KOTR Round 7th Matchup.

Ok here we go this is the 7th matchup on the card.

Below will be the answers from PM's i got off each person and i wan't you to use the poll's to vote for your favourite, i have set the poll to last 1 day.

The question i asked was:

Will ROH ever become Mainstream?

Person A.

will roh ever become mainstream?

yes, i believe with the talent they have in their company at some point sooner or later they will go mainstream. there's no reason why they couldn't be successful doing so with the talent on their roster and creative booking . just look at the way tna have kicked off since going mainstream they've gone from a weekly ppv to spike tv and worldwide coverage. the best possible thing for roh to do is find a company interested in broadcasting them into america and other countries cos theirs no doubt if they could go up against tna in a same time slot alot of fans would find themselves tuning into to roh instead. over the years roh have started to grow into 1 of the best wrestling companies in america. the main advantage roh would have over most wrestling companies in america is when they advertise wrestling they don't stand around talking in the ring for 75% of their show and put on a wrestling clinic. the biggest problem they would have is the lack of star names to wwe and tna fans. most of them would be like davey richards ? who the hell is that? also weather mainstream fans would of heard of roh could be another issue but i believe if they watched it for a good 20 minutes most of them would be hooked by it.

overall i believe they'll be mainsteam and in the uk within the next 5 years .

Person B.

The question of whether Ring of Honor could ever become mainstream depends on whether the current crop of wrestling fans would ever change. At this moment in time, WWE is pushing to become far more of an entertainment company and has even taken the word 'wrestling' out of it's name and it's shows and TNA for all it's attempts to push some form of wrestling is too busy trying to relive storylines from 10 years ago while trying to compete with the WWE rather than concentrate on it's own product.

Ring of Honor on the other hand, is the most pure form of a wrestling show anywhere in America, the relatively small fanbase love Ring of Honor for it's wrestling as do I. If Ring of Honor is to ever become a mainstream organisation and possibly challenge WWE and TNA, it needs wrestling fans to truly appreciate the true art form of Wrestling again. My opinion is that supposed 'wrestling' fans are now to busy wanting to enjoy 20 minute segments and the other things that come on a show and the actual wrestling has become a 2nd to what they want to see.

If Ring of Honor managed to establish a larger fanbase with more dedicated fans then they have now and they not only manage to have increased funding (wherever that will come from) and some sort of regular TV time, Ring of Honor could become a mainstream organisation and challenge WWE and TNA in the way that ECW challenged WWE and WCW in the 90's. The possibilities of this happening is a very big 'if' and tbh, I can't ever see the supposed wrestling fans ever appreciating wrestling in the way that it was in the 80's. If Ring of Honor was to become mainstream, it would have to use the formula that WWE and TNA use atm and for me and other fans, that would be a big sellout because tbh, I quite like Ring of Honor just the way that it is.

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Ok so just to remind you, you can vote on the following guidelines:

1). You enjoyed reading the reply.
2). You thought the argument was explained thoroughly
3). You just liked the reply!
4). You thought it was informative and well written.

Oh and please try not to vote for yourselves!

Let the voting commence!

I voted for Poster A as he actually answered the question. B seemed to just say what he thought ROH should do.

By far the weakest matchup yet in my opinion. I thought A's answer wasn't very well written but was at least an answer. B's was slightly better written but didn't really make much sense to me.

Voted Person A as they answered the question, but their punctuation needs work!

yeah person A seemed to answer the question but like some one else said, person b just wanted to do things his way.

Davieswasacrippledtart wrote:By far the weakest matchup yet in my opinion. I thought A's answer wasn't very well written but was at least an answer. B's was slightly better written but didn't really make much sense to me.

Do you mean the question or reply wise mate?

The answer. The question you asked them was fine.

Miz NG wrote:Voted Person A as they answered the question, but their punctuation needs work!

are we judging on punctuation and grammar? Surely getting their point across is more important

the-gaffer wrote:

Miz NG wrote:Voted Person A as they answered the question, but their punctuation needs work!

are we judging on punctuation and grammar? Surely getting their point across is more important

agree with you there

the-gaffer wrote:

Miz NG wrote:Voted Person A as they answered the question, but their punctuation needs work!

are we judging on punctuation and grammar? Surely getting their point across is more important

To be fair Gaffer your being a little harsh on Miz NG. I dont think Miz NG voted on punctuation grounds it was just merely a mention mate.

the-gaffer wrote:

Miz NG wrote:Voted Person A as they answered the question, but their punctuation needs work!

are we judging on punctuation and grammar? Surely getting their point across is more important

I definitely take this into account, but it's a personal thing; whether you care about it is your choice.

While the point being made is the most important thing, I am personally put off a response that has bad punctuation and grammar. It's fair enough if it's a mistake, but when people use expressions like "tbh" and can't be bothered to capitalise the initials of the company, that's just lazy.

I'm not saying I'd penalise someone for the odd mistake, but when it looks like someone just clicked send without reading through their own response my gut reaction is "you didn't care about your answer, so why should I?"

the-gaffer wrote:

Miz NG wrote:Voted Person A as they answered the question, but their punctuation needs work!

are we judging on punctuation and grammar? Surely getting their point across is more important

I have voted for Person A anyway, but for easiness of reading, I find punctuation quite critical. Just the way I was taught. I could bang on about it, but I don't want to be known as the punctuation police!

everyone has been taught different ways it just how you perceive things.

some people worry about grammar some people don't bother just the way things are nowadays.

fernando wrote:everyone has been taught different ways it just how you perceive things.

some people worry about grammar some people don't bother just the way things are nowadays.

I'm not sure which schools teach incorrect grammar and punctuation but attendance at those establishments definitely strikes me as a valid excuse.

you try coming to schools in the uk, i had cover teachers for 5 out of my 7 years in my english lessons there and learnt sweet f.a, we got taught basic english and that was it.

Neither answer exactly gripped me but I went for B on the basis that it had a better construction.

The arguments were quite similar, however, and it could be nice to see questions that are a little more analytical in nature to get some differentiation in responses.

Davieswasacrippledtart wrote:

the-gaffer wrote:

Miz NG wrote:Voted Person A as they answered the question, but their punctuation needs work!

are we judging on punctuation and grammar? Surely getting their point across is more important

I definitely take this into account, but it's a personal thing; whether you care about it is your choice.

While the point being made is the most important thing, I am personally put off a response that has bad punctuation and grammar. It's fair enough if it's a mistake, but when people use expressions like "tbh" and can't be bothered to capitalise the initials of the company, that's just lazy.

I'm not saying I'd penalise someone for the odd mistake, but when it looks like someone just clicked send without reading through their own response my gut reaction is "you didn't care about your answer, so why should I?"

tbh i think your bein’ a bit harsh their.

In all seriousness, is there a way of getting a spell check option on here or is this not controlled by the admins?... I have the advantage of working on a Mac which spell checks everything including posts, though I don't think this option is available on all systems.

Don't get me wrong, I try my best to make sure my punctuation is fine but I just feel that in a game like this the players opinions are far more important than their ability to spell check a post, for me a good point is a good point regardless if they use capital letters or not.

the-gaffer wrote:Don't get me wrong, I try my best to make sure my punctuation is fine but I just feel that in a game like this the players opinions are far more important than their ability to spell check a post, for me a good point is a good point regardless if they use capital letters or not.

I think that crips point is that to a certain extent poor grammar etc can detract from the quality of the argument. Capital letters, full stops, commas and semi-colons are there to aid the reader in understanding a sentence and its meaning can sometimes be lost without it.

Obviously this is a form of media that is less formalised than a newspaper article for example. This, however, doesn't mean that all the rules of the English language should be refrained from being used, in my opinion.

The fundamental content of the piece carries a great importance but like Crips said If the author can't care why should the reader?

If it's tricky decision I'd go with the better piece grammatically

Fair enough, I seem to be in the minority on this, I just feel that if the poster makes valid points then they should be judged on their opinions, I'm a member of a few forums and certain posters use punctuation and grammar as a way of looking down their noses at fellow posters, like a sly undertone, I'm not saying that's the case here however I'd hate to think a poster with better ideas would lose because they don't live up to some posters grammatical standards.

the-gaffer wrote:Fair enough, I seem to be in the minority on this, I just feel that if the poster makes valid points then they should be judged on their opinions, I'm a member of a few forums and certain posters use punctuation and grammar as a way of looking down their noses at fellow posters, like a sly undertone, I'm not saying that's the case here however I'd hate to think a poster with better ideas would lose because they don't live up to some posters grammatical standards.

I would certainly hope that this isn't the case, or, more worryingly, that people feel that there is a campaign against those who utilise a more formal style of prose. I try to appreciate that writing doesn't come as naturally to some as it does to me and try not to be a kind of grammar police. Then again, this is a competition and as such I do feel compelled to judge the pieces critically in a manner that I wouldn't with a standard post.

I suppose thats where I'll take a different approach, like I said earlier a good idea is a good idea and the best opinion for me should always go through even if it might not be grammatically correct, like you said, some may not find it as easy as others and I feel its harsh to punish them for it, I seem to be on my own though in that regard so maybe I'm wrong.

gaffer - I always try to leave myself open to the idea that I may be incorrect! I try not to reject an idea because it is not written as well, but in a case of two posts that have a similar content the one that is better written, for me, has the edge.

I don't think, however, that you are in the minority on this one. In my KotR match with Hero (I believe) his shorter post had better content than my rather long one and he got a convincing victory as a result.

Content does shine through, but where similar arguments are being made something has to be used as a method of differentiation.

the-gaffer wrote:I suppose thats where I'll take a different approach, like I said earlier a good idea is a good idea and the best opinion for me should always go through even if it might not be grammatically correct, like you said, some may not find it as easy as others and I feel its harsh to punish them for it, I seem to be on my own though in that regard so maybe I'm wrong.

I agree with your comments on snobberish behaviour towards grammatical errors, everyone makes mistakes & you don't need to be Shakespeare to be a decent poster on here...
This however is effectively a writing competition where the subject is proffessional wrestling. Content is more important than accuracy but both are required.
An idea is only an idea.... If it's not presented properly it can be worthless. I've read more than one round where the competitors (either one or both) have failed to answer the question properly.

There have been a few rounds that i haven't myself voted for that reason including this one, I just felt it would be a good time to find out what people are judging it on

I definitely agree with you gaffer that the content is the most important thing of all, and I agree with Josh that people shouldn't lose out just because they might not have great writing skills. Like I said previously, an honest mistake is an honest mistake, and in a normal forum conversation I'm sure none of us are too bothered what style people write in. But these posters are competing for our votes, so I'd expect them to take a bit more care in crafting their response compared to a regular post.

Poster A used the word "cos" instead of "because"; that's not an error, it's just lazy. It counts against them in my judgment but it wouldn't be enough for me to automatically vote for Poster B (especially when Poster B used the expression "tbh"! Again, that's not a mistake, that's just lazy).

Fernando, I'm English, I live in Bristol (and work in a school!). Badstreet, USA is a nod to the Freebirds.

well since its been 1 day and poll is close to finishing ill admit i had written post A in a post drunken state, where i didn't really pay attention to what i was writing.

Davieswasacrippledtart wrote:I definitely agree with you gaffer that the content is the most important thing of all, and I agree with Josh that people shouldn't lose out just because they might not have great writing skills. Like I said previously, an honest mistake is an honest mistake, and in a normal forum conversation I'm sure none of us are too bothered what style people write in. But these posters are competing for our votes, so I'd expect them to take a bit more care in crafting their response compared to a regular post.

Poster A used the word "cos" instead of "because"; that's not an error, it's just lazy. It counts against them in my judgment but it wouldn't be enough for me to automatically vote for Poster B (especially when Poster B used the expression "tbh"! Again, that's not a mistake, that's just lazy).

Fernando, I'm English, I live in Bristol (and work in a school!). Badstreet, USA is a nod to the Freebirds.

I wish I hadn't read that last paragraph! Completely killed your aura & mystic Crips

fernando wrote:well since its been 1 day and poll is close to finishing ill admit i had written post A in a post drunken state, where i didn't really pay attention to what i was writing.

606v2 answer to Scott Hall

Brady12 wrote:

fernando wrote:well since its been 1 day and poll is close to finishing ill admit i had written post A in a post drunken state, where i didn't really pay attention to what i was writing.

606v2 answer to Scott Hall

in that case what is 606v2's answer to:

Hogan
Flair
Vince McMahon
Hornswoggle

Ha, sorry Brady. I didn't realise I had an aura.

fernando, congratulations on your win. Poor Person B, losing to a drunk who went to a rubbish school!!!

i was only drunk cos it was my friends 19th bday

i don't sit wasting my days drinking like scott hall

fernando wrote:i was only drunk cos it was my friends 19th bday

i don't sit wasting my days drinking like scott hall

Brady will be devastated at this further loss of aura and mystique.

Apologies for the 'tbh'. I wrote it in a rush due to Uni etc. I wish I got a better question to be frank. Nevermind. Life is life.

greggschickenbake wrote:Apologies for the 'tbh'. I wrote it in a rush due to Uni etc. I wish I got a better question to be frank. Nevermind. Life is life.

you wrote it how you wanted to

i only won cos ring of honor is something im a big fan of