RWC - your squad of 30

Following on from a couple of conversations on here over the last day or 2, who would people put in their country's World Cup Squad (or who do you expect to be ). Obviously the French squad (barring injury) is already almost locked in.

This is a weekly article running in NZ charting form/fitness and likely impact on the RWC - has been an interesting read over the last few weeks.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/5047963/All-Blacks-Barometer-Whos-in-the-30#comments At the moment I'm struggling to disagree with it too much.

Here's my NZ pick (note, based on a 30-man squad, 2 players in each position EXCEPT - 3 hookers and 3 half-backs, with 1 wing/full back and 1 loose forward dropping off to even the numbers up)

Props:
Loosehead - Woodcock, B Franks/Crockett (Franks covers both sides so useful on the 'A' side bench)
Tighthead - O Franks, Afoa

Hooker:
Mealamu, Hore, Flynn

Locks:
Thorn, Whitelock, Boric, Williams/Hoeata (Ali is apparently hitting good form, though I haven't managed to see him play, Hoeata can play 6, helping team balance)

Loose Forwards
Kaino, McCaw, Read, Thompson, Messam/Todd (I would try playing Messam/Todd (one off the bench) in some Tri nations games to rest McCaw)

Halves:
Cowan, Weepu, Ellis, Carter, Slade (fingers crossed he makes it back - McAllister at 10 doesn't convince me, while Cruden's been hampered by the Horrorcanes' poor season. As for Brett and Donald ...)

Midfield:
SBW, Nonu, Smith, Kahui (Fruean's faded, while Ranger's form has seen him lose his Blues start)

Outside backs:
Muliaina, Toeava, Gear, plus 2 of Dagg (if fit), Sivivatu, Jane, Guildford

Backs:

Fussell, Stoddart, Brew, North, Davies, Bishop, Williams, Williams, Hughes, Jones, Biggar, Peel, Rees, Hook.

Forwards:

Thomas, James, Hibbard, Burns, Rees, Jones, Yapp, AWJones (c) Charteris, Reed, Lydiate, Turnbull, Warburton, Tipuric, Faletau, Jones.


(With thanks for the tips to Ldcpete and Kiwi.)

Props:
Loosehead - Court, Healy
Tighthead - Buckley, Ross

Hooker:
Varley, Best, Cronin

Locks:
O'Driscoll, O'Callaghan, O'Connell, Cullen

Loose Forwards
Ryan, Ferris, Jennings, Wallace, Heaslip, O'Brien

Halves:
Stringer, O'Leary, Reddan
O'Gara, Sexton

Midfield:
Wallace, O'Driscoll, Darcy

Outside backs:
Kearney, Bowe, Fitzgerald, Earls, Trimble

Interesting option Stag, 17:13 split between backs and forwards. In NZ's case I'd feel horribly nervous about Toeava as backup to Smith - but maybe that's just superstition about fullbacks* playing centre.

*IMO fullback is Toeava's best position, while he usurped Jane's wing berth due to sheer pace in the AIs.

For us its not that much risk. Earls and Bowe cover 13. I really think that rotating our pack will be vital and a 17-13 split is necessary for Ireland.

Stag,

If you have Ryan in the back row, then I wouldn't have O'Driscoll in the locks.

MBTGOG wrote:Stag,

If you have Ryan in the back row, then I wouldn't have O'Driscoll in the locks.

Who is your extra man then? Do you go for another loosehead like Horan/McAlister? Or does McFadden get a call up? Or Leamy?

I’d have a couple of bolters in the England squad. Player like Joe Gray have played brilliantly this season, but have had little no international experience. My squad looks a little short at no.8, but I suppose that is the reality of the situation.

LH Prop: Andrew Sheridan (Sale), Alex Corbisero (London Irish)

HK: Steve Thompson (Wasps), Dylan Hartley (Northampton), Joe Gray (Harlequins)

TH Prop: Dan Cole (Leicester), Paul Doran-Jones (Northampton)

SR: Tom Palmer (Stade Francais), Courtney Lawes (Northampton), Simon Shaw (Wasps), George Robson (Harlequins)

BS Flanker: James Haskell (Stade Francais), Tom Croft (Leicester)

OP Flanker Tom Wood (Northampton), Hendre Fourie (Leeds)

No: 8: Nick Easter (Harlequins)

SH: Ben Youngs (Leicester), Danny Care (Harlequins), Joe Simpson (Wasps)

FH Toby Flood (Leicester), Jonny Wilkinson (Toulon)

IC: Anthony Allen (Leicester), Jordan Turner-Hall (Harlequins)

OC: Manu Tuilagi (Leicester), George Lowe (Harlequins)

W: Chris Ashton (Northampton), James Simpson-Daniel (Gloucester), Matt Banahan, (Bath)

FB: Ben Foden (Northampton), Delon Armitage (London Irish)


Some of the players I’ve picked can cover other positions too:

Haskell (No.8)
George Lowe (Wing)
Matt Banahan (Centre, allegedly)
Simpson Daniel (Centre)
Delon Armitage (Wing)

I know the centres are horribly inexperienced but I am left wondering what would happen should Tindall and DJ Shape get injured anyway? Flutey could come in but is he the right man? I mean what is worse? An inexperienced player or a man who is terribly out of form?

Not my business, but isn't Goode a better option than the old man?

Depends which Goode and which old man you are talking about?

Andy and Jonny.

Replacing the old man with a player who is the same age and of inferior ability? I like your style.

This will be Wilkinson's last hurrah. He'll never recover the six years he missed through successive injuries, but I'm sure he'll be thinking of them. He will be determined to leave nothing on the pitch when he gets his chance.

Goode took you to the Final in France single handed. Since playing club rugby out there he has developed into the Gareth Rees role Leicester wouldn't let him have. I think both are good options. Flood is good but is he WC final good? You could take Goode and Flood and Jonny as a 12.

Springboks

Loosehead: Beast , Coenie Oosthuizen
Hookers: John Smit, Bismarck du Plessis, Chiliboy
Tightheads: Jannie du Plessis, Werner Kruger
Locks: Andries Bekker, Flip v d Merwe, Bakkies Botha, Victor Matfield
Loose forwards: Schallk Burger, Danie Rossouw, Pierre Spies, Brussouw, Willem Alberts, JUan smith( I am not sure whether he will be ready)
Scrum Halves: Francois Hougaardt, January, Fourie du Preez ( although I think it will be a mistake as he is off form and injured again)
Flyhalves: Morne Steyn, Pat Lambie
Centers: Jaque Fourie, Jean de Villiers, Juan du Jongh, Wynand Olivier.
Wings, Habana, Basson, JP Pietersen, Aplon
Fullback: Frans Steyn, Zane Kirchner.

That is the squad I suspect will go

biltongbek wrote:Springboks

Loosehead: Beast , Coenie Oosthuizen
Hookers: John Smit, Bismarck du Plessis, Chiliboy
Tightheads: Jannie du Plessis, Werner Kruger
Locks: Andries Bekker, Flip v d Merwe, Bakkies Botha, Victor Matfield
Loose forwards: Schallk Burger, Danie Rossouw, Pierre Spies, Brussouw, Willem Alberts, JUan smith( I am not sure whether he will be ready)
Scrum Halves: Francois Hougaardt, January, Fourie du Preez ( although I think it will be a mistake as he is off form and injured again)
Flyhalves: Morne Steyn, Pat Lambie
Centers: Jaque Fourie, Jean de Villiers, Juan du Jongh, Wynand Olivier.
Wings, Habana, Basson, JP Pietersen, Aplon
Fullback: Frans Steyn, Zane Kirchner.

That is the squad I suspect will go

That's 32 names Biltong, you'll have to lose a couple Would they take Smit as combo hooker/prop?

Yea 30 man squad only. It'll probably be at centre or backrow.

Glas a du wrote:Goode took you to the Final in France single handed. Since playing club rugby out there he has developed into the Gareth Rees role Leicester wouldn't let him have. I think both are good options. Flood is good but is he WC final good? You could take Goode and Flood and Jonny as a 12.

Goode got us to the final? No he didn’t, Goode didn’t even make the 2007 World Cup squad.

Goode has only ever been seen as a last resort among England fans resort. Since he has spent a large chunk of the season playing in the RFU Championship I can’t see that changing.

Kiwireddevil wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Springboks

That's 32 names Biltong, you'll have to lose a couple Would they take Smit as combo hooker/prop?

Sorry I should have made it clear.

Fourie du Preez and Juan Smith are additional if they are fit, Sarel Pretorius and one of the Loose Forwards can be replaced.

No worries Biltong, I was just being a pedant

Kiwireddevil wrote:No worries Biltong, I was just being a pedant

No problem, my concern are that a couple of those guys aren't showing much form and PDV doesn't seem to think it is important.

Bringing Hougaard and/or Januarie ahead of Ruan Pienaar would be a serious mistake.

Saffers are very dismissive of the standard of rugby over here, and it's true. It's not as good as Super Rugby. But the gulf isn't as huge as they seem to imagine and Pienaar is a better scrum-half than when he joined us. I'm not taking credit for that, it's just because he's had a run of games there. He's been settled. And he's been exposed to some difficult playing conditions.

He could be fantastic in the RWC if he's backed as first choice. But their loss would be our gain. Can't decide what I'd prefer.

Sheridan, Corbisero, Stevens, Cole, Wilson
Hartley, Thompson, Gray*
Lawes, Shaw, Palmer, Deacon
Moody, Wood, Haskell, Croft, Easter
Care, Youngs, Dickson*
Flood, Wilkinson
Hape, Tindall, Banahan
Ashton, Cueto, Simpson-Daniel
Foden, Goode (That's Alex Goode*, NOT Andy)

An explanation - Any market with an * are what I would class as risks. I would rather have a hooker with international experience but neither Mears or Chuter have been good enough this season. Went with Dickson over Simpson because I'm not convinced by Simpson's defense (and plus I'm a Saints fan so biased anyway) and I think that ALEX Goode is playing really well, offers a kicking option and is playing much better than Delon Armitage. If we want to take a red card risk as the back up Full Back then I would rather Mike Brown than Armitage, at least he's playing well. Other than that would have preferred a specialist open side flanker but Fourie didn't get enough chances to show he was good enough and I don't think Saull is ready just yet.

For me, were it my choice? This is who I would pick; not necessarily who I thin Kidney will pick.

PROPS
Cian Healy, Tom Court, Mike Ross, Tony Buckley
HOOKERS
Rory Best, Sean Cronin, Jerry Flannery*
LOCKS
Paul O'Connell, Donncha O'Callaghan, Donnacha Ryan, Leo Cullen
BACKROW
Stephen Ferris*, Shane Jennings, Sean O'Brien, David Wallace, Jamie Heaslip
SCRUM HALF
Peter Stringer, Eoin Reddan, Isaac Boss
OUT HALF
Johnny Sexton, Ronan O'Gara
CENTRE
Paddy Wallace, Gordon D'Arcy, Brian O'Driscoll, Fergus McFadden
BACK THREE
Keith Earls, Andrew Trimble, Tommy Bowe, Luke Fitzgerald, Rob Kearney*

Taking a bit of a gamble at fullback. Paddy Wallace, Luke Fitzgerald and Keith Earls all played there during the Six Nations however.

*Damien Varley, Denis Leamy and Geordan Murphy on standby in case those three don't make it- although all are expected to be fit by August.

Just sticking my nose into the SA scrum half debate, when on form and fitness Du Preez is the best in the world but I can't believe they wouldn't take Pienaar, the guy is class from what I've seen this season in both the ML and HK and agree with Notch, better than both Hougaard & Januarie.

Then again, can't believe any International team wouldn't at least take Brits in the squad. They already have the best current hooker in Bismarck du Plessis, can you imagine bringing Brits on with 20 to go? I know that Smit is a legend but at best he's solid and there are much better options available, and I'm sure Matfield would do a decent enough job as captain.

B91212 wrote:Just sticking my nose into the SA scrum half debate, when on form and fitness Du Preez is the best in the world but I can't believe they wouldn't take Pienaar, the guy is class from what I've seen this season in both the ML and HK and agree with Notch, better than both Hougaard & Januarie.

Then again, can't believe any International team wouldn't at least take Brits in the squad. They already have the best current hooker in Bismarck du Plessis, can you imagine bringing Brits on with 20 to go? I know that Smit is a legend but at best he's solid and there are much better options available, and I'm sure Matfield would do a decent enough job as captain.

Unfortunately SARU still gets criticised that there is not enough transformation in our rugby, and hence everytime an imprtant event arise, some selections are cntroversial.

Fortunately it is getting to a situation where, even though the best may not always be selected, the second third or fourth best is still at a decent level.

The most controversial at this point in time is Ricky January and Adie Jacobs.

With Tony Buckley injured and John Hayes back in the Munster starting team could Hayes travel. I had ruled it out by November but now I'm starting to wonder.

'With Tony Buckley injured and John Hayes back in the Munster starting team could Hayes travel. I had ruled it out by November but now I'm starting to wonder.'

You are kidding right?

WillyGilly wrote:'With Tony Buckley injured and John Hayes back in the Munster starting team could Hayes travel. I had ruled it out by November but now I'm starting to wonder.'

You are kidding right?

But who else is there to play tighthead who already has international experience?

Willy - who else do we bring? We have used Ross, Court, Buckley and Hayes at tight head this season. We have experiemented. If injury places a role he may well travel.

If Buckley isn't going to travel it's absolutely imperative John Andress is given a chance in a warm-up match.

Is it Fitzpatrick or Andress or Hagan or even Archer thats next in line?

Personally I'd prefer to see Andress or Fitzpatrick in there ahead of him, even though they have no international experience. I'm sorry but I thought Hayes was past it a last year during the 6n even though we had no real replacement. Too old and too slow for the international game and I would worry and him tarnishing that 100 cap reputation of his with one last hurrah at the WC even if it is as injury cover.

On another note you'd have to say Fergus would be extraordinarily unlucky to miss out after his performances of late. Any chance of him starting Saturday?

Willy there is a chance of McFadden playing 12. Darcy is out.

I'm all for bolters but not a snowballs chance in hell I would bring an uncapped tighthead who doesn't even know the players from provincial experience.

Aye just read about D'Arcy. Big chance for Fergus to show his worth.

The All Blacks are in the happy position they could go with a straight 30 man squad.Leaving a wider squad as back up to parachute in therefore.Props-woodcock,Crockett,B.Franks,O .Franks [stand by Macintosh or Afoa]Hookers-Mealamu,Flynn[stand by Hore].Locks- Thorn, Ali Williams, Sam Whitelock ,Jack/Boric/Donnelly any one from 3.Loosies McCaw,Read,Kaino,Thomson,Todd,George Whitelock].Scrum halves-Weepu,Cowan[Ellis stand by].Mid field-Conrad Smith,Nonu,SBW,Kahui,Back Three-Muliana,Dagg,Gear,Cory Jane, Guildford,Toeva /.Ranger /Ben Smith,

It's rather premature to be naming squads for the SH given that the Tri Nations has still to be played - it's almost inevitable that some key players will pick up injuries.

For England, assuming we don't lose anyone through the friendlies:

LH - Sheridan, Corbisiero
Hooker - Hartley, Thompson + 1 (Webber, Paice?)
TH - Cole, Wilson

Locks - Lawes, Palmer, Deacon, Shaw

Back row: Moody, Croft, Easter, Woods, Haskell (Lawes can cover 6 if needed)

SH - Youngs, Care + one of Simpson or Dickson
FH - Flood, Wilkinson

IC - Allen, Hape
OC - Tindall, Bananaman (I'd prefer Tuillagi, but it's probably a bit soon for him, and Banahan can cover 11, 12 and 14 from the bench)

Wingers - Ashton, Cueto, Strettle
FB - Foden, Abendanon

Listed with first XV players. Bench would be - Wilson (covers both sides better than Corbs), Shaw (more 'impact' than Deacon), Woods (seems comfortable in all 3 back row positions and is a better line-out option than Haskell) Care, Wilkinson and Banahan.

My squad was going on the assumption of all named players being available for selection.I expect a watered down 3Ns to protect key players.Seeing it ends a fortnight before RWC kick off.