How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
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Scottrf
Hands Of Stone
Rowley
mikeymax71
TRUSSMAN66
TopHat24/7
Lance
milkyboy
Mayweathers cellmate
catchweight
RanjitPatel
Hammersmith harrier
Strongback
Pound-for-Pound
sab275
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How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
The guy lasted against Wilder, certainly a step up and for me an interesting match up.
sab275- Posts : 23
Join date : 2015-05-18
Age : 42
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
More of a leap than a step. I reckon they should go with someone like Takam who easily beat Tony Thompson and gave Povetkin a very good fight. He poses a real challenge, we can compare Joshua's performance to Povetkin's and he should give rounds.
The problem is that Hearn is more interested in putting Joshua in with fighters who have name recognition rather than the ability to provide a stern test. Meaning his next opponent will probably be Thompson, and Hearn will talk about his victories over Price as if the losses afterwards never happened.
The problem is that Hearn is more interested in putting Joshua in with fighters who have name recognition rather than the ability to provide a stern test. Meaning his next opponent will probably be Thompson, and Hearn will talk about his victories over Price as if the losses afterwards never happened.
Pound-for-Pound- Posts : 340
Join date : 2011-04-08
Location : Yorkshire
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
I would like to see Stiverne v Joshua. It would burst the hype bubble nicely.
Strongback- Posts : 6529
Join date : 2011-07-01
Location : Matchroom Sports Head Office
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Unless he comfortably won of course which is more than possible considering Wilder beat him.
Hammersmith harrier- Posts : 12060
Join date : 2013-09-26
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Too big a jump from Johnson to Stiverne. He's looked good beating blokes who don't fancy a fight. Putting him in with a bloke who held a world title a fight ago would just be daft of Hearn and he doesn't do daft.
He said himself on Talksport that he's 12-18 months away from being ready to fight Tyson Fury so any decent fights are a long way off.
He said himself on Talksport that he's 12-18 months away from being ready to fight Tyson Fury so any decent fights are a long way off.
RanjitPatel- Posts : 692
Join date : 2013-02-26
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
It would be good if they took Joshua along the traditional routes of collecting the British, Commonwealth and European titles as that provides the kind of good fights that a fighter needs to progress (Lennox Lewis followed this route). He could be facing Price, Browne, Chisora who I would expect him to beat but arent guys just going to show up to roll over and are genuinely interesting fights.
catchweight- Posts : 4339
Join date : 2013-09-18
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Rumour has it Joshua's fighting Dillian Whyte next. Maybe a tilt at the British title towards the end of the year. He won't be facing anyone dangerous for a year or two.
Mayweathers cellmate- Posts : 685
Join date : 2012-05-01
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Dillian Whyte at this stage is the definition of a dangerous fight and would be for the British title I think which is currently vacant.
Hammersmith harrier- Posts : 12060
Join date : 2013-09-26
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
There's a bit of bad blood between them, and the amateur defeat and knock down gives it an edge. Whyte's been calling him out, and whilst I'm not sure he's a world beater he will come to fight... Which makes it a step up. Think he's getting over a hand injury so hasn't fought for a few months.
milkyboy- Posts : 7762
Join date : 2011-05-22
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Yes sorry. Joshua will probably have another tune up fight before facing Whyte for the British title which no doubt is the 'big' fight Eddie has been suggesting. Whyte is a decent opponent for Joshua at this stage, but he's no Bermane Stiverne. It's going to be another couple years before Joshua faces a decent ranked contender.
Mayweathers cellmate- Posts : 685
Join date : 2012-05-01
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Stiverne would win comfortably. Joshua is nowhere near ready for this, and it would be unfair to expect him to be. Not sure Joshua will have to face such tough fights before title shots anyway.
Who has Fury beaten to be mandatory? Chisora twice and Johnson. Its amusing really
Who has Fury beaten to be mandatory? Chisora twice and Johnson. Its amusing really
Lance- Posts : 1712
Join date : 2011-10-29
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
It wasn't Fury's fault Haye bottled it though, and Chisora was a high ranked contender when he fought him. Hearn will no doubt choose the path of least resistance to a title for Joshua, but you'd think there'd be at least one tough opponent along the way.
Mayweathers cellmate- Posts : 685
Join date : 2012-05-01
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Lance wrote: Stiverne would win comfortably. Joshua is nowhere near ready for this, and it would be unfair to expect him to be. Not sure Joshua will have to face such tough fights before title shots anyway.
Who has Fury beaten to be mandatory? Chisora twice and Johnson. Its amusing really
Who knows whether the hydration issues for stiverne were a one off and what he will have left in the locker going forward. He clearly has some whiskers... But I wouldn't be confident in such a prediction. Too early for him? Yes. But we don't know how good joshua is and until he fights someone who fights back we won't know. He might be good enough now.
milkyboy- Posts : 7762
Join date : 2011-05-22
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
When you consider Stiverne has issues due to the fact he had to shift a load of weight before the Wilder match, it suggests he's not the most dedicated of fighters if he's ballooning up badly after winning the title and against a hard-hitting, spiteful piece of work like Joshua, there's every possibility any cutting of corners will be highlighted in a very painful manner.
Yes Joshua still has plenty of flaws, he didn't seem willing or able to work Johnson's body when he was on the ropes but he immediately highlighted that failing in subsequent interviews so he knows where he went wrong. He's improving at a very decent rate, building his confidence without getting ahead of himself but the lack of decent tests is something Eddie needs to think about. Does he build Joshua's CV with another half dozen meaning highlight reel KO's and test the public's patience to the limit or move the lad up in class and run the risk of the next big thing looking less than stellar?
Yes Joshua still has plenty of flaws, he didn't seem willing or able to work Johnson's body when he was on the ropes but he immediately highlighted that failing in subsequent interviews so he knows where he went wrong. He's improving at a very decent rate, building his confidence without getting ahead of himself but the lack of decent tests is something Eddie needs to think about. Does he build Joshua's CV with another half dozen meaning highlight reel KO's and test the public's patience to the limit or move the lad up in class and run the risk of the next big thing looking less than stellar?
Guest- Guest
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
RanjitPatel wrote:
He said himself on Talksport that he's 12-18 months away from being ready to fight Tyson Fury so any decent fights are a long way off.
Which is a frankly embarassing statement.
TopHat24/7- Posts : 17008
Join date : 2011-07-01
Age : 40
Location : London
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Getting almost bored of Joshua now, almost coming round to Trussy's way of thinking that he just needs to risk that '0' and really challenge himself.
Stiv is a great shout, but maybe in 6-9 months/3 fights time. Really want to see that Whyte fight. Would like that and either Price or TT and maybe Wach then Stiv.
C'mon AJ, sh!t or get off the pot....
Stiv is a great shout, but maybe in 6-9 months/3 fights time. Really want to see that Whyte fight. Would like that and either Price or TT and maybe Wach then Stiv.
C'mon AJ, sh!t or get off the pot....
TopHat24/7- Posts : 17008
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Stifferne ...............lasts six minutes....
Just going to have to put up with two round blowouts until they see fit to give him a shot at the title...
He's a better man's Bruno and we all saw Bruno outbox Lewis until he got knackered !!
So what chance have these chumps got !!
Just going to have to put up with two round blowouts until they see fit to give him a shot at the title...
He's a better man's Bruno and we all saw Bruno outbox Lewis until he got knackered !!
So what chance have these chumps got !!
TRUSSMAN66- Posts : 40690
Join date : 2011-02-02
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
If Wilder couldn't knock out a depleted Stiverne in 12 rounds I don't see how Joshua can do it.
The Joshua hype around here has gone supersonic,
The Joshua hype around here has gone supersonic,
Strongback- Posts : 6529
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Joshua is about three stone heavier....Punches straight and makes fighters crap their pants..
TRUSSMAN66- Posts : 40690
Join date : 2011-02-02
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
AJ is a good prospect but going from cannon fodder to a very recent former world champion is a massive step up. As already been stated by going the old fashion route of British, Commonwealth and European will provide plenty of decent learning fights until a real big test. Price, Chisora (don't know much about or seen Whyte fight) domestically, Brown (Commonwealth), as well as a solid contingent on the European scene needs to be next up. 12-18 months should see him clean up those said titles and looking to challenge the the flag bearers of the division.
mikeymax71- Posts : 235
Join date : 2011-02-21
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
TopHat24/7 wrote:RanjitPatel wrote:
He said himself on Talksport that he's 12-18 months away from being ready to fight Tyson Fury so any decent fights are a long way off.
Which is a frankly embarassing statement.
The shock that a novice Heavyweight doesn't expect to be fighting at world level within 20 fights, it's almost as if he's going against the grain with his development when in fact he's going down the tried and tested route since time immemorial.
Hammersmith harrier- Posts : 12060
Join date : 2013-09-26
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Stiverne is pretty average. I would fancy Joshua to beat him.
Joshua is being undermatched so far. Absolutely no risks whatsoever taken so far. Seriously, put him in with someone who will at least attempt to fight back.
Joshua is being undermatched so far. Absolutely no risks whatsoever taken so far. Seriously, put him in with someone who will at least attempt to fight back.
catchweight- Posts : 4339
Join date : 2013-09-18
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
There was an interview with Joshua over the weekend on Sky, not sure if this contradicts the talksport one greatly but he says he thinks he would beat Fury now and would love the fight, but knows 12 or 18 months from now he would really do a number on him.
I think some of the criticism of Joshua is bordering on the OTT now. How old is he, 24? If he takes another 18 months to get to world level does it really matter? He is a heavyweight, if he wins the world title at 27 he still has a good 8 years left in him.
Think people also need to be realistic about the state of the division. The division is still pretty poor, what this means is two things, one there are not a glut of solid, competently skilled gate keeper types out there who will guarantee Joshua rounds or difficult questions. The second thing this means is the contenders out there know you're never more than two decent wins away from becoming mandatory for one of the titles. Joshua has a big look of all risk no reward for many of the divisions fighters.
That is not to say he can't step it up and obviously needs to be doing so fairly soon, but I genuinely get the impression with fans sometimes we want to be the first to label guys hype jobs and then desperately want to see our prophecy fulfilled. Joshua has time on his side, if we're still having the same conversations in a year (a full three years after he turned pro I might add) you may all have a point, until them calm down and give the kid a break.
I think some of the criticism of Joshua is bordering on the OTT now. How old is he, 24? If he takes another 18 months to get to world level does it really matter? He is a heavyweight, if he wins the world title at 27 he still has a good 8 years left in him.
Think people also need to be realistic about the state of the division. The division is still pretty poor, what this means is two things, one there are not a glut of solid, competently skilled gate keeper types out there who will guarantee Joshua rounds or difficult questions. The second thing this means is the contenders out there know you're never more than two decent wins away from becoming mandatory for one of the titles. Joshua has a big look of all risk no reward for many of the divisions fighters.
That is not to say he can't step it up and obviously needs to be doing so fairly soon, but I genuinely get the impression with fans sometimes we want to be the first to label guys hype jobs and then desperately want to see our prophecy fulfilled. Joshua has time on his side, if we're still having the same conversations in a year (a full three years after he turned pro I might add) you may all have a point, until them calm down and give the kid a break.
Rowley- Admin
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Price shoudve fought a fighter like stiverne after he knocked out Skelton, wouldve knocked him out in 2 rounds right...........No? Whys that, hed beaten the crap outta everyone so far......so surely he was world class right
Joshua needs to develop level by level, Whyte is a smart move as are the Tony Thompsons of this world, he keeps blasting them out then he keeps upping the level of comp, but you dont jump straight ti fighters like sticerne who have power skill and a granite chin. This is heavyweight, any fight carries a KO risk
Joshua needs to develop level by level, Whyte is a smart move as are the Tony Thompsons of this world, he keeps blasting them out then he keeps upping the level of comp, but you dont jump straight ti fighters like sticerne who have power skill and a granite chin. This is heavyweight, any fight carries a KO risk
Hands Of Stone- Posts : 158
Join date : 2015-05-09
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Rowley bugger off back to the Culture threads, you're sensible and reasonable posts aren't wanted here.
The division is so crap that unless you're fighting Wlad or Povetkin then it doesn't mean a great deal unless you lose. Joshua could well be good enough to do a number on Stiverne or Wilder in his next fight but it would be sheer stupidity from his team to chuck him against them without first slowly building him up. Whyte isn't great by any means from what i've seen but it at least would have some spite to it, they don't like each other and is the perfect fight for a 13-0 novice with very few amateur fights.
Whyte, Price and Chisora seems a reasonable path to take to me then onto somebody like Takam or Wach then move onto the likes of Stiverne or Wilder, it won't be overly exciting but it's a necessary and safe path to take.
The division is so crap that unless you're fighting Wlad or Povetkin then it doesn't mean a great deal unless you lose. Joshua could well be good enough to do a number on Stiverne or Wilder in his next fight but it would be sheer stupidity from his team to chuck him against them without first slowly building him up. Whyte isn't great by any means from what i've seen but it at least would have some spite to it, they don't like each other and is the perfect fight for a 13-0 novice with very few amateur fights.
Whyte, Price and Chisora seems a reasonable path to take to me then onto somebody like Takam or Wach then move onto the likes of Stiverne or Wilder, it won't be overly exciting but it's a necessary and safe path to take.
Hammersmith harrier- Posts : 12060
Join date : 2013-09-26
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Price is too good for Joshua to be using him as a learning fight. Too dangerous and hits too hard for it to be worth taking the chance on.
Not saying he would, but Price could beat Joshua at this stage. Why take the chance?
Not saying he would, but Price could beat Joshua at this stage. Why take the chance?
RanjitPatel- Posts : 692
Join date : 2013-02-26
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Its not that the journeymen are not around, its that they now pass for world class contenders because the division is poor.
Stiverne would be the quintessential journeyman in many of the past era's. He is 36 and not actually done a whole lot. His claim to fame is holding a title by virtue of beating another journeymen-esque level heavyweight like Chris Arreola. Of course when you earmark fighters like this as being outrageously risky then actual journeymen of the era (Sprott, Johnson etc) that can test Joshua are going to be non existant.
Nothing wrong with fans wanting a bit more from a boxer with obvious potential, a gold medal and the grandstand build up like Joshua. No reason he couldnt be contesting Domestic or European titles at this stage.
Stiverne would be the quintessential journeyman in many of the past era's. He is 36 and not actually done a whole lot. His claim to fame is holding a title by virtue of beating another journeymen-esque level heavyweight like Chris Arreola. Of course when you earmark fighters like this as being outrageously risky then actual journeymen of the era (Sprott, Johnson etc) that can test Joshua are going to be non existant.
Nothing wrong with fans wanting a bit more from a boxer with obvious potential, a gold medal and the grandstand build up like Joshua. No reason he couldnt be contesting Domestic or European titles at this stage.
catchweight- Posts : 4339
Join date : 2013-09-18
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Who has the most powerful straight right: Price or Wlad. When Price connects opponents go down and they stay down for a long time.
Price showed how important confidence is, does Joshua have any demons?
Price showed how important confidence is, does Joshua have any demons?
Strongback- Posts : 6529
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
I think I'm 12-18 months from being able to beat Fury.
How is Joshua not ready?
How is Joshua not ready?
Scottrf- Posts : 14359
Join date : 2011-01-26
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
When that bell rings he'll be 12-18 minutes from beating Fury
Guest- Guest
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Think that's being unfair on Joshua that Dave.
I'd say 6 minutes at best
I'd say 6 minutes at best
mobilemaster8- Posts : 4302
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Hammersmith harrier wrote:TopHat24/7 wrote:RanjitPatel wrote:
He said himself on Talksport that he's 12-18 months away from being ready to fight Tyson Fury so any decent fights are a long way off.
Which is a frankly embarassing statement.
The shock that a novice Heavyweight doesn't expect to be fighting at world level within 20 fights, it's almost as if he's going against the grain with his development when in fact he's going down the tried and tested route since time immemorial.
My point is Tyson Fury should not be considered 'world level' by any normal definition or yardstick.
He's vulnerable and not someone AJ should be suggesting he needs another 5 to 8 fights before he's ready for.
TopHat24/7- Posts : 17008
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Hearn did an interview where he mentioned Ustinov for Joshua in September then Whyte in November
wheelchair1991- Posts : 2129
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
wheelchair1991 wrote:Hearn did an interview where he mentioned Ustinov for Joshua in September then Whyte in November
Most probably, it will be a Monte Barrett type fighter. I've seen Joshua fight live and I think he might be the real deal. So I don't think there's any point in holding him back much longer. Get him into the mix.
Sam_London- Posts : 83
Join date : 2013-02-27
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
wheelchair1991 wrote:Hearn did an interview where he mentioned Ustinov for Joshua in September then Whyte in November
Would be happy with that.
TopHat24/7- Posts : 17008
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
All for learning fights.....Just a shame there is no one to teach him anything...
Stalling for stalling sake..
Stalling for stalling sake..
TRUSSMAN66- Posts : 40690
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
wheelchair1991 wrote:Hearn did an interview where he mentioned Ustinov for Joshua in September then Whyte in November
Peter Ustinov in September
Barry white in November
milkyboy- Posts : 7762
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Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Ustinov beat David Tua for the WBA pan African Heavyweight title. Work that one out.
Mayweathers cellmate- Posts : 685
Join date : 2012-05-01
Re: How about Stiverne for Joshua next?
Price is fighting for the European title in his next fight. So, according to AJ's fight path, should Price win, they'll be meeting in the not too distant future.
Dipper Brown- Posts : 1315
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