Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
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Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
He alleged that Stuart Lancaster wasn't even picking the team and that Andy Farrell was.
He attributes this to the picking of Burgess, who he says Farrell Snr saw as a new version of himself. He also attributes it to the picking of Farrell Jnr over George Ford.
He says Mike Catt walked out of the last selection meeting and vowed never to return on account of Andy Farrell picking the team.
He says the whole squad has been unhappy about the steamrollering of Sam Burgess into not just the squad but the starting 15.
He goes as far as to say that Stuart Lancaster does not coach the team but that Andy Farrell does.
He says Sam Burgess should never have been in the squad ahead of Luther Burrell because Burrell earned his place as opposed to Burgess just walking straight in.
He also says that none of the England players knew bonus point were on offer until after the Fiji game.
http://postimg.org/image/5cb3eur7r/
http://postimg.org/image/bnq4sgx1t/
He attributes this to the picking of Burgess, who he says Farrell Snr saw as a new version of himself. He also attributes it to the picking of Farrell Jnr over George Ford.
He says Mike Catt walked out of the last selection meeting and vowed never to return on account of Andy Farrell picking the team.
He says the whole squad has been unhappy about the steamrollering of Sam Burgess into not just the squad but the starting 15.
He goes as far as to say that Stuart Lancaster does not coach the team but that Andy Farrell does.
He says Sam Burgess should never have been in the squad ahead of Luther Burrell because Burrell earned his place as opposed to Burgess just walking straight in.
He also says that none of the England players knew bonus point were on offer until after the Fiji game.
http://postimg.org/image/5cb3eur7r/
http://postimg.org/image/bnq4sgx1t/
Artful_Dodger- Posts : 4260
Join date : 2011-05-31
Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
I find that hard to believe to be honest.
If SL is not coaching the England players. What is he doing?
Is he just a media man?
If SL is not coaching the England players. What is he doing?
Is he just a media man?
majesticimperialman- Posts : 6170
Join date : 2011-02-11
Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
It's been reported (without names) in the Telegraph.
If any of this is true then sh*t is going to get real.
If any of this is true then sh*t is going to get real.
yappysnap- Posts : 11993
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Heaf already posted a link to the forum in another thread. I don't buy it myself.
Rugby Fan- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
If it is true Vunipola does not come out of it looking great either tbf.
Notch- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Makes dwarf-gate seem tame.
Barney McGrew did it- Posts : 1604
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Notch wrote:If it is true Vunipola does not come out of it looking great either tbf.
True, but he's probably as sick as the rest of us are with how England performed. If what he says is true regarding Farrell Snr then it certainly needs to be brought to light, and doing so in a very public manner is the best way to create change.
belovedfrosties- Posts : 358
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Anyone got a link too the article?
Driver- Posts : 11038
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Dwarf-gate was tame. The worst that happened was Tindall getting drunk and chatting up an old girlfriend.Barney McGrew did it wrote:Makes dwarf-gate seem tame.
Rugby Fan- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Heaf gave this link:Driver wrote:Anyone got a link too the article?
http://www.rugbynetwork.net/boards/read/s98.htm?100,15365838
Rugby Fan- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
According to David Campese, Vunipola was there did the Q&A but didn't have a drink. Makes me wonder about the rest of the story. Don't know fact from fiction but you know a lie can get halfway around the world... caution needed.
https://twitter.com/Davidcampese11
https://twitter.com/Davidcampese11
Notch- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
You got to hand it to the Springbok camp, they had much turmoil, split camp, fights, power struggles and everyone remains tight lipped about it.
Biltong- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Biltong wrote:You got to hand it to the Springbok camp, they had much turmoil, split camp, fights, power struggles and everyone remains tight lipped about it.
How do you know then?
Notch- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Notch wrote:According to David Campese, Vunipola was there did the Q&A but didn't have a drink.
According to Alex Goode, Billy doesn't drink, and never has.
https://twitter.com/Alex_goode0/status/650737809557442560
Rugby Fan- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Biltong wrote:You got to hand it to the Springbok camp, they had much turmoil, split camp, fights, power struggles and everyone remains tight lipped about it.
Not really, if this is true then all power to Billy V for having the balls to say something, keeping quiet about things like this is not the way to go.
Hammersmith harrier- Posts : 12060
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Watching the Irish coverage Peter Stringer intimated (actually said) that from the little chats he was having with the English lads that during the six nations George Ford and the Bath lads were given the responsibility of "coaching" the backs as thats the way Lancaster wanted to play. Which makes it more interesting when suddenly you get Owen Farrell picked for the big games with Burgess originally included. Just seems funny that the team went from one way of playing to another...
Now I know Stringer would be in the George Ford camp so to speak but it was interesting none the less.
Now I know Stringer would be in the George Ford camp so to speak but it was interesting none the less.
ME-109- Posts : 5258
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
And picking Burgess over Eastmond as well, not to mention Burrell. From the outside its all over the place.
Notch- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
I'm behind Lancaster to be honest and the more i read the more Farrell seems to be the problem.
Does anyone else remember the tour too Argentina when Faz was with the Lions? We played some blinding rugby and scrummed the Argies off the park.
Does anyone else remember the tour too Argentina when Faz was with the Lions? We played some blinding rugby and scrummed the Argies off the park.
Driver- Posts : 11038
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Notch wrote:And picking Burgess over Eastmond as well, not to mention Burrell. From the outside its all over the place.
The continued selection of Wigglesworth and Barritt seems very centred around Farrell too.
Hammersmith harrier- Posts : 12060
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
It definitely seems as if there were two "philosophies" involved. The main thing is that the team which went from having very good back play suddenly changed tack almost completely....
ME-109- Posts : 5258
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Assuming this is an accurate report - and that is a big 'if' - then Billy needs to learn to keep his yapper shut. But who knows if this is accurate or if someone made it all up and put it on the internet.
Not sure I would ever pour my frustrations out to Dave Campese. Would you?
Not sure I would ever pour my frustrations out to Dave Campese. Would you?
doctor_grey- Posts : 12279
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Rowntree was with the Lions too. Rob Baxter and Paul Gustard joined the coaching set-up for that tour.Driver wrote:I'm behind Lancaster to be honest and the more i read the more Farrell seems to be the problem.
Does anyone else remember the tour to Argentina when Faz was with the Lions? We played some blinding rugby and scrummed the Argies off the park.
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
You mean when Argentina agreed not to call up their France based players so they wouldn't be missing too much (with their addition to the RC)? Effectly it was the Jaguars.
HammerofThunor- Posts : 10471
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Speaking of Billy, don't forget his hat-trick of tries against the mighty Consur XV on that tour
Cyril- Posts : 7162
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Rugby Fan wrote:Rowntree was with the Lions too. Rob Baxter and Paul Gustard joined the coaching set-up for that tour.Driver wrote:I'm behind Lancaster to be honest and the more i read the more Farrell seems to be the problem.
Does anyone else remember the tour to Argentina when Faz was with the Lions? We played some blinding rugby and scrummed the Argies off the park.
It was also a second string Argentina, they're not great on depth. Perhaps not a coincidence though that the pack was extremely well drilled under Baxter, not Rowntree.
Hood83- Posts : 2751
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
I'm pretty sure Lancaster has said that he leaves most of the actual coaching to Faz, Catt and Rowntree, so that's not a surprise. Selection is more of a shock, but it certainly makes sense.
Bathman_in_London- Posts : 2266
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Bathman_in_London wrote:I'm pretty sure Lancaster has said that he leaves most of the actual coaching to Faz, Catt and Rowntree, so that's not a surprise. Selection is more of a shock, but it certainly makes sense.
It makes sense for the Head Coach not to be making selection calls??
Artful_Dodger- Posts : 4260
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Notch wrote:Biltong wrote:You got to hand it to the Springbok camp, they had much turmoil, split camp, fights, power struggles and everyone remains tight lipped about it.
How do you know then?
A mate of mine know Johann van Graan. He has been leaking us some info, but is light on detail.
Biltong- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
So not THAT tight lipped then.
HammerofThunor- Posts : 10471
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Artful_Dodger wrote:Bathman_in_London wrote:I'm pretty sure Lancaster has said that he leaves most of the actual coaching to Faz, Catt and Rowntree, so that's not a surprise. Selection is more of a shock, but it certainly makes sense.
It makes sense for the Head Coach not to be making selection calls??
Sorry, I wasn't clear, I meant the apparent change in direction and the resulting shambles ties in with divisions in the selection process.
Bathman_in_London- Posts : 2266
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Bathman_in_London wrote:Artful_Dodger wrote:Bathman_in_London wrote:I'm pretty sure Lancaster has said that he leaves most of the actual coaching to Faz, Catt and Rowntree, so that's not a surprise. Selection is more of a shock, but it certainly makes sense.
It makes sense for the Head Coach not to be making selection calls??
Sorry, I wasn't clear, I meant the apparent change in direction and the resulting shambles ties in with divisions in the selection process.
My mistake.
Artful_Dodger- Posts : 4260
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
HammerofThunor wrote:So not THAT tight lipped then.
Enough to tell us all is not well, there was a fist fight for example, but no names.
If you consider Bismarck du Plessis was completely dropped in the next match, we can only assume it was him
Biltong- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Surely the pertinent point with the England tour of Argentina isn't that England won, but that they played a more aggressive brand of rugby with a better attacking game. In what was effectively a seconds match up, it was the approach rather than the result that was satisfying.
In terms of Farrell being one to go - absolutely, and I'm not at all surprised at the idea of him selecting the backs. I had assumed that all along - not least due to the continued selection of jnr, and any player that reminded him of himself such as Burgess and even Ashton who did the Wigan then Saracens thing - albeit via Saints (I say Ashton sparingly as I don't necessarily think he was a bad player - just didn't suit the way they were playing. Demonstrated when utilised well, as e.g. at Saints, Saracens post Farrel, and England pre-Farrell).
In terms of Farrell being one to go - absolutely, and I'm not at all surprised at the idea of him selecting the backs. I had assumed that all along - not least due to the continued selection of jnr, and any player that reminded him of himself such as Burgess and even Ashton who did the Wigan then Saracens thing - albeit via Saints (I say Ashton sparingly as I don't necessarily think he was a bad player - just didn't suit the way they were playing. Demonstrated when utilised well, as e.g. at Saints, Saracens post Farrel, and England pre-Farrell).
Big- Posts : 815
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
billy doesn't drink and never has.
https://twitter.com/Alex_goode0/status/650737809557442560
Inferno productions has been spreading the story and then admitted he read it on a message board. To me it sounds like a load of Love sacks.
What is Lancasters role, is it the same as Martin Johnsons as in a "manager" or an actual coach?
https://twitter.com/Alex_goode0/status/650737809557442560
Inferno productions has been spreading the story and then admitted he read it on a message board. To me it sounds like a load of Love sacks.
What is Lancasters role, is it the same as Martin Johnsons as in a "manager" or an actual coach?
nathan- Posts : 11033
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
The Argentina tour means diddly squat in the greater scheme of things. It was a very poor Arg squad that most AP sides would have battered.
This is backed up further by Kvesic and Eastmond looking like they cut the mustard in an England shirt....
This is backed up further by Kvesic and Eastmond looking like they cut the mustard in an England shirt....
Sgt_Pooly- Posts : 36294
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
seen this on another forum ostensibly from Billy
"Billy Vunipola @bvunipola 44s44 seconds ago
Hearing some rumours that I've been saying negative stuff about England. Laughable! Complete rubbish and I don't even drink!"
Yup - its on his twitter https://twitter.com/bvunipola?lang=en-gb
"Billy Vunipola @bvunipola 44s44 seconds ago
Hearing some rumours that I've been saying negative stuff about England. Laughable! Complete rubbish and I don't even drink!"
Yup - its on his twitter https://twitter.com/bvunipola?lang=en-gb
TJ- Posts : 8603
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
This story is now officially dead.
https://twitter.com/MikeBovill/status/650770235562270721
Billy on Twitter
https://twitter.com/bvunipola
Think we have to take all these alleged stories from the England camp with a pinch of salt.
Spoke to David Campese who confirmed @bvunipola said nothing negative about Burgess or coaches in that Q&A. And didn't drink all night
https://twitter.com/MikeBovill/status/650770235562270721
Billy on Twitter
Hearing some rumours that I've been saying negative stuff about England. Laughable! Complete rubbish and I don't even drink!
I would never say anything negative about the boys or staff. We gave everything we had, just wasn't enough and we all take responsibility
Proud to train and play alongside such great lads and we have to look forward now. Thanks for all of your support
https://twitter.com/bvunipola
Think we have to take all these alleged stories from the England camp with a pinch of salt.
Rugby Fan- Moderator
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Pity the eager muppets who believed this obvious twaddle.
People believe what they want to believe. But only the idiots repeat it as the truth...
People believe what they want to believe. But only the idiots repeat it as the truth...
quinsforever- Posts : 6765
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
I would imagine Inferno Productions are feeling a bit silly .
Espee66- Posts : 19
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
For example. Why did the England players go so wild after scoring their 4th try against Fiji if none of them knew about bonus points? The clues were in the story, before the denials from everyone who was actually there...
quinsforever- Posts : 6765
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
As I would hope artful does too...
quinsforever- Posts : 6765
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Not really. The most attention they've probably ever had. After all, that's what life is about. Drawing as much attention to yourself as possible to bask in the glory.
HammerofThunor- Posts : 10471
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
HammerofThunor wrote:Not really. The most attention they've probably ever had. After all, that's what life is about. Drawing as much attention to yourself as possible to bask in the glory.
This is a fair comment. I have found the whole thing highly amusing.... true or not.
Last edited by Artful_Dodger on Sun 04 Oct 2015, 10:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
Artful_Dodger- Posts : 4260
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Yes u would because you're just wunming
quinsforever- Posts : 6765
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
quinsforever wrote:Yes u would because you're just wunming
Not at all, I was merely facilitating some debate on what has been reported on many rugby forums. Which is that there may have been some internal turmoil within the England camp attached to their WC exit.
By the way Quins now that England are out of the competition with a group game to spare, can we now count on your support for the other home nations?
Last edited by Artful_Dodger on Sun 04 Oct 2015, 10:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
Artful_Dodger- Posts : 4260
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Facilitating some debate. Wonderful term for spreading made up cowpat. But then that's the lifeblood for forums like this I suppose. That's why the rugby paper exists.
HammerofThunor- Posts : 10471
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
I'm supporting Australia for the rest of RWC. Great team, great coach, sensible policies. England should have paid particular attention to cheika changing their overseas player rule....if u hope to win world cups as a coach, u leave no stone unturned to have every weapon available.
For Australia's complete dismantling of England, and quality of their play all over the pitch, I want to see them win.
For Australia's complete dismantling of England, and quality of their play all over the pitch, I want to see them win.
quinsforever- Posts : 6765
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
quinsforever wrote:I'm supporting Australia for the rest of RWC. Great team, great coach, sensible policies. England should have paid particular attention to cheika changing their overseas player rule....if u hope to win world cups as a coach, u leave no stone unturned to have every weapon available.
For Australia's complete dismantling of England, and quality of their play all over the pitch, I want to see them win.
I feel the same. Despite the painful reaming I finished up in admiration for the best rugby I have seen this tournament. Never imagined myself writing this kind, of stuff. I feel Aussie are the team, along with AB who will be in the final. Go Aussie.
gregortree- Posts : 3676
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
I can't imagine any of this is actually true.
No 7&1/2- Posts : 31374
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Re: Billy Vunipola's Online Revelations....Stuart Lancaster Not Coaching England
Yeah I agree 7.5
I don't doubt Farrell is a big influence...and maybe does lead the training...but I just cant see him making the selections.
But who knows. Mike Catts actions will be monitored closely
I think the whole lot of them need to go. Bring in management that has direction and none of this PR rubbish we constantly get.
I don't doubt Farrell is a big influence...and maybe does lead the training...but I just cant see him making the selections.
But who knows. Mike Catts actions will be monitored closely
I think the whole lot of them need to go. Bring in management that has direction and none of this PR rubbish we constantly get.
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