World rugby to monitor Ireland and France player discipline

marty2086 wrote:you think Hartley falls into that bracket?

LordDowlais wrote:

marty2086 wrote:you think Hartley falls into that bracket?

does a shark shoite in the sea ?

marty2086 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

marty2086 wrote:you think Hartley falls into that bracket?

does a shark shoite in the sea ?

So your saying Hartley has a good disciplinary record?

Munchkin wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

thebandwagonsociety wrote:In the Pro12 this season, the four Irish provinces account for 67% of the proven citings on the fair play table.  The Pro12 also as a league consisting of 4 separate Unions would make it trickier to enforce preferential treatment due to the nature of it's set-up.  Any league where discipline is enforced solely by its own Union..........

Ah but you could also say that only one of those provinces is responsible for 44.44% of the Pro12's upheld citings, so that really skews the figures somewhat.

But then on points we represent only 13.3%, with Scarlets on 9.04%.

Not that it makes great reading for us anyway. Our discipline has been very poor this season.

marty2086 wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:4 weeks isn't the minimum for striking with the head.  It's the Low entry level (which often gets confused with the minimum for some reason).  The IRB then recommend that up to 50% can be taken off this so a 'minimum' would be half the LE level, which is 2 weeks.

There's only been one case (that I know of) when more than 50% reduction was applied.  And that was for Haskell for striking with the head (flying into a ruck headfirst), which was reduced from 4 weeks to 1 week (75%).  In this case the additional mitigating circumstances were that a teammate of Haskell's was being held down in a ruck and being repeatedly punched.  Haskell tried to bring it to the refs attention be he was ignored so he charged in to clear him out.

Also, it wasn't a head butt (unless you clash touching someone with a fist a punch, i.e. pressing it against someone and pushing).

Finally, where do the PRO12 publish their discipline reports?

That's recommended whens theres been no previous bad conduct, you think Hartley falls into that bracket?

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

thebandwagonsociety wrote:In the Pro12 this season, the four Irish provinces account for 67% of the proven citings on the fair play table.  The Pro12 also as a league consisting of 4 separate Unions would make it trickier to enforce preferential treatment due to the nature of it's set-up.  Any league where discipline is enforced solely by its own Union..........

Ah but you could also say that only one of those provinces is responsible for 44.44% of the Pro12's upheld citings, so that really skews the figures somewhat.

But then on points we represent only 13.3%, with Scarlets on 9.04%.

Not that it makes great reading for us anyway. Our discipline has been very poor this season.

Your right there.  Not sure what the Scarlets discipline has to do with anything, but hopefully you feel better for mentioning them fair enough (guessing it was some sort of retaliation/bite?).  The point I was getting at was that the Pro12 Fair Play League, going by individual nations, is not exactly a decent reflection of each nation as Ulster's upheld citings do skew the figures.

I addition in order to really get a decent impression of if the citing system is working, you would need to weigh it up with how many yellow cards there have been, how many reds, how many citings in total, and how many up citings have lead to bans and/or posthumous cards.  Oh and in addition to that, how long the bans are in comparison to similar offenses in other leagues.

This season in the Pro12 there have been -:
413 yellow cards
10 red cards
9 upheld citings

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

This season in the Pro12 there have been -:
413 yellow cards
10 red cards
9 upheld citings

Munchkin wrote:

Because you're a Scarlets fan, and because I thought comparisons were relevant. No need to be so

SecretFly wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

Because you're a Scarlets fan, and because I thought comparisons were relevant. No need to be so

Cop on.  This thread is only about Irish and French indiscipline.

SecretFly wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

This season in the Pro12 there have been -:
413 yellow cards
10 red cards
9 upheld citings

Where are you getting that number from?

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

This season in the Pro12 there have been -:
413 yellow cards
10 red cards
9 upheld citings

Where are you getting that number from?

From having a numeric version of dyslexia   Was meant to type 143 (which is 10 out apparently).


Munchkin, ah fair enough.  Just seemed an odd one to bring up

HammerofThunor wrote:"England didn't drop Owen Farrell even after he wasn't yellow-carded for a high tackle on another player."

That's a rather strange statement.  It reads as though players are almost always red carded/banned for high tackles.

HammerofThunor wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:4 weeks isn't the minimum for striking with the head.  It's the Low entry level (which often gets confused with the minimum for some reason).  The IRB then recommend that up to 50% can be taken off this so a 'minimum' would be half the LE level, which is 2 weeks.

There's only been one case (that I know of) when more than 50% reduction was applied.  And that was for Haskell for striking with the head (flying into a ruck headfirst), which was reduced from 4 weeks to 1 week (75%).  In this case the additional mitigating circumstances were that a teammate of Haskell's was being held down in a ruck and being repeatedly punched.  Haskell tried to bring it to the refs attention be he was ignored so he charged in to clear him out.

Also, it wasn't a head butt (unless you clash touching someone with a fist a punch, i.e. pressing it against someone and pushing).

Finally, where do the PRO12 publish their discipline reports?

That's recommended whens theres been no previous bad conduct, you think Hartley falls into that bracket?

No. That's why he didn't get a 2 week ban

SecretFly wrote:Could we all agree that next season - if we're here - we'll find other things to talk about besides refs, citings and TMO decisions?  They'll still be there obviously...but we sure did knock the stuffing out of these topics this season....there really is not an awful lot left to be said that hasn't been repeated tenfold already.