Pro14 Round 8 - the round that the medjia forget

by thebandwagonsociety Wed 31 Oct 2018, 6:14 pm

Leinster Rugby squad to travel to South Africa this evening ahead of Sunday’s Guinness PRO14 Round 8 match against the Southern Kings (KO 2.45pm local/12.45pm Irish, live on eir Sport) has been announced.

Backs (12)

Adam Byrne (40 Leinster Rugby caps)
Tom Daly (10)
Ciarán Frawley (3)*
Jamison Gibson-Park (57)
Dave Kearney (125)
Hugo Keenan (2)*
Conor O’Brien (4)*
Jimmy O’Brien (0)*
Rory O’Loughlin (47)
Hugh O’Sullivan (2)*
Noel Reid (104)
Joe Tomane (8)

Forwards (15)

Vakh Abdaladze (2)
Michael Bent (109)
Bryan Byrne (29)
Ed Byrne (27)
Max Deegan (26)
Peter Dooley (51)
Caelan Doris (3)
Scott Fardy (28)
Mick Kearney (39)
Rónan Kelleher (0)*
Dan Leavy (57)
Ross Molony (68)
Josh Murphy (11)
Scott Penny (0)*
James Tracy (74)

*Denotes Leinster Rugby Academy.

If Leinster even manage to get a LBP I'd be very surprised.

by carpet baboon Wed 31 Oct 2018, 7:10 pm

How's Vakh been doing? Saw him for the under 20s a few years back and he was a bit of a monster

by Pot Hale Sun 04 Nov 2018, 6:47 pm

Good going by the Irish and Scottish teams - 100% wins despite losing a lot of players to test matches.

by VinceWLB Sun 04 Nov 2018, 10:50 pm

Pot Hale wrote:Good going by the Irish and Scottish teams - 100% wins despite losing a lot of players to test matches.

No team is affected as badly as Benetton if you consider travel on top of players lost to internationals.

This is killing the competition.

by Artful_Dodger Sun 04 Nov 2018, 11:14 pm

VinceWLB wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:Good going by the Irish and Scottish teams - 100% wins despite losing a lot of players to test matches.

No team is affected as badly as Benetton if you consider travel on top of players lost to internationals.

This is killing the competition.

It's killing the competition that around half of Italy's squad comes from one of their professional teams (Benetton) and around half from their other professional team (Zebre)???

16 of the Italy squad for their autumn internationals come from Benetton, 13 come from Zebre. It is also demonstrably false that they lose the most players as Leinster have 19 of their players with the Ireland squad right now.

How would you stop this "killing of the competition" you speak of? Perhaps Italy shouldn't be allowed to call up players from their domestic sides?

This is honestly one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen on here.

by VinceWLB Sun 04 Nov 2018, 11:34 pm

Artful_Dodger wrote:
It's killing the competition that around half of Italy's squad comes from one of their professional teams (Benetton) and around half from their other professional team (Zebre)???

16 of the Italy squad for their autumn internationals come from Benetton, 13 come from Zebre. It is also demonstrably false that they lose the most players as Leinster have 19 of their players with the Ireland squad right now.

How would you stop this "killing of the competition" you speak of? Perhaps Italy shouldn't be allowed to call up players from their domestic sides?

This is honestly one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen on here.

Look a Treviso crowd numbers.. Having talked to some of their fans i know how they feel about the competition, first hand.

They have realistically no chance to qualify for the play off the way the season is structured, unless they go full Montpellier with a team full of imports.

by Artful_Dodger Sun 04 Nov 2018, 11:40 pm

VinceWLB wrote:
Artful_Dodger wrote:
It's killing the competition that around half of Italy's squad comes from one of their professional teams (Benetton) and around half from their other professional team (Zebre)???

16 of the Italy squad for their autumn internationals come from Benetton, 13 come from Zebre. It is also demonstrably false that they lose the most players as Leinster have 19 of their players with the Ireland squad right now.

How would you stop this "killing of the competition" you speak of? Perhaps Italy shouldn't be allowed to call up players from their domestic sides?

This is honestly one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen on here.

Look a Treviso crowd numbers.. Having talked to some of their fans i know how they feel about the competition, first hand.

They have realistically no chance to qualify for the play off the way the season is structured, unless they go full Montpellier with a team full of imports.

It's a professional, competitive sport pal. It's not supposed to be fair, it's supposed to be cut throat. It is up to teams that are not performing to improve their performance both on and off the field. I include my own team in that (Ulster). You can't expect to compete with the likes of Leinster if you don't go to the lengths they go to. Whether it's the Italian Union, Welsh, Scottish or Irish, whether it's a union run game or a club run game ala England and France, it's a competitive environment. Leinster couldn't give a tosh if the rest of us can compete with them or not and why would they? They have built en empire that the rest of us have failed to build be it at union or club level, that is the beginning, middle and end.

by LordDowlais Mon 05 Nov 2018, 9:44 am

The only rugby that should be played on international weekends, is international rugby. End of.

by VinceWLB Mon 05 Nov 2018, 10:08 am

LordDowlais wrote:The only rugby that should be played on international weekends, is international rugby. End of.

I think this weekends games had among the lowest attendances recorded. It is beyond ridiculous when the commentator comes up saying a team is missing 15+ players.. Yes, teams like Munster and Leinster might get away with it due to their huge payroll but this kills the contest for the rest.

When Munster and Leinster have to play each other 10 times a season, some people might change their opinion.

by des Mon 05 Nov 2018, 10:10 am

I've mixed feelings about clubs playing when internationals are on.

I felt Edinburgh were diddled when Italy released the majority of their players back to Zebre and we got 3 or 4 back. We were terrible in that game though so the loss was mainly our own doing.

However, we did very well against the Scarlets last Friday and the lack of senior players available forced Cockerill's hand with regards to some of the youngsters getting game time. His lack of rotation has become a little worrying but it feels like there might be a bit more trust emerging.

I think squad management adds a strategic layer to the league. It's something else to chat about on game day.

by LordDowlais Mon 05 Nov 2018, 10:18 am

VinceWLB wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:The only rugby that should be played on international weekends, is international rugby. End of.

I think this weekends games had among the lowest attendances recorded. It is beyond ridiculous when the commentator comes up saying a team is missing 15+ players.. Yes, teams like Munster and Leinster might get away with it due to their huge payroll but this kills the contest for the rest.

When Munster and Leinster have to play each other 10 times a season, some people might change their opinion.

It's just another mockery to a league that is dying a slow death here in Wales. People want to see the best players playing in the league, not 2nd and 3rd choices players.

by Brendan Mon 05 Nov 2018, 11:14 am

Here is the problem with wanting the best players all the time.

Best players get injured so can't always play
If you play the same players ever week you will get poorer players because form doesn't matter. (Leinster squad is so compeditive that if you drop standards you end up playing for the A team, this pushes everyone)
We want to see good young players coming through but they have to be better than current internationals to get their place justifiably
We want squad players to step up and play seamlessly but we only want their experience to be in training

Can't have it both ways.
Rotation is a positive in the league, pushes coaches to develop a squad. Injuries seem less noticeable in the season as it is a first 30 not first 15/23. Younger players are happy to stay than go abroad knowing they will get good development time

by marty2086 Mon 05 Nov 2018, 11:18 am

LordDowlais wrote:
VinceWLB wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:The only rugby that should be played on international weekends, is international rugby. End of.

I think this weekends games had among the lowest attendances recorded. It is beyond ridiculous when the commentator comes up saying a team is missing 15+ players.. Yes, teams like Munster and Leinster might get away with it due to their huge payroll but this kills the contest for the rest.

When Munster and Leinster have to play each other 10 times a season, some people might change their opinion.

It's just another mockery to a league that is dying a slow death here in Wales. People want to see the best players playing in the league, not 2nd and 3rd choices players.

This slow death you talk of is really taking it's time, there are kids being conceived and going through to retirement faster than this slow death

by marty2086 Mon 05 Nov 2018, 11:23 am

Brendan wrote:Here is the problem with wanting the best players all the time.

Best players get injured so can't always play
If you play the same players ever week you will get poorer players because form doesn't matter. (Leinster squad is so compeditive that if you drop standards you end up playing for the A team, this pushes everyone)
We want to see good young players coming through but they have to be better than current internationals to get their place justifiably
We want squad players to step up and play seamlessly but we only want their experience to be in training

Can't have it both ways.
Rotation is a positive in the league, pushes coaches to develop a squad. Injuries seem less noticeable in the season as it is a first 30 not first 15/23. Younger players are happy to stay than go abroad knowing they will get good development time

How many times have people looked at the players Leinster are missing and thought they can't cope without SOB, Heaslip, Sexton, Healy, Kearney and the rest and they keep developing the players to fill the gaps. I think they do it better than anyone, they know when they'll be missing players, identify possible replacements and most that are coming in are properly integrated and usually have game time under their belt before they are thrown in. Didn't they have 7 or 8 capped players in their squad at the weekend? There'll probably be another 7 or 8 who will end up capped too

by Brendan Mon 05 Nov 2018, 12:33 pm

marty2086 wrote:
Brendan wrote:Here is the problem with wanting the best players all the time.

Best players get injured so can't always play
If you play the same players ever week you will get poorer players because form doesn't matter. (Leinster squad is so compeditive that if you drop standards you end up playing for the A team, this pushes everyone)
We want to see good young players coming through but they have to be better than current internationals to get their place justifiably
We want squad players to step up and play seamlessly but we only want their experience to be in training

Can't have it both ways.
Rotation is a positive in the league, pushes coaches to develop a squad. Injuries seem less noticeable in the season as it is a first 30 not first 15/23. Younger players are happy to stay than go abroad knowing they will get good development time

How many times have people looked at the players Leinster are missing and thought they can't cope without SOB, Heaslip, Sexton, Healy, Kearney and the rest and they keep developing the players to fill the gaps. I think they do it better than anyone, they know when they'll be missing players, identify possible replacements and most that are coming in are properly integrated and usually have game time under their belt before they are thrown in. Didn't they have 7 or 8 capped players in their squad at the weekend? There'll probably be another 7 or 8 who will end up capped too

If you look at Munster, which is their starting from row I'm not sure anyone knows who is ahead of who.
Italians have improved because their squad has. Last 6 nations the two Italian teams picked up wins while the internationals were away.
Plus who is going to stay in these squads (Which are about 10 people more than England) if they know as 3/4th choice they will get maybe 5-10 games as sub for 10-20mins. It's why players like Lamour (who only played due to rotation in the Munster game), Stockdale, North, Cuthbert, etc (not just wingers they are what came to mind) made a big impact at such a young age and were able to establish themselves

by SecretFly Mon 05 Nov 2018, 12:39 pm

The argument is and always will be a crap one... the idea that the Pro14 league can and should always play their 'best' players.

So talk ahead into a world where International is the only game played on a weekend.... no more 2nd or 3rd string sides playing?

Well, apart from the obvious self limiting team growth potential through real experience of real rookies in real games of real meaning (ie shooting yourself in the foot into the future).... the other reality is that such a structure STILL wouldn't see the Internationals play in every League game right up until and through the International window and straight into Pro14 again and straight into European competition and straight on to 6N.... no real breaks...all playing coz everyone wants to see them all the time.

Crap - dumb concept and a practical impossibility. These players will still be lost to Pro14 because they'll still be managed - number of games in a year will still be restricted and given that let's say Leinster has quite a number of Internationals in their team, that will still means lots of them being absent for specific games; not sprinklings being absent, lots of them ... 7, 8, 9 at a time.

by Brendan Mon 05 Nov 2018, 12:42 pm

SecretFly wrote:The argument is and always will be a crap one... the idea that the Pro14 league can and should always play their 'best' players.

So talk ahead into a world where International is the only game played on a weekend.... no more 2nd or 3rd string sides playing?

Well, apart from the obvious self limiting team growth potential through real experience of real rookies in real games of real meaning (ie shooting yourself in the foot into the future).... the other reality is that such a structure STILL wouldn't see the Internationals play in every League game right up until and through the International window and straight into Pro14 again and straight into European competition and straight on to 6N.... no real breaks...all playing coz everyone wants to see them all the time.

Crap - dumb concept and a practical impossibility. These players will still be lost to Pro14 because they'll still be managed - number of games in a year will still be restricted and given that let's say Leinster has quite a number of Internationals in their team, that will still means lots of them being absent for specific games; not sprinklings being absent, lots of them ... 7, 8, 9 at a time.

I guess no one learned anything from Clive Woodward and England on what happens when you have a team and no squad.

by RugbyFan100 Mon 05 Nov 2018, 3:22 pm

Artful_Dodger wrote:

It's not supposed to be fair

Spoken like a true Irish rugby fan.

by Brendan Mon 05 Nov 2018, 4:11 pm

SecretFly wrote:Crap - dumb concept and a practical impossibility. These players will still be lost to Pro14 because they'll still be managed - number of games in a year will still be restricted and given that let's say Leinster has quite a number of Internationals in their team, that will still means lots of them being absent for specific games; not sprinklings being absent, lots of them ... 7, 8, 9 at a time.

I think Leinster should have to name their first choice 23 and play at least 10 in every match and if they don't they can't replace them.
That way when they have 19 players called up they will to play with about 13 players for 80mins and we all might win some games against them.

by LordDowlais Mon 05 Nov 2018, 4:34 pm

Typical Irish responses on here.

just take the p!ss as usual.

The simple answer is, do not play any games on an international dedicated weekend. Why is that concept so difficult ?

by Artful_Dodger Mon 05 Nov 2018, 6:02 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
Artful_Dodger wrote:

It's not supposed to be fair

Spoken like a true Irish rugby fan.

Aww diddums. Tell you what mate, why don't you just ask for it. "Can you please give us more of a chance lads, we are struggling with X, Y and Z and it would be fairer if you cut us a break and made the conscious decision not to compete to the best of your ability".

Honestly....

by carpet baboon Mon 05 Nov 2018, 6:44 pm

But this weekend wasn't an international weekend. What t was outside the test window.
Blame them not the league

by SecretFly Mon 05 Nov 2018, 6:45 pm

LordDowlais wrote:Typical Irish responses on here.

just take the p!ss as usual.

The simple answer is, do not play any games on an international dedicated weekend. Why is that concept so difficult ?

It won't create the fantasy scenario you seem to think that it will.................. ie, star players turning up for every Pro14 game. Dreaming about stars playing in all Pro14 games won't kill off the reality that it's fantasy.

Now why is that truth so difficult to grasp?

by Brendan Tue 06 Nov 2018, 1:31 am

LordDowlais wrote:Typical Irish responses on here.

just take the p!ss as usual.

The simple answer is, do not play any games on an international dedicated weekend. Why is that concept so difficult ?

Glasgow and Edinburgh seemed to do fine as did many others

From what I see

Kings v Leinster was a more compeditive game or did you want them to win by 50+ points
The two Scotland v Wales ones were compeditive
Cheetahs v Munster was more compeditive
Connacht Dragons not much difference
Blues would have beaten Zebre regardless
Maybe the only loser was Benetton but they may have lost anyway

So in short only difference was closer games and more drama, unless that is not what you want

by Brendan Tue 06 Nov 2018, 1:35 am

I also should point out that some teams don't deserve to play the top teams full 15 as they struggle against the backups.

See Japan v NZ as an example of what would happen if Leinster and a few others put out full teams against the bottom teams.

by LordDowlais Tue 06 Nov 2018, 8:14 am

SecretFly wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Typical Irish responses on here.

just take the p!ss as usual.

The simple answer is, do not play any games on an international dedicated weekend. Why is that concept so difficult ?

It won't create the fantasy scenario you seem to think that it will.................. ie, star players turning up for every Pro14 game. Dreaming about stars playing in all Pro14 games won't kill off the reality that it's fantasy.

Now why is that truth so difficult to grasp?

Why should it be fantasy ?

I want the league to be showcasing itself, and using the best players available. The Pro14 must be the only competition where this is not a priority. No wonder it's lagging behind other leagues in Europe.

by No 7&1/2 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 8:29 am

The prem also plays matches during the international s.

by **LondonTiger** Tue 06 Nov 2018, 8:54 am

LordDowlais wrote:The only rugby that should be played on international weekends, is international rugby. End of.

Which is only relevant this coming weekend. Last week was not a designated international weekend, rather a fleece the punters weekend.

by marty2086 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 8:59 am

LordDowlais wrote:Typical Irish responses on here.

just take the p!ss as usual.

The simple answer is, do not play any games on an international dedicated weekend. Why is that concept so difficult ?

Because the stuff you come off with deserves to have the p!ss taken out of it

You continually come off with the same guff

It's dying a low death in Wales yet you never back it up, all because some 90 year down the pub who's been nursing the same pint for 6 months says it wasn't like that in his day and he'll not be buying PremierSports and games gone

You can never back up any of your claims with....you know...facts or evidence because you live in a bubble that you think is representative of the world at large

by marty2086 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 8:59 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:The prem also plays matches during the international s.

And it's causing the slow death of the game in Wales!

by marty2086 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 9:02 am

LordDowlais wrote:
SecretFly wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Typical Irish responses on here.

just take the p!ss as usual.

The simple answer is, do not play any games on an international dedicated weekend. Why is that concept so difficult ?

It won't create the fantasy scenario you seem to think that it will.................. ie, star players turning up for every Pro14 game. Dreaming about stars playing in all Pro14 games won't kill off the reality that it's fantasy.

Now why is that truth so difficult to grasp?

Why should it be fantasy ?

I want the league to be showcasing itself, and using the best players available. The Pro14 must be the only competition where this is not a priority. No wonder it's lagging behind other leagues in Europe.

In what way is it lagging behind?

by RugbyFan100 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 9:15 am

carpet baboon wrote:But this weekend wasn't an international weekend. What t was outside the test window.
Blame them not the league

Are they not the same thing? We keep getting told that the Pro14 is great because it's a Union run league. Well, wasn't it 2 of those Unions who just organised the Wal v Sco game?

by LordDowlais Tue 06 Nov 2018, 9:17 am

There's fixtures for the Pro14 on the 24th/25th and 26th of November, the same weekend Wales, Italy, Scotland and Ireland are playing.

by LordDowlais Tue 06 Nov 2018, 9:19 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:The prem also plays matches during the international s.

There are more English teams in the Prem, so when players are taken on England duty, there are still 1st team players playing, as there are only 4 Welsh sides, 4 Irish sides, 2 Scottish sides and 2 Italian sides, when they release their best players for international duty, the standard of the league drops, massively.

by SecretFly Tue 06 Nov 2018, 9:32 am

LordDowlais wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:The prem also plays matches during the international s.

There are more English teams in the Prem, so when players are taken on England duty, there are still 1st team players playing, as there are only 4 Welsh sides, 4 Irish sides, 2 Scottish sides and 2 Italian sides, when they release their best players for international duty, the standard of the league drops, massively.

That's an inescapable fact. We have to all represent ourselves in this pan-National League. As always, our League/Championship is Different entirely to the structure of the English and French leagues. You can't escape the hard fact that Welsh players don't represent me at International, Scottish players don't represent you, Italian players don't represent Scotland, etc , etc
The Pro14 Does NOT usurp European Rugby and it does NOT usurp International (it's not going to happen).... but it still needs to get its work done through a season and therefore games need to go on.

by No 7&1/2 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:04 am

There's also more players of other nationalities in the English leagues ld. More just pointing out yur statement was incorrect though. You're welcome.

by marty2086 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:09 am

LordDowlais wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:The prem also plays matches during the international s.

There are more English teams in the Prem, so when players are taken on England duty, there are still 1st team players playing, as there are only 4 Welsh sides, 4 Irish sides, 2 Scottish sides and 2 Italian sides, when they release their best players for international duty, the standard of the league drops, massively.

There are also Welsh, Scottish and Italian players playing abroad meaning it affects the league less

by marty2086 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:23 am

marty2086 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
SecretFly wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Typical Irish responses on here.

just take the p!ss as usual.

The simple answer is, do not play any games on an international dedicated weekend. Why is that concept so difficult ?

It won't create the fantasy scenario you seem to think that it will.................. ie, star players turning up for every Pro14 game. Dreaming about stars playing in all Pro14 games won't kill off the reality that it's fantasy.

Now why is that truth so difficult to grasp?

Why should it be fantasy ?

I want the league to be showcasing itself, and using the best players available. The Pro14 must be the only competition where this is not a priority. No wonder it's lagging behind other leagues in Europe.

In what way is it lagging behind?

by LordDowlais Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:31 am

Look

I am not doing this with marty & No 7&1/2 again.

You will just ware my patience thin as always.

Enjoy your thread.

by marty2086 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:33 am

LordDowlais wrote:Look

I am not doing this with marty & No 7&1/2 again.

You will just ware my patience thin as always.

Enjoy your thread.

So you'll continue to make claims but refuse to back them up?

Whats new there?

by No 7&1/2 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:35 am

That makes us sound unreasonable. Whereas it's just correcting a statement slightly to reflect the facts. See ya ld.

by RugbyFan100 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:48 am

marty2086 wrote:

In what way is it lagging behind?

-Money (unless you can provide a link which states the tv deal has overtaken the English and French leagues)

-TV accessibility. Here in the UK, the English league is available on sky tv, BT TV and Virgin Media. Pro14 is not.

-Public availability - Most pubs near me have not got premier sports. But they do have sky tv / BT TV.

-Refereeing standards. An subjective statement perhaps. But IMO the refereeing pool is weaker in the pro14 than French and English leagues

-Away fans. Atmosphere created in top 14 and English league seem way better to me.

-More rivalry / intense games per round in English and French leagues. While we get to go to South Africa. Yay.

-More stronger teams throughout league in English and French leagues. Subjective again, but I'd much rather watch rugby matches involving the bottom 4 of the French and English leagues than the bottom 4 teams of the Pro14

Bottom 4 Gallagher Prem teams:
Newcastle
Sale
Bristol
Saints

Bottom 4 Top 14 teams
Perpignan
Toulon
Agen
Grenoble

Bottom consolidated Pro14 teams:
Dragons
Kings
Cheetahs
Zebre

-Quality of players - Bigger budgets across the French and English leagues mean that the quality of squads and foreign imports across squads are better. So the matches are more attractive.

There are some examples - and you will refute / deny / ignore / scoff at every single one.

by No 7&1/2 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:53 am

I live in England and I'm able.to easily view the pro 14.
Not sure how not playing on international weeks would affect your points though.

by RugbyFan100 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:55 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:
Not sure how not playing on international weeks would affect your points though.

I never said it would. Was just giving a few examples as to why the Pro14 lags behind the English and French leagues.

by No 7&1/2 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:57 am

Ah. Sorry hough you were following the same conversation you took the quote from.

by marty2086 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 10:59 am

RugbyFan100 wrote:
-Money (unless you can provide a link which states the tv deal has overtaken the English and French leagues)

Top14 and Premiership kind of had a head start with brand building

RugbyFan100 wrote:TV accessibility. Here in the UK, the English league is available on sky tv, BT TV and Virgin Media. Pro14 is not.

The Pro14 is available on FreeView more readily than the Premiership

RugbyFan100 wrote:Public availability - Most pubs near me have not got premier sports. But they do have sky tv / BT TV.

How many pubs don't have PremierSport?

RugbyFan100 wrote:Refereeing standards. An subjective statement perhaps. But IMO the refereeing pool is weaker in the pro14 than French and English leagues

Roman Poite is the top referee in France Rolling Eyes

RugbyFan100 wrote:Away fans. Atmosphere created in top 14 and English league seem way better to me.

What percentage of attendances are made up of away fans?

RugbyFan100 wrote:More rivalry / intense games per round in English and French leagues. While we get to go to South Africa. Yay.

The French teams rotating away from home and losing big really shows the rivalry and intensity

RugbyFan100 wrote:More stronger teams throughout league in English and French leagues. Subjective again, but I'd much rather watch rugby matches involving the bottom 4 of the French and English leagues than the bottom 4 teams of the Pro14

Bottom 4 Gallagher Prem teams:
Newcastle
Sale
Bristol
Saints

Bottom 4 Top 14 teams
Perpignan
Toulon
Agen
Grenoble

Bottom consolidated Pro14 teams:
Dragons
Kings
Cheetahs
Zebre

How many Cheetahs and Kings game have you watched over the last 18 months?

RugbyFan100 wrote:Quality of players - Bigger budgets across the French and English leagues mean that the quality of squads and foreign imports across squads are better. So the matches are more attractive.

Were you not complaining about the Irish having budgets the same as the English and French before? Now they don't....I'm confused...which is it?

RugbyFan100 wrote:There are some examples - and you will refute / deny / ignore / scoff at every single one.

Well pretty much everyone is you prefer not to watch the Pro14, seems to be you need to have a word with whoever is forcing you to watch something you don't want to watch and just go watch the English and French games

by RugbyFan100 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 11:00 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:Ah. Sorry thought you were following the same conversation you took the quote from.

Apology accepted.

by RugbyFan100 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 11:09 am

marty2086 wrote:
Top14 and Premiership kind of had a head start with brand building

A nice excuse, but doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. You can't use that for the rest of time while problems still exist.

The Pro14 is available on FreeView more readily than the Premiership

Doesn't address my point at all.

How many pubs don't have PremierSport?

In my area, there are 11 pubs in the immediate vicinity. Just 1 has Premier Sports, and that was only installed last week.

Roman Poite is the top referee in France

In France yes. Where he referees most of the time.

What percentage of attendances are made up of away fans?

How on earth would I have that detail to hand?

The French teams rotating away from home and losing big really shows the rivalry and intensity

What have the results got to do with my point?

How many Cheetahs and Kings game have you watched over the last 18 months?

8. Unfortunately.

Were you not complaining about the Irish having budgets the same as the English and French before? Now they don't....I'm confused...which is it?

That's exactly why I underlined the word "across". I knew you would ignore it.
I wasn't complaining either. The Irish have huge budgets because their system works for them.....and good luck to them.

by SecretFly Tue 06 Nov 2018, 11:11 am

The Pro14 no longer gets laughed at or sneered at by outside, and some eternally unhappy inside, observers.

So as an evolving beast, and that's what it has been since its very inception - much more evolutionary than the other two leagues mentioned - it is getting stronger and stronger. Unavoidable fact.

It's evolving and strengthening - it is much more dynamic than the other two Leagues.
Yes, it is much more a planes, trains and automobiles competition but that's exactly where the big world of rugby professionalism wants to go. We are the practical beginning of that. We're already doing it. A yearly competition that stretches from Ireland to Italy, from NH to SH. A truly modern interpretation of what all 'Leagues' are likely to become.

Planes, trains and automobiles. It's strange that such global reach and earning potential is seen as a weakness in Pro14 but a much talked about 'future positive' direction for club rugby into the future.

The Pro14, along with the Super Rugby Competition, is at the forefront of the future (whether I like what's coming or not) and yet, for some 'progressives' it's considered to be lagging behind.....................?

by No 7&1/2 Tue 06 Nov 2018, 11:29 am

Lol. You really don't have to accept an apology like that as it was you who confused things. Just an English reaction to apologise for other people.

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