Get over it Frank

Poor ol' Fish Eyes, parting (your cash cow from his belt) is such sweet sorrow. Seems he was asleep on Saturday

"The general consensus seems to be that James won the fight, so they should order a rematch," said Warren.

"I haven't found one person who thought George won that fight"

Well, I can find at least two dear chap

Would have a little more sympathy (ok I'm lying) if he had been quite so keen to grant either Thompson a rematch with Nelson or Reid a rematch with Calzaghe. Sometimes you reap what you sow in this life

I had it a draw but would have favoured Groves. Frank is just trying to get a rematch and I understand why but he is acting like a tool.

Opinion is pretty much split 50/50 on the result of the fight so Frank knows he is talking utter gash.

Personally I would rather Grove give up the belt than give Degale a rematch.

I know Dave,

I read that yesterday on the BBC Website.

Can't wait for his article this Saturday in The Sun. I shall be standing outside the local newsagents to get a copy like a lovestruck Westlife fan waiting to get a ticket to their last ever "gig"

Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn wrote:I know Dave,

I read that yesterday on the BBC Website.

Can't wait for his article this Saturday in The Sun. I shall be standing outside the local newsagents to get a copy like a lovestruck Westlife fan waiting to get a ticket to their last ever "gig"

ARE WESTLIFE SPLITTING UP!!!!! WHERE IS THIS GIG HAPPENING?

Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn wrote:I know Dave,

I read that yesterday on the BBC Website.

Can't wait for his article this Saturday in The Sun. I shall be standing outside the local newsagents to get a copy like a lovestruck Westlife fan waiting to get a ticket to their last ever "gig"

Ahh yes, Fwanks weekly moan about all good fighters not signed up with him and him bigging up his talent(less) prospects.

I am quite amused that Warren was quoted as saying that "there's no-one else out there for Groves", other than DeGale again. I'd have thought that Groves is not short of offers or options right now. DeGale won't be bereft of them, either, but as Groves said: "I'll be taking a more direct route than him."

I dont care what them judges say. DeGale was the man that won the fight

Steffan wrote:I dont care what them judges say. DeGale was the man that won the fight

Not sure that they'll be particularly disturbed by your disagreeing with them, Steffan.

I know I'm not.

Steffan wrote:I dont care what them judges say. DeGale was the man that won the fight

You need to get on the blower to the BBBC in that case, Steffan. Do they realise that great injustice is afoot?

Steffan wrote:I dont care what them judges say. DeGale was the man that won the fight

Except he didnt actually win.

You know for a fact that Groves will, at least for the time being, be paired with some absolute garbage to milk the belt and also keep Warren's grubby paws off it. No way DeGale gets another shot at Groves for ages. Look for Chunky to be fighting on Ricky Burns undercards long after Burns has lost his SF belt

No doubt the quality of Groves' opposition will be called into question by Warren and yet, I bet Frank will have the name of all their promotors in his Blackberry.

Lumbering_Jack wrote:

Steffan wrote:I dont care what them judges say. DeGale was the man that won the fight

Except he didnt actually win.

Hahaha!!

I think if they had a rematch the chunkster would get the victory. Groves doesnt need to give him the rematch though. Jim McDonnell is still wiping the egg off his face. I cant stand Adam Booth normally he is a slimey little runt but to be fair he trained his man well

The reasons for a rematch are legitimate in my view. It was a highly contentious decision with general opinion split as to the winner from what I have seen so far.

I think peoples dislike of Warren and DeGale are kind of taking away from this.

In my opinion, if Groves intends on staying at the domestic scene for the time being he should rematch DeGale. If he wants to move on to a higher level then thats fine and he is entitled to do so. I just wouldnt like to see him hang around this level and avoid a rematch.

I had it 115-114 to degale, but no complaints with it going the other way because a) it was so close and b) degale and McDonnell needed a lesson.

Fish face is always bitter when things don't go his way. He must hate Hayemaker, first haye lures enzo and fwank into a false sense of security then promptly sparks him in 2 rounds, now this. Hurr hurr hurr.

To be honest the fight was close enough to justify a rematch but with how little respect Degale showed George in the build up can fully understand him either telling him to whistle for it or really screwing him at the negotating table, particularly as Warren tried to get options on Haye when the Enzo fight was first mooted and then shamefully reported it as Haye ducking Enzo.

There is no love lost between Hayemaker and Warren and think Frank is about to realise that payback can indeed be a bitch sometimes.

If I was Groves I would demand the lion share of the purse. Maybe a 70-30 split. Afterall, Groves has 2 belts, has beaten Defail twice now and has vastly more fans.

I just dont think it will do Groves credibility much good if he decides to remain at domestic level yet refuses to grant DeGale a rematch.

If he moves on and upwards and looks to target the Euro belt or a legitimate Euro level opponent then I think he can justify leaving DeGale behind.

But if he stays at domestic level for the time being then I think he should rematch DeGale. If not right away, then in a couple of fights time.

Depends on where Groves intends to go in the next 12-18 months.

manos de piedra wrote:I just dont think it will do Groves credibility much good if he decides to remain at domestic level yet refuses to grant DeGale a rematch.

If he moves on and upwards and looks to target the Euro belt or a legitimate Euro level opponent then I think he can justify leaving DeGale behind.

But if he stays at domestic level for the time being then I think he should rematch DeGale. If not right away, then in a couple of fights time.

Depends on where Groves intends to go in the next 12-18 months.

Degale trash talked Groves for years, I heard about Groves via Degale's mouth before I heard of Groves, so i'd like to see Degale stew for a bit.

I understand your point and if he wants to retain his current titles and Degale has a few fights and wins, he'll have to fight him as he'll surely be his mandatory and therefore will have to vacate or fight and to vacate at that point will look like he's ducking so needs to vacate now and go the Euro route to avoid this.

Hardly anyone, me included, gave Groves much of a chance and he's defied the odds and won so I think Groves has the right to take a couple of easy fights and then decide what to do.

I hope Degale's loss humbles him but I highly doubt it, but at least he has less clout when he runs his mouth.

I can see Degale becoming an Audley type hate figure, well I mean he's almost there anyway! The guy has no class, some have arrogance in a fun entertaining way i.e. Naz to an extent but Degale come across as the spoilt kid picking on others and the British public have rejected him IMO.

Tough for Groves as he has added pressure and spotlight now but if you want to be at the top, this is all part of it.

Valero's Conscience wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:I just dont think it will do Groves credibility much good if he decides to remain at domestic level yet refuses to grant DeGale a rematch.

If he moves on and upwards and looks to target the Euro belt or a legitimate Euro level opponent then I think he can justify leaving DeGale behind.

But if he stays at domestic level for the time being then I think he should rematch DeGale. If not right away, then in a couple of fights time.

Depends on where Groves intends to go in the next 12-18 months.

Degale trash talked Groves for years, I heard about Groves via Degale's mouth before I heard of Groves, so i'd like to see Degale stew for a bit.

I understand your point and if he wants to retain his current titles and Degale has a few fights and wins, he'll have to fight him as he'll surely be his mandatory and therefore will have to vacate or fight and to vacate at that point will look like he's ducking so needs to vacate now and go the Euro route to avoid this.

Hardly anyone, me included, gave Groves much of a chance and he's defied the odds and won so I think Groves has the right to take a couple of easy fights and then decide what to do.

I hope Degale's loss humbles him but I highly doubt it, but at least he has less clout when he runs his mouth.

I can see Degale becoming an Audley type hate figure, well I mean he's almost there anyway! The guy has no class, some have arrogance in a fun entertaining way i.e. Naz to an extent but Degale come across as the spoilt kid picking on others and the British public have rejected him IMO.

Tough for Groves as he has added pressure and spotlight now but if you want to be at the top, this is all part of it.

At the end of the day, I dont really buy into the not giving someone a payday or he called me names argument as a reason to avoid a match/rematch.

I dont think what DeGale did to Groves is any worse than say what Haye did to the Klitschkos. At the end of the day its about taking the credible fights. I dont like DeGale and am delighted Groves won but I simply cant see how he can remain at domestic level and credibly avoid rematching DeGale. The only legitimate reason for avoiding a rematch is to move forward and up a level.

rowley wrote:

Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn wrote:I know Dave,

I read that yesterday on the BBC Website.

Can't wait for his article this Saturday in The Sun. I shall be standing outside the local newsagents to get a copy like a lovestruck Westlife fan waiting to get a ticket to their last ever "gig"

ARE WESTLIFE SPLITTING UP!!!!! WHERE IS THIS GIG HAPPENING?

I heard there's been lots of talk about gig(g)s on Twitter...

Good luck to Groves, I think he should challenge for the euro belt (although at only 13 fights the lonsdale belt could stand to him for experience).

I think he should let DeGale and Warren stew, they will be making so much noise about a rematch, they will be unwittingly be promoting Groves. Their slander will keep Groves in the paper and casual fans interested in Groves fights. The Warren hype machine will have to kick into overdrive to keep Degale on the map and in the process promote Groves for free, Nice one Fwank.

I've not got much knowledge on how the BBBC act with these situations where a fight for their title was so close. Surely a request for a rematch will be given considering how close the fight was where both sides can dispute the win/loss etc.

In this case what choice does Groves have other than fight Degale again or vacate and fight for the European title?

manos de piedra wrote:

Valero's Conscience wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:I just dont think it will do Groves credibility much good if he decides to remain at domestic level yet refuses to grant DeGale a rematch.

If he moves on and upwards and looks to target the Euro belt or a legitimate Euro level opponent then I think he can justify leaving DeGale behind.

But if he stays at domestic level for the time being then I think he should rematch DeGale. If not right away, then in a couple of fights time.

Depends on where Groves intends to go in the next 12-18 months.

Degale trash talked Groves for years, I heard about Groves via Degale's mouth before I heard of Groves, so i'd like to see Degale stew for a bit.

I understand your point and if he wants to retain his current titles and Degale has a few fights and wins, he'll have to fight him as he'll surely be his mandatory and therefore will have to vacate or fight and to vacate at that point will look like he's ducking so needs to vacate now and go the Euro route to avoid this.

Hardly anyone, me included, gave Groves much of a chance and he's defied the odds and won so I think Groves has the right to take a couple of easy fights and then decide what to do.

I hope Degale's loss humbles him but I highly doubt it, but at least he has less clout when he runs his mouth.

I can see Degale becoming an Audley type hate figure, well I mean he's almost there anyway! The guy has no class, some have arrogance in a fun entertaining way i.e. Naz to an extent but Degale come across as the spoilt kid picking on others and the British public have rejected him IMO.

Tough for Groves as he has added pressure and spotlight now but if you want to be at the top, this is all part of it.

At the end of the day, I dont really buy into the not giving someone a payday or he called me names argument as a reason to avoid a match/rematch.

I dont think what DeGale did to Groves is any worse than say what Haye did to the Klitschkos. At the end of the day its about taking the credible fights. I dont like DeGale and am delighted Groves won but I simply cant see how he can remain at domestic level and credibly avoid rematching DeGale. The only legitimate reason for avoiding a rematch is to move forward and up a level.

And i expect that what he will do and start looking at european level. Its ok knocking Groves for no reason but you have to ask does Degale need to sort himself out first before any rematch or before he moves on with his career. Degale treatment of Groves was a lot different to Haye. Degale has done it out pure hate that stems from Groves beating him as an amatuer and meaning Degale lost his slot as top dog in gym, so straight away you have a very weak minded person there. The corner did not have a plan b to counter Groves change in tactics so you have to ask yourself is the current coach the right one and i honestly think by end of this year he would of changed trainers. Plus Warren said it himself 'hopefully the back slappers will go now' he saw the defeat as maybe a good thing. I know fans of Degale will be upset but there are problems that need to be faced before moving forward. Groves and Booth are more willing to admit the weak points and work on them. Thats whats needed with Degale because as you saw on Sat he will not always have opponenets who will fight in straight lines especially so top americans.

The_Phenom wrote:I've not got much knowledge on how the BBBC act with these situations where a fight for their title was so close. Surely a request for a rematch will be given considering how close the fight was where both sides can dispute the win/loss etc.

In this case what choice does Groves have other than fight Degale again or vacate and fight for the European title?

I think he will vacate.

Even if the BBBC dont issue a rematch order, DeGale wont have to much to become Groves mandatory challenger.

callan wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:

Valero's Conscience wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:I just dont think it will do Groves credibility much good if he decides to remain at domestic level yet refuses to grant DeGale a rematch.

If he moves on and upwards and looks to target the Euro belt or a legitimate Euro level opponent then I think he can justify leaving DeGale behind.

But if he stays at domestic level for the time being then I think he should rematch DeGale. If not right away, then in a couple of fights time.

Depends on where Groves intends to go in the next 12-18 months.

Degale trash talked Groves for years, I heard about Groves via Degale's mouth before I heard of Groves, so i'd like to see Degale stew for a bit.

I understand your point and if he wants to retain his current titles and Degale has a few fights and wins, he'll have to fight him as he'll surely be his mandatory and therefore will have to vacate or fight and to vacate at that point will look like he's ducking so needs to vacate now and go the Euro route to avoid this.

Hardly anyone, me included, gave Groves much of a chance and he's defied the odds and won so I think Groves has the right to take a couple of easy fights and then decide what to do.

I hope Degale's loss humbles him but I highly doubt it, but at least he has less clout when he runs his mouth.

I can see Degale becoming an Audley type hate figure, well I mean he's almost there anyway! The guy has no class, some have arrogance in a fun entertaining way i.e. Naz to an extent but Degale come across as the spoilt kid picking on others and the British public have rejected him IMO.

Tough for Groves as he has added pressure and spotlight now but if you want to be at the top, this is all part of it.

At the end of the day, I dont really buy into the not giving someone a payday or he called me names argument as a reason to avoid a match/rematch.

I dont think what DeGale did to Groves is any worse than say what Haye did to the Klitschkos. At the end of the day its about taking the credible fights. I dont like DeGale and am delighted Groves won but I simply cant see how he can remain at domestic level and credibly avoid rematching DeGale. The only legitimate reason for avoiding a rematch is to move forward and up a level.

And i expect that what he will do and start looking at european level. Its ok knocking Groves for no reason but you have to ask does Degale need to sort himself out first before any rematch or before he moves on with his career. Degale treatment of Groves was a lot different to Haye. Degale has done it out pure hate that stems from Groves beating him as an amatuer and meaning Degale lost his slot as top dog in gym, so straight away you have a very weak minded person there. The corner did not have a plan b to counter Groves change in tactics so you have to ask yourself is the current coach the right one and i honestly think by end of this year he would of changed trainers. Plus Warren said it himself 'hopefully the back slappers will go now' he saw the defeat as maybe a good thing. I know fans of Degale will be upset but there are problems that need to be faced before moving forward. Groves and Booth are more willing to admit the weak points and work on them. Thats whats needed with Degale because as you saw on Sat he will not always have opponenets who will fight in straight lines especially so top americans.

I saw DeGale lose a razor thin decision that could have gone either way. Had he got the decision Im not sure the outcry would be the same.
You would think he had been comprehensively schooled judging by some reactions.

I tend to think if DeGale did anything wrong it was probably due to overconfidence, He looked the better in the second half of the fight to me and while he never truly got to grips with Groves, the same was true for Groves.

I think part of the problem is that DeGale was expected to win this rather easily judging by many and that probably wasnt realistic expectations. I dont think a close fight was all that surprising.

I dont see much difference between Hayes treatment of the Klitschkos and DeGales treatment of Groves. Haye has gone on record saying he dislikes Wlad and has pretty much been slandering the guy for 3 years now. Whats his lofty justification for that? He wont even shake the guys hand.

I think its too early to dismiss DeGale as mentally weak. He did win an Olympic Gold after losing to Groves so not sure how you can dismiss him on that basis. The fight might serve as a wake up call that he needs to approach fights with a more focused attitude. I dont like the guy but I think hes perfectly entitled to call for a rematch and I think people are kidding themselves if they think Groves is a cert to win it.

How can you not say Degale has a few issues when his reason for hating Groves is based on Groves beating him in ABAs and he felt his team mate had over shadowed him as club top dog. I say he has a massive problem with his ego. Lets hope you do not meet him a spill any milk on him or he may start hating you. Look a rematch is 50/50 however if Degale wins great but if he loses i think the damage to his own hyped up mind could ruin him. Plus why should Groves have a rematch anyway. An olympic gold does not mean you go on to world honurs or that your strong minded. Hayes treatment was to get Klitschko out to fight, i eman they have no previous history. Its all game play but Degale is not.I know you may be a fan but face the truth.

callan wrote:How can you not say Degale has a few issues when his reason for hating Groves is based on Groves beating him in ABAs and he felt his team mate had over shadowed him as club top dog. I say he has a massive problem with his ego. Lets hope you do not meet him a spill any milk on him or he may start hating you. Look a rematch is 50/50 however if Degale wins great but if he loses i think the damage to his own hyped up mind could ruin him. Plus why should Groves have a rematch anyway. An olympic gold does not mean you go on to world honurs or that your strong minded. Hayes treatment was to get Klitschko out to fight, i eman they have no previous history. Its all game play but Degale is not.I know you may be a fan but face the truth.

Yes I must be a DeGale fan because I think the fight was close and DeGale might win a rematch! Is this the best you can respond with?

Haye has got his fight his Klitschko. Yet he refuses to offer even the smallest amount of respect, shake his hand or even share a studio with the guy. I fail to see how this is all justified and fine but DeGales is in need of some kind of psychiatric help. As far as I can see, DeGale hates Groves for a reason whereas Haye has no reason to hate Wlad, who did nothing to him.

Unless you are psychiatrist and have examined DeGale personally I dont know how you can know DeGale is mentally weak. He is immature for sure, he is a bit of tool and he has an inflated ego. But mentally weak? Only time will tell. Clearly winning an Olympic Gold after being beaten by Groves in the amateurs shows he can bounce back and the fact he is chasing a rematch indicates he is itching to try and set the record straight.

If Groves wants to move on European level then he can forget about DeGale for the time being. However if he intends to stay at domestic level then I simply cant see how he can justify not giving DeGale a rematch due to the nature of the first fight and the fact that DeGale is easily the most credible and challenging oponent available on the domestic scene. It has all the neccessary ingredients for a rematch unless Groves opts to abandon the domestci scene.

I can see DeGale going for the euro strap and trying to tempt Groves into a rematch in a fight that could be a world belt eiminator.

But Groves is correct in that he has alluded that a rematch could happen if they were both belt holders at world level. I can see that happening after the super 6 ending with the World Champ being stripped of all bar one of his belts.

azania wrote:I can see DeGale going for the euro strap and trying to tempt Groves into a rematch in a fight that could be a world belt eiminator.

But Groves is correct in that he has alluded that a rematch could happen if they were both belt holders at world level. I can see that happening after the super 6 ending with the World Champ being stripped of all bar one of his belts.

If Groves doesnt want to rematch DeGale then I dont think theres much DeGale can do about it.

He shouldnt have any difficulty becoming a mandatory for Groves and I think the BBBC would very likely install him asap given the first fight.

Groves has been matched reasonably tough so far though so I would expect him to go to Euro level within a fight or two and vacate his domestic titles.

I had a look at the rankings earlier with the EBU which hadnt yet been updated. But after this win Groves should be in the top 5 and well placed to challenge soon if he wants to go down that round.

I think there is still too much quality in SMW at world stage at the moment to go there so the Euro title would seem a logical step.

Title fights can be manouvered and manufactured so the house fighter gets an easy ride to the title. I can see Groves fighting some no name eastern euro for the belt and DeGale fighting someone like Glen Johnson (or that ilk) for another strap leaving Dirrell out in the cold.

After a defence or two they will square up for a unification which in all intense and purpose it will be a british title fight.

I really dont see either DeGale or Groves being ready for world level yet. The fight at the weekend was close and competitive but it still looked european level at best with both fighters having plenty of room for improvement.

There isnt really an easy belt up for grabs at world level and wont be for the next year at least. I think it would be mistake for either guy to go to world level now as neither look ready and need to develop further.

manos de piedra wrote:I really dont see either DeGale or Groves being ready for world level yet. The fight at the weekend was close and competitive but it still looked european level at best with both fighters having plenty of room for improvement.

There isnt really an easy belt up for grabs at world level and wont be for the next year at least. I think it would be mistake for either guy to go to world level now as neither look ready and need to develop further.

Neither do I. But in 5-6 fights, they may both be. I'm cynical as I believe the situation will be manipulated to ensure they get a strap. DeGale has the more powerful promoter and Hayemaker appears to be the ones who would go for a legit belt and make GG earn a shot. But after the S6, the belt situation will shortly be fragmented.

azania wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:I really dont see either DeGale or Groves being ready for world level yet. The fight at the weekend was close and competitive but it still looked european level at best with both fighters having plenty of room for improvement.

There isnt really an easy belt up for grabs at world level and wont be for the next year at least. I think it would be mistake for either guy to go to world level now as neither look ready and need to develop further.

Neither do I. But in 5-6 fights, they may both be. I'm cynical as I believe the situation will be manipulated to ensure they get a strap. DeGale has the more powerful promoter and Hayemaker appears to be the ones who would go for a legit belt and make GG earn a shot. But after the S6, the belt situation will shortly be fragmented.

I think its too early to say what the scenario will be in 5/6 fights. Both fighters have lots of developing to do and its hard to predict how the world title picture will look. Its already fragmented as it stands now with 4 seperate world champions, all of whom I would pick as too strong for DeGale or Groves at present.

If I had to bet I would say the chances of both Groves and DeGale holding seperate world titles at the same time is pretty remote. Both have yet to prove they are world class let alone world title material and its too dificult at the moment to say who will be operating in the division at that time.

Poor old frank I can just see him offering Groves a rematch had degale won by the same margin...................

Groves by two points for me..better work.

rowley wrote:Would have a little more sympathy (ok I'm lying) if he had been quite so keen to grant either Thompson a rematch with Nelson or Reid a rematch with Calzaghe. Sometimes you reap what you sow in this life

Darn right!!!

I'm sure there have been countless controversial decisions where Warren fighters didn't give rematches after getting the nod.

One prime example is the old cash cow Ricky Hatton against Collazo.

Also, didn't Ricky have Micky Vann for something absurd such as 5 fights in a row.....

TumblingDice wrote:

rowley wrote:Would have a little more sympathy (ok I'm lying) if he had been quite so keen to grant either Thompson a rematch with Nelson or Reid a rematch with Calzaghe. Sometimes you reap what you sow in this life

Darn right!!!

I'm sure there have been countless controversial decisions where Warren fighters didn't give rematches after getting the nod.

One prime example is the old cash cow Ricky Hatton against Collazo.

Also, didn't Ricky have Micky Vann for something absurd such as 5 fights in a row.....

I dont think he was with Hatton for the Callazo fight. Could be wrong though.

2-0 to Hayemaker though. Love it.

Yeah, hopefully this can be a Hayemaker summer with another big win shortly!!

Might raise this in a new thread but how do you think Frank is handling Saunders and Gavin, they seem to have been left a little with all the focus on Spoon Face.

TumblingDice wrote:Yeah, hopefully this can be a Hayemaker summer with another big win shortly!!

Might raise this in a new thread but how do you think Frank is handling Saunders and Gavin, they seem to have been left a little with all the focus on Spoon Face.

I think so far Fwank has done well by Gavin and Saunders both have had injuries will be interesting to see how he gos with them from here Saunders looked excellent at the weekend. I thought Gavin looked a bit off but Mutley offered nothing and killed the fight.