Sam Burgess tells his side of the story

This just up on the Daily Mail

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/article-3311129/SAM-BURGESS-couldn-t-right-fighting-losing-battle-playing-rugby-union-England-heart-just-isn-t-it.html

Interesting quotes:

"That was an upsetting factor to me; that people who are supposed to love the game are actually tearing it to shreds. I felt like certain people didn’t want England and Stuart Lancaster to succeed. They were after him — so aggressively. He could never do a thing right, no matter what. I was right in the middle of that and it is unbelievable. It’s not a productive place to be.

Some ex-players just kept letting rip. It was a losing battle from day one. I couldn’t believe it. It’s almost like they don’t want anyone else to do well in the jersey. That’s definitely the feeling I got in rugby union. And since the tournament, there have been players coming out in the press, leaking stories. I find that really disappointing and I didn’t want to stay in a sport like that. It makes it harder to build on when people from the inside are crumbling."



"It was tough going in to see Mike (Ford, Bath’s head coach) to ask to be released from my contract. I know I have disappointed some of the players and fans at Bath. I completely understand why they would feel that way. I am sorry for the fact that I’ve left a hole in that team."



"I wanted to go in and see the team, to get my point across, but Stuart Hooper, our captain, said he didn’t think I’d be well received there, which was fair enough — if that’s how he felt. I wanted to go and say goodbye, not just as a team-mate but as a friend, but that didn’t happen. I’ve not been back in there, but I’ve spoken to guys away from the club."



"I’ve been in contact with Madge (Michael Maguire, Rabbitohs coach) and Russell (Crowe, Rabbitohs co-owner) since I’ve been here, from day one. Yes, I spoke to Madge the day after we lost to Australia and yes, I watched the Grand Final that morning — of course I did, because I love rugby league. I sat at breakfast, watching the final on my phone. It was a bloody exciting game."



"When I told him about my decision to leave, Stuart was disappointed. It doesn’t look great in the situation as it is now, but he had no clue about this and had never promised me anything. It is tough having to let those guys down and they got their point across to me, but they respected my decision."



"I don’t have any regrets about playing union. I enjoyed it and met so many good people. I’ve got a lot of good friendships from it, but at the end of the day, the game just didn’t give me as much enjoyment as rugby league gives me."

After reading that I'm confused why he wanted to come over in the first place. Did he think he was going to be able to be good right away? I would have viewed that three-year contract as an apprenticeship after which he might have learnt Union well enough to make the grade.

People make choices they regret, that's life. I don't see reason for people to be attacking the guy. There are a lot of reasons for him to move back. Headlines like 'good riddence' I'm sure won't make him regret his decision. It's his career and playing on when he's not committed isn't good for anyone.

I get people saying he's let Ford or Bath down but for how long would they be loyal if he wasn't performing? Has to do what's right for him.

He wanted to be a back but Bath didn't see him that way, by the looks of it. I'd also completely agree that the media is full of ex players who seem focuses on tearing down the current lot regardless of anything else. Not always wrong but usually full of it.

It sounded to me a bit as if he thought it would be easy and he could walk in and play for England.

I agree about the media though, they have loved his demise. Hopefully everyone can just move on now the 'official' story is out.

I don't know why Burgess is surprised at the back-biting and second-guessing taking place after the World Cup. If he wasn't paying attention four years ago, he had only to look at the tone of media coverage for the English football and cricket teams to get an idea of how things might play out.

It's not as if that's a trait exclusive to England: he can see former Australian internationals bagging their rugby and cricket teams when things go wrong for them too.

He seems to have a sense that things are different in rugby league. The truth is, the profile of the sport in England isn't high enough to generate the same level of scrutiny.

Burgess comes across as an honest, decent bloke, so I'm confident he's given us the reasons as he sees them. It's sad we'll just never know whether he could have had a greater impact if things had played out differently.

What are the wages like in NRL in comparison to RU?

Just a young man who got a real shock, it seems.

It doesn't make him a bad person and I've seen enough interviews with him to be fairly happy that there isn't an insincere bone in his body. I feel very sorry for Bath being left in the lurch, mind you but I'm sure that they will pick up someone suitable (Denton or otherwise) as they're a prestige outfit.

I think that the other obvious thing to say is that neither Bath nor England could be said to be unaware of the risks involved in bringing him over. His mother, fiancee, brothers, teammates and entire support network is back in Australia. Was it really outwith the realms of possibility that he would ever return? Of course not. He's a young man, let's not forget. Nobody should try and offer claims of being naive here.

Golden wrote:What are the wages like in NRL in comparison to RU?

A$6.1m for the 25 man main squad is the cap. So just under £3m quid or on average not much more than £100k per player.

I'd kinda share a lot of the comments here.

That he seems bewildered that he wasn't fully accepted as a League Knight in Shining Armour arriving just in Time to bestow on England Union a World Cup  comes across as a tad naïve.  I'm sure even as a casual observer he'd have been somewhat familiar about what happens when English games don't go according to plan... for the reasons some people set out above - high expectation in media and not too much patience with excuses.  It's not exactly a new climate in Union.

It's also quite pointed that he seems a little irritated that the Union game itself was more difficult than he expected it to be.  He's obviously a player that operates on confidence levels to a high degree so he won't blame his personal frustrations at the difficulty he had in adapting (and why would he?) - so better to claim the distractions of ex-players and media were the issues turning him off the game bit by bit.

But yes, overall, he does come across as a decent man who faced a lot more difficulties than he had anticipated, had an emotional change of heart (as we all can through life) and then felt uncomfortable about the perception that he was letting people down by returning to where his heart obviously is.

He's guilty of nothing more than wanting to believe that he could have made a big difference during the WC.  Lots of things conspired to prevent that from happening.  But he should understand that one or two English Union players were even more disappointed than he was by their treatment before and during the WC... a guy called Luther Burrell being one of them.

George Carlin wrote:Just a young man who got a real shock, it seems.

It doesn't make him a bad person and I've seen enough interviews with him to be fairly happy that there isn't an insincere bone in his body. I feel very sorry for Bath being left in the lurch, mind you but I'm sure that they will pick up someone suitable (Denton or otherwise) as they're a prestige outfit.

I think that the other obvious thing to say is that neither Bath nor England could be said to be unaware of the risks involved in bringing him over. His mother, fiancee, brothers, teammates and entire support network is back in Australia. Was it really outwith the realms of possibility that he would ever return? Of course not. He's a young man, let's not forget. Nobody should try and offer claims of being naive here.

Well said George.
If this was facebook you'd get a Like

Maybe he was worried being a Union forward would damage his good looks!

Reading the above, does not make me feel more positive about him

Seems he is blaming everyone else but himself - and you can tell that everyone is completly p**s off with him at Bath

He has kept in touch with his old club FROM day one


All in all makes him look like a very selfish person

It sounds a bit like he didn't enjoy the gold fish bowl of a bigger sport where his involvement was being questioned.

Riskysports wrote:Reading the above, does not make me feel more positive about him

Seems he is blaming everyone else but himself - and you can tell that everyone is completly p**s off with him at Bath

He has kept in touch with his old club FROM day one


All in all makes him look like a very selfish person

Yeah, how dare the [swear filter]. He should have cut all ties (including with several members of his family) where he came to us.  It sounds like he finds union as boring a **** in the forwards.

EDIT: And of course he's being selfish. He's hardly doing it for anyone else is he?

HammerofThunor wrote:

Riskysports wrote:Reading the above, does not make me feel more positive about him

Seems he is blaming everyone else but himself - and you can tell that everyone is completly p**s off with him at Bath

He has kept in touch with his old club FROM day one


All in all makes him look like a very selfish person

Yeah, how dare the [swear filter]. He should have cut all ties (including with several members of his family) where he came to us.  It sounds like he finds union as boring a **** in the forwards.

EDIT: And of course he's being selfish. He's hardly doing it for anyone else is he?

But it once you sign a contract then you should honour it. Simples

And seems ford is agreeing with me

If he wasn't performing the club would be happy for him to break the contract to get a fee for him leaving. It's not a contract of slavery which stops you from moving, it's just a club protecting their assets. He has a short career, has to look after himself.

Scottrf wrote:If he wasn't performing the club would be happy for him to break the contract to get a fee for him leaving. It's not a contract of slavery which stops you from moving, it's just a club protecting their assets. He has a short career, has to look after himself.

It is this sort of attitude which ruins sport, life and the universe (Not your - the breaking contract just because)

What ever happened to honour, being a proper human being with respect

he stuffed Bath, buggered off and left them high and dry and mucked them around

The world is going to sh*t and this is the type of stuff that we now accept - you make an agreement - you fing respect that agreement


NO MORE =- this Risky Sports is not for turning

Presumably you feel he shouldn't have moved to Bath in the first place though.

Riskysports wrote:It is this sort of attitude which ruins sport, life and the universe (Not your - the breaking contract just because)

So join the people in attacking him if you think that makes the sport better.

Helps create a great atmosphere in football when players leave to rival clubs.

Riskysports wrote:It is this sort of attitude which ruins sport, life and the universe (Not your - the breaking contract just because)

What ever happened to honour, being a proper human being with respect

he stuffed Bath, buggered off and left them high and dry and mucked them around

The world is going to sh*t and this is the type of stuff that we now accept - you make an agreement - you fing respect that agreement

What on earth are you talking about? It was a mutual agreement to terminate his contract earlier. You think THAT is what is wrong with the world? You need to get out more.

I have a permanent contract with notice period. If I came to a mutual agreement with my employer that I didn't need to work the notice period would you say the same thing about me?

You seem to be taking this so ridiculously over the top I would think that you were WUMing (in a mild and gentle way).

HammerofThunor wrote:

Riskysports wrote:It is this sort of attitude which ruins sport, life and the universe (Not your - the breaking contract just because)

What ever happened to honour, being a proper human being with respect

he stuffed Bath, buggered off and left them high and dry and mucked them around

The world is going to sh*t and this is the type of stuff that we now accept - you make an agreement - you fing respect that agreement

What on earth are you talking about? It was a mutual agreement to terminate his contract earlier. You think THAT is what is wrong with the world? You need to get out more.

I have a permanent contract with notice period. If I came to a mutual agreement with my employer that I didn't need to work the notice period would you say the same thing about me?

You seem to be taking this so ridiculously over the top I would think that you were WUMing (in a mild and gentle way).

I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!! and he left them in the lurch

I may be a little over the top, but I see the derogation of respect in society and this is another example (Small - though it is) of peoples attitude to focus 'on me' with no regard for others they are letting down

I am sure he is a great guy - and all reports seem to indicate this - so I certainly do not want it to be personal attack on him, just I can not get my head around how we should not pick up of poor behavior when if affects others directly

Anyway, I am now off to stand on a soap box in a corner

The RFU should shoulder a large amount of the blame for this muddled affair. It is almost impossible for a player to transition from league to union in a season (it took Sonny Bill two years to come to grips with the game), let alone make the jump to International rugby.
Having said that Burgess was being naïve if he thought he could avoid this reality.

To my mind he has made the right choice. He is, according to most observers, a quality league player.
However the assets that make him good in that code: size, power and directness, aren't enough, on their own,to make it in union, either as a back row or a centre. The requirement to protect the ball in contact and the increased decision making (let alone learning the skills around lineouts and scrums) make union a much harder game to become proficient in than most would be league converts would care to admit.
He could have knuckled down and made a good/ excellent 6 but the lure of rejoining his family and his old league club ( the splendidly but camply named Rabitoohs) in Sydney proved too much.
This surely must have been the risk when he was lured to Bath, and so it cant be too surprising to Bath and the RFU that it has happened.
However, as a Scotsman I am sad to see him go as a midfield of Farrell, Burgess and Baritt would  have suited us nicely for the Calcutta match!

Riskysports wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

Riskysports wrote:It is this sort of attitude which ruins sport, life and the universe (Not your - the breaking contract just because)

What ever happened to honour, being a proper human being with respect

he stuffed Bath, buggered off and left them high and dry and mucked them around

The world is going to sh*t and this is the type of stuff that we now accept - you make an agreement - you fing respect that agreement

What on earth are you talking about? It was a mutual agreement to terminate his contract earlier. You think THAT is what is wrong with the world? You need to get out more.

I have a permanent contract with notice period. If I came to a mutual agreement with my employer that I didn't need to work the notice period would you say the same thing about me?

You seem to be taking this so ridiculously over the top I would think that you were WUMing (in a mild and gentle way).

I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!! and he left them in the lurch

I may be a little over the top, but I see the derogation of respect in society and this is another example (Small - though it is) of peoples attitude to focus 'on me' with no regard for others they are letting down

I am sure he is a great guy - and all reports seem to indicate this - so I certainly do not want it to be personal attack on him, just I can not get my head around how we should not pick up of poor behavior when if affects others directly

Anyway, I am now off to stand on a soap box in a corner  

What are you on about, fartface?

( )

George Carlin wrote:

Riskysports wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

Riskysports wrote:It is this sort of attitude which ruins sport, life and the universe (Not your - the breaking contract just because)

What ever happened to honour, being a proper human being with respect

he stuffed Bath, buggered off and left them high and dry and mucked them around

The world is going to sh*t and this is the type of stuff that we now accept - you make an agreement - you fing respect that agreement

What on earth are you talking about? It was a mutual agreement to terminate his contract earlier. You think THAT is what is wrong with the world? You need to get out more.

I have a permanent contract with notice period. If I came to a mutual agreement with my employer that I didn't need to work the notice period would you say the same thing about me?

You seem to be taking this so ridiculously over the top I would think that you were WUMing (in a mild and gentle way).

I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!! and he left them in the lurch

I may be a little over the top, but I see the derogation of respect in society and this is another example (Small - though it is) of peoples attitude to focus 'on me' with no regard for others they are letting down

I am sure he is a great guy - and all reports seem to indicate this - so I certainly do not want it to be personal attack on him, just I can not get my head around how we should not pick up of poor behavior when if affects others directly

Anyway, I am now off to stand on a soap box in a corner  

What are you on about, fartface?

( )

I may be a little over the top, but I see the derogation of respect in society and this is another example (LARGE - though it is) of peoples attitude to focus 'on juvenile fart jokes' with no regard for others they are letting down with a poor sense of humour and a questionable fashion sense

I am sure CG is a great guy - although all reports seem to indicate this in not the case - so I certainly do not want it to be personal attack on him, just I can not get my head around how we should not pick up of poor behavior when if affects others directly - SO THERE (

Riskysports wrote:...I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!!...

Burgess also expected to be playing. The mutual agreement was between the owner of Burgess' contract - Bruce Craig - and the man who bought it from him - Russell Crowe.

Riskysports wrote:

George Carlin wrote:

Riskysports wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

Riskysports wrote:It is this sort of attitude which ruins sport, life and the universe (Not your - the breaking contract just because)

What ever happened to honour, being a proper human being with respect

he stuffed Bath, buggered off and left them high and dry and mucked them around

The world is going to sh*t and this is the type of stuff that we now accept - you make an agreement - you fing respect that agreement

What on earth are you talking about? It was a mutual agreement to terminate his contract earlier. You think THAT is what is wrong with the world? You need to get out more.

I have a permanent contract with notice period. If I came to a mutual agreement with my employer that I didn't need to work the notice period would you say the same thing about me?

You seem to be taking this so ridiculously over the top I would think that you were WUMing (in a mild and gentle way).

I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!! and he left them in the lurch

I may be a little over the top, but I see the derogation of respect in society and this is another example (Small - though it is) of peoples attitude to focus 'on me' with no regard for others they are letting down

I am sure he is a great guy - and all reports seem to indicate this - so I certainly do not want it to be personal attack on him, just I can not get my head around how we should not pick up of poor behavior when if affects others directly

Anyway, I am now off to stand on a soap box in a corner  

What are you on about, fartface?

( )

I may be a little over the top, but I see the derogation of respect in society and this is another example (LARGE - though it is) of peoples attitude to focus 'on juvenile fart jokes' with no regard for others they are letting down with a poor sense of humour and a questionable fashion sense

I am sure CG is a great guy - although all reports seem to indicate this in not the case  - so I certainly do not want it to be personal attack on him, just I can not get my head around how we should not pick up of poor behavior when if affects others directly - SO THERE (

I totally am. I have a note from my mum saying that very same thing.

Well my take on the Burgess "side of the story" is that he's a bit of an emotional jessie and needs to grow a pair.

Interesting to hear George Ford lay into Burgess! I agree with him

http://www.itv.com/news/west/2015-11-10/bath-players-feel-let-down-by-burgess/

Rugby Fan wrote:

Riskysports wrote:...I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!!...

Burgess also expected to be playing. The mutual agreement was between the owner of Burgess' contract - Bruce Craig - and the man who bought it from him - Russell Crowe.

I was going to add that Burgess clearly said he was expecting to playing for Bath the next weekend but Risky clearly didn't read the actual article and instead jumped to conclusions. THAT is a much bigger problem in the modern era than people mutually leaving contracts (although the contract was between Burgess and Bath, with Crowe facilitating the agreement with the lubrication of money).

HammerofThunor wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

Riskysports wrote:...I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!!...

Burgess also expected to be playing. The mutual agreement was between the owner of Burgess' contract - Bruce Craig - and the man who bought it from him - Russell Crowe.

I was going to add that Burgess clearly said he was expecting to playing for Bath the next weekend but Risky clearly didn't read the actual article and instead jumped to conclusions. THAT is a much bigger problem in the modern era than people mutually leaving contracts (although the contract was between Burgess and Bath, with Crowe facilitating the agreement with the lubrication of money).

Really -


Ford "But I did speak to him about that and about what a fantastic player he could be, and about the investment the club and the players had made in him, and that it was time to repay that.

"But he chose differently."


Burgess, 26, said his "heart wasn't in" rugby union.


Not sure how you can say he was expecting to play with that attitude - and if he was - it just goes to show even more clearly his attitude - I don't like your game - not really bothered - but I still expect you to pick me

 - even taking out his actions (which speak louder than words) he clearly says his heart was not in Union - so had already made his mind up

He gave up - as he wanted the excitement of playing International without working at it (See I read the article)

Riskysports wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

Riskysports wrote:It is this sort of attitude which ruins sport, life and the universe (Not your - the breaking contract just because)

What ever happened to honour, being a proper human being with respect

he stuffed Bath, buggered off and left them high and dry and mucked them around

The world is going to sh*t and this is the type of stuff that we now accept - you make an agreement - you fing respect that agreement

What on earth are you talking about? It was a mutual agreement to terminate his contract earlier. You think THAT is what is wrong with the world? You need to get out more.

I have a permanent contract with notice period. If I came to a mutual agreement with my employer that I didn't need to work the notice period would you say the same thing about me?

You seem to be taking this so ridiculously over the top I would think that you were WUMing (in a mild and gentle way).

I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!! and he left them in the lurch

I may be a little over the top, but I see the derogation of respect in society and this is another example (Small - though it is) of peoples attitude to focus 'on me' with no regard for others they are letting down

I am sure he is a great guy - and all reports seem to indicate this - so I certainly do not want it to be personal attack on him, just I can not get my head around how we should not pick up of poor behavior when if affects others directly

Anyway, I am now off to stand on a soap box in a corner  

I actually think you make a very good point here.

Riskysports wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

Riskysports wrote:...I am not so sure it was mutual - as Bath thought he was playing that weekend!!!...

Burgess also expected to be playing. The mutual agreement was between the owner of Burgess' contract - Bruce Craig - and the man who bought it from him - Russell Crowe.

I was going to add that Burgess clearly said he was expecting to playing for Bath the next weekend but Risky clearly didn't read the actual article and instead jumped to conclusions. THAT is a much bigger problem in the modern era than people mutually leaving contracts (although the contract was between Burgess and Bath, with Crowe facilitating the agreement with the lubrication of money).

Really -


Ford "But I did speak to him about that and about what a fantastic player he could be, and about the investment the club and the players had made in him, and that it was time to repay that.

"But he chose differently."


Burgess, 26, said his "heart wasn't in" rugby union.


Not sure how you can say he was expecting to play with that attitude - and if he was - it just goes to show even more clearly his attitude - I don't like your game - not really bothered -  but I still expect you to pick me

 - even taking out his actions (which speak louder than words) he clearly says his heart was not in Union - so had already made his mind up

He gave up - as he wanted the excitement of playing International without working at it (See I read the article)

Yeah. His heart wasn't in Union and wanted to leave. He had said that. Doesn't mean he wouldn't play and it doesn't he wouldn't give his best.

I hate the job I'm in now since I moved into it a couple of years ago. I trying to go back to what I was doing before but can't at the moment. I do the best I can in the mean time because that is what I'm employed to do. Once again you seem to reaching and jumping to conclusions, which again, I think is a much bigger problem than people agreeing to terminate contracts.

Perhaps he should have lied to his employer, which is what you seem to be suggesting.

You told your boss you hate your job and looking to move? No as that sets a whole set of wheels in motion


Well his employer seems to be jumping to the same conclusions too by the way he is completely p**d off about the way he did it

Maybe I will just agree with him

Riskysports wrote:Well his employer seems to be jumping to the same conclusions too by the way he is completely p**d off about the way he did it

Craig owns Bath, not Mike Ford. He isn't claiming Burgess broke his contract. For that matter, I haven't heard Ford make that claim either.

I think this is pointless - as we have differences of what is acceptable - and unlikely we will agree

He had a 3 year contract - left after a year after making it clear that he was not interested in playing - how that is not breaking a contract - i do not know

My final thought is how I would react if one of my team behaved like this

Headhunted and came in on a 3 year contract, for a premium - got extra training resources, mentoring and also valuable time that could have been spent on the rest of the department - above what others get - was given the best projects - and all he assistance he could desire to help him succeed

Then - out the blue, after a project did not go smoothly - told me - he could not be bothered - did not have the heart to try - and wanted the directors job now - as it was exciting, but could not be bothered to train for a couple of years to gain the experience - and as such was off - that weekend

Leaving the rest of the team - short handed and in a bind, so I had to go out to a recruitment consultancy to hire a emergency replacement to fill in to ensure we did not miss client deadlines (I would expect at a premium)

- then finally get annoyed we did not have a leaving party for him


Now - if that happened, I would feel very let down, the department would feel betrayed and there would be bad feeling - and I think that member of staff would have behaved poorly

If you disagree - then fine, that is your prerogative and we shall part ways on this in the happy world were everyone is allowed to have an opinion :-)

It wasn't SB's fault that Bath took a risk with him. It wasn't his fault that he became the centre of a lot of attention. He was probably surprised that he wasn't as good at union as perhaps he expected. It certainly wasn't his fault that he found himself in the England squad, or that the media continued to make so much of England's bid all about SB.

However, it is down to him that he let down his club and team mates and quit. Naive, perhaps; emotionally weak, perhaps; missing his teddy, who knows. I don't like quiters. Good luck somewhere else Sam - don't bother to write - we'll be just fine.

To leave straight after the RWC is low, as low as it gets imo.