The provinces are forbidden to cite each other by the IRFU.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:

MrsP wrote:There may be a discussion needs to occur about the fairness or otherwise of the disciplinary arrangements of various leagues but this is an very poor example to try to use to further such an arguement.

Maybe we should follow the example of the RFU disciplinary process which allowed a QC to mislead a judge in a hearing, thus allowing the most violent act any of us have probably ever witnessed to have the sanction reduced by a half erroneously!

Would that be a good place to start this discussion?

O Jeez. Having just been exposed as a complete idiot   , I'm going to have to ask MrsP to provide a substantiated example again.

Pretty please.

ME-109 wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:If the Provinces are forbidden to cite each other, Joe Schmidt was definately off messages because he was screaming for Paul O'Connell to be cited. Will I ever forget his 'think of the children watching it on youtube' comment.    

Probably not but you'll forget John Hayes stamping on Cian Healys head   

or Sexton kicking Mafi and opening a nasty wound ...    

MrsP wrote:

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:

MrsP wrote:There may be a discussion needs to occur about the fairness or otherwise of the disciplinary arrangements of various leagues but this is an very poor example to try to use to further such an arguement.

Maybe we should follow the example of the RFU disciplinary process which allowed a QC to mislead a judge in a hearing, thus allowing the most violent act any of us have probably ever witnessed to have the sanction reduced by a half erroneously!

Would that be a good place to start this discussion?

O Jeez. Having just been exposed as a complete idiot   , I'm going to have to ask MrsP to provide a substantiated example again.

Pretty please.

Callum Clarke

Got 50% reduction because the QC acting for Clarke told the judge his previous record was accrued underage and too long ago to be considered. The QC was at best wrong on both counts. There are other interpretations of that misinformation available. Simple maths was all that was required.

Kingshu wrote:Do the 2 Scottish teams ever cite each other? or the Italians?
Even the Welsh, I don't believe cite each other.

I don't think this is an IRFU only thing that the original title suggests. I also don't believe it is forbidden by the IRFU, as anything forbidding it would be against the rules of the game.

My belief is that simply the provinces don't cite each other and leave it up to the citing commissioner, same as Scottish teams, Italian teams and Welsh (possibly) do when playing each other. It is the fairest way to keep any infighting within a Union to an minimum, leave it in the hands of the 3rd party.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:

Kingshu wrote:Do the 2 Scottish teams ever cite each other? or the Italians?
Even the Welsh, I don't believe cite each other.

I don't think this is an IRFU only thing that the original title suggests. I also don't believe it is forbidden by the IRFU, as anything forbidding it would be against the rules of the game.

My belief is that simply the provinces don't cite each other and leave it up to the citing commissioner, same as Scottish teams, Italian teams and Welsh (possibly) do when playing each other. It is the fairest way to keep any infighting within a Union to an minimum, leave it in the hands of the 3rd party.

So long as the third party is neutral.

Kingshu wrote:

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:

Kingshu wrote:Do the 2 Scottish teams ever cite each other? or the Italians?
Even the Welsh, I don't believe cite each other.

I don't think this is an IRFU only thing that the original title suggests. I also don't believe it is forbidden by the IRFU, as anything forbidding it would be against the rules of the game.

My belief is that simply the provinces don't cite each other and leave it up to the citing commissioner, same as Scottish teams, Italian teams and Welsh (possibly) do when playing each other. It is the fairest way to keep any infighting within a Union to an minimum, leave it in the hands of the 3rd party.

So long as the third party is neutral.

The 3rd party will be from the home union in the Pro 12 in most games, due to the format of the assigned referee and assistances. Due you not believe that referees are impartial.
Should we insist the Jeff games citing commissioners are neutral, ie not from the RFU? and French games they are not from the FRU? it these are ok then whats the issue with an Irish derby having a commissioner from the IRFU?

or are IRFU ref's not to be trusted for interprovincial games, but RFU ref's are to be trusted for Jeff derbies?

Portnoy wrote:One possibility might be for complete neutrals to be appointed for citing observers to be appointed : e.g. Franglos for the Rabo and Celtalians to the Jeff/T14.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:I would equally say that a player tackling an opponent around the neck and receiving nothing more than ten minutes on the naughty step is a disgrace, MrsP.

You are hot on potentially violent play. But you do tend to don the green glasses when Ulster/Irish players are involved.

rodders wrote:Not sure about rugby MrsP but in professional wrestling such manoeuvres are common place without serious injuries.  

Notch wrote:

rodders wrote:Not sure about rugby MrsP but in professional wrestling such manoeuvres are common place without serious injuries.  

Serious injuries are actually very common in pro wrestling, and thats when the other guy often knows what is going to happen and 'leans in' to it.

rodders wrote:

Notch wrote:

rodders wrote:Not sure about rugby MrsP but in professional wrestling such manoeuvres are common place without serious injuries.  

Serious injuries are actually very common in pro wrestling, and thats when the other guy often knows what is going to happen and 'leans in' to it.

Agreed but statistically only a minority come from a "closeline" manoeuvre. If Kearney really intended to hurt Jackson he'd have used something more damaging like a tombstone pile driver or stone cold stunner. Therefore a yellow is probably sufficient.

Notch wrote:

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:I would equally say that a player tackling an opponent around the neck and receiving nothing more than ten minutes on the naughty step is a disgrace, MrsP.

You are hot on potentially violent play. But you do tend to don the green glasses when Ulster/Irish players are involved.

Don't you think it would benefit Ulster if one of Leinsters best players was suspended for our crucial playoff game against Leinster though? I'd be all for it if Kearney was suspended, definitely good news for Ulster if it had happened. Just don't agree with you that it would be merited for this specific incident. Reckless yeah- hence meriting the yellow. I think red cards are overused and should be reserved for deliberate acts. For violent play as you say- Kearneys tackle was bad but it could never be termed as violent. Or deliberate for that matter. Dangerous, yeah. It was dealt with at the time.