Group of death, what about Fiji ?

Everybody on here saying that it is two of England, Australia and Wales to go through in the group of death, what about Fiji, I was just looking through their squad, not too shabby, in fact quite frightening, look at some of the players they will have:-

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_52105,00.html

That is quite a strong squad, and they could easily beat any of Wales, England or Australia. If not they will definitely have a say on who will qualify. The group of death just got a little harder.

It's true. I'm glad England have them first up. I think they'll get better throughout the tournament.

They seldom add up to the sum of their parts, otherwise they'd be a major international power

I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

Matawalu
Matavesi
Nalaga
Nadolo
Goneva
Tikoirotuma
Talebula

Not a bad back division, but the pack will be the issue as usual

Looking at their record they actually beat Australia a couple of times back in the 50's

In the modern era they have beaten Italy, Scotland and err - some other country 

England played 8 won 8, but as we all know playing these guys there is always the chance of taking casualties....

I don't think Wales, England or Australia will lose to Fiji, but they certainly won't be able to rest players or rotate as much as they would probably like.

I'd agree with the comment above that it's probably best to have them first up.

Is Timoci Nagusa injured? He usually always turns out for Fiji. Can't believe Bobo still has one more world cup in him! He's been unreal for La Rochelle.

Cant believe Bobo is actually older than me and still plays on the wing at that level!

lostinwales wrote:They seldom add up to the sum of their parts, otherwise they'd be a major international power

Sums it up perfectly.

Might also be an issue about not always getting their full allocation of players on a regular basis to become familiar with each other and a stronger team.

Set piece also lets them down

Don't we always say this though (like Scotland being dark horses for the 6Ns ).

Have Fiji really improved from the last World Cup (the time when supposedly they have their best players together for a period of time) when they were utterly appalling?

The only way they will have an impact on the group is who can beat them by the most. The Aussies, England and Wales should really be putting 30+ on them.

Completely disagree that they 'could easily beat any of Wales, England or Australia'.

Sorry if this seems a bit dismissive, Fiji fans

Cyril wrote:Don't we always say this though (like Scotland being dark horses for the 6Ns ).

Have Fiji really improved from the last World Cup (the time when supposedly they have their best players together for a period of time) when they were utterly appalling?

The only way they will have an impact on the group is who can beat them by the most. The Aussies, England and Wales should really be putting 30+ on them.

Completely disagree that they 'could easily beat any of Wales, England or Australia'.

Sorry if this seems a bit dismissive, Fiji fans

You'll need to be on the British Army's website to talk to them.

Cyril wrote:Have Fiji really improved from the last World Cup

Weren't most of the Fiji players on strike during the last WC ? Or was there something else ? I know most of the big name Fiji players did not go to the last WC due to payments or clubs putting pressure on the players or something.

LordDowlais wrote:

Cyril wrote:Have Fiji really improved from the last World Cup

Weren't most of the Fiji players on strike during the last WC ? Or was there something else ? I know most of the big name Fiji players did not go to the last WC due to payments or clubs putting pressure on the players or something.

looking at their squad for that WC not many names missing with players from allover the world. From memory NZ refused to give visas to any player who was employed by Fijian Armed Forces or Police.

LordDowlais wrote:I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

one decent set of coaches and the disappearance of New Zealand

Are their parts really that good anyway? Timoiratuma, Goneva etc aren't bad players but neither would be anywhere near the England, Wales or Australia teams.

LordDowlais wrote:

Cyril wrote:Have Fiji really improved from the last World Cup

Weren't most of the Fiji players on strike during the last WC ? Or was there something else ? I know most of the big name Fiji players did not go to the last WC due to payments or clubs putting pressure on the players or something.

There have been a number of problems with the Samoan Union and their players, largely due to the Union following the Sepp Blatter guide to corporate governance. Last years Autumn internationals almost didnt happen and there was some talk of them being refused into the last world cup. World rugby also suspended the Fijian unions payments last year because they were about as auditable as Sir Alan Stamfords lunch account, I dont think thats still in place though and was ostly aimed about forcing them nto some kind of vague professionalism of approach ahead of the world cup.

The serving soldier thing is incorrect , it was Nakarawa (or however its spelt) who had problems but he got in after political intervention.

There may have been a couple of players who retired to protect their European contracts but really Fiji are just rubbish.

LordDowlais wrote:I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

[/quote]

So whats Wales excuse?

Gooseberry wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

So whats Wales excuse?[/quote]

The same as England's.

A lot of teams (Wales especially) have a habit of playing into Fijis hands by throwing it around from the word go. You have to play percentage rugby against them for 40+ minutes then look to kick on in 2nd half/last quarter.

Gwlad wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

So whats Wales excuse?

The same as England's.

England have a PE teacher, someones dad, the bloke that invented fruit pastilles and Mike Catt as coaches. Id say thats a valid excuse.

LordDowlais wrote:I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

In both of those cases, the team is being held back by off field corruption and incompetence. Thats why so many great players have withdrawn from tours over the years etc. It's not just rugby stuff that is preventing them from being a real force, its a lot of other things too. The strained relations between players and officials can really undermine the morale of the whole squad.

whocares wrote:Cant believe Bobo is actually older than me and still plays on the wing at that level!

Three cheers for Sireli Bobo!

The Fijian team is superb on paper but lacks 2 real attributes...

A structured and cohesive gameplan, run by a unit who know each other.

And a kicking game to rival the big nations.

They will always be exciting, and a threat for the odd one off, but have they got the capabilities to beat 2 of Wales, Australia or England in their own back yard?

And thats if half of the players are allowed to be available for the world cup, or are strong armed to stay in France and England.

Gooseberry wrote:

Gwlad wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

So whats Wales excuse?

The same as England's.

England have a PE teacher, someones dad, the bloke that invented fruit pastilles and Mike Catt as coaches. Id say thats a valid excuse.

So that's how you get to 2nd place.

The Saint wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:

Gwlad wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

So whats Wales excuse?

The same as England's.

England have a PE teacher, someones dad, the bloke that invented fruit pastilles and Mike Catt as coaches. Id say thats a valid excuse.

So that's how you get to 2nd place.

What did Gordon Gekko say

Mediocrity is good.

Gwlad wrote:

The Saint wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:

Gwlad wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:I would say, they are one decent set of coaches from being a world power. The same with Samoa as well actually.

So whats Wales excuse?

The same as England's.

England have a PE teacher, someones dad, the bloke that invented fruit pastilles and Mike Catt as coaches. Id say thats a valid excuse.

So that's how you get to 2nd place.

What did Gordon Gekko say

Mediocrity is good.

You are so good...

Oh and talking of I think he might be back, and I am not talking about the wannabe posting above

Does seem a bit ghostly

Very, very hard to tell.

Wales will remember both losing to Fiji 38-34 in 2007 and then absolutely hammering them 66-0 in 2011. If you compare the teams in 2011:

Wales Byrne; Halfpenny, Scott Williams, Roberts (J Davies, 64), North; Priestland (S Jones, 58), Phillips (L Williams, 54); Jenkins, Bennett (Burns, 37), Adam Jones (James, 58), B Davies (AW Jones h-t), Charteris, R Jones, Warburton (capt), Faletau (Powell, 54).

Fiji Keresoni; Vulivuli (Goneva, 68), Fatiaki, Lovobalavu (Bai, 55), Tagicakibau; Little, Buatava (Kenatale, 76); Nailago (Somoca, 65), Koto (Veikoso, 60), Somoca (Ma'afu, 51), Nakawara, Lewaravu, Nasiga (Ravulo, 61), Matadigo (Qera, 61), Talei (capt).

I would say that the Wales team will be about the same level but that the current Fijian side will be stronger if they can avoid injuries. Their problem has always been poor coaching and poor organisation but more and more of their squad are involved in good pro set ups now and if the game breaks down, any international side outside the top 5 will be in trouble. Just to assess the quality, a sample side could be:

01 Yanuyanutawa (Glasgow Warriors)
02 Ledua (Northland)
03 Koroi (Hurricanes)
04 Nakarawa (Glasgow Warriors)
05 Cavubati (Ospreys)
06 Qera (Montpellier)
07 Yato (Clermont)
08 Matadigo (Lyon)

09 Matawalu (Glasgow Warriors)
10 Ralulu (Farul Constanța - Romania)
11 Goneva (Leicester Tigers)
12 Nadolo (Crusaders)
13 Matavesi (Ospreys) / Tikoirotuma (Harlequins)
14 Nalaga (Clermont)
15 Talebula (Bordeaux Bègles)

Not too shabby. They'll really miss Nicky Little, though.

George Carlin wrote:Very, very hard to tell.

Wales will remember both losing to Fiji 38-34 in 2007 and then absolutely hammering them 66-0 in 2011. If you compare the teams in 2011

Wales lost in 2007 because they decided to play Barbarian rugby. while this meant they scored more tries than Fiji they made far too many mistakes, were far too loose and played right into Fiji's hands. Despite not scoring Seru Rabeni had a barnstorming day in attack and defence. If Wales had played a more structured game they would probably have won that game easily.

As I mentioned, don't play Fiji at their own game.

it would be great if Yato gets to play for Fidji. at only 22 he's already making an impact at ASM but the problem he's that he's potentially already french qualified (as am not sure he has a cap for fidji ) having been there for 3 years now (through the Nadroga academy connection like Nakaitaci before him). If the IRB helps fidjian players to spend 3 month together before the RWC with real games and training struture then am sure those players could do wonders.

Wasn't there a bit of media presence about the lack of strength form the Fijian squad in 2011 though?
Weren't they missing 7/8 players?
Maybe I have it wrong, but Fiji need every one of their players availabe throughout the summer, and throughout the entirity of the RWC if they want to challenge, is that realistic?

No Samu Manoa has signed for Toulon is he avalable for the USA?

The Saint wrote:

to be honest lads, I have not seen fanster say anything untoward so far, it's early days I know and we are yet to see how he pans out, but there is an issue with dwindling numbers on the rugby board as it is, why would you want to push people away ?

I don't understand, what have I done?

LordDowlais wrote:to be honest lads, I have not seen fanster say anything untoward so far, it's early days I know and we are yet to see how he pans out, but there is an issue with dwindling numbers on the rugby board as it is, why would you want to push people away ?

I'd say it's a grey area, LD. It's a shame if people give up the ghost but sometimes it's better to call it quits and avoid another world of pain.

Id prefer to stay neutralee too many pantomime villains around already

Fanster wrote:I don't understand, what have I done?

Nothing Fanster, it's just there has been a particular member on this site, that came on here with the sole motivation to wind people up, he has had many a name, Hersh was his most popular one, GreyGhost was another, and then he was another world of pain, to be fair, you do not sound like him to me, and just because you are new, people are being a little paranoid, just stick in here and prove people wrong, do not let them drive you away.

Hersh was not the same guy 

Ok, I had read a few threads before posting and noticed a slightly hostile atmsphere here, but just assumed it was all a bit of a joke between friends.

You won't see anything negative or intended to wind people up from me, i'm generally pretty positive by nature.

Thanks for the heads up.

Fanster wrote:Ok, I had read a few threads before posting and noticed a slightly hostile atmsphere here, but just assumed it was all a bit of a joke between friends.

You won't see anything negative or intended to wind people up from me, i'm generally pretty positive by nature.

Thanks for the heads up.

Why don't you tell us a bit about yourself Fanster ? Who's your rugby team ? What is your nationality ? At least then we will now how to engage you in conversations.

I'm Welsh, born and brought up there but lived in London growing up and moved around quite a bit as an adult (I'm 33).

I'm a bit of a nomad and don't have a Welsh region, or an English premiership club to support, but if my back was against the wall I would probably say London Welsh would be my team, and yes it is a bit embarrassing to admit.

I would support the Welsh national team, but to be honest after a not so stellar playing career I have found refereeing the next best thing, so have a pretty unbiased nature.

I won't spoil the thread with a huge essay but hopefully this will help dispell some fears surrounding me, I am recently unemployed and have a bit too much time on my hands now the seasons over, there is only so much gardening and DIY one can do before boredom sets in.

Very creative

Wow red pen, that look so official!

Sorry, wasn't trying to cause a fuss guys.

As George says - welcome to the boards

Fanster wrote:Wow red pen, that look so official!

Sorry, wasn't trying to cause a fuss guys.

You've not, and I hope some of the conspiracy theorists are suitably embarrassed and go out their way to make you welcome!