October-November - Asian swing/European indoor season

First topic message reminder :

Noticed that other than the Kyrgios thread there's not much discussion about the tournaments going on this season - 606 gone into early hibernation?  We may have had the last slam of the season and Nadal may have sewn up number 1 spot, but there's still plenty going.  To recap so far:

Goffin's proved to be one of the form players, bagging the Shenzhen Open and Japan Open titles - bodes well for the forthcoming Davis Cup final (as long as he doesn't over-play!).  Nadal won the China Open, whilst Istomin won a rare title (only his 2nd) at Chengdu.

For the end of season masters in London, looks like Goffin's in good shout with chance to qualify and I think Querrey may just sneak in ahead of Anderson - http://www.atpworldtour.com/en/rankings/singles-race-to-london

Delpo an outside shout for final WTF place.

Would very much prefer him to PCB or Querrey.

Just 62 mins for Fed tonight as he beats Tiafoe 1 and 3. Managed to win ALL his points when he got his first serve in.
   Next up for Rog is Benoit Paire. 
   Kyle Edmond had a good straight-sets win over Ferrer in Vienna.

Didn't see Federer's clearly comfortable win, but Tiafoe - who had of course pushed Fed so close at USO - given praise in match reports for some spells of good shot-making, with more signs that he is one to watch for future success.

Seen a few clips from Fed match. Tiafoe, still a teenager, looks good. Big serve and big ground strokes. 
   Fed seems very relaxed on court. Attacking but controlled and prepared to rally. Serve very dominant at present which suggests back troubles are over.

@sfp - indeed !

Very young, promising guys like Tiafoe will in many ways be glad to see the back of Federer ; but - for as long as he continues to ply his trade - there is much they can learn from him. Being on the same court as Fed must be something of a privilege for anyone who has just entered the upper tier of the professional ranks, in the very early stages of their tennis career.

Delpo wins again in Basel, while Kyle Edmund needs three sets and nearly three hours to beat Austrian qualifier in Vienna.
   Coric takes Cilic to a third set in all-Croatian clash.


Later: Cilic thru 6-3 in third. Federer match coming up.

Benoit Paire takes just four games from Federer and so once again fails to win a set v the maestro.

The big contenders (other than Fed himself) for the trophy are also safely through - Cilic and Del Potro - as mentioned by sfp.

Just 57 mins taken by Fed tonight. Keeping himself fresh. At this rate he might even consider playing Paris.

Edmund has just beaten J-L Struff in straight sets. Presumably Struff did not strut his stuff quite well enough.

Sounds like a bit of a struffing.

Delpo wins in two hours (6-4 in the third) against RBA. Improves his chances of making the 02.

Federer v Goffin, Del Potro vs Cilic.

Just seen some highlights of last night's Fed match. Mannarino played very well, getting everything back and making few UEs. Could so easily have won if Fed had not played amazing baseline backhand half-volley a BP down in the final set.
   Delpo, apparently, has a back problem but is playing a guy who took more than three hours to win yesterday. Bad news for Goffin is that Fed has probably got his "bad" match out of the way. 
   Delpo and Tsonga, playing in Vienna, are both pushing hard for a place in the 02. Much could depend on how the Paris draw pans out.

Del Potro through to the Final. If can beat Federer, he will make it to O2.

So a Delpo-Fed final which, I seem to recall, has happened before in Basel. Delpo is one of the few players who consistently troubles Fed so it could go either way. Fed could be the fresher of the two, particularly after his demolition of Goffin.
   I see both Rafa and Rog are in the draw for Paris. But will both play?

Edmund lost in semi-finals at Vienna in end to Pouille - didn't disgrace himself though, losing in 3 tight sets http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/41789257

Edmund has yet to reach an ATP final, although I feel he will do so at some point during one of the outdoor hardcourt tournaments next year.

Federer wins Basel. More work for DelPo for a spot at O2.

Two hours 31 mins for the Fed win today. Wonder if the punishing schedule finally caught up with delpo. Both he and Tsonga lost their finals today so may be pushed to make the 02 now.

Federer angrily bashed the net with his racquet after missing out on a BP, while Delpo, according to reports, had angry exchanges with the umpire at the end of the second set.
   Fed should have taken the opening set as he was ahead in the tiebreak. The crucial thing was probably his saving of BPs in the second set. 
   Fed said before the final he did not really think the number one spot was possible, so he could well pull out of Paris.

sirfredperry wrote:Two hours 31 mins for the Fed win today. Wonder if the punishing schedule finally caught up with delpo. Both he and Tsonga lost their finals today so may be pushed to make the 02 now.

Maybe.  But was Delpo's schedule really THAT punishing ......

Delpo has played 51 ATP/Slam matches this season (was he involved in any DC at all ...?) - which is two fewer than Federer.

Couldn't see the Final, but reports indicate that (although lots of entertainment for the crowd) neither player was at his best, hence the seesaw pattern, and succession of breaks.

Not sure if there are many new plaudits to be given to Federer, but his resurgence and 2017 achievements, all at the age of 36, have been quite ridiculous :  2 x Slams, 3 x Masters, and 2 x 500's. He has played other top tenners 12 times so far and lost only one of them. It really is amazing stuff.

This latest Basel win puts him into clear second place with 95 career titles. Connors' all-time record (109) still looks very safe - but even Jimbo wasn't reeling off wins at this pace, at this sort of age.

Would be very surprised if he plays Paris. I suspect he will take some time out and re-charge the batteries for London which he certainly won't want to miss, after last year's enforced break in consecutive WTF appearances.

Federer Reacts To Winning Eighth Basel Title

Federer not playing Paris. (3:40+ on the video). Pouille will replace Federer.

Just watched highlights of the Basel final. Probably the best game Fed played was the ninth in the first set when he hit four incredible winners - only to drop serve when serving for the set next game!
   Still think delpo is suffering from the fact that he can't really hit through his backhand. More than makes up with it with that monster FH, though. Reckon he was pretty tired at the end.
   Unlikely that Fed was going to play Basel, Paris and the 02. He has a special affection for Basel, so it was Paris that had to miss out.
   A good clutch of points at the 02 will enable Fed to cherry pick his tournaments again next year. He and Rafa are a long way ahead at the top.
   So yet another tournament win for a 30-something. Has the annual record for 30+ titles been broken yet? What is the record?

lags72 wrote:

sirfredperry wrote:Two hours 31 mins for the Fed win today. Wonder if the punishing schedule finally caught up with delpo. Both he and Tsonga lost their finals today so may be pushed to make the 02 now.

Maybe.  But was Delpo's schedule really THAT punishing ......

Delpo has played 51 ATP/Slam matches this season (was he involved in any DC at all ...?) - which is two fewer than Federer.

Couldn't see the Final, but reports indicate that (although lots of entertainment for the crowd) neither player was at his best, hence the seesaw pattern, and succession of breaks.

Not sure if there are many new plaudits to be given to Federer, but his resurgence and 2017 achievements, all at the age of 36, have been quite ridiculous :  2 x Slams, 3 x Masters, and 2 x 500's. He has played other top tenners 12 times so far and lost only one of them. It really is amazing stuff.

This latest Basel win puts him into clear second place with 95 career titles. Connors' all-time record (109) still looks very safe - but even Jimbo wasn't reeling off wins at this pace, at this sort of age.

Would be very surprised if he plays Paris. I suspect he will take some time out and re-charge the batteries for London which he certainly won't want to miss, after last year's enforced break in consecutive WTF appearances.

Delpo hasn't played a load of matches for the whole season, but played Shanghai (SF), Stockholm (W) and Basel (F) in consecutive weeks, will now play Paris where I think he needs to reach at least SF to stand a chance of O2 qualification.

The seeds are dropping like flies in Paris. Goffin, Dimi, Thiem and Zverev now all out. The last two places at the 02 are still up for grabs.
   Latest: Pouille now out. Even Sock and Isner (both have to win it to have a chance) are now in the 02 running.

I think it is all about delpo

Nadal out of Paris now and possibly the world tour finals. Aside from the kudos due to Federer and Nadal for their big wins in 2017 I think this has been a pretty woeful year for mens tennis. It has really lacked drama from start to finish.

With Djokovic, Murray, Wawrinka, Nishikori among others all in awful form / injured it has been such an anti climax. Watching the much poorer quality this year really drives home for me how incredible the level of tennis was from 2008 - 2015 in particular. During all those years there were so many epic battles between the top 4 in particular but this year has been woeful.

I am also very disappointed in the next generation. I really thought they would have kicked on more and the fact that Federer and Nadal won their slams with relative ease maybe shows us a real weakness in the younger generation. Even back in those years before 2015 you had the likes of Nishikori, Ferrer, Tsonga, Berdych who were a level or two below the top guys but they still were able to cause problems for the top players on any given day. That just doesn't appear to be the case with the next gen.

Granted Thiem had his great win over Novak at the French open but Djokovics form was atrocious and that was one of the worst performances I had ever seen from him.

Here is hoping a healthy return for the likes of Novak, Wawrinka, Murray to make it much more entertaining and competitive in 2018.

The fact that I haven't switched on tennis since Wimbledon says it all for me. Even at that I thought Wimbledon was abysmal this year

Rafa now a doubt for the 02 although no definite word on that yet. Twould be a pity if he could not play.
   You do wonder why he chucked in a tournament just before Shanghai. He still seems to struggle to sort out a sensible schedule.
   Chance now for Isner, or even Sock, to make the 02 although there may be reprieve for delpo if Rafa is forced out thru injury.
   I can see SlasherMc's frustration with this injury-hit season. Really, the most dramatic tennis was done and dusted by the end of the AO. Much to enjoy for Rog and Rafa fans, though and, as with all sport, there's always next year to look forward to.

I think the anticlimactic feeling got more as the season went on and more players fell by the wayside.

It would be a shame for Rafa if he has to miss the ATP or alternatively if he plays it without being fully fit, since it's not an even he can win at 90% fitness, not with Federer's current form.

If he was 100% fit this would be a real chance for him with so many players missing, and one of his last big chances. Granted it's difficult to see how he could beat Federer in a 3-set indoors at the moment.

Federer masters record this season was won 3 events out of 4 entered.
Rafa wins 2 out of 9 entered.
That's a very big difference.
Federer the best player of the season at masters events.

Federer 3
Rafa 2
Zverev 2
Dimitrov 1
TBD 1

Can't help but think Rafa went into Paris just to get the one win needed to ensure YE No 1, even if he misses the O2. Certainly he wouldn't have been expecting to win the O2 if carrying an injury so playing Paris, getting the win, then withdrawing, was probably quite a shrewd move.

Doubt if there's ever been such a remarkable set of semi finalists for a 1,000-pointer as we have in Paris today. 
   Fatigue often seems to hit players at Paris. I recall Henman winning it in 2003. He was fresh after being injured and beat a host of guys who were totally knackered.

Benneteau's run is a very clear indication of Paris decimation.

Isner out and Sock through. Can't say I'm too disappointed to see Isner not make the O2. Very one dimensional. Nothing against the guy. A fighter and a bloke who's made the most of what he has. But rarely breaks serve and gets by on tiebreaks. Win the breakers against him and you've won the match.
   Paris always seems a tournament too far. Players are exhausted and you get some strange results.

Kajinovic has to be the story of the season - prior to Paris he had played 2 main draw matches in Moscow and had otherwise played Challengers and quails. In a career stretching back to 2008, he's only won 17 matches total on the main tour. OK, he's been in very good form in the Challengers, winning 5 in the last 6 months, but it is some remarkable step up to make the Paris MS final including beating Isner.

So Jack Sock wins the tournament no one seemed to want to win. Up to 9th in the rankings and so qualifies for the WTFs with Stan definitely missing. Pushes PCB down to 10th and the replacement should Rafa withdraw, meaning Del Potro falls short (by20 points).

Edmund must be kicking himself having been 5-1 up against Sock in the 2nd round...

Well done, Sock. Bad news for delpo who probably has no chance now as he is not even first reserve. Delpo's absence is good news for those that have qualified. He would probably have been a major handful in London.

Wow, I don't even know how to pronounce the name of the losing finalist. What an open tournament. To think Sock was at 4-6 6-6 against Edmund and later at 4-6 6-6 1-5 and that was in his first match, and then he wins the tournament. I've noticed this pattern a few times this year. A player very nearly losing their first match and then wins the tournament.

Interesting that Murray is only as low as 16th having not played for months. The other absentees, although far behind the top two, are not that distant from anyone from number three downwards, thanks to Rafa and Rog hoovering up most of the big points.
  Much will depend on Andy's fitness and Novak's motivation, but it's possible the Big Four will actually be the top four this time next year.

Speaking of Andy's fitness level ...... he is playing Federer later today in Glasgow.

Scotland isn't a regular feature of the Fed schedule  

Not sure what we will learn (if anything ....?!) from a charity match but perhaps some idea - however limited - of how his recuperation /rehab is progressing.

It is certainly going to make the draws more interesting. Usually, we analyze the draws and debate whether Nadal's R2 opponent in a slam is harder than Murray's, but the reality of it is usually these things even out. However, next year, that may not be the case at all.

Scottish crowd may be in jokey mood but both players are going at this charity exho very seriously. Some fine play in this first set.

Not surprisingly, it's a packed house, given that Andy's opponent is reasonably well known

This is positively surreal.

R. Federer is now wearing - and playing in - a kilt. I kid you not.

Well, Andy M has emerged relatively unscathed from his charity match with that well-known, kilt-wearing Scotsman Roger (Mc)Federer.
   Andy said that there were still some hip problems and he would not completely confirm that he would be back at the beginning of next year. But he seemed quite positive, said he was moving in the right direction and was hopeful of a return at Brisbane in January.
   Quite rightly, he said it could be a while before he's back to his best but that he was delighted to be playing again. 
   From the clips I've seen, Andy looked to be moving OK and hitting the ball well.

Draw has been made for the 02 year-end finals.

Rafa has - Thiem, Dimi and Goffin
Rog has - Cilic, Zverev, Sock

It would be a surprise if either of the top two didn't make the semis, although Rafa's fitness could come into play.

I think Andy was moving - and striking - just about as well as you could reasonably expect after such a layoff. He was looking pretty sharp, I thought and made Federer work for the win (even if it was just an exho)

Good event for both of them : gave Andy a clear idea of 'where he is' with the rehab ; useful prep for Fed ahead of WTF.

lags72 wrote:This is positively surreal.

R. Federer is now wearing - and playing in - a kilt. I kid you not.

Well good for him - I like the way he does exhibitions against so many of the top guys, it's not just Rafa, and the crowds seem to love it. It looks from my distance as if it's a good way of bringing the top guys to recognise their common interests, and the best interests of their sport as well as giving fun and raising some money. The Laver Cup seems to have been a similar thing - it will be interesting to see if it survives his career.

On what we see so far, what's not to like.

@barrystar

Federer's just tweeted he's starting at 2pm on Sunday v Sock at the 02. Means his group, if I'm right, will play Sun, Tues and Thurs, with the top two getting Friday off before the semi on Saturday.
   Mind you, last year Murray had tough group plus an exhausting three hour 38 minute semi and still beat Djoko who had an absolute cakewalk to the final.

sirfredperry wrote:Federer's just tweeted he's starting at 2pm on Sunday v Sock at the 02. Means his group, if I'm right, will play Sun, Tues and Thurs, with the top two getting Friday off before the semi on Saturday.
   Mind you, last year Murray had tough group plus an exhausting three hour 38 minute semi and still beat Djoko who had an absolute cakewalk to the final.

That sounds wrong, ATP website says Federer's group are starting on Monday, and Nadal's are starting on Sunday - all this seems to be taking the limelight away from the 'sexy' NextGen tournament.