Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

[Guest]

First topic message reminder :

Too early?!  Never mind.

So, big changes are afoot at Dave Parade.  There's been loads of arguments about the best way forward, the pros and cons of regional v club rugby, and I'm sure there'll be many more to come.  But what's done is done and, for now, we have a pro team at Dave Parade to support next year.  A few weeks ago even that was in jeopardy.  So moving forward...

Ownership:
So the WRU has taken over the reigns.  I'll add updates here as and when we know them, but the formal split from Newport RFC should mean 'cleaner' or more straightforward to understand revenue streams.  

Pitch:
A new one is being laid as we speak.  This original pitch has been part and parcel of the problems at RP for a number of years.  A BBC report showed it to be up there as the most used pitch pro pitch in the UK.  Something had to be done.  A fully synthetic pitch was mooted and preferred by some, a al Blues, Saracens, Glasgow, et al.  However, FA rules state that football clubs cannot play on these surfaces (probably since the AstroTurf days of Luton Town, etc.).  So it looks like a compromise has been agreed with a 4g semi-synthetic pitch, like those used by many football clubs, Swansea City/Ospreys, Millennium Stadium, Aviva Stadium, Twickenham, Murrayfield, Cardiff City stadium, etc.  A weave of synthetic fibres and real grass meaning it's easier to maintain, less prone to weather damage, but still sort of like the real thing.  This will be a real move forward and should improve the product on the field.  A bit.

Personnel:
New coach - Huw Jackman.  Comes with a good reputation for hard work and attacking rugby.  Good stuff.
Gavin Henson - I'm happy with this.  Despite his knockers, so to speak, he is still a classy club player and performed well in the English Prem with Bristol, when not injured.  Which is the crux of the issue.  Hopefully we can keep him fit for an extended run of games.
Zane Kirchner - On paper a quality player but as with a lot of good players, when they are in the twighlight of their careers and join a 'lesser' club more often than not they do not perform as expected.  Let's hope he is an exception to the rule.  Did Jackman and Kirchner play together at Leinster?


Transfers In:

Bernard 'No Pudding' Jackman - coach
Gavin Henson
Zane Kirchner

Transfers Out:
Shaun Knight
Nick Crosswell
Tom Prydie
Geraint Rhys Jones
Darren Harris
Craig Mitchell


New Badge:

[Guest]

You're not moving to Bristol and exaggerating, are you?

You mean back to Bristol? And no sadly, although I would like to live there again. Many fond memories and friends there. I'm going to Canada

Isn't that where Gwlad lives?! Waaaaaaait a minute...!

[RiscaGame]

Love Canada, particularly having gone to a lot of places there. Probably my most favourite to get tasked to. Where are you moving to?

I'm actually really looking forward to Saturday, although by no means do I think we will win. I just expect us to be better and it can't be worse than the corresponding fixture last season. There's certainly more of a positive vibe about the place than there was around that game anyway.

I suspect the team will be similar to (judging by the SWA article on Henson today and pre-season games).

Kirchener, Hewitt, Morgan, Beard, Amos, Henson, Pretorious, Harris, Dee, Brown, Hill, Screech, Thomas, Griffiths, Benjamin

Buckley, Davies, Fairbrother, Landman, Cudd, Davies, AOB, Warren

[Luckless Pedestrian]

I really hope Elliot Dee stays injury-free this season, he's had no luck at all.

I've never visited Canada but I'd love to go. My Dad's best man moved to Delta, so I'd probably start there, if I ever had the money.

[Kingshu]

Nice article on the 42.ie about jackman and the dragons, he says attack will take a year and defense a year and a half but is overall very positive about building up the team, also say dragons will play the 4-2-4 so we shoild get attacking rugby.
I think that this relies on a ball playing lock to do effectively, do the Dragons have a lock with a good range of passing skills that can fill this role. Its noteable how connacht struggled with it when mcsomething left last year?

[mikey_dragon]

Gwlad sure is in Canada but I think it's Victoria? He isn't particularly fond of where I'm going. I'll be going to Calgary in Alberta. The state is underpopulated so jobs there are well paid and I have family there to help me get set up. The rugby community in Calgary is very strong and there's a few more brits there as well. A few boys from up your way have likely been there playing rugby throughout the summer Risca, and I bet a few more will be going in the near future. Recruitment from South Wales has stagnated in recent years though.

I like that team Risca, backline is pretty good. I knew we were light at LH so I guess Harris is there permanently? I don't rate Benjamin so I would rather Cudd at 7 and Griffiths to 8; he's a very explosive carrier and an all-round class player in general. I'd also prefer to see an academy 9 on the bench in place of Davies. The boys in pre-season looked alright and they can't be worse than Knoyle.

[RiscaGame]

I was pretty close to chucking my ticket in with work and moving to Calgary myself around ten years ago. Just didn't have the balls to do so. It's my favourite city personally, out of all the places I've been to in Canada and it's the one we fly to most so I always try and get on those tasks. I even found a rugby team on a night out.

I only assume Benjamin will play there, the way he has been talked up by Jackman. Jackman did also say in the Argus that he rates Harris as the best loosehead currently. It would appear that he rates Brown as his number two tighthead (meaning that Harris is also his best tighthead), but I guess he considers his number two tighthead to be better than his number two loosehead and so Brown will play a fair bit. Be interesting to see what happens when Hobbs is fit.

[munkian]

Nice article on the 42.ie about jackman and the dragons, he says attack will take a year and defense a year and a half but is overall very positive about building up the team, also say dragons will play the 4-2-4 so we shoild get attacking rugby.
I think that this relies on a ball playing lock to do effectively, do the Dragons have a lock with a good range of passing skills that can fill this role. Its noteable how connacht struggled with it when mcsomething left last year?

Cheers for the article heads up, had to correct them on KO time though

Rynard Landman is hard carrying old school lock - I wouldn't exactly say he has 'soft hands' though.

Cory Hill(of Lions 'fame') is a decent enough player and hopefully time with Wales/Lions will of improved him.

My concern is we've had flankers play at 4/5 in previous seasons and it really hasn't helped our creaking scrum.

Hopefully, if we show some solid improvement this season we will be able to recruit some ballast in our tight 5 next season.

We do, however have some two prospects at hooker and prop in Elliot Dee and Leon Brown.

[mikey_dragon]

I was pretty close to chucking my ticket in with work and moving to Calgary myself around ten years ago. Just didn't have the balls to do so. It's my favourite city personally, out of all the places I've been to in Canada and it's the one we fly to most so I always try and get on those tasks. I even found a rugby team on a night out.

I only assume Benjamin will play there, the way he has been talked up by Jackman. Jackman did also say in the Argus that he rates Harris as the best loosehead currently. It would appear that he rates Brown as his number two tighthead (meaning that Harris is also his best tighthead), but I guess he considers his number two tighthead to be better than his number two loosehead and so Brown will play a fair bit. Be interesting to see what happens when Hobbs is fit.

If you play rugby and like cowboys you'll have a good time there . It might have been Calgary Irish, Rams or Hornets you seen if they were local. My team are Rams who play in blue and white.

That's fair if it's Jackman's perspective but I think the other back-row option will makes us more competitive and more of a nuisance at the breakdown.

[mikey_dragon]

Hmm I don't remember much about Steve Jones but good luck to him. He could be the next Lyn Jones if he puts his mind to it...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41096463

[munkian]

Hmm I don't remember much about Steve Jones but good luck to him. He could be the next Lyn Jones if he puts his mind to it...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41096463

You don't remember Jabba ?

[Luckless Pedestrian]

The Argus is reporting that Henson will start at 10 on Saturday.

[mikey_dragon]

I read it on the BBC too, but I'm wondering why they haven't mentioned the other 22 players...

[Guest]

Hmm I don't remember much about Steve Jones but good luck to him. He could be the next Lyn Jones if he puts his mind to it...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41096463

You don't remember Jabba ?

 I concur, how could you not remember Jabba?! Such a legend he has his own 'bar' on the north terrace!

[international198]

I don't understand why the Dragons always seem to be the bottom Welsh region. Do they have less of a budget than the other three Welsh regions?

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Dragons: Z Kirchner, A Hewitt, T Morgan, J Dixon, H Amos, G Henson, C Davies, B Harris, E Dee, L Brown, M Screech, C Hill, J Thomas, J Benjamin, H Keddie. Replacements: R Buckley, L Garrett, L Fairbrother, R Landman, M Williams, T Knoyle, A O'Brien, J Rosser.

Leinster: R Kearney, A Byrne, R O’Loughlin, I Nacewa (captain), J Larmour, R Byrne, J Gibson-Park, C Healy, S Cronin, M Bent, D Toner, S Fardy, D Leavy, J van der Flier, M Deegan. Replacements: J Tracy, E Byrne, A Porter, J Ryan, J Conan, N McCarthy, C Marsh, B Daly

[Guest]

That strikes me as quite a young team (with players like Henson and Harris the exceptions).  One for the future, perhaps?  

I've never been convinced by Screech. Where's Ollie Griffiths?  Injured?  I rate him very highly.  But apart from that I quite like the look of the team.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Loads of local young players there - I make it 9 of the starting XV and another four on the bench (I don't know where Rhys Buckley's from).

I think Ollie Griffiths had a knock to his hip so they must be looking after him.

[munkian]

That strikes me as quite a young team (with players like Henson and Harris the exceptions).  One for the future, perhaps?  

I've never been convinced by Screech. Where's Ollie Griffiths?  Injured?  I rate him very highly.  But apart from that I quite like the look of the team.

Good backline.

I think Griffiths is carrying a knock as is Pretorius. I'd love to get Evans back from the Turks and ditch Knoyle.

[Guest]

That strikes me as quite a young team (with players like Henson and Harris the exceptions).  One for the future, perhaps?  

I've never been convinced by Screech. Where's Ollie Griffiths?  Injured?  I rate him very highly.  But apart from that I quite like the look of the team.

Good backline.

I think Griffiths is carrying a knock as is Pretorius. I'd love to get Evans back from the Turks and ditch Knoyle.

Definitely. Evans is class. And he's not exactly first choice at Scarlets. I think he's experienced enough and good enough to be the no.1 no.9 at a region, the obvious one being us! I can understand from his point of view why he might want to be at a team who has won the league and is playing in the champions cup though.

[Guest]

On the team, there's a lot of players there that at various times over the past few seasons we've been shouting "Give X a go! Give youth a chance! Build for the future!", and now all of a sudden the new coach has given them all a go at the same time and I'm wondering is it too much! Ha! Can never please me!!!

[Luckless Pedestrian]

I think in some instances he's had to go with a younger player - I think Sam Beard probably would have started, for example. But I do think there's been a shift, and that we were too hesitant before.

[munkian]

Leon and Dee starting against Leinster is a big statement, hope they cement their places this year.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

I hope Dee can stay fit. It pains me to see Scott Baldwin racking up the caps.

[Guest]

I'm not expecting us to beat Leinster, but if we do lose it would be great if we gave them a bl00dy good game and a bit of a scare and at least a losing BP. It's a sunny evening, a new pitch, a youthful backline with bags of pace - perfect conditions for some running rugby. Just some excitement for the fans would be ace and would give us some hope going forward.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

With Hewitt and Amos back we've got two players that can create something from nothing. We really did miss their creativity last season.

I'm not expecting miracles, but at least there's some actual grounds for optimism now, not just blind faith.

I think we'll score tries tomorrow, but I worry we'll concede more.

[munkian]

I see PhilBB has been trolling nearly every single Dragon's tweet bless him.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Of course he has.

[Kingshu]

Link to last article that I though was interesting and how Jackman plans to build Dragons and the 2-4-2 system
http://www.the42.ie/bernard-jackman-france-dragons-grenoble-3570403-Aug2017/

also to to the Leinster game
http://www.the42.ie/gavin-henson-kirchner-dragons-leinster-3576350-Sep2017/
says "a big crowd is expected on Saturday to witness what they hope will be the start of something special in south east Wales."
I do hope there is a big crowd and there is excitement for Dragons future.
Always though they have the best base to improve from, also the Pro 12/14 does allow teams to improve and top it quickly, like Glasgow around 2011 and Connacht last year, even Scarlets to a lesser extent. Dragons could be next?

[munkian]

Link to last article that I though was interesting and how Jackman plans to build Dragons and the 2-4-2 system
http://www.the42.ie/bernard-jackman-france-dragons-grenoble-3570403-Aug2017/

also to to the Leinster game
http://www.the42.ie/gavin-henson-kirchner-dragons-leinster-3576350-Sep2017/
says "a big crowd is expected on Saturday to witness what they hope will be the start of something special in south east Wales."
I do hope there is a big crowd and there is excitement for Dragons future.
Always though they have the best base to improve from, also the Pro 12/14 does allow teams to improve and top it quickly, like Glasgow around 2011 and Connacht last year, even Scarlets to a lesser extent. Dragons could be next?

Some good positive stuff coming from Jackman and he seems very willing to engage the fans and listens to feedback.

Baby steps for me - getting into top 6 will be a huge step forward for us.

[RiscaGame]

Getting a big crowd is a little ambitious, seeing as the game clashes with pretty much every other rugby game in the region. Some people might choose to miss their club's game (like me), but others won't and you can't blame them for that.

In no way do I think we will win, but I think we will have a good go today. Really want to see our backs allowed to play and not just have to kick the ball to the opposition. Haven't looked forward to a season like this, in ages. Even though things will take a while to fix, I do feel like it's the start of something better for us.

[Stone Motif]

Getting a big crowd is a little ambitious, seeing as the game clashes with pretty much every other rugby game in the region. Some people might choose to miss their club's game (like me), but others won't and you can't blame them for that.

In no way do I think we will win, but I think we will have a good go today. Really want to see our backs allowed to play and not just have to kick the ball to the opposition. Haven't looked forward to a season like this, in ages. Even though things will take a while to fix, I do feel like it's the start of something better for us.

See, targeting people who already watch a club regularly is where all this goes wrong. It's easier to get someone to start a habit than break one.

[RiscaGame]

I wasn't really thinking of new supporters, more existing ones. As an example everybody I normally go with can't go today.

That said, I guess they're a ticket sold still so the first part of my post is irrelevant. In terms of numbers actually attending, I can't imagine it being great.

[Guest]

Hmmm.  Pitch looked nice!

[Stone Motif]

Well, we looked better organised except in defence, and that is gonna take time because when you're getting bodies off-the floor ours are always going to have come off second best in a bunch of collisions. We have no carrying threat in the forwards at all...but that has been the same old story for donkeys. Jackman won't hang that without a budget to recruit. Negatives were then same old, some players particularly the backs looked like they'd packed on some beef, but still a warning the pace setters physically. James B a case in point, played well, right place right time on a few occasions, but man handled in others. Brave, but you can't put in what the gene pool left out.

[munkian]

The Dave is looking brilliant, fantastic atmosphere and seemed much more professional than previous seasons.

Was hoping for a better performance but can't expect miracles just yet. Gutted that Cudd is out for the season but I'm glad that the young players put their hands up. I think Griffiths will be back next game as will Sarrel.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

The thing that was noticeable to me was that we either played one-up rugby or threw it wide - there was no inbetween (apart from a really nice pass out of the tackle from Leon Brown). In the second half especially, when Leinster had the ball there was always someone offering an angle, whereas we were far easier for their defence to contain.

There's been a lot of talk about this new defence coach, but Shaun Connor will need to come under more scrutiny if we don't start seeing more of a cutting edge.

Speaking of cutting edge, Hallam Amos was literally crying out for the ball at times on Saturday, but it was still just going to the nearest forward. When you've got a player as dangerous as he is, you put the ball in his hands as often as you can.

[Stone Motif]

The thing that was noticeable to me was that we either played one-up rugby or threw it wide - there was no inbetween (apart from a really nice pass out of the tackle from Leon Brown). In the second half especially, when Leinster had the ball there was always someone offering an angle, whereas we were far easier for their defence to contain.

There's been a lot of talk about this new defence coach, but Shaun Connor will need to come under more scrutiny if we don't start seeing more of a cutting edge.

Speaking of cutting edge, Hallam Amos was literally crying out for the ball at times on Saturday, but it was still just going to the nearest forward. When you've got a player as dangerous as he is, you put the ball in his hands as often as you can.

I'd flip that on its head, we can't go wide especially against teams as well drilled as Leinster, without the threat of those one up forward carries around the fringes to fix the defence and make space out wide. There's only a few players in the pack who have the power for that unfortunately...Griffiths, Benjamin possibly in that he has quick feet (he's not an eight tho), Max Williams looks like he had he athleticism. I'd almost throw Robson Blake in at eight if he can catch just to have a lump we can throw at the line. Don't think Keddie is going to make is as an eight, hasn't got the power at this level.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

My point was that it was either one or the other. They kept us guessing, whereas we were easier to read.

I thought Max Williams was very good when he came on. He knew how to fix a defender, which is more than you can say about most backs these days.

You might be right about Robson Blake. He'd be most likely to get us over the gainline. It's a shame we don't have Jack Condy as an option too.

[mikey_dragon]

I like Max Williams too. I've seen him at my gym a few times, I think he still catches the bus there! He's a lock, but should concentrate on 6 for now, I'd like to see more of him there. At age 18/19 he should bulk up. I don't know much about Robson Blake but is it true he's 130kg? Sign the guy up!

RE the game, I wasn't happy that I waited in that ticket queue to watch that! I feel for the people who pre-paid, I believe there should be an option for them to print their tickets rather than collect them, the Leinster fans said they have that option for home games. I also had my reservations about starting Screech over Landman. AOB still can't tackle, you can't play at semi-pro level if you can't tackle never mind this level. No go forward at all, Leinster had that in abundance. Tyler Morgan really seems to have stagnated, can anyone see him ever getting back to the level he was once at?

[RiscaGame]

It's very annoying about Tyler, as our best centre is always Beard, yet Tyler seems to be the one getting the opportunities all the time.
Screech looked very bulked up the other day. I wish Landman would get back to where he was, as I feel we'd have a good lock partnership with an in form Landman and Hill.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

That might be the way it'll go now. He's a dual-contract player and the WRU will want their man playing. I think Beard is an excellent player in that he always seems to make the right decision.

[munkian]

When Tyler was put on a DC he was in sparkling form but since then injury and imagine poor coaching have hampered that.

[mikey_dragon]

I would try Beard at 12 and Morgan at 13. Any idea when McLeod, Sarel and Griffiths are back?

[Luckless Pedestrian]

I don't know about Mcleod but the other two could be back for the Edinburgh game.

[munkian]

[mikey_dragon]

Looks like some of my proposed changes have come in. Are all of our other 7s injured or does Jackman have a crush on Benjamin?

[munkian]

Looks like some of my proposed changes have come in. Are all of our other 7s injured or does Jackman have a crush on Benjamin?

Cudd long term crocked

Griffiths hopefully back against Craggy Island (along with Sarel)

Do we have any others ?

[Stone Motif]

Looks like some of my proposed changes have come in. Are all of our other 7s injured or does Jackman have a crush on Benjamin?

Perhaps in the context of trying to implement a more expansive game plan, it's not a crush he just wanted to include one of our few forwards that can pass and step?

[BamBam]

Forwards that pass and step?! Blasphemy

[mikey_dragon]

Looks like some of my proposed changes have come in. Are all of our other 7s injured or does Jackman have a crush on Benjamin?

Perhaps in the context of trying to implement a more expansive game plan, it's not a crush he just wanted to include one of our few forwards that can pass and step?

You can't play expansivley when you get duffed up front. I remember you having a crush on Benjamin now as well actually.

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