Pool draw for European Rugby, 29 June

First topic message reminder :

Champions Cup Pool Draw 2016/17

Pool 1: Racing 92, Glasgow Warriors, Leicester Tigers, Munster Rugby
Pool 2: Connacht Rugby, Wasps, Toulouse, Zebre
Pool 3: Saracens, RC Toulon, Scarlets, Sale Sharks
Pool 4: Leinster Rugby, Montpellier, Northampton Saints, Castres Olympique
Pool 5: Exeter Chiefs, ASM Clermont Auvergne, Ulster Rugby, Bordeaux-Begles

Challenge Cup Pool Draw 2016/17

Pool 1: La Rochelle, Gloucester Rugby, Benetton Treviso, Bayonne
Pool 2: Ospreys, Grenoble, Newcastle Falcons, Lyon
Pool 3: Brive, Worcester Warriors, NG Dragons, Enisei STM
Pool 4: Cardiff Blues, Bath Rugby, Pau, Bristol Rugby
Pool 5: Harlequins, Edinburgh Rugby, Stade Francais Paris, Timisoara Saracens

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EPCR weekends - 2016/17 season

Round 1: 13/14/15/16 October
Round 2: 20/21/22/23 October
Round 3: 8/9/10/11 December
Round 4: 15/16/17/18 December
Round 5: 12/13/14/15 January 2017
Round 6: 19/20/21/22 January 2017
Quarter-finals: 30/31 March - 1/2 April 2017
Semi-finals: 21/22/23 April 2017

Finals Edinburgh 2017

European Rugby Challenge Cup final: Friday 12 May, BT Murrayfield Stadium
European Rugby Champions Cup final: Saturday 13 May, BT Murrayfield Stadium

formerly known as Sam wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:I'm hoping Edinburgh draw La Rochelle. I hear it's lovely, and I spent my school French lessons listening to poor quality recordings of people from La Rochelle all introducing themselves in a very formal manner and wondering where their train station was.

LA Rochelle is lovely and some of the food on offer there is fantastic. Not the cheapest but they are rugby mad and you do have to use the old French lessons as not everyone knows English like in the more touristy bits.

Brits abroad, point and shout louder lol

It was more of look blank and ask my privately educated wife to translate.

formerly known as Sam wrote:It was more of look blank and ask my privately educated wife to translate.

Well I'd could do the look blank part to perfection

Good draw for Wasps.

George Carlin wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:Pool 1: Racing 92, Glasgow Warriors, Leicester Tigers, Munster Rugby

nice easy group that

RDW_Scotland wrote:Prediction - Leicester will draw Zebre.

Since 2008 they've drawn the Italian whipping boys in all but one season - incredible luck!

Not this year. Probably the toughest group

As a Wasps fan pretty happy with that. Got a decent record against Toulouse in the competition, should be 5 points home and away against Zebre. Connacht away on the back of a great season will be tough. A lot will depend, as ever, on how the Frenchmen travel.

Tough pool for Scarlets, but a team with 9 Welsh internationals and a few good NWQ and up and coming players should at least be aiming to win ALL their homes games, and try and get a result away to Sale. I will be very disappointed if they end up win-less again this season.

LordDowlais wrote:Tough pool for Scarlets, but a team with 9 Welsh internationals and a few good NWQ and up and coming players should at least be aiming to win ALL their homes games, and try and get a result away to Sale. I will be very disappointed if they end up win-less again this season.

Lord I don't know what land you're living in, I think it is inhabited with Cuckoo's, they will be lucky to win more than one game in that group, and as an Ospreys fan it would give me enormous pleasure for them to exceed those estimates, just take a long hard look at the squads and money available to those teams compared to what the Scarlets have.

LordDowlais wrote:Tough pool for Scarlets, but a team with 9 Welsh internationals and a few good NWQ and up and coming players should at least be aiming to win ALL their homes games, and try and get a result away to Sale. I will be very disappointed if they end up win-less again this season.

Win against Sarries and Toulon at home? Riiiightttt

Wayne a team containing the following players:-

Rob Evans
Ken Owens
Samson Lee
Jake Ball
James Davies
Aaron Shingler
Gareth Davies
Rhys Patchell
Jonathan Davies
Scott Williams
Liam Williams

And all the NWQ signings they have made, that is the Welsh international front row, and most of the Wales international backs. They should be looking to win at least all their home games.

BamBam wrote:Win against Sarries and Toulon at home? Riiiightttt

Have I said that ?

Scarlets should be aiming to beat them at Parc Y Scarlets though.

They should surely be aiming to win all their games. Unlikely though. Sale away is not an easy place to go at all.

LordDowlais wrote:

BamBam wrote:Win against Sarries and Toulon at home? Riiiightttt

Have I said that ?

Scarlets should be aiming to beat them at Parc Y Scarlets though.

I meant even at Scarlets - Riiiiightttt

Anybody know any teams who don't aim to win games?

Thanks in advance.

Agree on that Phil

I've interpreted LD's statement as "expecting to win". Apologies LD if that is not the case

BamBam wrote:Agree on that Phil

I've interpreted LD's statement as "expecting to win". Apologies LD if that is not the case

It's the only way it can be interpreted.

I doubt that anybody would expect a Llanelli win over first choice teams from Saracens or Toulon, although I agree that they could push both to close results - IF (huge IF) the Turks can field a first choice team.

Hey PhilBB - surprised to see you here. Thought you (and the rest of Gwlad) would be all over the Annual Report of the Ulster Branch of the IRFU which was just published.

Sin é wrote:

Hey PhilBB - surprised to see you here. Thought you (and the rest of Gwlad) would be all over the Annual Report of the Ulster Branch of the IRFU which was just published.

The rest of the boys are busy counting Munster's debts.

They will be some time.

As Oscar Wilde said: “There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about.”

LordDowlais wrote:Wayne a team containing the following players:-

Rob Evans
Ken Owens
Samson Lee
Jake Ball
James Davies
Aaron Shingler
Gareth Davies
Rhys Patchell
Jonathan Davies
Scott Williams
Liam Williams

And all the NWQ signings they have made, that is the Welsh international front row, and most of the Wales international backs. They should be looking to win at least all their home games.

If all of those guys are available throughout the tournament then yeah, I think they should be competing for top spot. I can't see it happening though, Scarlets haven't cut the mustard in Europe for years - right now it's difficult to be able to see what they'll do differently which will enable them to do better than the previous two years. Last year they were nothing short of embarrassing in this competition and I couldn't quite put my finger on why.

Winnable groups for all Welsh regions in the 2nd tier, I thought Worcester would do well but maybe not if their coach is leaving? The other contenders will be the rest of the English clubs besides Bristol and Falcons who I think may struggle. I can't see the French being up to much when compared to last year where Montpellier were in this competition.

mikey_dragon wrote:If all of those guys are available throughout the tournament then yeah

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't the agreements with the NDC's ensure that most of those players should be available for Europe over the league, which is another bug bear I have.

They get messed around every year because of the extra AI for a start. Then you might have to factor in injuries etc. I'd have thought a churno would be all over this.

RiscaGame wrote:churno

Whats one of though's ?

Pool 1 the toughtest.
Pool 2 the easiest (though not by much).
Pool 5 the tastiest, can see why Notch is pleased, should be cracking rugby in that one

LordDowlais wrote:Wayne a team containing the following players:-

Rob Evans
Ken Owens
Samson Lee
Jake Ball
James Davies
Aaron Shingler
Gareth Davies
Rhys Patchell
Jonathan Davies
Scott Williams
Liam Williams

And all the NWQ signings they have made, that is the Welsh international front row, and most of the Wales international backs. They should be looking to win at least all their home games.

Lord, that might be your and my Welsh front row, it patently isn't the Welsh managements at the moment, Gethin was the preferred loose head and Samson was outed by Thomas Francis for the final test, and as for the backs I still think you're still in cloud cuckoo land, the best back selection at the moment, would only select JD2 and Liam Williams, the rest are 2nd, 3rd and go down to 5th and 6th welsh choices, and because they are Welsh Internationals doesn't make them top class, you only have to go back to the Chiefs game to see where our substitutes stand in the world order.
You only have to go back to the Toulon and Saracens teams that played in the latter stages of RCC1 and ask how many of next seasons Scarlets squad would have got in either of those teams, I would venture probably only Liam would get in EITHER, some others would get in the first 23. As I said anything over 1 win would be a good outcome and if there are any significant injuries that number might not be attained and it would not be their fault.

For the Irish teams, think Connacht should be happiest. Wasps will be very tough but Toulouse are ageing and Zebre are the usual Italian whipping boys. If Connacht play as they did at their best this past season then they can win all their home games though the Wasps game will be very tough. At minimum they should be aiming to win 4 out of 6 and pick up bonus points in the others.

Leinster should be content, but some people on other board seem to be pencilling in a QF slot. Yes they should but even with Henshaw on board there is an awful lack of penetration in the Leinster back line to build on the possession that a strong pack should provide. Having Castres in their pool is a big bonus - they usually don't give a tuppeny fook about European cups so there's a good chance that two teams will come out of the Leinster group. Hopefully Leinster and Saints.

Ulster are the opposite of Leinster - a superb back line with a pretty weak pack (apart from Hendo). Lot depends on how the French teams treat the Euro Cup - but a good chance of Ulster getting through as long as they can the ball to PJ, Marshall, Olding, McCloskey, Piutau, Gilroy and Payne.

Having seen Leinster end up in some pools of death in recent years, have to say think Munster are rightly banjaxed. Thomond is no longer a fortress, and even less so when it's only half full. Racing to win the group, Glasgow/Tigers fighting for 2nd place.

Group 3 the only one one without an Irish team. Seen above what some Welsh posters are saying about Scarlets' prospects, but Saracens and Toulon are probably going to take points off each other so wouldn't automatically rule Scarlets. Still two will come out of this group and it will be a big surprise if it's not Saracens and Toulon.

Forecast:
Group 1 - Racing
Group 2 - Wasps and Connacht (hopefully not in that order)
Group 3 - Saracens and Toulon
Group 4 - Leinster and Northampton (though wouldn't bet my house on Leinster)
Group 5 - Hard to call - difficult to separate Exeter, Ulster and Clermont - and only one to go through

RDW_Scotland wrote:

Pool 4: Cardiff Blues, Bath Rugby, Pau, Bristol Rugby

I'd say there are a few Welsh regionalists knocking one out behind the chipper at the prospects of such ancient and venerable derby games even if it's in tier 2.

As a Tigers fan I'm pretty happy with that group. I've enjoyed our games vs Munster so I don't mind drawing the again. It'll be good to see Carter at WR and be on the opposing team to his good friend Mauger again. The French teams don't traditionally travel way so we should be able to grab the home victory. Who knows with Glasgow, they are a joy to watch when their attacking game is going and we should have a pretty tasty back line to go toe to toe with there's.

Yeah, I like that group - should be entertaining matches.

I would have much preferred Glasgow to get an easier group - but those matchups are certainly mouthwatering. Unfortunately I think Glasgow will not be as good as last year but at least wil not have the WC hangover

St John The Enforcer wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:

Pool 4: Cardiff Blues, Bath Rugby, Pau, Bristol Rugby

I'd say there are a few Welsh regionalists knocking one out behind the chipper at the prospects of such ancient and venerable derby games even if it's in tier 2.

LordDowlais wrote:Wayne a team containing the following players:-

Rob Evans
Ken Owens
Samson Lee
Jake Ball
James Davies
Aaron Shingler
Gareth Davies
Rhys Patchell
Jonathan Davies
Scott Williams
Liam Williams

And all the NWQ signings they have made, that is the Welsh international front row, and most of the Wales international backs. They should be looking to win at least all their home games.

True but then again you're facing Toulon and Saracens who have at least 23 international capped players in each squad.... Now of course international caps doesn't necessarily make someone a better player or take into account form but certainly does show a little bit about experience. Especially big match experience.

Would be interesting if anyone wants to wants to add up how many international caps each squad has.

Surprisingly Sale will have the most experienced 9s in the competition with Stringer and Phillips in their squad.