England's Summer of Cricket 2023, Featuring The Ashes

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Well done to Scott Boland, a very tidy job and added precious runs.

Another fantastic day in a fantastic test in a fantastic rivalry in a fantastic sport. Fantastic.

And just as the pattern has been throughout, when one team looked to be taking control, it just got yanked back. And it was Broad yanking it back with a brilliant spell. Labuschagne is the new Warner, as far as Broad's concerned.

174 to get. Seven wickets left. Still favouring Australia, but it'll be interesting to see how the bowling conditions are after the expected rain tomorrow. If they're anything close to what England's top order had to face yesterday, it could be curtains for Australia, but I'm not anticipating it to be that bad.

Will almost certainly be a delayed start. Hopefully the BBC's more pessimistic forecast doesn't come to fruition.

It'll probably go to the wire, that's the way the whole test has been shaping up. Might even be a tied test...

If anyone else is still watching ...the short ball has another victim

Green holes out ...good catch Duckett and Robinson has a wicket at last. Hasn't been the most enthralling hour so if you are all asleep I don't blame you...

Mark Taylor isn't happy. But I don't think the Match Referee can change the rules just to stop this tactic !

And Green holes out. Every time I hit send on a long post saying nothing's going on a wicket falls!

It feels like both sides have been happy to take time out the game this session. England basically seemed happy to bowl dots without the lead building too much. Meanwhile the Aussies seemed happy for the England seamers to get more overs in their legs. I'd guess that Australia want 4 sessions at England. Are they just thinking, bat until close to tea, tire the bowlers, then have a swing?

What happened to the excitement of Bazball, eh? Running to the danger and all that? I'd get more entertainment watching Atherton and Hussain grind out a partnership than this.

Australia have ground England down superbly. England have been in the field for every single day of this series so far (a run which will, of course, end tomorrow).

It's not exciting but for as long as it's working I don't think England could do anything else.

Another one for Robinson... Good bouncer...Carey can't keep it down... Short ball attack keeps on giving .

Just not very exciting;)

But honestly , Duty : bit hypocritical to be complaining about England adopting "boring" tactics when you've been moaning about them putting a premium on entertainment for ages !

Duty281 wrote:What happened to the excitement of Bazball, eh? Running to the danger and all that? I'd get more entertainment watching Atherton and Hussain grind out a partnership than this.

Australia have ground England down superbly. England have been in the field for every single day of this series so far (a run which will, of course, end tomorrow).

You can't hate the entertainment first tactics and lack of adaptability then give the Bazball setup flack when it adapts and prioritises wickets from a boring tactic surely Duty...? 

England being in the field so quickly after their innings is indeed a concern with an attack lacking durability though. That's a very fair point.

Carey goes, tail exposed. If Lyon doesn't bat then there are two more to get. Can England keep it under 350?

alfie wrote:Another one for Robinson... Good bouncer...Carey can't keep it down... Short ball attack keeps on giving .

Just not very exciting;)

But honestly , Duty : bit hypocritical to be complaining about England adopting "boring" tactics when you've been moaning about them putting a premium on entertainment for ages !

I'm not complaining, I'm pointing out a lack of consistency. England have been on the defensive today, and were on the defensive when bowling to Cummins and Lyon in the last test. This is all in spite of the messages we keep hearing, about how style and entertainment is more important than winning. Apparently, McCullum told England at stumps on Day Four at Edgbaston that, no matter the result, England had already won because of their style. He can't say the same now can he?

Looking like going 2-0 down, worst start to a series at home to Australia since 2001, and England's answer will be to bring Moeen back.

Ponting thinks Australia have enough already. He's probably right ; but there's no way they'll be declaring just yet.

Shouldn't need to. Plenty of time yet to bowl England out - as we know they are never going to stonewall for a draw.

I see Cummins wants to play some shots at least. I do hope Stokes' knee doesn't fall off after this spell

Given most of us acknowledge that the tactics need to evolve surely that's a good thing though Duty? Isn't varying the tactics to the situation better what we are asking for?

Duty281 wrote:

alfie wrote:Another one for Robinson... Good bouncer...Carey can't keep it down... Short ball attack keeps on giving .

Just not very exciting;)

But honestly , Duty : bit hypocritical to be complaining about England adopting "boring" tactics when you've been moaning about them putting a premium on entertainment for ages !

I'm not complaining, I'm pointing out a lack of consistency. England have been on the defensive today, and were on the defensive when bowling to Cummins and Lyon in the last test. This is all in spite of the messages we keep hearing, about how style and entertainment is more important than winning. Apparently, McCullum told England at stumps on Day Four at Edgbaston that, no matter the result, England had already won because of their style. He can't say the same now can he?

Looking like going 2-0 down, worst start to a series at home to Australia since 2001, and England's answer will be to bring Moeen back.

You'd be complaining either way so not sure your comment holds much weight if any.

Stokes into his 10th over and looking predictably knackered.

And a wicket with a no ball. He knew it straight away as well. So frustrating.

Lead up to 350 with that wide.

It does feel like Australia have been happy for the opposition skipper to just bang away with that knackered knee here.

Sorry , Duty , but I reckon you're just looking for reasons to rubbish Stokes and McCullum. Doesn't matter what England do , you knock it. You have indeed been consistent - whether it is declarations , selections , or batting and bowling tactics...
I don't like these tactics much either : but I'm not sure what you would prefer to see them do ? Bowl Joe Root with catchers round the bat ?

Australia are in charge here of course. But I fancy a more orthodox approach would probably see the lead around 400 by now ...so if you value trying to win any way you can you probably ought to approve of what they've done since lunch.

Anyway you are free to keep moaning if it makes you happy

A lot has been made of Robinsons fitness and rightfully so at times but it can't be as bad as we thought considering he's banged it in short for 9 straight overs now.

king_carlos wrote:Given most of us acknowledge that the tactics need to evolve surely that's a good thing though Duty? Isn't varying the tactics to the situation better what we are asking for?

I'd love to see tactical evolution, but it flies in the face of the pronouncements made by Stokes/McCullum. If they dial back the idiotic statements, be a little more humble, that would also be nice.

alfie wrote:Ponting thinks Australia have enough already. He's probably right ; but there's no way they'll be declaring just yet.

Shouldn't need to. Plenty of time yet to bowl England out - as we know they are never going to stonewall for a draw.

I see Cummins wants to play some shots at least. I do hope Stokes' knee doesn't fall off after this spell

He would say that though, alfie. I agree with him that they wouldn't be thinking of a declaration.

England have amassed 74 extras over two innings, Australia only 22 over one. One of the drawbacks of all this short ball stuff. It's like an extra Warner + 8 runs..

Almost felt sorry looking at the pain on Stokes' face a few overs ago. England have bowled 195 overs (thus far) to Australia's 76. Surely there'll have to be wholesale bowling changes before Headingley. All this effort must be taking a lot out of the legs.

Another no ball and Cummins get another life!

Pause for thought: I saw a link to a 1984 match at Lord's.
The Windies polished off 344 runs (for the loss of one wicket) in a 4th innings chase... in just over 66 overs. RR was a leisurely 5.19.

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/west-indies-tour-of-england-1984-61869/england-vs-west-indies-2nd-test-63376/full-scorecard

GG 214* and your man Gomes 92* got them over the line... with ease, Guildford. And this was 40 years before Bazball.  

Why do you even bother watching cricket? You seemingly get no enjoyment from it going by your constant negative remarks.

king_carlos wrote:Lead up to 350 with that wide.

It does feel like Australia have been happy for the opposition skipper to just bang away with that knackered knee here.

And with that wide, Extras advance to 36. Trailing only behind Khawaja as Australia's top scorer this dig.

guildfordbat wrote:

king_carlos wrote:Lead up to 350 with that wide.

It does feel like Australia have been happy for the opposition skipper to just bang away with that knackered knee here.

And with that wide, Extras advance to 36. Trailing only behind Khawaja as Australia's top scorer this dig.

See my post above, Guildford. 74 extras in total.
Also a reference to a 1984 match. Can England do the same?
They'll have plenty more overs but the Australian bowling will have something to say, no doubt.

alfie wrote:Sorry , Duty , but I reckon you're just looking for reasons to rubbish Stokes and McCullum. Doesn't matter what England do , you knock it. You have indeed been consistent - whether it is declarations , selections , or batting and bowling tactics...
I don't like these tactics much either : but I'm not sure what you would prefer to see them do ?  Bowl Joe Root with catchers round the bat ?

Australia are in charge here of course. But I fancy a more orthodox approach would probably see the lead around 400 by now ...so if you value trying to win any way you can you probably ought to approve of what they've done since lunch.

Anyway you are free to keep moaning if it makes you happy

England are about to go two nil down in a home ashes for the first time since 2001, so what would you like me to do? Offer high praise?

Once more, I haven't complained about the tactics, I'm pointing out the inconsistency that Stokes/McCullum bang on about entertainment first/winning second and then deliver this.

I have praised England at times, I haven't always knocked them. However, they've got very little right this series - and that does include selections/declarations - so praise is very thin on the ground.

Robinson has done better with the short ball tactic than I'd have expected, I'll concede. He's got such a high release point so maybe that's helping get the two paced nature out the pitch. The Aussies have barely been taking it on. They seem happy to put overs in the England seamers legs. If that's what they're doing it could be a shrewd move with the back to back Tests. Then again I'd expect a lot of rotation in T3 anyway.

21 overs, 39 runs and 2 wickets. Those 39 runs have pushed the lead over 350 though, for 21 overs into the England bowlers legs.

Make that 3 wickets. Cummins goes to a good short one from Broad. One more to go.

Three for Broad and just Hazlewood to bat now.

Lyon padded up ? Seriously ?

Wow. Lyon is padded up!

Are Australia just taking time out the game?

alfie wrote:If anyone else is still watching ...the short ball has another victim

Green holes out ...good catch Duckett and Robinson has a wicket at last. Hasn't been the most enthralling hour so if you are all asleep I don't blame you...

Mark Taylor isn't happy. But I don't think the Match Referee can change the rules just to stop this tactic !

Atherton saying just now that the body line tactic is working for England with wickets being taken and the scoring rate reduced.

Yes but Australia have increased their lead, albeit slowly, and probably knackered England's bowlers for next time.

Today's play has rather made me think of a football first-half in which both sides are happy not to concede a goal and so don't try too hard for one either. Certainly not exciting but it needs to be understood that it happens from time to time and can't - nor should it - be outlawed by changing the rules.

This is madness to put Lyon out there. He's struggling to even walk to the crease. I remember Anderson went to the middle in 2019 when he was struggling with injury. That was also daft.

king_carlos wrote:Wow. Lyon is padded up!

Are Australia just taking time out the game?

I feel that may encourage England as it suggests Australia are worried they haven't got enough.

If Lyon does bat, it's imperative that England do not bowl short to him, under no circumstances can you allow the possibility of a concussion sub for someone already injured.

Stokes strikes at last...another catch for Root .

and Lyon is indeed hobbling out...

Lyon will be excused for lack of footwork. He'll be thinking of boundaries as usual.
Reminds me of a women's match with Healy barely able to walk. Painful to watch!

Duty281 wrote:This is madness to put Lyon out there. He's struggling to even walk to the crease. I remember Anderson went to the middle in 2019 when he was struggling with injury. That was also daft.

Ponting reckons they are hoping he will duck into a bouncer and they'll get a concussion sub

Ha - you beat me to it , Soul

Pal Joey wrote:Lyon will be excused for lack of footwork. He'll be thinking of boundaries as usual.
Reminds me of a women's match with Healy barely able to walk. Painful to watch!

Now Lyon's out there, he has one thing to do -
Stay with Mitch.

And that's why it was utterly stupid. Lyon may have done himself serious damage now.

Fantastic fielding from Rehan Ahmed !

But Lyon might not be doing his calf much good here.

guildfordbat wrote:

Pal Joey wrote:Lyon will be excused for lack of footwork. He'll be thinking of boundaries as usual.
Reminds me of a women's match with Healy barely able to walk. Painful to watch!

Now Lyon's out there, he has one thing to do -
Stay with Mitch.

Pope, for his serious misdemeanors, should be forced to push Lyon up and down the edge of the pitch in a wheelchair at least.

Lyon is backing away, just go for the stumps, he doesn't have the manoeuvrability to keep it out.

Australia clearly feels Lyon's done for the series. Else can't see them taking such a chance with him. Still not sure this is the smartest thing being done here. A lot of daft stuff in this test match, from both sides.

Hope I'm allowed another criticism - England's bowling to Lyon has been atrocious and bizarre. Bowl a yorker, he won't keep it out, especially when he's backing away.

To the larger debates about Bazball. I feel England's change of approach is as much a product of the desire to do something new as such, as much as an adjustment to the quality or the lack of available to them. Other than Root and Stokes, their test match batting is mediocre. Those hyped up big time, were struggling to break out of the 20s in terms of average. The new approach has enabled them to maximize the available resources. As KPF said, Root should surely play like a proper test bat, and Stokes should let the rest just go for, go back to more orthodox batting for himself. and the likes of Pope, once they are in, can bring in a bit of common sense in their approach...
So some minor adjustments, but Bazball's the way to go ahead for England for sure...

Lyon departs after a nice parting shot! Australia bowled out for 279. Think they underachieved here and have kept England in the game, particularly as Lyon's not going to bowl... Bit of a wasted effort, after the contributions of Khawaja, and even Warner for that matter. Marnus, Smith, Head, Green and Karey, all gave it away...

Well I guess Lyon's heroism is sort of justified now as Starc has got the partnership up to 11. And now he's hit a four !

If they end up winning by less than 15 this was a match winning move If he gets any more England will be seriously frustrated. Not too impressed with the bowling to this last pair I must say.

But all done now...four for Broad. Lyon just a bit more crippled ; Stokes may still be able to walk .
Jokes aside : very courageous effort

371 to win. Four sessions. Do we believe in miracles ?

Duty281 wrote:Hope I'm allowed another criticism - England's bowling to Lyon has been atrocious and bizarre. Bowl a yorker, he won't keep it out, especially when he's backing away.

For that matter, why challenge Starc to try and hit the short stuff over you when he can only score boundaries with Lyon at the other end?

371 to win. Australia haven't put it entirely out of reach, but they're obviously big favourites. Not certainties, because they've lost Lyon, and we saw England knock off two sizable chases last year when the opposition were a bowler down. And, y'know, Headingley 2019...

What Australia have done is the classic test grind. Anderson's bowled 39 overs in this test, Robinson 51...they won't be playing at Headingley. Broad close to 50 overs, he might not make the Headingley test. All change?

About 40 overs left tonight. Won't get them all in, although play does go on until 7 tonight, so maybe about 30-32 overs? England may very well be in the 120-150 bracket by stumps. How many down by that point is the key question.

alfie wrote:Well I guess Lyon's heroism is sort of justified now as Starc has got the partnership up to 11. And now he's hit a four !

If they end up winning by less than 15 this was a match winning move   If he gets any more England will be seriously frustrated. Not too impressed with the bowling to this last pair I must say.

But all done now...four for Broad. Lyon just a bit more crippled ; Stokes may still be able to walk .
Jokes aside : very courageous effort

371 to win. Four sessions. Do we believe in miracles ?

England's probability with the bookmakers is around 35% - Doubt even Winviz goes that high! - so they're not putting it in miracle territory. Although I probably am.

I think Lyon's heroic effort will inspire the team. Now the trend for short-pitched bowling has completely changed the complexion of the match, I wouldn't want to be batting for England right now in the final session. They might get off to a flyer but ultimately the odds will be against surviving another bouncer barrage for a sustained period of time. At least that's what I'm hoping.

Pal Joey wrote:

guildfordbat wrote:

Pal Joey wrote:Lyon will be excused for lack of footwork. He'll be thinking of boundaries as usual.
Reminds me of a women's match with Healy barely able to walk. Painful to watch!

Now Lyon's out there, he has one thing to do -
Stay with Mitch.

Pope, for his serious misdemeanors, should be forced to push Lyon up and down the edge of the pitch in a wheelchair at least.

Other than getting crocked, I'm not sure what misdemeanors Pope has committed but I'm happy to go along with that!

guildfordbat wrote:

Pal Joey wrote:

guildfordbat wrote:

Pal Joey wrote:Lyon will be excused for lack of footwork. He'll be thinking of boundaries as usual.
Reminds me of a women's match with Healy barely able to walk. Painful to watch!

Now Lyon's out there, he has one thing to do -
Stay with Mitch.

Pope, for his serious misdemeanors, should be forced to push Lyon up and down the edge of the pitch in a wheelchair at least.

Other than getting crocked, I'm not sure what misdemeanors Pope has committed but I'm happy to go along with that!

Let's hope Rehan puts in good innings for him.

Pal Joey wrote:I think Lyon's heroic effort will inspire the team. Now the trend for short-pitched bowling has completely changed the complexion of the match, I wouldn't want to be batting for England right now in the final session. They might get off to a flyer but ultimately the odds will be against surviving another bouncer barrage for a sustained period of time. At least that's what I'm hoping.

PJ - isn't the flipside to that though McCullum (from his chair obviously) and Stokes saying, ''Australia haven't got enough and they knew that sending Lyon out there?

Green dropping a catch at Gully! He's established himself as one of the best in that position. The early luck England needed to turn it around?

guildfordbat wrote:

Pal Joey wrote:I think Lyon's heroic effort will inspire the team. Now the trend for short-pitched bowling has completely changed the complexion of the match, I wouldn't want to be batting for England right now in the final session. They might get off to a flyer but ultimately the odds will be against surviving another bouncer barrage for a sustained period of time. At least that's what I'm hoping.

PJ - isn't the flipside to that though McCullum (from his chair obviously) and Stokes saying, ''Australia haven't got enough and they knew that sending Lyon out there?

No, I don't think that would have even entered the equation. What would they know?
I'm sure Lyon was eager to commence his physio programme... perhaps he just overdid it a bit.

Nice early breakthrough for the Aussies. Crawley averaging just under 30 in this series so far, which is very Crawley-like.