New book - " Hitters, Dancers and Ring Magicians " By Kelly Richard Nicholson

This one looks interesting.

Reviews by Tracy Callis and Clay Moyle here :

http://cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/BookReview-Hitters-KellyNicholson.htm

http://cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/Hitters-ClayMoyle-Book-Review.htm

Looks good Windy. Have to say there are some excellent books out and about now. Spoke to Adam Pollack and he has his latest in the series about ready to go, on Tommy Burns, which should be great and means after that he should get to work on Jack Johnson which I am probably more excited about than is healthy for a grown man.

The only pity is these tend not to get decent distibution in the UK so tend to be expensive. Another one I am looking forward to getting hold of is

http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=4817

I like the look of that one, jeff. That will definitely be on my wish list.

The Burns one will be interesting, also. I always felt that Tommy was a wee bit more than the footnote he has become.

Think that is the best things about his books Windy. With a lot of those guys it is easy to get swept along with the prevailing views, such as Sullivan was a crude brawler or Hart was a guy who does not deserve to be considered champion etc. But when you actually read the views of the day about these guys the opinion often does not support the assumptions.

Have to say whilst I am not going to re-invent Hart as a great on the back of reading his book I have massive new found respect for him. There is a spell at light heavy where he is fighting great fighters pretty much back to back with little more than a couple of week between bouts. Is staggering to read about it and irrespective of his heavyweight claims or lack of them is definitely worthy of massive respect

Windy,

Talking of Tommy Burns, I am currently reading Unforgivable Blackness (how many footnotes?) and was interested to read that Burns eventually conceded that he was beaten by a superior boxer, despite all the shenanigans that surrounded the fight and the obvious racist undertones. Was facinated by the fact Burns and his people were outraged by Johnson making some derogatory comments about Tommy's wife, rather ignoring their own verbal indicretions throughout!

rowley wrote:Think that is the best things about his books Windy. With a lot of those guys it is easy to get swept along with the prevailing views, such as Sullivan was a crude brawler or Hart was a guy who does not deserve to be considered champion etc. But when you actually read the views of the day about these guys the opinion often does not support the assumptions.

Have to say whilst I am not going to re-invent Hart as a great on the back of reading his book I have massive new found respect for him. There is a spell at light heavy where he is fighting great fighters pretty much back to back with little more than a couple of week between bouts. Is staggering to read about it and irrespective of his heavyweight claims or lack of them is definitely worthy of massive respect

Funny you should mention Hart, jeff.

In my ignorance I had always dismissed him out of hand. Then I read an interesting article about him at the IBRO and, just like you, I found myself warming to him.

We live and learn.

Windy am not sure how much uptake you would get as I am not sure how many of the users are massive readers but do you think a book review section would be worth having as a sticky. I know I would welcome it as I dearly love reading about the sport and with the cost of some of the more obscure titles a review from someone I respected would be a big help

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:Windy,

Talking of Tommy Burns, I am currently reading Unforgivable Blackness (how many footnotes?) and was interested to read that Burns eventually conceded that he was beaten by a superior boxer, despite all the shenanigans that surrounded the fight and the obvious racist undertones. Was facinated by the fact Burns and his people were outraged by Johnson making some derogatory comments about Tommy's wife, rather ignoring their own verbal indicretions throughout!

Jack could push buttons with the best of them, couldn't he, Tino ? Tony Galento tried that with Joe Louis. At referee's instructions, Galento confided in the Brown Bomber that he had sexual ambitions toward Mrs. Louis which, presumably, highlighted simultaneously Galento's fine taste in women and his incredible courage.

rowley wrote:Windy am not sure how much uptake you would get as I am not sure how many of the users are massive readers but do you think a book review section would be worth having as a sticky. I know I would welcome it as I dearly love reading about the sport and with the cost of some of the more obscure titles a review from someone I respected would be a big help

Now that is a superb idea, jeff.

I'm all for it, and will raise it with the other admins. If it gets consensus okay I think it only right and proper that you open it up, and I'll make it a sticky for you.

I am currently reading Unforgivable Blackness (how many footnotes?)
______________________________________________________

Ain't that the truth. Really spoilt my enjoyment of the book. Found it really prententious. Is only done to give the book the veneer of intelectualism which it doesn't really need as a) it's a boxing sodding book and b) footnotes aside it is a pretty well written and researched book, if a little dry at times.

rowley wrote:Windy am not sure how much uptake you would get as I am not sure how many of the users are massive readers but do you think a book review section would be worth having as a sticky. I know I would welcome it as I dearly love reading about the sport and with the cost of some of the more obscure titles a review from someone I respected would be a big help

Rowley, I think that is a great idea. I am also in the middle of reading of book by Michael T Izenburg about John L. Sullivan that is a brilliant study into his life in and out of the ring. Haven't finished it yet and it can be a touch "academic" in places but really has some great stuff in it.

HumanWindmill wrote:

rowley wrote:Windy am not sure how much uptake you would get as I am not sure how many of the users are massive readers but do you think a book review section would be worth having as a sticky. I know I would welcome it as I dearly love reading about the sport and with the cost of some of the more obscure titles a review from someone I respected would be a big help

Now that is a superb idea, jeff.

I'm all for it, and will raise it with the other admins. If it gets consensus okay I think it only right and proper that you open it up, and I'll make it a sticky for you.

No problem Windy, will try and get something going over the weekend when I have a little more time. Hopefully will find a few like minded souls and it will not die on the vine

rowley wrote:I am currently reading Unforgivable Blackness (how many footnotes?)
______________________________________________________

Ain't that the truth. Really spoilt my enjoyment of the book. Found it really prententious. Is only done to give the book the veneer of intelectualism which it doesn't really need as a) it's a boxing sodding book and b) footnotes aside it is a pretty well written and researched book, if a little dry at times.

I think I am just going to gloss over the footnotes and try to pickout the interesting ones. It's a bit like reading two books in one!

HumanWindmill wrote:

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:Windy,

Talking of Tommy Burns, I am currently reading Unforgivable Blackness (how many footnotes?) and was interested to read that Burns eventually conceded that he was beaten by a superior boxer, despite all the shenanigans that surrounded the fight and the obvious racist undertones. Was facinated by the fact Burns and his people were outraged by Johnson making some derogatory comments about Tommy's wife, rather ignoring their own verbal indicretions throughout!

Jack could push buttons with the best of them, couldn't he, Tino ? Tony Galento tried that with Joe Louis. At referee's instructions, Galento confided in the Brown Bomber that he had sexual ambitions toward Mrs. Louis which, presumably, highlighted simultaneously Galento's fine taste in women and his incredible courage.

That's a great story Windy. If only Two Ton Tony had the skill to back up his bravery, we would all have to re-assess our p4p lists!

Johnson sure could push buttons. Despite Tommy's obvious character flaws, I ended up with sympathy for him. I envisaged him as a spider and Jack as a naughty child picking it's legs off. Really tormented Burns both physically and mentally.

I know what you mean, Tino.

jeff, we have the green light on your ' sticky ' idea. Please drop me a PM when you open the thread so that I can be sure to be alerted to it and convert it to ' sticky.'

Thanks, mate.

Will do Windy, will write a few over the weekend to get the ball rolling and hopefully a few other users will follow suit. Will be nice if we can get a few things like this going. Is no reason the forum has to be solely debate because with over 100 years of the sport to go at there is surely plenty things such as this and fight videos we can get off the ground

I'm sure I don't need to tell you that I totally agree, jeff. This is a great idea.

rowley wrote:Will do Windy, will write a few over the weekend to get the ball rolling and hopefully a few other users will follow suit. Will be nice if we can get a few things like this going. Is no reason the forum has to be solely debate because with over 100 years of the sport to go at there is surely plenty things such as this and fight videos we can get off the ground

Tried a couple with boxing articles and documentaries but didn't really take off.

Can I be the first to write a review? Don't bother with Oscar De La Hoya's auto. It's rubbish. There is not much more to say about it! And I grew up a huge fan of the Golden Boy, so much so that I named my first son Oscar. Still rubbish though.

On a serious note, great idea and I will try to wrte something when I have finish the John L. book.

Is there a feature to link to individual posts on this forum?

Was thinking the initial post should be a list of all the books hyperlinked to the posts reviewing them.

Scottrf wrote:Is there a feature to link to individual posts on this forum?

Was thinking the initial post should be a list of all the books hyperlinked to the posts reviewing them.

I'll find out, Scott. Watch this space.

rowley wrote:Looks good Windy. Have to say there are some excellent books out and about now. Spoke to Adam Pollack and he has his latest in the series about ready to go, on Tommy Burns, which should be great and means after that he should get to work on Jack Johnson which I am probably more excited about than is healthy for a grown man.

The only pity is these tend not to get decent distibution in the UK so tend to be expensive. Another one I am looking forward to getting hold of is

http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=4817

This is good Rowley, read somewhere that he was working on Tommy Burns but couldn't find anything on google, great to see such work on the likes of Tommy and Marvin Hart. Looks like he intends to keep going with the series which is great news. Have had my eye on the First black champions one's but obviously is a little pricey, have had a shop around and are struggling for any less than 40 bucks.

HumanWindmill wrote:This one looks interesting.

Reviews by Tracy Callis and Clay Moyle here :

http://cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/BookReview-Hitters-KellyNicholson.htm

http://cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/Hitters-ClayMoyle-Book-Review.htm

Been keeping an eye on this one Windy, looks great, little bit cheaper than some of the more expensive books aswell.

I thought this thread was called 'Hitler, Dancers and Ring Magicians " By Kelly Richard Nicholson'.

Words can't describe my disappointment upon re-reading the title.

The Galveston Giant wrote:

rowley wrote:Looks good Windy. Have to say there are some excellent books out and about now. Spoke to Adam Pollack and he has his latest in the series about ready to go, on Tommy Burns, which should be great and means after that he should get to work on Jack Johnson which I am probably more excited about than is healthy for a grown man.

The only pity is these tend not to get decent distibution in the UK so tend to be expensive. Another one I am looking forward to getting hold of is

http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=4817

This is good Rowley, read somewhere that he was working on Tommy Burns but couldn't find anything on google, great to see such work on the likes of Tommy and Marvin Hart. Looks like he intends to keep going with the series which is great news. Have had my eye on the First black champions one's but obviously is a little pricey, have had a shop around and are struggling for any less than 40 bucks.

Galveston he said he was nearly done so he expects it to be out in the next couple of months. Would expect we would have to wait quite a while for the Johnson one as he is one of the more significant, and active fighters for the era so could well be another Jeffries style epic but if that one is anything to go by should be well worth the wait

Here you go, Scott, courtesy of David Tails, who provided the answer and covered for my hi tech inadequacy :

If you right click the title of the individual post and click select shortcut (May be known as copy link). That will be a link to the individual post rather than the topic.

Perfect Windy thought there would be, cheers.

You're welcome, mate.

by rowley on Thu May 19, 2011 11:49 am

The Galveston Giant wrote:
rowley wrote:
Looks good Windy. Have to say there are some excellent books out and about now. Spoke to Adam Pollack and he has his latest in the series about ready to go, on Tommy Burns, which should be great and means after that he should get to work on Jack Johnson which I am probably more excited about than is healthy for a grown man.

The only pity is these tend not to get decent distibution in the UK so tend to be expensive. Another one I am looking forward to getting hold of is

http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=4817


This is good Rowley, read somewhere that he was working on Tommy Burns but couldn't find anything on google, great to see such work on the likes of Tommy and Marvin Hart. Looks like he intends to keep going with the series which is great news. Have had my eye on the First black champions one's but obviously is a little pricey, have had a shop around and are struggling for any less than 40 bucks.


Galveston he said he was nearly done so he expects it to be out in the next couple of months. Would expect we would have to wait quite a while for the Johnson one as he is one of the more significant, and active fighters for the era so could well be another Jeffries style epic but if that one is anything to go by should be well worth the wait

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Brilliant, looking forward to the Tommy one, think you're right about the size Rowley, would expect Burns to be a similair size to Hart and Johnson similair to Jeffries, had a little break from Jeffries like you say it's a monster, keep us in the loop mate.

Will the Admin staff immediately ignore any and all reviews of "No Ordinary Joe"?

DAVE667 wrote:Will the Admin staff immediately ignore any and all reviews of "No Ordinary Joe"?

I was actually planning on that being one of the first ones I did. Think if the section is to work it should have some negative reviews as well as positive ones and I would struggle to think of a book I could be less psoitive about than no ordinary joe

Negative reviews...let's hope no writes a bio of Don Curry in the immediate future!

DAVE667 wrote:Negative reviews...let's hope no writes a bio of Don Curry in the immediate future!

If they do I hope the Didsbury branch of Waterstones are willing to open at midnight like when a new Harry Potter book comes out.

DAVE667 wrote:Will the Admin staff immediately ignore any and all reviews of "No Ordinary Joe"?

Dave, have you read the De La Hoya book? I haven't read No Ordinary Joe but I can't imagine it can be worse than Oscar's.

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:Will the Admin staff immediately ignore any and all reviews of "No Ordinary Joe"?

Dave, have you read the De La Hoya book? I haven't read No Ordinary Joe but I can't imagine it can be worse than Oscar's.

Don't say things like that because on some deeply buried masochistic level I now feel the need to read Oscar's book to see if it can truly match the horror of no ordinary joe.

rowley wrote:

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:Will the Admin staff immediately ignore any and all reviews of "No Ordinary Joe"?

Dave, have you read the De La Hoya book? I haven't read No Ordinary Joe but I can't imagine it can be worse than Oscar's.

Don't say things like that because on some deeply buried masochistic level I now feel the need to read Oscar's book to see if it can truly match the horror of no ordinary joe.

It's not that deeply buried then Rowley. Admitting your problem is the first step and all that!

In all seriousness, it is incredibly dull and he comes across as so bitter it is untrue. I had to finish it just to see if there were any redeeming features at the end. Alas, I will never get that time back.

What is so bad about No Ordinary Joe then?

Bit like people saying, have you seen the new Jean Claude van Damme movie...it's soooooo bad you have to watch it. Then Channel Five have it and I have to fight every with every fibre in my being not to stay up and watch it.

My only concern with Boxing bio's is that, like the "celebrity" circuit and (to a lesser degree) the football circuit, everyone seems to think their story deserves to be heard.

How long before Tony "Hokey Cokey" Oakey is doing the rounds flogging his opus? (That's not a euphemism either)

It's just really bland. Thought there might be some insights as to why he didn't unify for so long, why he stuck around with Warren when he was not delivering big fights and these kind of issues as they are valid subjects but alas not.

A friend once gave me some decent advice and that is never to read a sports biography for someone who is still active and that is pretty good advice as he was still with Warren at the time guess he had to toe the party line. Would guess it would read a little different were he to write it now

My only concern with Boxing bio's is that, like the "celebrity" circuit and (to a lesser degree) the football circuit, everyone seems to think their story deserves to be heard.

Dave, never sure if it's wise to admit to your team for fear of opening yourself up to ridicule, but I am, like you, a Liverpool fan. Have you read Growlers auto? I thought he came across as bitter and angry in that. You would have though Houllier was actually Satan according to Robbie. It was a long time ago, but that is my residing memory of it. It was the first, and last, footballers book I have read. Although strangely enough, I have heard Tony Cascarino's is a good read!

I'm not one to abitrarily read anything by someone just cos they we're once connected to my favourite club.

Andrey Voronin's book isn't going t be on my hit list any time soon...although ironically, Voronin himself might just be!

DAVE667 wrote:I'm not one to abitrarily read anything by someone just cos they we're once connected to my favourite club.

Andrey Voronin's book isn't going t be on my hit list any time soon...although ironically, Voronin himself might just be!

His wife would kick your head in first.

Only if those leopard jumpsuits are quite stretchy