Federer at current form not very far off his best and I think the favorite in final.

First topic message reminder :

It is strange that Roger is having a second and even now a third spring in his career at the age 34. In many ways it is unprecedented in tennis but at the same time we are seeing players having their best results in the late 20s and early thirties something that would have been unthinkable on the tour 15 years ago. I mean Mac never won a slam after 84, Borg retired at 25. I feel that Federer is in many ways better than he was even at his peak in 04-07. I think many people will argue with me and call me crazy. But physically modern tennis players are not losing their fitness and athleticism as rapidly as they did in the past. This has to do with how far advanced sports medicine has come. Improved surgeries, medicines, holistic alternative medicine, better nutrition, yoga, pilates, and weight training has allowed athletes in tennis to maintain near peak physical powers at later ages. Especially, if they are as athletically gifted to start with as a player like Federer and have avoided many serious injuries.

In comparison to fed 04-07 I would say that current Federer has a better backhand, is more comfortable in being aggressive on the second serve return. Additionally, Federer of 04-07 was not as tactically astute or varied as current Federer. He was much more comfortable to play from the baseline on opponents service games and use his slice backhand and his movement to work the point. A style that in my mind didn't suit the strong points of his game as much as his all out aggression model of today. Fed was faster and fitter in his peak years and therefore he didn't feel a need to rush and pressure opponents at every single opportunity like he does today. Today Federer I feel is more eager and comfortable at net than he was at his peak as well. Federer of 04-07 wouldn't adjust to opponents wouldn't play out of his comfort zone or try new things, he didn't need to. But years of playing second fiddle to Nadal and to an extent to Djokovic changed Federer's mentality and made him tactically a much more difficult player to play. The use of SABRE or drop shot or quicker strike tennis with more approaches to the net have all played dividends and have made Roger uniquely challenging for today's power baseliners. Another tactical variation he has added post peak, aided by the better more modern racquet is his ability to come over the return and to be aggressive instead of using the chip or block back return of the past. In the past a heavy kick serve to Fed's backhand if you had a good kick almost always assured you a pretty workable chip return that you could run around and get on top of the point with a return. Now he steps in and belts those backhand returns not giving you the opportunity to attack him on the first forehand.

On the serve there is actually a clear improvement in today's Federer than in comparison to peak Federer at no point in 04-07 did he win as high percentage of service games as he is today. So in summary, combining a better harder backhand, with a better serve, more aggression on the return, and better tactical mix has made new Federer if not as equally formidable to his peak; very close to it. Yes he is not as fast or as fit, but those are relatively minor losses to Federer and the way that he plays. He doesn't play many physical matches or points to begin with and doesn't spend much time defending in most matches whether now or in the past. Yes his results aren't as strong and surely there is drop off in certain areas, but I feel that this type of purple patch should no longer surprise us.

I see Fed as 60-40 favorite in tomorrow's final based on his current form and Djokovic's current form. Novak has just not hit the high notes post Wimbeldon and Federer has. In away I think Federer has found away to evolve to where he can still win and be the best with the new tool set of skills, equipment, and tactics at his disposal.

greengoblin wrote:This sounds a lot like you're trying to cover Djokovic's a** . I sure wish Fed had faced 33+ year old's in his slam finals (3 of them now for Novak).

You mean like 35 year old Agassi in 2005 US open final

Been said

He has a reposte.

I think people are being too negative of Roger's chances. I mean he got to the finals of wimby, won at cincy, and is now in the finals of USO in his last three tournaments. Certain factors cut in favor of Roger. 1. fan support 2. condition of the court is pretty quick close to that of cincy 3.Generally, Novak doesn't fare to well in the hot and humid conditions of the east coast in this time of year. 4. Roger is in better form while Novak has looked unconvincing.

I think Roger can win this in either 3, 4, or 5. Novak has been having poor walkabouts on serve and he is playing a bad service game or two in every match. If Roger serves well he could easily run with one break and win the set.

lol at all the big nose fanboys. you nose whats coming.

novak to beet the arrogant swiss in 4. 1st 2 sets tight then easy just like wimby

ZZ... I truly hope by the end I can frame that comment as a sticky for all to see ...

ZZ wrote:lol at all the big nose fanboys. you nose whats coming.

novak to beet the arrogant swiss in 4. 1st 2 sets tight then easy just like wimby

yeah I suppose spade chin will be able to dig himself out another cheap slam.

ZZ wrote:lol at all the big nose fanboys.

Well you know what they say...big nose small di....

Diaphragm.

LuvSports! wrote:Diaphragm.

Nope. Just watching Porridge documentary and in it is one of the writers Dick Le Clement.

Bovril?

Must be pancake day...tossers galore!

Ding Ding! We have a winner

Aw come on lk. We have had massive leg-pulling on here about Murray supposedly making Amelie pregnant and jokes about his mum and about Kim Sears. What's good for the goose and all that.

I know CC

You know when your too frustrated to read through things? Well that was it and I thought why not paint a target on myself

It needs Jahu to turn this into some kind of 60's brothel!

I've known yaazoooo for years now, he has it in him.

If I say his name 5 times in front of a mirror he might appear behind me and violate me!

Three times for Biggie Smalls.

Yazoo? What like "looking from a window above, theres a story of love" Yazoo?

legendkillarV2 wrote:If I say his name 5 times in front of a mirror he might appear behind me and violate me!

Hell hath no fury like a jahu scorned!

but Banbro, Rog lost to Seppi at a slam only this year, that is not a result he would have had at his peak

Anyways everyone enjoy the tennis. I am about to start work.

For me Djokovic is a warm to hot favourite - his record in Bo5 vs Federer since he stepped up in 2011 is very commanding, and he's won them all since 2012.  Like BB says, he has a goto tactic of stretching it out which puts all the pressure on Federer who risks getting mentally frazzled just as quickly as any physical frazzling.

Fed is still great and playing amazing for his age, but the reality remains- he tires quicker and his loss of a small amount of speed is exposed in best of 5 against the very best current player- djoko.

Perfect example- except for when he met Rafa on clay- Fed has never been THIS dependent on perfect conditions. If it's slightly slow, or heavy,he's in trouble.... Fed in his prime never needed those type things to be perfect in order for him to win.

Wow, what can you say about that final. I am happy I was wrong. But if Roger played better on break point he would have won this title. Credit to Novak for coming up with his best stuff on break point. Still an amazing last couple of months of tennis from fed. Wimbeldon final, Cincy win, USO Final.

True he would have won if he played better on break point but then he would also have won the French open in 2006 and.or 2007 and the Australian Open in 2009, and if was stronger on big points he might have taken the match point at 40-30 on serve against Djokovic in 2011 when he hit the tape from a makeable position. So it's no surprise really.

He has always matched or beaten Djokovic and Nadal up to break point.

Yes HB he had the same problem against Nadal at Wimby 2008. Frankly, it is a bit disconcerting that he doesn't convert these BPS in a grandslam final against a big rival. I mean he was like 4 for 24 and that is just really poor.

Well. He played well, Probably a little better than Djokovic overall. But Nole is in the form of his life. Had a miracle year. Probably better than 2011.

* And yes, I don't really like typing that.

It's the efficient ruthless manner he has won in 2015 that makes this season so impressive. Might not be the most eye catching, but it's getting results.

Yes, LK good point. I really don't feel like he has had his best form for long parts of the season. In 2011, if you were going to beat him you had to play at a shockingly high level and keep it up. Hell most of the guys where struggling to get games off of him. This year he hasn't hit those consistent high notes but has still achieved similar results. I honestly think he has a gear to go up in game from this level of play. He really did win this slam without being particularly spectacular in his level of play. He just played the big points well.

To me his 2011 was more spectacular because all the big four members were present and playing at a high level. He had 13070 race points after USO and lost only two matches by then.

This year Nadal is obviously not the same Nadal; Novak has to play many five sets matches at the slams this year compared to only one in 2011 (USO SF vs Fed that year). He has 5 losses so far this year and 12745 race points and won 4 Masters instead of 5 compared to 2011. I think he has spent more time on court this year too.