the idea of Punk winning and going on to defend the title at Wrestlemania against The Undertaker. Then The Rock would face off against John Cena in round 2.

Obviously things could change but this has been talked about.

The only problem I have is if Punk were to face Taker. How can they consider Taker being Champ and then be concerned about putting the belt on Rocky?

Unless...



They would give the streak to Punk!


To be fair though, can see The Rock taking the title at The Rumble

I like Kid Vicious points and can definitely see the logic in them but don't really agree with them

If you put Brock, Rock, Taker and HHH in four separate matches then you could potentially elevate 2/3 or even possibly 4 stars to the next level, a level that sees guys go on a path that could see them reach the status of thos mentioned

Rock/Cena - Cena doesn't need it but could get the same rub Rock got from Hogan
Brock/Punk - Punk wants respect, what more respect could u get from beating a true badass who was WWE and UFC World Champ

Taker/Bryan - this probably wouldn't happen but it could easily male Bryan a top star, if he went 20 minutes with Taker at Mania he'd be main event material

HHH/Wade Barrett - Triple H is one of the best at telling a story and letting it unfold, if he could take Barrett under his wing it could make Barrett a big time player in the WWE

I think that could easily have a long term benefit for the WWE

I would concede that using them in 4 separate matches could make for a better PPV on paper, but I think WWE needs to be thinking more long term. They need to think about what's going to happen after Wrestlemania. They need to avoid the annual post Wrestlemania slump.

Lets take Wrestlemania 2000 as an example. The highlight? The TLC match? 6 guys that had been on the roster for less than 2 years. Given the chance to go at it on the big stage. They didn't need past star power to put them over. They didn't say, "oh Hawk, Animal, would you mind coming back for another HUGE payday to make a couple of our teams look good. They knew they were good and gave them a chance.

I have no real problem with HHH or Undertaker doing their thing, win or lose. They've given their lives to the company. But if they give them two matches, then I wouldn't be so quick to do the same for Rock and Brock. I don't think either deserve it. Both have been gone on a full time basis for over 8 years now and WWE should've moved on. They haven't so I can appreciate why they want them on the card, but they should use the Grandest Stage of Them All to showcase the future, and not for a nostalgic ego boost to two guys that walked.

Wrestling will be in better shape if come 8th April fans are saying "Holy cr*p, that match with Dolph Ziggler and Daniel Bryan was epic. Did you see that move PAC did? Can't believe Dean Ambrose and Tyler Black got the tag titles" Rather than "Undertaker won, who would've believe it? Uh, Cena beat Rock WTH. Man, they wasted CM Punk. Why the hell is HHH champion again?"

It's like we always discuss, at the end of the day short term money and buyrates from this PPV rather than anything else.

I still think Taker should be used as a way to get people over, especially if he's gonna make 25-0. A couple lesser ones would help him reach that number without getting in anyway stale. A program and feud with Bryan or Ziggler would be huge for them both.

Punk deserves a main event. Which means a title match, or a big name like lesnar or undertaker.

Can I just guys, thanks very much for your comments. Been a great read

chris.wilkerson13 wrote:It's like we always discuss, at the end of the day short term money and buyrates from this PPV rather than anything else.

Yeah, but they'll get the short term money and buyrates simply by having these guys on the card. They do not need to waste 20 minutes of program on each of them and then let genuine future talents like Daniel Bryan rot in a 10 second squash match.

I dunno, you probably get more buyrates if you sell Taker v Lesnar, Cena v Rock etc than Taker v Bryan, Cena v Ryback. I would rather see them project long term and use these legends to both face off with each other and to put over the burgeoning talent, but they want every Wrestlemania to be the biggest and for the casual fans to buy, and casual fans care more about the 'best' vs the 'best' (ie big names)

I think the post WrestleMania slump is something that's ingrained to anyone who worked for the WWF/E for a long long time, from way back to the 80s and early 90s the WWF would do 6-8 weeks of TV tapings in the space of about a week/10 days so the Wrestlers would get a break then tour Post Mania so the whole slump would be in line with the guys getting a rest, you usually found that around late May/early June storylines would really pick up as they geared into SummerSlam season and where taping more regularly too, by 93 the schedule changed but the booking remained the same,it was all pretty safe, as the years have gone on they've becime a bit more 'out there' with their planning but its still pretty safe, the exception to the rule was in 1997 & 1998 when they just hit gold and everything they did turned to money and ratings but if we're looking to conquer the post WredstleMania slump then I think we need to go deep into the psyche of Vince and his merry bunch of yes men he loves to surround himself with

Here's the latest news:
Undertaker is on track fitness wise, and is "likely" to face CM Punk
also, Ryback vs Big Show

So pretty much any heel that can carry him through a match in his shape then KV?

Are we talking Undertaker or Ryback?

I think Ryback vs The Big Show would be pretty solid booking to be honest, Ryback destroying Big Show for the WHC at his first WrestleMania is a great way to introduce him to the big time (even though his current feud is bigger) I think and have done for a while now that if they can keep Big Show looking strong all the way to Mania then Ryback as the Rumble winner and defeating him would be a pretty big moment

If he can hit Shellshocked on Big Show (big if) at Wrestlemania then you can see it as one those moments WWE love to create. I'd still prefer Ziggler to be in the WHC title match and Ryback used elsewhere, but I'd have no complaints with Ryback making his impact at his first WM like that, and it would be clever use of Big Show too.

Also, I think if they do saddle Punk with The Undertaker then you can pretty much guarantee Punk will drop the Title at The Royal Rumble, although to be fair that's what's been expected since RAW1000, The Rock being the 1 to beat Punk is pretty special though to be fair, how many guys can say they needed The Rock to get the belt off them

I read on dirtsheets earlier about Big Show v Ryback ....

and i instantly thought that it wouldnt be for the title ... you know that markee big show match were treated to every year..... where big show is squashed (happens most years) could be a repeat of Bryan v sheamus a proper squash

I know it says on the report to give Ryback his WM moment but that would be it.... to Squash Show nothing else, may be as big as it gets ..... still think Ziggler will be WHC at WM

You could be right but The Big Show looks like the real deal as the World Champion, I don't see any great need to take that off him, if Ziggler is in the Title match I'd rather he's the challenger using his case to challenge and become the #1 contender

I agree that for the first time, Big Show looks good as the WHC and it would be good to see him have a dominant reign up until Mania....where dropping it to Ryback would be a big moment for the new star, especially if he nails "Shellshock" which I have no doubts he would.

I did hear the rumour that WWE was looking at Ziggler/Orton as the WHC match at Mania but obviously things can always change.

Rumour at the moment is that Punk will retain at TLC, climbing the ladder to retrieve the belt whilst Ryback powerbombs each member of The Shield through a table.....but this could all change.

And then Punk vs Taker at Mania. I have no problems with seeing this match, as I think the story in itself could be booked fantastically.

Although I felt the "respect" angle was always heading towards Taker, the whole Heyman involvement did seem to suggest Lesnar/Punk in the offing and will be interesting to see how WWE swerves it back towards Taker in the coming weeks/months.

Just really not into the whole Cena/Rock II. It was supposed to be "once in a lifetime" and to be honest I wouldn't want to watch it again. But then again that is because I am a Rock mark and don't want to see Cena beat him.

Everything is obviously still up in the air at this point, but if the booking is done correctly then it could be a fantastic Mania season.

Was Orton/Ziggler an actual rumour? I thought I started that

I know what you're saying about Rock/Cena, it was supposed to be Once in a Lifetime but when the Championship of the World is involved then the Champion and Challenger can't help being drawn together, the only way for it to make sense is if its unavoidable, Rock as Champ and Cena as the Rumble winner (although I'd rather Ryback won that)

I'm not into Punk/Taker at all to be honest, Taker will come back, rihght into the top feud with the most entertaining guy on the roster, go through his routine then disappear again leaving Punk to pick up the pieces, maybe I'm wrong but I don't see how this will benefit Punk, will he be presented anywhere near as legitimate a threat as HBK, HHH or even Edge back in 08? I'm not so sure

I totally disagree KF, i think it'll do wonders for Punk's stock being in a marquee match against the guy who has arguably been the biggest draw at Wrestlemania for the last 5 years. What is the saying - You dont have to go over to get over. Getting a nod of approval/respect at the end of the match from The Undertaker cant be a bad thing. After beating two of the all time greats in HBK and HHH in classic matches then next in line is CM Punk, that itself is an honour.

Punk hasnt exactly faced any slouches at Mania. His record is 3 MITB matches and singles matches against Rey Mysterio, Randy Orton and Chris Jericho. Decent opposition i'd say.

I think the promos, build up and hype to a Punk/Taker match would be executed brilliantly and its something i'd definately look forward to.

If CM Punk vs Undertaker gets the green light we know Taker will go over. Standard. But I'd like to see them script out a classic back n forth, and then just as Punk is about to get the win, HHH, Shawn Michaels, Nash, or whoever from the streak past interrupts and stops that from happening.

I'm no writer; a DQ finish would suck, but basically what I'm saying is have it so that the kids and the "it's-real-to-me-dammit" fans are all, "Punk had him beat!"

I hate screwy finishes at Mania KV. I see what you're saying and you'd want Punk to come out of the match looking strong to the fans, but for me theres no better way than Taker pulling up a beaten Punk from the canvas and leaving the ring to him as a mark of respect, something which Punk has been craving for so long.

Would you not mark out just slightly if Jimmy Snuka came out of no where and smashed a coconut into Undertakers head?

The "who-the-hell-is-this-pile-of-saggy-skin-in-leopard-pants?" look on the kids faces as Punk covers Taker, for me would be priceless.

Shame Giant Gonzales has passed on, I'd mark out royally for his big weird hair suit and chloraform cotton wool.

The problem I have with any potential Undertaker vs Punk match is that I don't believe he'd be presented as anything like the threat of Shawn and/or Hunter, I also think it'd be a straight up 1 on 1 match too and with that kind of enviroment I'm struggling to see how Punk would come out looking anything like the underdog who got beat.

Taker I don't believe would give him 'a nod of approval' like he did with Shawn and he wouldn't do another stretcher job either like he did with Hunter and he wouldn't end the show with a hug like they did last year, the feud has no real on screen basis to it, what we'd get is Taker coming back for no reason, either taking issue with Punk or vice versa, Punk would say the only way to get respect he deserves is to beat Taker....what happens when he doesn't beat him? Takers gone and Punks lost his only way of getting the respect he tells us he deserves?

Nah not for me, I can see why some want it but if this match happens its more to do with giving Taker a name rather than giving Punk an avenue to cement his spot as one of the trusted top men

Still disagree. Taker is a very good storyteller in ring. Punk kicking out of the Tombstone and Taker's look of disbelief will itself put Punk over massively, paired with some decent commentary.

I just dont understand how anyone could think that facing The Undertaker at Wrestlemania in the biggest drawing match of the last 5 years can be a bad thing for CM Punk. Baffles me. Naturally they'll absolutely build and promote it properly so its a big draw.

ok, i just found something in regards to the streak. it's from a couple of years back, so who knows if there's still any weight in it.

apparently there is/was a plan in place for the streak to end.
the man to take it?
Ted Dibiase Jr.


yeah, that's what Calloway himself (according to the dirt sheets at least) has said. the idea being that DiBiase Sr bought him to the WWF and Jr will send him away.

my guess is that Jr never came on like they hoped he would, so i can't see it happening. but it's a nice thought circa 2010.

Kid Vicious wrote:ok, i just found something in regards to the streak. it's from a couple of years back, so who knows if there's still any weight in it.

apparently there is/was a plan in place for the streak to end.
the man to take it?
Ted Dibiase Jr.


yeah, that's what Calloway himself (according to the dirt sheets at least) has said. the idea being that DiBiase Sr bought him to the WWF and Jr will send him away.

my guess is that Jr never came on like they hoped he would, so i can't see it happening. but it's a nice thought circa 2010.

And that's why the Streak should never be ended by an up and comer, or an upwardly mobile mid-carder who just needs that 'last push' to main event stardom.

Mr H wrote:Still disagree. Taker is a very good storyteller in ring. Punk kicking out of the Tombstone and Taker's look of disbelief will itself put Punk over massively, paired with some decent commentary.

I just dont understand how anyone could think that facing The Undertaker at Wrestlemania in the biggest drawing match of the last 5 years can be a bad thing for CM Punk. Baffles me. Naturally they'll absolutely build and promote it properly so its a big draw.

Punk kicking out of a Tombstone would be a mark out moment but everyone kicks out of it now at Mania do they not? WrestleMania is the show that finishers suddenly don't have as much impact

They'd definitely build it, that's obvious, perhaps a tad cheeky to suggest I didn't expect them too, but would Punk be considered a bigger threat than HHH? HBK or Edge? Bearing in mind Edge the World Champion, was at his best and was himself undefeated at WrestleMania (barring a MitB match) and the match went on last...everything pointed to the fact it could possibly happen

If they could present Punk in the same light and have me believing he could genuinely beat him I'd hold my hands up, I truly don't see it though

Also, I'm not sure what you mean when you say the biggest drawing match in the last 5 years...do you think Takers been in the biggest drawing match in the last 5 years? Or do you think Taker/Punk would be the biggest drawing Taker match in the last 5 years? Because personally nothing would touch either of his matches with Shawn, particularly the second match when Shawns career was on the line

I meant the streak match in general has arguably been the biggest drawing match at Wrestlemania for the last 5 years. With probably the exception of Rock/Cena this year.

Nothing would draw as much at Michaels/Taker II though, that was in a different league.

I take it by your reasoning KF that you're also not a fan of putting a young upstart i.e Ziggler/Bryan against Taker? I mean, if they cant build Punk up to be a legitmate threat after a year long title reign then there is no hope for guys like Ziggler/Bryan is there?

Kid Vicious wrote:If CM Punk vs Undertaker gets the green light we know Taker will go over. Standard. But I'd like to see them script out a classic back n forth, and then just as Punk is about to get the win, HHH, Shawn Michaels, Nash, or whoever from the streak past interrupts and stops that from happening.

Or maybe Lesnar?

Mr H wrote:I meant the streak match in general has arguably been the biggest drawing match at Wrestlemania for the last 5 years. With probably the exception of Rock/Cena this year.

Nothing would draw as much at Michaels/Taker II though, that was in a different league.

I take it by your reasoning KF that you're also not a fan of putting a young upstart i.e Ziggler/Bryan against Taker? I mean, if they cant build Punk up to be a legitmate threat after a year long title reign then there is no hope for guys like Ziggler/Bryan is there?

I don't really see the connection between not wanting Punk vs Taker but wanting Bryan/Ziggler vs Taker

For the record I wouldn't have Ziggler near Taker, all it would be in my opinion is Ziggler bumping all over the place trying to find that one epic Mania bump, I would love to see Daniel Bryan vs The Undertaker tho and believe it would do Bryan far more good than CM Punk.

Here's why, Punk is at a completely different stage in the game to Bryan, he's higher up the card and for me needs that big WrestleMania win, Daniel Bryan doesn't, Bryan gets a rub from being a galliant loser to a genuine Main Event talent, Punks past that spot now, he's in a place where he'll just lose, it won't be galliant

Daniel Bryan would go in there as the underdog and get beat, I believe CM Punk would need us to believe he could and should beat him, which when he doesn't will do him more harm than good, I'm a big believer in the whole "you don't need to go over to get over" but there comes a time when you as a main event talent with asperations to be the main man do have to go over, I believe CM Punk is at that stage now, what happens if he loses to Undertaker? He gets Austin next year, he'll lose that too, then what? You'd be talking about the guy who potentially should be the biggest thing to hit the WWE in years yet the only name he's went over at WrestleMania would be the well past his sell by date Chris Jericho

Daniel Bryan isn't near that level yet creatively yet a galliant loss to The Undertaker could take him to that next level

By the way I don't think for one minute they'd ever allow Daniel Bryan such a spot opposite The Undertaker

I agree totally with gaffer on this one, CM Punk has been long overdue his big Wrestlemania win, it should have come last year, and it probably should have come at the end of a long feud with Triple H.

I've said it on other threads, that this year Undertaker's streak match does not need to be relied upon as the big draw...you have Rock involved, Brock Lesnar could be involved, John Cena, CM Punk, possibly even Triple H, the Undertaker match can certainly take a back seat.

For me there are three options, the first is the most unlikely, the last the most likely. (1) John Cena vs. Rock vs. CM Punk; CM Punk wins, think it's much more likely for Rock to be champion and drop it to Cena in a one on one match, if Punk is involved he wouldn't win. (2) CM Punk vs. Triple H; have the match they should have, problems I see with this are it wouldn't mean that much as it would have to be a quickly assembled back story to the match, Wrestlemania tends to be an older and therefore more smarky crowd so it's possible CM Punk will get the cheers against the "corporate" Triple H. (3) CM Punk vs. Brock Lesnar in which CM Punk goes over, the main issue I see with this is that in this feud, it screams out to me that CM Punk is the natural face, Brock Lesnar the natural heel with Heyman turning on Punk and aligning with Lesnar and possibly the Shield, I'm not a fan of turning Punk face again so soon, especially if he is going to face Austin at 'Mania which I think should and probably would lead to another heel-turn the next year.

My Wrestlemania main events would be:

WWE Championship
The Rock (c) vs. John Cena (John Cena wins)

CM Punk vs. Brock Lesnar (CM Punk wins, Brock Lesnar hopefully will have a new contract so people don't think he is leaving already leading to a dead reaction and a meaningless win)

The Undertaker vs. Randy Orton/Daniel Bryan (my choice would be Bryan, Orton is much more likely.)

Triple H vs. somebody (Ryback is a possibility, think if HHH is fit and up for it, somebody should go over him this Wrestlemania, not sure if he'd be willing to take a back seat though.)

World Heavyweight Championship
The Big Show (c) vs. Ryback/Dolph Ziggler/Daniel Bryan (Big Show loses championship after long reign)

This Wrestlemania does have a chance of being a really epic one, so let's hope they don't mess it up. I'd also love to see an Austin appearance, perhaps after Punk's match to place the seeds for next year. This would be a nice mirror of the seeds being planted for The Rock vs. Cena a year in advance, showing Punk's position as at least equal billing with Cena.