Johnson v Ketchel: What really happened?

Johnson and Ketchel met for the heavyweight title in 1909 in Colma, California for a fight scheduled for 20 rounds. At the time Ketchel was the finest middleweight in the world and Johnson was the reigning heavyweight champion that had white America in uproar. Already the pressure was mounting on Jim Jeffries to abandon his retirement and prove that the white man was better than the negro.

But first there was Ketchel, who is an all time great middleweight that may have had a strong claim to the best middleweight of all time had tragic circumstances not resulted in his death just a year after this bout. Despite Ketchels quality, the sheer size differance made this something of a mismatch and not many fancied Ketchel to win despite Americas desperation for a white champion.

The bout was a largely tame affair (footage is available) with Johnson appearing to be in second gear against the outsized Ketchel who was not his usual aggressive self. Ketchel had a reputation of being one of the most ferocious and aggressive fighters around but Johnsons size made this difficult. After a rather tepid 11 rounds, the 12th suddenly exploded into action. Ketchel had mainly been manhandled on the inside and was bloodied from Johnsons jabs. But springing into action he throws a huge overhand right over the top which Johnson tries to avoid but it catches him around the ear sending the heavyweight champion down and dazed. What happeded next was one of the most brutal knock outs in history. Johnson beats the count but appears right into. The momentum also causes Johnson to fall over and Ketchel is well and truly out cold. Johnson has a couple of Ketchels teeth imbedded in his glove as a result of the blow. After a lukewarm 11 rounds the fight is suddenly over spectacularly.

The fight has long been considered a fix or at least tampered with. What really happened still remains a source of specualtion, especially as Ketchel would die prematurely without much comment on the bout, and Johnson himself is a far from reliable source. A bit of background is needed for the context of the fight.

The fight was to be filmed and then played in theatres around America afterwards. Ketchel and Johnson would be entitled to a share of the profits the theatres made. Common thought is that both knew that a longer fight would encourage more people to go and watch the fight in the theatre and if the fight was over quickly then they would lose a large audience. Thus they agreed to ensure the bout would go a certain (unspecified) length. This much seems to be very much the case and is supported by the performance of the two fighters which is far from enthralling.

However what happened in the 12th is a source of mystery.

One school of thought is that both fighters had agreed from round 12 on the fight would become no holds barred. Thus after the 11th, with enough time lapsed to make theatres happy, both fighters went out to play for keeps resulting in the explosion of action.

Another view is that the fighters had agreed to go easy on each other but Ketchel was angered by Johnson bloodying him up and thus lost his temper and attacked him by knocking him down in the 12th when Johnson was unsuspecting.

Yet another opinion is that the two fighters had agreed for the fight to go the distance with Johnson winning on points. Ketchel would save face and earn money by going the distance and Johnson would keep his title at no risk. However Ketchel and his team had other ideas and planned an underhand stunt to lure Johnson into a false sense of security and then try an sucker punch him and steal his title when he wasnt expecting it. Many people attribute the fury with which Johnson unleashed his attack on Ketchel to this double cross as Ketchel went to try and finish Johnson off. There are also reports of Ketchels corner screaming "NOW" at a certain point to indicate when Ketchel should attack.

Lastly there are those that believe the fight was never pre agreed and the lacklustre performance was just down to Johnson coasting for the most part until Ketchel gave him a sturdy wake up call.

To this day its never been fully explained what actually happened. However the brutal nature of the knock out and the image of the negro standing over the stricken white man would damage Johnsons reputation even further and bring things twith Jeffries to a head. Jeffries himself would be stopped 9 months later leaving Johnsons supremacy undisputed.

You know, Colonial Lion, I've spent more hours than I care to remember poring over newspaper articles of the day in an effort to get to the bottom of it all, and I've still drawn a blank.

In some ways I suppose it could be argued that the little bit of mystery surrounding the fight is a healthy thing, and adds to the romance of the ' little one vs giant ' scenario.

Nonetheless, it irritates me.

From what I have rad about this, which is a fair bit but is by no means exhaustive I have always bought the double cross theory. For me nothing else an explain the relative passivity of Stan's performance up until that point which was out of character to say the least. Would also nicely explain the fury of Johnson's reaction.

Read something recently that there were rumours Stanley had developed something of an opium habit by this point which may give a little more credence to the idea he would contemplate welching on any arrangement made in advance but whether this has any truth to it or not Stanley could be a pretty odd guy so would probably contemplate double crossing Johnson irrespective.

The only issue I have with the theory is if they were wanting to get rounds in for the cameras they could have made things a little more exciting in the first 11 rounds because even in a fixed or staged fight you can do things so they are not as lacklustre as the first 11 of this one certainly were.

I was beginning to wonder where you were, jeff.

That's interesting about the opium habit. Ketchel has long fascinated me but I never knew about that. We live and learn.

On a side note - captaincarrantuohil joined us today, so we history enthusiasts have another among our number.

Just got back from New York Windy, was the wife's 40th. However with what she made me spend in the diamond district suspect my appearances back on here will be fairly frequent as the internet is about all I can afford to do for the rest of the year at least.

Will admit the opium rumour was new on me Windy but based on what I've read of Stan before doesn't seem too far out of left field. Does pose an interesting question though, if true is if dying young could have actually done Ketchel a favour in terms of his all time ranking because if you add this to the fact his next defence was likely to be against Sam Langford his career could well have been on the cusp of unravelling fairly quickly because I think in a title fight over 20 rounds he loses to Sam. All speculation but such is the nature of forums.

Cracking news about the captain. Looking briefly over the greatest of all time results thread does appear another hand on the deck cannot hurt too greatly.

rowley wrote:From what I have rad about this, which is a fair bit but is by no means exhaustive I have always bought the double cross theory. For me nothing else an explain the relative passivity of Stan's performance up until that point which was out of character to say the least. Would also nicely explain the fury of Johnson's reaction.

Read something recently that there were rumours Stanley had developed something of an opium habit by this point which may give a little more credence to the idea he would contemplate welching on any arrangement made in advance but whether this has any truth to it or not Stanley could be a pretty odd guy so would probably contemplate double crossing Johnson irrespective.

The only issue I have with the theory is if they were wanting to get rounds in for the cameras they could have made things a little more exciting in the first 11 rounds because even in a fixed or staged fight you can do things so they are not as lacklustre as the first 11 of this one certainly were.

I think the double cross theory fits the best aswell because there is no real possiblity of a knockout that brutal being simulated and it explains the sudden ferocity of Johnson. I have also read reports that Johnson and Ketchel were reasonably good friends at the time and that this cheap shot attempt enraged Johnson.

However there are also reports of Ketchel and Johnson playing craps together later that night which would seem very surprising given Johnson had knocked out several of Ketchels teeth and Ketchel had supposedly tried to double cross him.

Another article I read indicated that Ketchel had bet significant amounts on himself to lose in the 12th (unbeknownst to Johnson) and didnt want to risk a simulated knock out. Thus his attack on Johnson was a genuine attempt to provoke Johnson into knocking him out and he simply got much more than he bargained for!

Many sources also allude to Ketchel making some extravagent purchases shortly after the fight (such as a luxury which was a real novelty back then) which support the idea he had made one deal with Johnson and another with the bookies!

rowley wrote:Just got back from New York Windy, was the wife's 40th. However with what she made me spend in the diamond district suspect my appearances back on here will be fairly frequent as the internet is about all I can afford to do for the rest of the year at least.

Will admit the opium rumour was new on me Windy but based on what I've read of Stan before doesn't seem too far out of left field. Does pose an interesting question though, if true is if dying young could have actually done Ketchel a favour in terms of his all time ranking because if you add this to the fact his next defence was likely to be against Sam Langford his career could well have been on the cusp of unravelling fairly quickly because I think in a title fight over 20 rounds he loses to Sam. All speculation but such is the nature of forums.

Cracking news about the captain. Looking briefly over the greatest of all time results thread does appear another hand on the deck cannot hurt too greatly.

Fond memories Of New York, jeff. My wife and I were married in the Big Apple.

That's a great point about Stan coming up against Langford next time out. I suspect that an ill - prepared and dishevelled Stan, great though he was, would have shipped a pasting of Biblical proportions against Langford. The six round prequel had been tough enough, after all. So many things in history, boxing or otherwise, seem to hang by the thinnest of threads.

HumanWindmill wrote:You know, Colonial Lion, I've spent more hours than I care to remember poring over newspaper articles of the day in an effort to get to the bottom of it all, and I've still drawn a blank.

In some ways I suppose it could be argued that the little bit of mystery surrounding the fight is a healthy thing, and adds to the romance of the ' little one vs giant ' scenario.

Nonetheless, it irritates me.

Goodness me windy. I knew you were old, but I didn't imagine you were old enough to read newspaper articles on the day of the fight.

Anyways, I have read countless articles and heard Bert Sugar say it was a fix and Johnson took offense when Ketchel forgot the script and decked him. As the OP alluded to, this was an early PPV and to give fans their money's worth the fight was supposed to go some distance. Otherwise it was common knowledge that Johnson would have knocked out ketchell at any given time. He was that good for the crude brawler that Ketchel was.

azania wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:You know, Colonial Lion, I've spent more hours than I care to remember poring over newspaper articles of the day in an effort to get to the bottom of it all, and I've still drawn a blank.

In some ways I suppose it could be argued that the little bit of mystery surrounding the fight is a healthy thing, and adds to the romance of the ' little one vs giant ' scenario.

Nonetheless, it irritates me.

Goodness me windy. I knew you were old, but I didn't imagine you were old enough to read newspaper articles on the day of the fight.

To be fair, az, I was only a lad. Anyway, I do believe that Colonial Lion has three or four years on me, if he doesn't mind my saying.

HumanWindmill wrote:

azania wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:You know, Colonial Lion, I've spent more hours than I care to remember poring over newspaper articles of the day in an effort to get to the bottom of it all, and I've still drawn a blank.

In some ways I suppose it could be argued that the little bit of mystery surrounding the fight is a healthy thing, and adds to the romance of the ' little one vs giant ' scenario.

Nonetheless, it irritates me.

Goodness me windy. I knew you were old, but I didn't imagine you were old enough to read newspaper articles on the day of the fight.

To be fair, az, I was only a lad. Anyway, I do believe that Colonial Lion has three or four years on me, if he doesn't mind my saying.

No wonder you guys have this thang for the oldies. Nevermind. Care if a YOUNG lad like myself joins? I have all my teeth also.

Perhaps you can prescribe some of this elixir of youth to Shame Mosely.

azania wrote:

No wonder you guys have this thang for the oldies. Nevermind. Care if a YOUNG lad like myself joins? I have all my teeth also.

Perhaps you can prescribe some of this elixir of youth to Shame Mosely.

Have to say, az, that it's a miracle that you still have your own teeth.

HumanWindmill wrote:

azania wrote:

No wonder you guys have this thang for the oldies. Nevermind. Care if a YOUNG lad like myself joins? I have all my teeth also.

Perhaps you can prescribe some of this elixir of youth to Shame Mosely.

Have to say, az, that it's a miracle that you still have your own teeth.

You're not the first person to have said that to me. I have no idea why though. :chewie: (love these new smileys)

I reckon that one is Floyd Mayweather.

Well not quite as far reaching as the days of Ketchel Im happy to say but I was about 10 years old when Marciano announced his retirement!

Colonial Lion wrote:Well not quite as far reaching as the days of Ketchel Im happy to say but I was about 10 years old when Marciano announced his retirement!

Pah, Windy was ringside when he mae his debut.

rowley wrote:

Colonial Lion wrote:Well not quite as far reaching as the days of Ketchel Im happy to say but I was about 10 years old when Marciano announced his retirement!

Pah, Windy was ringside when he mae his debut.

I'm sure he was there when Fitz won the HW title also.

Colonial Lion wrote:Well not quite as far reaching as the days of Ketchel Im happy to say but I was about 10 years old when Marciano announced his retirement!

That name is akin to swearing.

rowley wrote:

Colonial Lion wrote:Well not quite as far reaching as the days of Ketchel Im happy to say but I was about 10 years old when Marciano announced his retirement!

Pah, Windy was ringside when he mae his debut.

Nonsense, Sir !

It is Colonial who has claim to the honorary woolie cardigan and slippers. I'm a product of the mid fifties.

Just a lad, you see !

HumanWindmill wrote:

rowley wrote:

Colonial Lion wrote:Well not quite as far reaching as the days of Ketchel Im happy to say but I was about 10 years old when Marciano announced his retirement!

Pah, Windy was ringside when he mae his debut.

Nonsense, Sir !

It is Colonial who has claim to the honorary woolie cardigan and slippers. I'm a product of the mid fifties.

Just a lad, you see !

1850s?

On reflection, I like the theory that they both agreed to go the distance and Johnson would retain the title, but, that Ketchel in private made other bets on himself to lose by KO without informing Johnson.

It seems to satisfy most of the evidence. He obviously wanted Johnson to attack him with intent to make the KO look real but just didnt bank on the sheer ferocity of Johnson who might have felt he had been double crossed or suckered.

Later when Ketchel explained what he did they were able to put aside their differences and reconciliate.

Nice article Colonial.

Much has been covered here and there's really not a lot to say apart from i'm not sure myself. There's no doubt in my mind that both fighters agreed to carry the fight a bit for increased revenue. Also the word on the street is they did play craps that night but like you say strange given the circumstances. Did Stanley cross him but all was forgiven?, was it the plan all along?. Whatever they agreed on i'm sure Stanley wasn't expecting to lose a few teeth. Some good points and theories, and a mystery we'll never get to the bottom of.