Scarlets v Newport Gwent Dragons 8th October 2016

First topic message reminder :

Saturday 8th Oct, 19:35, live on S4C.

Scarlets were pointless after the first three rounds of the 2016/17 Guinness PRO12 campaign but have since reeled off successive victories, at home to Connacht and in Treviso.

The West Walians have lost their last two home games against fellow Welsh regions since they beat Dragons at Parc y Scarlets at the end of October 2015.

Newport Gwent Dragons have recorded just one victory in their last nine fixtures in all competitions: 11-6 at home to Zebre in round 2 of the Guinness PRO12.

Dragons have not beaten a fellow Welsh region on their own soil since visiting Cardiff on Boxing Day 2014.

Scarlets solitary defeat in their last 15 Championship encounters with Dragons was 16-23 at Rodney Parade in September 2013.

Dragons only victory on Scarlets soil since the two regions were formed in 2003 was 30-23 at the old Stradey Park in the PRO12 in September 2007.

Overall Guinness PRO12 head to head record:
Played 26, Scarlets won 21, Dragons won 5.

At Parc y Scarlets, 7.35pm. Live on S4C
Referee: Ben Whitehouse (WRU, 30th competition game)
Assistant Referees: Wayne Davies, Chris Williams (both WRU)
Citing Commissioner: Aurwell Morgan (WRU)
TMO: Jon Mason (WRU)

Read more at http://www.pro12rugby.com/preview/preview-scarlets-rugby-v-newport-gwent-dragons/#FmgaHx734kZHSe2J.99

SCARLETS: 15 Liam Williams, 14 DTH van der Merwe, 13 Hadleigh Parkes, 12 Scott Williams, 11 Steff Evans, 10 Rhys Patchell, 9 Aled Davies, 1 Wyn Jones, 2 Ken Owens [c], 3 Samson Lee, 4 Lewis Rawlins, 5 David Bulbring, 6 Aaron Shingler, 7 James Davies, 8 Morgan Allen

DRAGONS: 15 Tom Prydie, 14 Pat Howard, 13 Adam Warren, 12 Jack Dixon, 11 Hallam Amos, 10 Nick Macleod, 9 Charlie Davies; 1 Sam Hobbs, 2 Rhys Buckley, 3 Brok Harris, 4 Nick Crosswell, 5 Cory Hill, 6 Lewis Evans ©, 7 Nic Cudd, 8 Ed Jackson.

Replacements; Darran Harris, Thomas Davies, Lloyd Fairbrother, Matthew Screech, Ollie Griffiths, Sarel Pretorius, Angus O’Brien, Sam Beard.

Eilyddion: Ryan Elias, Luke Garrett, Werner Kruger, Rynier Bernardo, John Barclay, Jonathan Evans, Dan Jones, Steff Hughes

The Dragons haven't won in Llanelli since 2007. Is there any reason to think their fortunes will change this weekend?

One-word answers are okay, but feel free to elaborate!

GavinDragon wrote:First trip to PYS on the DOSC bus. Looking forward to it. Sure we will make more noise than came out of the Library yesterday

#standupforthemenofgwent

Bus singular?

Well, as we approach kick off the thought of watching this sober isn't appealing to me at all.

Stone Motif wrote:

GavinDragon wrote:First trip to PYS on the DOSC bus. Looking forward to it. Sure we will make more noise than came out of the Library yesterday

#standupforthemenofgwent

Bus singular?

Maybe a double decker mun.

Stone Motif wrote:Well, as we approach kick off the thought of watching this sober isn't appealing to me at all.

Do you do anything sober?

Amos is single-handedly destroying the Scarlets

Playing well dragons, I hope those missed kicks don't come back to haunt you

wayne wrote:Playing well dragons, I hope those missed kicks don't come back to haunt you

You just know they will.

Have any of you checked the Argentina V Australia game out ?

What a farce, who agreed to play this game at Twickenham ? Half empty stadium, absolutely no atmosphere what so ever, and a low quality game. Why the hell the Argies gave up home advantage for this is anyone's guess. They must be making more ££££'s than they would playing in Buenos Aires. But it cannot be that much, can it ?

Everything AOB does goes wrong. I can't fault the kids effort but like I've been saying for a while he's not good enough at this level.

LordDowlais wrote:

wayne wrote:Playing well dragons, I hope those missed kicks don't come back to haunt you

You just know they will.

Have any of you checked the Argentina V Australia game out ?

What a farce, who agreed to play this game at Twickenham ? Half empty stadium, absolutely no atmosphere what so ever, and a low quality game. Why the hell the Argies gave up home advantage for this is anyone's guess. They must be making more ££££'s than they would playing in Buenos Aires. But it cannot be that much, can it ?

Wrong thread.

Fraking stupid by AOB again, running into Barclay - also thought Whitehouse blew too soon for that one.

Good to see us fight til the end and bring it back 32-20 to get a losing BP. But that 14-20 to 32-20 swing in the second half was really sh*t from us.

wayne wrote:Playing well dragons, I hope those missed kicks don't come back to haunt you

I thought it would and it has, unlucky Dragons but still a good 2 points, I wouldn't have expected that before this game.

Oh yeah, forgot it was 2! But still, yet another close but no cigar from us

However, just to add I (wrongly) assumed we'd get a big hiding at PYS tonight so at least I was wrong on that count. But so disappointing to be leading for most (maybe?) of the game and then not to come away with the win.

Griff wrote:However, just to add I (wrongly) assumed we'd get a big hiding at PYS tonight so at least I was wrong on that count. But so disappointing to be leading for most (maybe?) of the game and then not to come away with the win.

If you assumed that then clearly you haven't been watching the Scarlets this season. I just hope for your sake you didn't watch it on S4C with English commentary .

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:However, just to add I (wrongly) assumed we'd get a big hiding at PYS tonight so at least I was wrong on that count. But so disappointing to be leading for most (maybe?) of the game and then not to come away with the win.

If you assumed that then clearly you haven't been watching the Scarlets this season. I just hope for your sake you didn't watch it on S4C with English commentary .

Form doesn't matter mate. Or should that be 'fam'?! We're prone to a thumping anywhere anytime from teams in or out of form. It was an away game and we're catastrophically sh*te away from home. You do the maths. Look at the bookies odds too. From watching the game I thought a win could have happened, but after the 18 point swing I'm quite happy to come away with 2 points. Were you expecting a win pre game or something?

Griff wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:However, just to add I (wrongly) assumed we'd get a big hiding at PYS tonight so at least I was wrong on that count. But so disappointing to be leading for most (maybe?) of the game and then not to come away with the win.

If you assumed that then clearly you haven't been watching the Scarlets this season. I just hope for your sake you didn't watch it on S4C with English commentary .

Form doesn't matter mate. Or should that be 'fam'?! We're prone to a thumping anywhere anytime from teams in or out of form. It was an away game and we're catastrophically sh*te away from home. You do the maths. Look at the bookies odds too. From watching the game I thought a win could have happened, but after the 18 point swing I'm quite happy to come away with 2 points. Were you expecting a win pre game or something?

Jeez is your name cement head? Form doesn't matter . I can see what you're saying fam, but only a fool would think that on this form Scarlets can thump anyone. Things are going to be far from pretty for them in Europe I fear. And nah fam, I always thought it would be a dour affair from two poor teams with Scarlets edging it. AOB missed kicks critical...

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:However, just to add I (wrongly) assumed we'd get a big hiding at PYS tonight so at least I was wrong on that count. But so disappointing to be leading for most (maybe?) of the game and then not to come away with the win.

If you assumed that then clearly you haven't been watching the Scarlets this season. I just hope for your sake you didn't watch it on S4C with English commentary .

Form doesn't matter mate. Or should that be 'fam'?! We're prone to a thumping anywhere anytime from teams in or out of form. It was an away game and we're catastrophically sh*te away from home. You do the maths. Look at the bookies odds too. From watching the game I thought a win could have happened, but after the 18 point swing I'm quite happy to come away with 2 points. Were you expecting a win pre game or something?

Jeez is your name cement head? Form doesn't matter . I can see what you're saying fam, but only a fool would think that on this form Scarlets can thump anyone. Things are going to be far from pretty for them in Europe I fear. And nah fam, I always thought would it would be a dour affair from two poor teams with Scarlets edging it. AOB missed kicks critical...

Are you some sort of Dizzee Rascal wannabe? Seriously, who actually says 'fam'? Noticed you using it on a few posts. Sounds really odd coming from a South Wales rugby fan rather than from an Brixton grime artist.

Form doesn't matter against us, yes. How many times have we faced teams in poor form and still lost? The answer is plenty and often and it happens every single season. Please tell me what you've seen from us over the last 13 years that makes you think we're now favourites to go to the Scarlets and get a win? Only a fool (your words) would think that. We get man shamed away to Treviso last week, who themselves are in dire form, so yes a heavy away loss to the Scarlets wasn't too much of a stretch prediction wise. But I'm glad it was close in the end.

Also, on the topic of form doesn't matter: Blues v Ospreys. Surely on form quite close on paper with the Blues perhaps a bit more 'on form'? Absolute horsesh*t come match day. A compete smashing. So you know where you can shove your form.

Griff wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:However, just to add I (wrongly) assumed we'd get a big hiding at PYS tonight so at least I was wrong on that count. But so disappointing to be leading for most (maybe?) of the game and then not to come away with the win.

If you assumed that then clearly you haven't been watching the Scarlets this season. I just hope for your sake you didn't watch it on S4C with English commentary .

Form doesn't matter mate. Or should that be 'fam'?! We're prone to a thumping anywhere anytime from teams in or out of form. It was an away game and we're catastrophically sh*te away from home. You do the maths. Look at the bookies odds too. From watching the game I thought a win could have happened, but after the 18 point swing I'm quite happy to come away with 2 points. Were you expecting a win pre game or something?

Jeez is your name cement head? Form doesn't matter . I can see what you're saying fam, but only a fool would think that on this form Scarlets can thump anyone. Things are going to be far from pretty for them in Europe I fear. And nah fam, I always thought would it would be a dour affair from two poor teams with Scarlets edging it. AOB missed kicks critical...

Are you some sort of Dizzee Rascal wannabe? Seriously, who actually says 'fam'? Noticed you using it on a few posts. Sounds really odd coming from a South Wales rugby fan rather than from an Brixton grime artist.

Form doesn't matter against us, yes. How many times have we faced teams in poor form and still lost? The answer is plenty and often and it happens every single season. Please tell me what you've seen from us over the last 13 years that makes you think we're now favourites to go to the Scarlets and get a win? Only a fool (your words) would think that. We get man shamed away to Treviso last week, who themselves are in dire form, so yes a heavy away loss to the Scarlets wasn't too much of a stretch prediction wise. But I'm glad it was close in the end.

Also, on the topic of form doesn't matter: Blues v Ospreys. Surely on form quite close on paper with the Blues perhaps a bit more 'on form'? Absolute horsesh*t come match day. A compete smashing. So you know where you  can shove your form.

Well done fam, you clearly went for it . No idea why 'fam' winds you up . No idea where Brixton is tbh with you.

There's been a few occasions in the past - but Scarlets form is possibly the worst I've seen it - how on earth can you expect that to dish out a thumping. Who said that I said we were favourites to win? Did you imagine that? A fool would believe that we could go there and beat Scarlets on our current FORM but as far as I can tell nobody believed that? Also when it comes to us you have to take into account the selection policy - we seem to be the only ones doing it and that's never worked well for us.

Yeah a bit more, just a bit as you say. Things you've overlooked; 1 head to head (it matters); 2 Ospreys form (league positons prior to that match); 3 home advantage. Did I seriously just have to inFORM you of those things you should have considered? Complete naf way to try and prove a point.

Griff wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:However, just to add I (wrongly) assumed we'd get a big hiding at PYS tonight so at least I was wrong on that count. But so disappointing to be leading for most (maybe?) of the game and then not to come away with the win.

If you assumed that then clearly you haven't been watching the Scarlets this season. I just hope for your sake you didn't watch it on S4C with English commentary .

Form doesn't matter mate. Or should that be 'fam'?! We're prone to a thumping anywhere anytime from teams in or out of form. It was an away game and we're catastrophically sh*te away from home. You do the maths. Look at the bookies odds too. From watching the game I thought a win could have happened, but after the 18 point swing I'm quite happy to come away with 2 points. Were you expecting a win pre game or something?

Spot on.

LordDowlais wrote:

wayne wrote:Playing well dragons, I hope those missed kicks don't come back to haunt you

You just know they will.

Have any of you checked the Argentina V Australia game out ?

What a farce, who agreed to play this game at Twickenham ? Half empty stadium, absolutely no atmosphere what so ever, and a low quality game. Why the hell the Argies gave up home advantage for this is anyone's guess. They must be making more ££££'s than they would playing in Buenos Aires. But it cannot be that much, can it ?

Nice chat about Argentina on a different thread and all that, but how can you gob off about them giving up a home game, yet be such a Judgement Day fanboy when Dragons have to do the same? You are either forgetful of what you write, or a poor WUM. Either way Dowellais, at least people see your double standards again.

Sainty-Rascal , that dire Scarlets form is three wins from the last three. Over the last three games we have upped on our try count in each game. Best 'form' in Wales over the last three games. Jus' sayin' innit fam.

Yeah nice - beat the worst in the league in start talking yourself up, typical turk. Good luck in Europe, you'll need a lot of it.

Just watching the Saracens Wasps game now. It's almost like a different sport. The whole attitude to carrying the ball, the brutal phsyicality around it, and the constant desire to be confrontational to the opposition- whether with the ball, or in defence- is incredible in comparison the last night's game, which is frankly symbolic of a larger decline in Welsh rugby.

It's something fundamental. I didn't think I'd see the day where Welsh rugby was far more prescriptive and (negatively, boringly, self desctructively) structured with ball in hand than the English clubs. Think it could be a long and sorry decade in store for Wales. The club game is being left behind, and that will only impact on the national team as well, with the players unable to bridge the ever widening shortfall as they so often have had to do under Gatland.

Such a poor game last night. Both teams look dreadful. As it stands, only the Ospreys would not be obvious relegation candidates if they were playing in the English Premiership. Worrying times indeed, as the Scarlets have- on paper- a good team. I've never called for Pivac to go, but clearly the coaching isn't working. I'm not convinced by the Blues resurgence yet, let's review them at the end of the season. The Dragons are just a perenially poor with a few good individuals, despite upping their performance last night.

mikey_dragon wrote:Everything AOB does goes wrong. I can't fault the kids effort but like I've been saying for a while he's not good enough at this level.

Better than Priestland, a 48 times capped international, though, yeah?

What do you call a fam with no eyes?

mikey_dragon wrote: No idea

mikey_dragon wrote:No idea where Brixton is tbh with you.

Not surprised.

mikey_dragon wrote:Yeah nice - beat the worst in the league in start talking yourself up, typical turk. Good luck in Europe, you'll need a lot of it.

Simple statistics. Not any talking up involved.

Whilst classed as off form we have picked up 13 points in three matches, scoring 2 tries, then 3 tries, and then 4 tries.

Anyhow, the game was not as dire as I was expecting. The Dragons came at us, and kept it up for the full 80, and they didn't just roll over after dropping to being behind by two scores. We still need to practice how to catch a ball, and how to tackle. Sadly we have the top tier of Europe up next, and our best chance of a win up next week (Sale at home), but being the only side not to have raised the top tier euro trophy in the group, only a fool would expect anything other than one win (if that).

Regarding form you take into account performance and standard of opposition. There's quite the contrast between Scarlets and say Ospreys performances right now - with Scarlets being down the lower end of the scale. Interesting stats quoted by the commentary team during this match - Scarlets are among the lowest in the league for scrums complete, kicks at goal - there's the stats that are a good indicator of form.

If you've learnt anything new (which I doubt); Aled Davies is third of fourth choice 9 at best, Patchell is a full-back. Also it was probably Barclay who was MOTM, not Williams who took too long to get into the game and still wasn't as good as the shockingly biased commentary team made out. It was also rather cringeworthy how that whenever Barclay did something well (fairly often) they would mention James Davies in the same sentence.

Mikey, after watching it on tv this morning, I know why Parkes got his hair cut now too. It is so he can be mixed up with Scott easier, as the commentators often hit them mixed up too.

I agree Barclay was probably motm, his appearance on the pitch did make a difference. Not sure it was down to his physical impact on the game, but his mental impact on the Scarlets side. Ken is not a good choice for captain, he is far too emotionally invested in things (fan first, player second). Someone like Barclay or Hadleigh would pr.obavly be a better choice, especially when Emyr returns.

Jon Evs deserves a start next weekend, as he has shown well the last few times he has come on. His try looked very much like the sort of try Cawdor scores when on form. So I doubt that him and Cawdor will feature in the same 23 too often, as they play a similar style. Aled's strength is his pace of service, but this season he isn't whipping the ball out, but putting it to boot which isn't working.

I can't agree with you on Patch, he had a decent game, and was easily the best non-osprey fly half this weekend.

Also, on one of you favourite subjects, Cubby and Cudd clashed a few times and whether the figure support it or not, I'd say Cubby came out on top physically as he left Cudd down on the deck a few times.

I counted once. The time Cudd did it to Cubby off the back of a line out gone wrong, it wasn't shown as they were talking to Kingsley or Taylor, I can't quite remember. I just noted that they said he was smashed and eventually it lead to Amos setting up Warren's first try.

I was thinking of in the second half, they collided over a loose ball, Cubby secured it and Cudd stayed down with the magic sponge boys running on to get him back on his feet.

Oh right - well I don't remember anything else specific but Cudd looked pretty unfit for some reason. I guess it won't be long before Griffiths takes over.

miaow wrote:Just watching the Saracens Wasps game now. It's almost like a different sport. The whole attitude to carrying the ball, the brutal phsyicality around it, and the constant desire to be confrontational to the opposition- whether with the ball, or in defence- is incredible in comparison the last night's game, which is frankly symbolic of a larger decline in Welsh rugby.

It's something fundamental. I didn't think I'd see the day where Welsh rugby was far more prescriptive and (negatively, boringly, self desctructively) structured with ball in hand than the English clubs. Think it could be a long and sorry decade in store for Wales. The club game is being left behind, and that will only impact on the national team as well, with the players unable to bridge the ever widening shortfall as they so often have had to do under Gatland.

Such a poor game last night. Both teams look dreadful. As it stands, only the Ospreys would not be obvious relegation candidates if they were playing in the English Premiership. Worrying times indeed, as the Scarlets have- on paper- a good team. I've never called for Pivac to go, but clearly the coaching isn't working. I'm not convinced by the Blues resurgence yet, let's review them at the end of the season. The Dragons are just a perenially poor with a few good individuals, despite upping their performance last night.

Pretty much spot on. Watching it now myself. Ospreys best of of a bad bunch atm but they were dominated for large periods by Leinster and Ulcer, they'd be miles off the pace in the Aviva an' all. Pro rugby in Wales is finished inside if inside of a decade without massive change and a concerted effort towards establishing a British League.

Umm, comparing the top two teams in the premiership and probably Europe, to two of the worst in the pro12... Who the feic come up with that bonkers comparison? Idiocy at it's best.

Hmm looks like playing meaningful games every week has taken its toll on the Pro12 teams, I'm sure you guys will get used to it, just like the Aviva Prem clubs had too.

mikey_dragon wrote:Everything AOB does goes wrong.

Yes, his pass for Adam Warren's second try was shocking...

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Everything AOB does goes wrong.

Yes, his pass for Adam Warren's second try was shocking...

He's played a lot of top level games and hasn't moved forward, and obviously isn't good enough to play at this level - I doubt that he will be ready at any point in the near future. He plays below average every time I see him and you big him up over one pass - oh dear how very Turkish of you .

TightHEAD wrote:Hmm looks like playing meaningful games every week has taken its toll on the Pro12 teams, I'm sure you guys will get used to it, just like the Aviva Prem clubs had too.

Yeah, Bristol games are meaningful aren't' they....

mikey_dragon wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Everything AOB does goes wrong.

Yes, his pass for Adam Warren's second try was shocking...

He's played a lot of top level games and hasn't moved forward, and obviously isn't good enough to play at this level - I doubt that he will be ready at any point in the near future. He plays below average every time I see him and you big him up over one pass - oh dear how very Turkish of you .

If you didn't mean 'everything', you shouldn't have used the word.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Everything AOB does goes wrong.

Yes, his pass for Adam Warren's second try was shocking...

He's played a lot of top level games and hasn't moved forward, and obviously isn't good enough to play at this level - I doubt that he will be ready at any point in the near future. He plays below average every time I see him and you big him up over one pass - oh dear how very Turkish of you .

If you didn't mean 'everything', you shouldn't have used the word.

And if you're not a little b**ch then stop following me around here trying to pick up on spelling mistakes and sh*t. I got enough turk stalkers as it is. Of course if you are one of those then by all means carry on.

Follow you around? You're much less important to me than you seem to think you are. It might have escaped your attention that I created this thread.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Follow you around? You're much less important to me than you seem to think you are. It might have escaped your attention that I created this thread.

Ta-ra then.

munkian wrote:

TightHEAD wrote:Hmm looks like playing meaningful games every week has taken its toll on the Pro12 teams, I'm sure you guys will get used to it, just like the Aviva Prem clubs had too.

Yeah, Bristol games are meaningful aren't' they....

Just goes to show how small a player pool England have to pick from seeing as a club with Bristol's resources cannot find 15/20 players up to the standard of the Aviva Premiership.

How often do newly promoted clubs actually stay up ? Im guessing Exeter are the exception ?

Yeah, I guess Newcastle and Wuzz have managed it, Having watched them preseason I thought they had enough to be competitive from the off.

To be honest I think they miss Henson.

Yeah, he's still a very fine player, gutted he didn't come to the port.

mikey_dragon wrote:Umm, comparing the top two teams in the premiership and probably Europe, to two of the worst in the pro12... Who the feic come up with that bonkers comparison? Idiocy at it's best.

Scarlets were the best Welsh team last season, it's quite evidently a highly fitting comparison in that sense.

I'm also glad you recognise how far the Pro12 (including the Irish and Glasgow, but they've managed it better)- and in particular the Welsh regions- has fallen behind many of the English clubs, Wasps and Saracens being two good examples, in the last 3-4 seasons, and how it's a worrying trend that shows no signs of reversing. Make no mistake, part of the "Eddie Jones England Saviour" thing is due to the ramping up in quality and intensity the English Premiership has seen, particularly now with so many SH players playing in it post RWC '15.

I know you're obsessed with me, but at least try to engage your critical faculties when reading my posts, Saint...