Japan V Scotland (if it's on)

First topic message reminder :

MATCH 40
SUNDAY 13 OCTOBER
KICK OFF (UK TIME)
11:45

SCOTLAND
WORLD RANKING 9TH

Referee: Ben O'Keeffe
International Stadium Yokohama, Kanagawa Prefecture, Yokohama City

(Or not at all)

Is this Schrodinger's game in that it can be considered both on and cancelled at the same time? I'm sure Jimbo will correct me in my interpretation....

Laidlaw is a good captain most of the time. My only gripe with him is when we're on the back foot, he can get a bit moany with the ref which is a fast way to lose a match. You do feel there's a good captain in this side somewhere and I like the idea of Ritchie being the captain once he's a guaranteed starter. Thomson could well grow into that role too depending on how he gets on.

I often wondered about that...the ref/captain relationship when things are going wrong.  Moaning obviously doesn't work.  It just becomes a whine in the ref's ear who has already demonstrated frustration with your team.  So I've wondered what I'd try to get the ref back on side.

Maybe try to be the exact opposite of a constant moan...become self effacing.  Mock your own players' efforts whilst in earshot, smile a lot, laugh a lot; pat him on the shoulder gently a few times when he penalises your team one more time.  Act like you've given up the challenge to his authority completely.  Kill the f**king basterde's resolved with love.  Nobody can resist being loved.

You never know.  If you stop protesting so much, you might only end up losing by 47 points rather than 52......

52? Come on we're not playing new zealand! 20 after we throw a few cheeky intercepts, be realistic!

In all seriousness, i think the mcinally move is the right one, he's just not the right stuff for captain. Immensely likeable and decent like kelly brown was but also like kelly brown not a captain. Greig was the only other realistic option, I hope he does better than at the 6Ns. Needs to know when to zip it, especially as this is technically a home game for Japan so we'll need to help guide some ref decisions through our behaviour to make up for home advantage.

IF it's on then i dont know what I predict.

Scotland can do it but doesn't mean they will as long suffering fans know. Especially under toonie.

Japan can do it but can they cope with their first pressure game?

I'll back my team for the win but Japan to reach the QFs in injury time.

22-20 to Scotland

EWT Spoons wrote:

BigGee wrote:Everyone seems to have forgotten that we may have a game on sunday!

Teams out

Big news is the McInally drops to bench and Brown starts, GL is the captain. Maitland out with injury so Seymour starts on the wing with Blairhorn on the bench!

Been posted 4x already mate.  Seems to be less important than discussing where a future WC could be held.

Can understand why you might have missed them, as they've largely been ignored.

It's really hard to get excited for a game that may be called off.

Even if its a massive crunch game, its jsut, met, maybe called off!!!

Yes but it isnt yet, yet that’s not stopped the legal call ups

"It is disappointing that the Scottish Rugby Union should make such comments at a time when we are doing everything we can to enable all Sunday's matches to take place as scheduled, and when there is a real and significant threat to public safety owing to what is predicted to be one of the largest and most destructive typhoons to hit Japan since 1958," World Rugby said.

"Along with the 19 other teams, the Scottish Rugby Union signed the Rugby World Cup 2019 terms of participation, which clearly state in Section 5.3: Where a pool Match cannot be commenced on the day in which it is scheduled, it shall not be postponed to the following day, and shall be considered as cancelled."'

Hmmm, better things to do methinks...

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/oct/11/world-rugby-contingency-plan-typhoon-hagibis-england-france-scotland-japan-cup

If this is true, it's really not a great look for World Rugby's so-called "robust contingency plans", or indeed for World Rugby in general.

Not really T. It's Scotland putting a bit of pressure on WR - literally what NZ are used to doing to refs etc. Use the media in your favour. Get the press/narrative talking about something which can help 'clarify the mind' of those you're looking to influence.

As said, don't think Towsend et al. are at the heart of this. Good to know your union has your back, if anything.

This is a non issue. Scotland at no fault here. Defending their legitimate interests.

Yeah but at what cost? I say overall will disrupt the sides plans. We’ll see. Let’s hope Scotland bear the cost of any injury and damage should World rugby be legally forced to play the match. I’d assume they’ll cover any deaths and injuries with all that money huh?

I think you're talking yourself in knots here. Really not sure what your point it.

Anyway, a few hours away from finding out whether this game is going ahead. Hopefully it does.

I don’t get how the SRU can mount a challenge as the rules as written down are being followed.

If Scotland vs Japan is rearranged then Italy would have grounds to fire a legal challenge due to inconsistency but not the SRU.

Having said that, If England or NZ were going to be knocked out if their game was off, you can bet your house that they’d be fighting it all the way.

tigertattie wrote:I don’t get how the SRU can mount a challenge as the rules as written down are being followed.

If Scotland vs Japan is rearranged then Italy would have grounds to fire a legal challenge due to inconsistency but not the SRU.

Having said that, If England or NZ were going to be knocked out if their game was off, you can bet your house that they’d be fighting it all the way.

Yeah that’s what we said about the cricket. If Eng, India etc were in the same boat as NZ a replay would have been demanded.

I don’t know what ‘the fight’ is.

If it’s called off Scotland will request that it’s played in a hurricane or what?. Legal experts will say they know more than weather experts? Perhaps they’ll draw a line on the map that China is actually getting the typhoon?

Why? Because the rules and WR's response to them are clearly there to be challenged in a court of law. That's generally how things work.

The grounds for a Scottish appeal are quite clear - loss of earnings, failure of duty on the part of WR's contingency plans, and no doubt several other areas relating to cancelling games which knock teams out of a world leading global sports tournament.

It's never been a binary choice of "play it in a typhoon or cancel it" - clearly there are both mitigating circumstances for the cancellation rule to be challenged, including a change of day (why pushing each game back 1 day or so has been deemed impossible is beyond me, and a failure for WR), as well as, I believe, a change of venue for the same day being deemed one of the acceptable back up plans that WR failed to enact. The article above is fairly damning at what constituted WR's alternatives should the weather disrupt the tournament - that alone would be a key area, I'd imagine. But then I'm no lawyer - it's just clear that there is grounds for the SRU to go hell for leather at WR if they are knocked out of the tournament through the rigidity with which they've prepared for the RWC.

It's a litigious world we live in, and paired with righteous anger, and supported by a media storm, this has all the hallmarks of money, infamy, power, and professional prestige - all reasons to launch a legal appeal.

Done? Do we need to keep questioning why the SRU might appeal, and how it will have no bearing on Townsend's team?

Oh,all that, good luck to them, best focus on the tourney then

Glad you agree.

Well, not so much agree, just don’t care if it’s about post tournament blues.

Flooding and already a death and now an earthquake.

Bigger things that if we get the honour of being spanked By NZ to worry about here

As you say tiger, there are many more important things than sport. I'm sure being in the path of a typhoon as devastating as this one threatens to be must be terrifying for the locals and our thoughts should never stray too far from that.

However, if Ireland take nothing from today's game then both Scotland and japan would advance with a draw. So, I predict a Samoa win, Scotland force tomorrow's match to be played and Japan spank us and send us home.

jimbopip wrote:As you say tiger, there are many more important things than sport. I'm sure being in the path of a typhoon as devastating as this one threatens to be must be terrifying for the locals and our thoughts should never stray too far from that.

However, if Ireland take nothing from today's game then both Scotland and japan would advance with a draw. So, I predict a Samoa win, Scotland force tomorrow's match to be played and Japan spank us and send us home.  

Poetic justice if that were to happen.

Can’t see Ireland losing, but if they do, do you think Dobson and his GC/FES associates will turn round and say “you know what, let’s be safe and call the game off”

tigertattie wrote:

jimbopip wrote:As you say tiger, there are many more important things than sport. I'm sure being in the path of a typhoon as devastating as this one threatens to be must be terrifying for the locals and our thoughts should never stray too far from that.

However, if Ireland take nothing from today's game then both Scotland and japan would advance with a draw. So, I predict a Samoa win, Scotland force tomorrow's match to be played and Japan spank us and send us home.  

Poetic justice if that were to happen.

Can’t see Ireland losing, but if they do, do you think Dobson and his GC/FES associates will turn round and say “you know what, let’s be safe and call the game off”

In a heartbeat. Once the lawyers have been paid obviously.

Damnit you had one job samoa.

Taylorman wrote:

tigertattie wrote:I don’t get how the SRU can mount a challenge as the rules as written down are being followed.

If Scotland vs Japan is rearranged then Italy would have grounds to fire a legal challenge due to inconsistency but not the SRU.

Having said that, If England or NZ were going to be knocked out if their game was off, you can bet your house that they’d be fighting it all the way.

Yeah that’s what we said about the cricket. If Eng, India etc were in the same boat as NZ a replay would have been demanded.

I don’t know what ‘the fight’ is.

If it’s called off Scotland will request that it’s played in a hurricane or what?. Legal experts will say they know more than weather experts? Perhaps they’ll draw a line on the map that China is actually getting the typhoon?

Why keep bringing that up? It wouldn't happen at all. Everyone was aware of the rules beforehand, just like they were for the RWC.

Don't enter the tournament if you aren't happy. Or in the case of the cricket, score more boundaries.

Everyone's happy until they're the ones who lose out.

Can't remember which thread I saw it on and cant find it now but there were some grumbles about comments from jones on scotland. BBC have altered their article to better reflect:

On Thursday, England head coach Eddie Jones spoke about the impact of the typhoon.

He said: "We've been talking about it all the time, about the possibility that this was going to happen.

"It's typhoon season, so you go somewhere else and it's terrorists' season. You know what's going to happen. It's typhoon season here and you've got to be prepared for it.

"We had an idea it could happen and therefore you have to accumulate points in your games to put yourself in the right position in case that happened.

"We just knew that there was the possibility of a game like this during the tournament so we just wanted to put ourselves in the best position we could.

"This is supposed to be a big typhoon, so I don't see any other option that the organisers had [than calling off England's game against France].

"That's why we're not concerned at all about the comings and goings of it. We think it's the right decision."

On the BBC Sport website we reported Jones had said Scotland 'only have themselves to blame' if they are knocked out of the World Cup because of the typhoon.

We would like to make clear Jones did not say this - he was speaking purely about England's position and not Scotland or any other team

Update due at 6 pm as to whether or not game is still on.

Good to see the Beeb have retracted and apologised to Eddie. Many on here didn’t read beyond the incorrect headline.

If this game does get played tomorrow, it’ll be a minor miracle.

I thought the update was going to be at midnight after the stadium inspection?

Fingers are crossed.

NeilyBroon wrote:I thought the update was going to be at midnight after the stadium inspection?

Fingers are crossed.

Maybe u are right. RTE said 6 pm Irish time which would be 2am Jaoan time which would be late.

Yeah I thought it was 6 hours before start of match. If they're doing it that early to me it suggests it may be going ahead, possibly elsewhere.

Duty281 wrote:If this game does get played tomorrow, it’ll be a minor miracle.

Id be surprised if its called off

All reports are suggesting that the game will be cancelled. As with the other games if it’s about overall safety it’s what they need to do.

According to the BBC:

World Rugby plan an inspection of the stadium at 22:00 BST on Saturday, with a final decision expected within two hours.

However, tournament organisers say they will only be able to make that call once it is safe enough for inspections to take place.

A World Rugby spokesman said: "Our primary consideration is the safety of everyone.

"We will undertake detailed venue inspections as soon as practically possible with an announcement following as soon as decisions are made in the morning.

"Our message to fans continues be stay indoors today, stay safe and monitor official Rugby World Cup social and digital channels."

Can’t see it being on myself. Aftermath will be brutal.

Well toonie probably rides his luck again. He's going to avoid being exposed until the 2020 6Ns when this current squad is beyond saving. Now he has a legitimate excuse for not meeting our target performance there's no way the SRU will drop him.

Bad times ahead once again for Scottish rugby.

No 7&1/2 wrote:
On the BBC Sport website we reported Jones had said Scotland 'only have themselves to blame' if they are knocked out of the World Cup because of the typhoon.

We would like to make clear Jones did not say this - he was speaking purely about England's position and not Scotland or any other team

Yep, I went looking for that quote and couldn't find it. It's poor from the BBC - a classic case of fake news, Britain-located journalists copying headlines over at 5am from other publications. It wasthe headline in several papers, yet no-one had the quote. Shocking.

https://rugbylad.ie/worrying-scenes-scotland-footage-emerges-japan-wading-flooded-stadium/

I doubt it's happening now if these pics are anything to go by. Game over lads.

Someone left the tap on

I'd imagine that's lower than pitch level though.

But I would be surprised if the drainage were good enough that the pitch was completely dry. That said, they were clearly going out to train, so maybe it was ok.

The game will not go ahead are that stadium tomorrow. Folk are delusional if they think it can be played.

The issue is if the game will be cancelled or moved to another stadium and played on Monday.

As they cancelled the earlier games today instead of rearranging then a precedent has been set so can’t see the game being moved so it’s bye bye World Cup for us.

Bigger things to worry about with a country being ravaged and already sad reports of fatalities. SRU aren’t really showing much compassion here by rolling out the lawyers.

Aye true that tattie. Easy to get tunnel vision (prime culprit here) and I hope that all affected are okay. Pretty devastating storm by the sounds of it so far.

I can’t understand how anyone (pointing the finger at the sh!tstorm on Twitter here) thinks this game is being moved when others have been cancelled and Italy have been put out of the tournament. Characteristic that Dodson would try and bully his way out of the situation, but sad to see ‘fans’ trying to justify how our position is different to Italy’s. If we’re going to start preempting match outcomes based on expected results then the spirit of the World Cup is well and truly out the window

that video showing the flooded stadium was taken at least 6 hrs BEFORE the storm hit, which was due at 6 or 7pm

alive555 wrote:that video showing the flooded stadium was taken at least 6 hrs BEFORE the storm hit, which was due at 6 or 7pm

Ha I was right, someone left the tap on.

EnglishReign wrote:

Taylorman wrote:

tigertattie wrote:I don’t get how the SRU can mount a challenge as the rules as written down are being followed.

If Scotland vs Japan is rearranged then Italy would have grounds to fire a legal challenge due to inconsistency but not the SRU.

Having said that, If England or NZ were going to be knocked out if their game was off, you can bet your house that they’d be fighting it all the way.

Yeah that’s what we said about the cricket. If Eng, India etc were in the same boat as NZ a replay would have been demanded.

I don’t know what ‘the fight’ is.

If it’s called off Scotland will request that it’s played in a hurricane or what?. Legal experts will say they know more than weather experts? Perhaps they’ll draw a line on the map that China is actually getting the typhoon?

Why keep bringing that up? It wouldn't happen at all. Everyone was aware of the rules beforehand, just like they were for the RWC.

Don't enter the tournament if you aren't happy. Or in the case of the cricket, score more boundaries.

Everyone's happy until they're the ones who lose out.

Just offering a comparison, didn’t really care about the loss, crickets turned into a bit of a bore these days with so many formats. Enjoyed it but the layer upon layer of fortune England had to get there was absurd. Not just the rules, the umpires failure to count correctly, Stokes freak of extra runs. No skill in all that. One big laugh really.

Give it a rest. If you want to argue about the cricket start another thread.

NeilyBroon wrote:Give it a rest. If you want to argue about the cricket start another thread.

It was a comparison to the overall tournament rules that take count backs etc into account at a World Cup event so is relevant. So yeah, nah. Can’t help it if you can’t see that chief.

Cricket gets called off for drizzle. It's a weird and irrelevant comparison.

And Scotlands lawyers want to play rugby in a typhoon where eight million are evacuating, where at least one has perished so far.

Bet it goes ahead.