Wales Summer Tour 2013 (Japan)

Who would you pick for Wales Summer Tour 2013? Here's my team:

1) Ryan Bevington (Ospreys)
2) Richard Hibbard ( Ospreys)
3) Samson Lee ( Scarlets)
4) Bradley Davies (Blues)
5) Lloyd Peers ( Ospreys)
6) Josh Turnbull ( Scarlets)
7) Josh Navidi ( Blues)
8) Gareth Delve ( Melbourne) ( Capt)
9) Gareth Davies (Scarlets)
10) Dan Biggar (Ospreys)
11) Eli Waker ( Ospreys)
12) Ashley Beck (Ospreys)
13) Scott Williams ( Scarlets)
14) Tom Prydie (Dragons)
15) Liam Williams (Scarlets)

16) Craig Mitchell ( Exeter Chiefs)
17) Emyr Phillips ( Scarlets)
18) Jake Ball ( Scarlets)
19) Jon Evans ( Dragons)
20) Steve Shingler ( London Irish)
21) Rhys Patchell ( Blues)

Other players I'd like to see go on tour would be Adam Hughes ( Dragons) Hanno Dirksen (Ospreys) (will he be qualified by then?) Lewis Evans (Dragons) Richard Kelly (Scarlets)

Players not Considered

The rest of the current Welsh squad who possibly (slim I know on current form) might make the lions tour.

Injured

Rhys Priestland ( Scarlets)
Aaron Jarvis (Ospreys)
Ian Evans ( Ospreys)

http://www.thisissouthwales.co.uk/Robin-McBryde-lead-Wales-Japan-2013-tour/story-17566752-detail/story.html

looks like McBryde will be head coach of the tour. Interesting to see Mark Jones in the mix too.

Head Coach McBryde & Assistant Mark Jones?

Its only Japan matey.

Its good to see Japan encouraging struggling rugby nations to improve.

Not a bad team to be honest

If Wales pick up an injury to their wingers. Well at least little Shane might get a recall. Dont you think?

1) Rhys Gill
2) Ken Owens
3) Scott Andrews
4) Bradley Davies
5) Lloyd Peers
6) Aaron Shingler
7) Josh Navidi
8) Gareth Delve (Capt)
9) Gareth Davies
10) Dan Biggar
11) Eli Waker
12) Adam Hughes
13) Scott Williams
14) Tom Prydie
15) Liam Williams

16) Samson Lee
17) Richard Hibbard
18) Lewis Evans
19) Lou Reed
20) Jon Evans
21) Ashley Beck
22) Rhys Patchell

There you go thats my side

Rhys Gill is a good shout Bedford, forgot about him. Did think about Eifion Lewis Roberts of Sale as he covers both sides of the scrum. But maybe he' s missed the boat to establish himself on the international scene.

I'd really like us to keep with Scott Andrews as long as he's not injured. I've been one of his bigger critics, but he has really improved over the last 6 months and this is a good chance for him to continue to improve. Gill, Owens, Andrews would be a good front row to take on Japan.

pioden,

Yh I think Roberts' chance has gone but hope not.

Coleman,

Like you I have knocked Andrews quite a bit but I think he showed up really well in the AIs so lets give him his chance.

I don't think as many Welsh players will make the Lions as some think but even then with our lack of A Side options I would like to see us use the Japan tour as a bit of a development tour

The problem Scott has had, is that he isn’t Adam Jones and he is never going to be Adam Jones. So when we've taken Adam off to give Scott his 15/20 mins during games it’s always been a negative impact. He is still young though (only 23), and he is improving which is all we can ask. He will have to improve year on year now if he wants to be Wales starting #3 as Samson Lee is a mean little blighter and aggression is something we lack in the front three.

Coleman wrote:The problem Scott has had, is that he isn’t Adam Jones and he is never going to be Adam Jones. So when we've taken Adam off to give Scott his 15/20 mins during games it’s always been a negative impact. He is still young though (only 23), and he is improving which is all we can ask. He will have to improve year on year now if he wants to be Wales starting #3 as Samson Lee is a mean little blighter and aggression is something we lack in the front three.

I agree Samson Lee is something special, His demolition of the Baby Black scrum in the junior world cup was simply spectacular. He brings that specialist ability as a tight head which is vital in securing good ball. Rest of his game needs some work and he needs some more gametime but I think he is going to be world class in a couple of years.

Give some fringe players a chance, but play a strong team.

1. Rhys Gill
2. Richard Hibbard
3. Craig Mitchell
4. Bradley Davies
5. AWJ/Charteris/Evans (whichever is left)
6. Aaron Shingler
7. Josh Navidi
8. Toby Faletau
9. Tavis Knoyle
10. Rhys Patchell (assuming Biggar is with Lions )
11. Harry Robinson
12. Ashley Beck
13. Scott Williams
14. Morgan Stoddart
15. Liam Williams

16. Paul James
17. Scott Andrews
18. Ken Owens
19. Lou Reed
20. Josh Turnball
21. Rhys Webb
22. Matthew Morgan
23. Andrew Bishop??

This will be a great opportunity for Wales to test new potential stars and also provide good experience for them.

TycroesOsprey wrote:

Coleman wrote:The problem Scott has had, is that he isn’t Adam Jones and he is never going to be Adam Jones. So when we've taken Adam off to give Scott his 15/20 mins during games it’s always been a negative impact. He is still young though (only 23), and he is improving which is all we can ask. He will have to improve year on year now if he wants to be Wales starting #3 as Samson Lee is a mean little blighter and aggression is something we lack in the front three.

I agree Samson Lee is something special, His demolition of the Baby Black scrum in the junior world cup was simply spectacular. He brings that specialist ability as a tight head which is vital in securing good ball. Rest of his game needs some work and he needs some more gametime but I think he is going to be world class in a couple of years.

I didn't believe what I was seeing at first, and I thought that maybe it was just a mismatch between him and the other prop that was 6ft4 or something. But he’s looked good in the Rabo games he has played in and his time with the Welsh squad over the autumn hopefully has helped him improve. Strangely I’m starting to think if we should be more worried about our future options at loosehead as I don't think Sam Hobbs is up too much, never been too sure about Bevington either. Hopefully Rhodri Jones keeps developing in to a good player, and stays injury free.

gregortree wrote:Its good to see Japan encouraging struggling rugby nations to improve.

Good to see 606v2 is encouraging mental health in the community as well or as it is commonly known worldwide...English supporters.

remembered this being published in the western mail before this years summer tour to Australia:

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/rugbynation/rugby-news/2012/05/14/wales-target-southern-hemisphere-blues-duo-and-ospreys-star-hanno-dirksen-for-future-selection-91466-30967932/

ROB HOWLEY has revealed three foreign-born regional stars are on Wales' selection radar.

Howley admitted he has checked up on the eligibility of Ospreys winger Hanno Dirksen and Blues forwards Andries Pretorius and Michael Paterson ahead of naming the summer training squad for the Test series in Australia.

Those checks revealed South Africans Dirksen and Pretorius and New Zealander Paterson weren’t available for the tour of Australia as they still have time to serve before qualifying for Wales on the three-year residency rule.

But back rower Pretorius, who has just returned from a six-month knee injury lay-off, could be big candidate for Wales honours next season as he becomes eligible later this summer.

Blues Player of the Year Paterson has another 12 months to run before qualifying in the summer of 2013, while Dirksen won’t be eligible until January 2014.

“We checked up on the qualification of Michael Paterson and Andries Pretorius as well as Hanno Dirksen,” he said.

“They are not qualified for this tour.”

So Paterson and Pretorius are eligible for this tour. I'd definitely consider taking Paterson think he's quality.

Yeah forgot about Stoddart, would be a good level for him to get back into it, also I hope Prydie or Walker gets the nod over Robinson at least those two are getting regualr game time, how much is Robinson getting?

The equivelant players who went on the North America holiday 4 years ago:

Dwayne Peel (Sale), Gareth Cooper (Gloucester), Dan Biggar (Ospreys), Nicky Robinson (Blues), Andrew Bishop (Ospreys), James Hook (Ospreys), Jonathan Spratt (Ospreys), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Mark Jones (Scarlets), Richard Mustoe (Blues), Tom James (Blues), Chris Czekaj (Blues), Gareth Owen (Ospreys), Jason Tovey (Dragons).

Duncan Jones (Ospreys), Craig Mitchell (Ospreys), Richard Hibbard (Ospreys), Gareth Williams (Blues), John Yapp (Blues), Eifion Lewis-Roberts (Sale), Bradley Davies (Blues), Ian Gough (Ospreys), Deiniol Jones (Blues), Luke Charteris (Dragons), Dafydd Jones (Scarlets), Robin Sowden-Taylor (Blues), Ryan Jones (Ospreys, capt), Lewis Evans (Dragons), Rob McCusker (Scarlets), Josh Turnbull (Scarlets), Sam Warburton (Blues), Dan Lydiate (Dragons).



Very few of those players got there chance and ran with it.

I don't know - all have had/are having regular gametime at their club/region (though how Cooper had as much as he had, I'll never know...), there's quite a few players who are still young and may break through to the national side - like Biggar, Tovey, Hibbard, and even (outside chance) Lewis Evans, Turnbull and Mccusker.

While Hook, Jon Daives, Bradley Daives, Charteris, Ryan Jones, Warburton and Lydiate have all been integral to the Wales team at various times.

Mark Jones, Peel, Cooper (hmm), Bishop, James, Duncan Jones, Gough & Daf Jones all had quite a number of caps and are experienced, being superseeded by younger players.

While Gareth Williams, Daf Jones, Mark Jones & G Owens careers were curtailed with injuries.

And the others either suffered from playing in England (I don't mean performance/skills wise, I mean their Welsh careers) or were only ever good enough to be on the fringes of the Welsh squad.

Peter,

Thanks for the info mate and yeah when you look at it not many have really established themselves.

Peel, M Jones, D Jones, D Jones, Gough and R Jones were already established.

Hook, JD, B Davies, Charteris Warburton and Lydiate are now established team/squad members

Andrew Bishop had a good run for a bit while the rest have really either failed to establish temselves or fallen by the way side.

Hook had already established himself by then.
Chateris made his Wales debut in 2004, and didnt become a regular till 2011 well after that tour. He certainy cant have been said to have been unearthed there anyway.

Really the guys who came out of that and stayed in were the Davies' and Lydiate, Warburon ......and Bradley D had been on the fringes of the team for a year already.

The disappointments for me as in the ones who haven't gone onto establish themselves are Owen, Tovey, Lewis-Roberts and Evans.

That said the 1st three have all had their fair share of injuries whilst Evans had to deal with being againt Lydiate, Faletau and Thomas at the Dragons along with Warburton

Ahh you're looking for players 'unearthed' during the tour - rather than 'players on that tour who became good players'.

I see, as you say there were only a few. Though I'd say these squads don't tend to be crammed full of youngsters (or at least they weren't back then) and had lots of players on the fringes, and experienced players in them.

Now that our academies are producing lots more youngsters I'd expect a younger average age to be in the squad next year, but then as you say how many youngsters will go on to do what Warbs and Lydiate have done?
Though I think it'll still be a case that the players who are on the fringes/haven't had as much of a chance - say maybe Biggar, Prydie, Andrews and Webb maybe kick on and claim a regular place in the team.

Yeah I'd say this is definitely the tour for guys like Andrews, Lee, Patchell, perhaps Steffan Jones to establish their credentials. Webb has disapointed beyond belief this season. If Tom Habberfield is fit I'd rather see him go, along with others like Navidi, Prydie maybe Dan Evans.

On the LH side, Bevington nor Rhodri have been that good. But perahps over time with Wales, their talents can be developed. I wonder if Mitchell will be involved aswell?

I think it's an inspired idea to make Delve captain.

I'm not sure why Delve is in the team when we seem to have an abundance of back-row players available in Wales. McCusker, Turnbull, Navidi, Evans maybe Faletau if he doesn't make the Lions should be good enough.

If some other 'big name' players do not make the Lions then I would give them the summer off, IE Roberts, , Alun Wyn Jones, Ryan Jones, Cuthbert (i'd probably take him actually because of his good strike rate.

Norfolklass wrote:I think it's an inspired idea to make Delve captain.

I'm not so sure myself. He spends all his time away from Wales and has only been involved when called upon for a club game against the Wales team in Australia. If Rees, R.Jones or AWJ go then possibly give it to them.

As for the midfield, I think we should work around Beck/Williams 12, Hughes 13.

McCusker and Turnbull seem to me to be second rate, the others you mention Morg are unproven. Delve, is also on an international stage unproven, but to bring him back as captain, after such rave reviews for Melbourne encourages him back into the Welsh fold. All the players you mention are really 6s apart from Faletau who is a small 8. After Merthyr Morgan turned English I feel we are short of natural 8s.

What is the tour schedule?

I would only play the regular starting internationals once, and mix up the teams to give everyone a chance with plenty of rest time for the guys who have played a lot over the last 18 months who are not on the Lions tour (AWJ, R.Jones etc)

The young lad Murphy playing for Scarlets looked pretty good, big aswell. Is he Irish?

Coleman: Murphy was born in Scotland, but brought up in wales. So he's eligible to play for us. He spent the summer bulking up, but his main assest is his footwork. Not sure he' s ready for international rugby yet. I agree with norfolklass assessment of our number 8 situation. There aren't that many around at the moment, or at least playing regular rugby. Turnbull and mccusker are more ruck hitting six' s than eights.

I have made my thoughts clear on Delve many times but I think that boat as well and truly sailed now and I would rather us take a youngsters or the likes of McCusker etc.

I also agree that if some of the big names don't make the Lions tour rhen give the likes of R Jones, Evans, Roberts etc the summer off to re-charge.

I would take players for the future with a bit of experience...

Ryan Bevington/Rhodri Jones

Richard Hibbard/Ken Owens/Scott Baldwin

Scott Andrews/Sampson Lee

Lloyd Peers/James King
Cory Hill/James Down/Richard Kelly

Josh Nalvidi/Tom Young

Lewis Evans/Luke Hamilton

Kieran Muphy/Morgan Allen

Tom Habberfield/Rhodri Williams

Rhys Patchell/Steffan Jones

Adam Warren/Stephen Shingler

Adam Hughes/Corry Allen

Harry Robinson/Eli Walker/Tom Grabham/Owen Williams

Liam Williams/Tom Prydie

Maes,

I agree but there's not much experience in there, if they don't make the Lions I would take players like Faletau, Cuthbert, Biggar and Lydiate (gametime wouldn't hurt him).

I would definately take Rhys Gill and Lewis-Roberts (but don't think he will go) and even maybe someone like Bennett (can't believe I said that) as the tour captain.

I don't know what players like Bennett would have to offer? They've been in the wilderness since last year.

I think Wales have a good number who need a very long summer holiday.

The squad I suggest has plenty of youthful experience, Liam Davies, Adam warren, Harry Robinson will have been in the squad a year by then.

Lads like Hibbard and Andrews have had years around the welsh squad.

I think we need to see if these young lads can front up. We might well need them soon.

some good names mentioned there maes. but i would also take rhys gill, michael paterson, jake ball....maybe dan thomas the wales u20 number 7 over tom youngs (think more potential, roughly same age) wouldn't be surprised if kirby myhill will make the squad either, he was called into the welsh camp this autumn to cover injuries.

Bennetts been out through injury rather than in the wilderness, just maybe think his added experience would be of benefit.

Hibbard and Andrews may have been around the squad but neither have really made the breakthrough, Andrews might have done now after a good Autumn.

Faletau, Biggar, Lydiate and Cuthbert are all young and fit enough to deal with a summer tour as well.

Props -: Bevington, R Jones, Hobbs, Gill, Lee, Andrews
Hookers -: Owens, Hibbard, Myhill
Locks -: Reed, Ball, Peers
Backrow -: Shingler, L Evans, Navidi, Turnbull, Murphy

Scrum Half -: G Davies, R Webb, A.N.Other (youngster who is looking in form at the time, R Williams at the moment)
Fly Half -: Patchell, Morgan
Centre -: G Owen, S Williams, Beck, A Hughes
Back Three -: E Walker, Li Williams, D Evans, T Prydie

I guess if I were picking a side it would be

Li Williams, Prydie, S Williams, Beck, E Walker, Morgan, G Davies;
R Jones, Owens, Lee, Reed, Ball, Shingler, Navidi, Murphy
(bench: Hibbard, Bevington, Andrews, Peers, L Evans, Webb, D Evans/Patchell/Owen, Hughes)

Yh I would take Myhill as 3rd hooker behind Hibbard and Owens

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:The equivelant players who went on the North America holiday 4 years ago:

Dwayne Peel (Sale), Gareth Cooper (Gloucester), Dan Biggar (Ospreys), Nicky Robinson (Blues), Andrew Bishop (Ospreys), James Hook (Ospreys), Jonathan Spratt (Ospreys), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Mark Jones (Scarlets), Richard Mustoe (Blues), Tom James (Blues), Chris Czekaj (Blues), Gareth Owen (Ospreys), Jason Tovey (Dragons).

Duncan Jones (Ospreys), Craig Mitchell (Ospreys), Richard Hibbard (Ospreys), Gareth Williams (Blues), John Yapp (Blues), Eifion Lewis-Roberts (Sale), Bradley Davies (Blues), Ian Gough (Ospreys), Deiniol Jones (Blues), Luke Charteris (Dragons), Dafydd Jones (Scarlets), Robin Sowden-Taylor (Blues), Ryan Jones (Ospreys, capt), Lewis Evans (Dragons), Rob McCusker (Scarlets), Josh Turnbull (Scarlets), Sam Warburton (Blues), Dan Lydiate (Dragons).



Very few of those players got there chance and ran with it.

Also a few of those players never actually got to the tour, Hook and Ryan Jones were called up to the Lions (i think) and Tovey I believe got crocked before the plane took of and Dan Evans got to go, and got capped.

SS,

I like look of that team, I would most probably make few changes

Start with Gill and Andrews (reward him after good Autumn) and I would stick Lewis Evans in the back row.

Who would you have as skipper, Evans and Navidi both captain their Regions so one of them would be a logical choice or what about giving Owens a crack maybe.

ss,

also like squad/ team, apart from lou reed (just personal preference) just for a lock i've never seen any aggression or dog in the player. maybe i'd replace him in the squad for michael paterson who could cover lock and 6 from the bench.

Bedford - to be honest your changes would probably be fair, maybe my one eye taking over a bit there. I guess I would go for Navidi for captain, as IMO he will be pushing for welsh test places in serious matches pretty soon.

Also I think I would not consider players who have not been selected for the Lions, as those lads will IMO benefit from having a summer off, resting up etc, as opposed to risking getting knocks and bumps on a somewhat meaningless tour.

SS,

A Scarlet with one eye - never

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:The equivelant players who went on the North America holiday 4 years ago:

Dwayne Peel (Sale), Gareth Cooper (Gloucester), Dan Biggar (Ospreys), Nicky Robinson (Blues), Andrew Bishop (Ospreys), James Hook (Ospreys), Jonathan Spratt (Ospreys), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Mark Jones (Scarlets), Richard Mustoe (Blues), Tom James (Blues), Chris Czekaj (Blues), Gareth Owen (Ospreys), Jason Tovey (Dragons).

Duncan Jones (Ospreys), Craig Mitchell (Ospreys), Richard Hibbard (Ospreys), Gareth Williams (Blues), John Yapp (Blues), Eifion Lewis-Roberts (Sale), Bradley Davies (Blues), Ian Gough (Ospreys), Deiniol Jones (Blues), Luke Charteris (Dragons), Dafydd Jones (Scarlets), Robin Sowden-Taylor (Blues), Ryan Jones (Ospreys, capt), Lewis Evans (Dragons), Rob McCusker (Scarlets), Josh Turnbull (Scarlets), Sam Warburton (Blues), Dan Lydiate (Dragons).



Very few of those players got there chance and ran with it.

Also a few of those players never actually got to the tour, Hook and Ryan Jones were called up to the Lions (i think) and Tovey I believe got crocked before the plane took of and Dan Evans got to go, and got capped.

Good point. Any idea who took their places?

Its just interesting to see with what really are development tours how many players actually make the grade long term.

In their equivelant Argentinian tour though the only new players England gave a chance to were Sam Vesty, Tom May and Steffon Armitage.
Which I guess says a lot about the relative approaches ( and number of Lions ) of both sides at that time. It could almost be a reverse this tour, with very few fresh Welsh faces (theres a big group of "10 cap cavalrymen" and probably less Lions)

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:The equivelant players who went on the North America holiday 4 years ago:

Dwayne Peel (Sale), Gareth Cooper (Gloucester), Dan Biggar (Ospreys), Nicky Robinson (Blues), Andrew Bishop (Ospreys), James Hook (Ospreys), Jonathan Spratt (Ospreys), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Mark Jones (Scarlets), Richard Mustoe (Blues), Tom James (Blues), Chris Czekaj (Blues), Gareth Owen (Ospreys), Jason Tovey (Dragons).

Duncan Jones (Ospreys), Craig Mitchell (Ospreys), Richard Hibbard (Ospreys), Gareth Williams (Blues), John Yapp (Blues), Eifion Lewis-Roberts (Sale), Bradley Davies (Blues), Ian Gough (Ospreys), Deiniol Jones (Blues), Luke Charteris (Dragons), Dafydd Jones (Scarlets), Robin Sowden-Taylor (Blues), Ryan Jones (Ospreys, capt), Lewis Evans (Dragons), Rob McCusker (Scarlets), Josh Turnbull (Scarlets), Sam Warburton (Blues), Dan Lydiate (Dragons).



Very few of those players got there chance and ran with it.

Also a few of those players never actually got to the tour, Hook and Ryan Jones were called up to the Lions (i think) and Tovey I believe got crocked before the plane took of and Dan Evans got to go, and got capped.

Good point. Any idea who took their places?

Its just interesting to see with what really are development tours how many players actually make the grade long term.

In their equivelant Argentinian tour though the only new players England gave a chance to were Sam Vesty, Tom May and Steffon Armitage.
Which I guess says a lot about the relative approaches ( and number of Lions ) of both sides at that time. It could almost be a reverse this tour, with very few fresh Welsh faces (theres a big group of "10 cap cavalrymen" and probably less Lions)

11 of those players are now retired or out of International favour due to age.

Dwayne Peel (Sale), Gareth Cooper (Gloucester), Nicky Robinson (Blues), Mark Jones (Scarlets), Richard Mustoe (Blues),
Duncan Jones (Ospreys), Gareth Williams (Blues), Ian Gough (Ospreys), Deiniol Jones (Blues), Dafydd Jones (Scarlets), Robin Sowden-Taylor (Blues).

Injury has hurt the prospects of the following who have spent most of the last four years on the physio's bench, though now fit they are young enough to still make an international impact.

Chris Czekaj (Blues), Gareth Owen (Ospreys), Jason Tovey (Dragons)

Richard Mustoe and Tom James are really the only lads taken that never did and likely won't make the grade. Considering the size of the pool of players we have available thats not a bad tour by all accounts.

Yeah Ive kind of argued myself out of my initial point Maest.
It did serve a purose in blooding new players, some of whome went on to make it.

The reasosn why others didnt does show as well just how much like the Somme test rugby is becoming.

Didnt realise you had an argument?

What was it you were trying to prove/dispel?