Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
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Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Post-Wimbledon events now in full swing ahead of the USO. New York is arguably the most open and hardest-to-predict Slam. It's the only one that since 2008 has not been dominated by the Big Three/Four. The title has "gone the rounds" with no one retaining it since Rog 15 years ago.
Been watching some of the clips of Alcaraz's stunning Wimbledon performances. I still gasp at some of those enormous wow-inducing forehands. The lad himself says he can't quite believe he's Wimbledon champion and that he beat Djoko.
I enclose a piece by Ed Smith, who may not be everybody's cup of tea as a sports' writer. But I think he hits the nail on the head with these comments.
This is Smith: "It’s unfair to make style a question of morality, but I suspect one reason why Djokovic has been less loved than his main rivals is simple: his mastery over the game of tennis has been based on making fewer mistakes. He’s a brilliant all-round player, but fundamentally he is powered by the errors he doesn’t make. Which fills the trophy cabinet, but not quite our hearts. The highest ambition – and perhaps also the way to honour the gods – is to play at tempo, to expand the dimensions of the game, and to flood the court with judicious optimism. And never, ever yield."
Been watching some of the clips of Alcaraz's stunning Wimbledon performances. I still gasp at some of those enormous wow-inducing forehands. The lad himself says he can't quite believe he's Wimbledon champion and that he beat Djoko.
I enclose a piece by Ed Smith, who may not be everybody's cup of tea as a sports' writer. But I think he hits the nail on the head with these comments.
This is Smith: "It’s unfair to make style a question of morality, but I suspect one reason why Djokovic has been less loved than his main rivals is simple: his mastery over the game of tennis has been based on making fewer mistakes. He’s a brilliant all-round player, but fundamentally he is powered by the errors he doesn’t make. Which fills the trophy cabinet, but not quite our hearts. The highest ambition – and perhaps also the way to honour the gods – is to play at tempo, to expand the dimensions of the game, and to flood the court with judicious optimism. And never, ever yield."
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
I get where Smith is coming from regarding Djokovic - there is something about his style that, other than his movement, doesn't make you go 'wow'. I've said before there's a certain amount of it being very functional / robotic and just all executed at such a high level that he very rarely beats himself (and to be honest, unlike Rafa or Roger, he's also very difficult to just hit off the court - can't think of Djokovic losing in the way Rafa did to Rosol for example).
Alos, Djokovic doesn't always come across as the most likable personality - even before his anti-vax stance, he was someone many in the crowd didn't seem to warm to in spite of things like the player impersonations. Somehow he lacks the relatability of Rafa or the poise of Fed.
Alos, Djokovic doesn't always come across as the most likable personality - even before his anti-vax stance, he was someone many in the crowd didn't seem to warm to in spite of things like the player impersonations. Somehow he lacks the relatability of Rafa or the poise of Fed.
dummy_half- Posts : 6497
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Djoko's hard-to-beat mentality was never better illustrated than in the third point of what turned out to be the final game of the Wimbledon final.
It was 15-15 and Djoko had slightly slipped making his return from the right court. He somehow recovered and hit a terrific cross-court BH which Alcaraz, brilliantly, cut off at the net at full stretch with an outstanding volley.
Just as the new Wimbledon champion won a point few others would have done, very few could have hit a shot as good as Djoko's. It could easily have been 15-30 and, who knows, we could have had a repeat of the ending of the Djoko-Rog 2019 Wimbledon epic.
It was 15-15 and Djoko had slightly slipped making his return from the right court. He somehow recovered and hit a terrific cross-court BH which Alcaraz, brilliantly, cut off at the net at full stretch with an outstanding volley.
Just as the new Wimbledon champion won a point few others would have done, very few could have hit a shot as good as Djoko's. It could easily have been 15-30 and, who knows, we could have had a repeat of the ending of the Djoko-Rog 2019 Wimbledon epic.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
First time I had heard of Ed Smith. Wikipedia has the following (paraphrased):
Now to Ed Smith's quote which I paraphrase:
I thought it particularly odd to insert morality when writing about how one plays professional tennis, but rather than dismiss it out of hand as nonsense I played around with the wording to get it into a form that I could better understand what he was going on about.
Wikipedia wrote: Edward Thomas Smith. Pembury, Kent 1977. Father: novelist & English teacher. Education: Peterhouse, Cambridge: double first in history. Professional Sport: Cricketer: Kent, Middlesex, England. Later Life: BBC commentator, Author, Sports Columnist ...
Now to Ed Smith's quote which I paraphrase:
Ed Smith wrote: Tennis style is a question of morality. Djokovic is justifiably less loved than his main rivals because his style is function over flair, safety over ambition and courage. He is a dour demonic functionary that dishonors tennis. Tennis should be played with tempo, expansive vision, judicious optimism and unyielding courage. It is this latter style of play that fills our hearts with joy and honors tennis.
I thought it particularly odd to insert morality when writing about how one plays professional tennis, but rather than dismiss it out of hand as nonsense I played around with the wording to get it into a form that I could better understand what he was going on about.
No name Bertie- Posts : 3688
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Ed Smith was a good county cricketer who had a few games for England. He later became a selector and made some good, as well as strange, selection choices.
He always rather fancied himself as a writer and some said he was over indulged by certain publications. I've not always agreed with his printed thoughts but in taking a liking to Alcaraz and the way he plays Smith probably speaks for most sports writers.
He always rather fancied himself as a writer and some said he was over indulged by certain publications. I've not always agreed with his printed thoughts but in taking a liking to Alcaraz and the way he plays Smith probably speaks for most sports writers.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Smith's comment is fair I think.
Especially the part about "fewer mistakes".
I am not sure about
"at tempo",
"to expand the dimensions of the game", and
"judicious optimism".
And "never, ever yield."
It's not clear which player those are best applied to.
But certainly I personally preferred Federer because he was going for winners instead of waiting for others to miss.
Alcaraz is similar as well.
Especially the part about "fewer mistakes".
I am not sure about
"at tempo",
"to expand the dimensions of the game", and
"judicious optimism".
And "never, ever yield."
It's not clear which player those are best applied to.
But certainly I personally preferred Federer because he was going for winners instead of waiting for others to miss.
Alcaraz is similar as well.
Henman Bill- Posts : 5265
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Zverev took the Hamburg title while Fritz and Popyrin, who beat Stan the Man, were also final winners over the weekend.
Interesting story in the women's in Hamburg where a 19-year-old WC of Nigerian parentage, Noma Noha Akugue, had a dream run to the final only to lose to 32-yr-old Arantxa Rus.
Andy Murray is in action this weekend in Washington where he's seeded (there are 16 seeds).
Interesting story in the women's in Hamburg where a 19-year-old WC of Nigerian parentage, Noma Noha Akugue, had a dream run to the final only to lose to 32-yr-old Arantxa Rus.
Andy Murray is in action this weekend in Washington where he's seeded (there are 16 seeds).
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Good win by Murray over Nakashima in Washington. Saw a few highlights and Andy looked as if he was hitting the ball well.
He now pays, tonight, top seed Fritz. Was distinctly underwhelmed by Fritz on the grass but it will be a tough match.
Dimi is close to victory in his match to take his place in the quarters in W'ton. Having climbed back into the top 20, Dimi joins Djoko as the only player in that top 20 over the age of 27 - a fairly remarkable stat.
He now pays, tonight, top seed Fritz. Was distinctly underwhelmed by Fritz on the grass but it will be a tough match.
Dimi is close to victory in his match to take his place in the quarters in W'ton. Having climbed back into the top 20, Dimi joins Djoko as the only player in that top 20 over the age of 27 - a fairly remarkable stat.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Good to see Dom Thiem making a semi - the first time he's done it for yonks. He came from a set down tonight to win in Kitzbuhel. Most will agree that Thiem plays exciting, watchable tennis so it's nice to see him getting some wins.
Dimi did, indeed, win in Washington tonight and now could go deep.
Dimi did, indeed, win in Washington tonight and now could go deep.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Thiem reaches his first final in almost 3 years, coming from a set down to beat Laslo Djere (3)6-7 7-5 7-6(8).
Thiem saved 5 match points and will face Sebastian Baez in the final.
Thiem saved 5 match points and will face Sebastian Baez in the final.
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Alas for Thiem, his exertions the day before clearly told as he managed only four games in the final.
Andy Murray battled for nearly three hours before being edged by Fritz but Dan Evans, who has had a rough time of it of late, got thru two rounds in one day.
He'll face Dimi in the semis tonight, although the Bulgarian only had to play once on Friday as he got a w/o. You always have a chance against the mercurial Dimi but you also know that if he plays well he's capable of beating anyone.
Many of the top guys are in action next week in a 1,000-pointer in Toronto. Djoko is just about the only absentee from the top 10. The women are also there and, again, it's a quality field.
Andy Murray battled for nearly three hours before being edged by Fritz but Dan Evans, who has had a rough time of it of late, got thru two rounds in one day.
He'll face Dimi in the semis tonight, although the Bulgarian only had to play once on Friday as he got a w/o. You always have a chance against the mercurial Dimi but you also know that if he plays well he's capable of beating anyone.
Many of the top guys are in action next week in a 1,000-pointer in Toronto. Djoko is just about the only absentee from the top 10. The women are also there and, again, it's a quality field.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Dan Evans on court soon in his first 500-point final. He beat tiredness to win in straight sets against Dimi yesterday.
Dan has not been in sparkling form of late so it's something of a surprise to see him string some excellent results together in Washington in a rain-hit tourney.
To win three matches in two days, with Dimi and Tiafoe beaten, is quite something.
Griekspoor awaits in the final. In the women's in Washington the title has gone to Gauff, while Tsitsipas triumphed in Los Cabos, Mexico.
Dan has not been in sparkling form of late so it's something of a surprise to see him string some excellent results together in Washington in a rain-hit tourney.
To win three matches in two days, with Dimi and Tiafoe beaten, is quite something.
Griekspoor awaits in the final. In the women's in Washington the title has gone to Gauff, while Tsitsipas triumphed in Los Cabos, Mexico.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Terrific title win by Evans and the biggest win of his career. He came thru 7-5, 6-3 v Griekspoor who has had a good season so far with two titles of his own.
The match was halted at 2-2 in the second set which may have helped Dan who had had to play twice the previous day.
He didn't face a BP until the final game when he had to ward off four of them before serving it out. The 500pts take him to a career-high 21 and he should now be seeded for the USO.
Ironically, this win has come after one of the worst runs Evans has had in recent years. I've been watching some highlights of the final and Dan took every opportunity to get into the net where his volleying was of a high standard.
G'spoor didn't quite have the weight of shot to make Dan's task harder. Evans may have had to thank Andy Murray for his title win as Andy could well have worn Fritz out in that 3-hr match, with the American possibly too tired to get to the final.
The circus moves on to Toronto this week with quality fields in both the men's and the women's.
The match was halted at 2-2 in the second set which may have helped Dan who had had to play twice the previous day.
He didn't face a BP until the final game when he had to ward off four of them before serving it out. The 500pts take him to a career-high 21 and he should now be seeded for the USO.
Ironically, this win has come after one of the worst runs Evans has had in recent years. I've been watching some highlights of the final and Dan took every opportunity to get into the net where his volleying was of a high standard.
G'spoor didn't quite have the weight of shot to make Dan's task harder. Evans may have had to thank Andy Murray for his title win as Andy could well have worn Fritz out in that 3-hr match, with the American possibly too tired to get to the final.
The circus moves on to Toronto this week with quality fields in both the men's and the women's.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Good win by Murray over Sonego in Toronto but Evans and Norrie both beaten.
What's happening to FAA? - another first-round exit at the hands of Aussie qualifier Purcell who now plays Murray.
Mum-of-two Caroline Wozniaki returned to the tour with a straight sets win.
What's happening to FAA? - another first-round exit at the hands of Aussie qualifier Purcell who now plays Murray.
Mum-of-two Caroline Wozniaki returned to the tour with a straight sets win.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Sinner took the men's title in Toronto winning in straights over surprise, for me, finalist de Minaur.
The likes of Alcaraz and Medvedev fell comparatively early. Big tourney coming up again this week in Cinci with the USO looming, so players may be pacing themselves.
Pegula did well to beat Swiatek and went on to win the whole thing. She was probably helped by the weather/scheduling which forced a very late night finish for Rybakina and then led final opponent Samsonova to play her semi and final on the same day.
Andy M was forced out in Toronto with an abdominal strain but I see he's still in the draw for Cinci. Djoko returns. He missed the USO last year while Alcaraz had to skip the WTF and the AO. So we could see the number one spot yo-yoing over the new few months.
Indeed, Alcaraz could take the title in New York and still slip to number two, not that he'd be too worried with another Slam secured.
The likes of Alcaraz and Medvedev fell comparatively early. Big tourney coming up again this week in Cinci with the USO looming, so players may be pacing themselves.
Pegula did well to beat Swiatek and went on to win the whole thing. She was probably helped by the weather/scheduling which forced a very late night finish for Rybakina and then led final opponent Samsonova to play her semi and final on the same day.
Andy M was forced out in Toronto with an abdominal strain but I see he's still in the draw for Cinci. Djoko returns. He missed the USO last year while Alcaraz had to skip the WTF and the AO. So we could see the number one spot yo-yoing over the new few months.
Indeed, Alcaraz could take the title in New York and still slip to number two, not that he'd be too worried with another Slam secured.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Andy Murray has pulled out of Cinci with that abdominal strain. No point taking any chances ahead of the USO.
Rain badly affected Monday schedule but not before 43-yr-old Venus Williams came from a double break down in each set to beat 16th seed Kudermetova 6-4, 7-5. Remarkable.
I see that Swiatek and Rybakina have complained about the all-too-frequent late-night finishes. Important here to distinguish between tourneys where rain ruins the programme and tourneys squeezing as much money out of spectators/TV companies by putting on ridiculous scheduling.
Alas with tennis and far too many sports, the needs of players and spectators come well down the list of administrators' priorities.
Rain badly affected Monday schedule but not before 43-yr-old Venus Williams came from a double break down in each set to beat 16th seed Kudermetova 6-4, 7-5. Remarkable.
I see that Swiatek and Rybakina have complained about the all-too-frequent late-night finishes. Important here to distinguish between tourneys where rain ruins the programme and tourneys squeezing as much money out of spectators/TV companies by putting on ridiculous scheduling.
Alas with tennis and far too many sports, the needs of players and spectators come well down the list of administrators' priorities.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Alcaraz made hard work of seeing off Jordan Thompson before finally prevailing in 2hrs 45mins.
Carlos's Wimbledon triumph seems to have taken a lot out of him mentally and physically. This, plus the fact he may well have to get past Djoko again, means he's by no means overwhelming favourite for the USO.
Djoko begins in Cinci today and just might have to play Monfils in round three, the Frenchman having overcome Cam Norrie who ain't having much of a run at the moment. Djoko, though, faces a tough opener against the feisty D-Fokina.
Some interesting stats have been published about return-of-serves. Medvedev, who seems to be in Row B when receiving, actually has very good stats - winning lots of return points and also, remarkably, getting his return shots fairly deep.
Come back of the day yesterday was by Jabeur who somehow recovered from 5-1 down in the final set to beat Kalinina of Ukraine.
Carlos's Wimbledon triumph seems to have taken a lot out of him mentally and physically. This, plus the fact he may well have to get past Djoko again, means he's by no means overwhelming favourite for the USO.
Djoko begins in Cinci today and just might have to play Monfils in round three, the Frenchman having overcome Cam Norrie who ain't having much of a run at the moment. Djoko, though, faces a tough opener against the feisty D-Fokina.
Some interesting stats have been published about return-of-serves. Medvedev, who seems to be in Row B when receiving, actually has very good stats - winning lots of return points and also, remarkably, getting his return shots fairly deep.
Come back of the day yesterday was by Jabeur who somehow recovered from 5-1 down in the final set to beat Kalinina of Ukraine.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Motivation, body and mental preservation and youth. Maybe Alcaraz will be focusing on peaking for the slams with two in the bag already including one on what was his least favorite surface grass. After winning the USO-2022 slam he withdrew from AO-2023 due to a pulled hamstring. In the FO-2023 semi-final he lost to Djokovic because his body cramped.
This years USO will probably be interesting with several contenders. Sinner and Ruud are knocking at the door and at age 22 and 24 respectively and with Djokovic heading towards decrepitude they probably won't have too long to wait.
This years USO will probably be interesting with several contenders. Sinner and Ruud are knocking at the door and at age 22 and 24 respectively and with Djokovic heading towards decrepitude they probably won't have too long to wait.
No name Bertie- Posts : 3688
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Alcaraz avoided back-to-back defeats by Tommy Paul by edging the American in three, despite seeing three MPs come and go at the end of the second set.
Saw a few highlights of this and you could see how Paul upset Carlos last week. Looked a terrific match.
Djoko was too much for Monfils - for the 18th time!* Two big seeds in the men's fell - Medvedev to Zverev and Tsitsipas to Hurkacz.
Pegula and Rybakina also went out, but Swiatek remains and can be expected to go on to take the title.
* Apparently that should have read "for the 19th time". Some sort of a record head-to-head. No doubt Gasquet (awful record v Rafa) and David Ferrer (similarly unsuccessful against Roger) are feeling a little bit better.
Saw a few highlights of this and you could see how Paul upset Carlos last week. Looked a terrific match.
Djoko was too much for Monfils - for the 18th time!* Two big seeds in the men's fell - Medvedev to Zverev and Tsitsipas to Hurkacz.
Pegula and Rybakina also went out, but Swiatek remains and can be expected to go on to take the title.
* Apparently that should have read "for the 19th time". Some sort of a record head-to-head. No doubt Gasquet (awful record v Rafa) and David Ferrer (similarly unsuccessful against Roger) are feeling a little bit better.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Alcaraz is certainly doing things the hard way, coming thru in three yet again in a hard-fought encounter with Purcell. Next up - Hurkacz.
Djoko fairly demolished Fritz who, for me, is well over-ranked. Zverev will now play Nole in the semis. It's their 14th meeting, with Zverev's tally of five wins quite respectable.
Looking like a one v two Swiatek v Sabalenka final in the women's, although both top seeds face tricky semis against Gauff and Muchova, who came so close to winning the French this season.
The USO is almost upon us. As for the last two Slams, it's hard to see much beyond Alcaraz and Djoko for the title.
Djoko fairly demolished Fritz who, for me, is well over-ranked. Zverev will now play Nole in the semis. It's their 14th meeting, with Zverev's tally of five wins quite respectable.
Looking like a one v two Swiatek v Sabalenka final in the women's, although both top seeds face tricky semis against Gauff and Muchova, who came so close to winning the French this season.
The USO is almost upon us. As for the last two Slams, it's hard to see much beyond Alcaraz and Djoko for the title.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Another instalment in the Alcaraz-Djoko rivalry will unfold today as both have reached the final in Cinci.
Carlos again had to do it the hard way, saving an MP in the second set and then having to come back back from 1-4 in the ensuing tiebreak.
Zverev made Djoko work in the other semi before going down 7-6, 7-5, with Nole failing to serve it out the first time but breaking again and getting the job done.
Alcaraz has had to put in the hours on court in this tourney and that might just give Djoko the edge today. Both will obvs go for it, but you feel that given the choice of a title here or one in New York next month they'd prefer the latter.
Bit surprised that Gauff beat Swiatek, although tiredness may have played a part there, too. The final will be not be easy as Sabalenka's conqueror, Muchova, is a real handful and will now enter the top 10 for the first time.
Carlos again had to do it the hard way, saving an MP in the second set and then having to come back back from 1-4 in the ensuing tiebreak.
Zverev made Djoko work in the other semi before going down 7-6, 7-5, with Nole failing to serve it out the first time but breaking again and getting the job done.
Alcaraz has had to put in the hours on court in this tourney and that might just give Djoko the edge today. Both will obvs go for it, but you feel that given the choice of a title here or one in New York next month they'd prefer the latter.
Bit surprised that Gauff beat Swiatek, although tiredness may have played a part there, too. The final will be not be easy as Sabalenka's conqueror, Muchova, is a real handful and will now enter the top 10 for the first time.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Just seen a few clips from the Alcaraz semi. Looked really good, with Hurkacz just one wayward forehand away from winning it and fully contributing to some terrific rallies.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Coco Gauff only 19 years of age continues to make steady progress to the top. It can't be too long before she wins a grand slam tournament, then given her consistency will surely remain at the top for some period of time.
With Alcaraz it seems the longer the match the better it is for him as his quality and endurance come through. He is peaking as the US Open approaches. With Djokovic it seems a question of doing the damage early and hanging in there when the going gets tough.
With Alcaraz it seems the longer the match the better it is for him as his quality and endurance come through. He is peaking as the US Open approaches. With Djokovic it seems a question of doing the damage early and hanging in there when the going gets tough.
No name Bertie- Posts : 3688
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Gauff beat Muchova in straight sets despite missing out on three MPs at 5-2 in the second set.
Coco has been very consistent of late and must be considered a serious threat at the USO.
Djoko v Alcaraz coming up. I think Djoko will edge it.
Coco has been very consistent of late and must be considered a serious threat at the USO.
Djoko v Alcaraz coming up. I think Djoko will edge it.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Djoko took the title after an epic near-four hour match which appeared to have everything.
After recovering from a break down to take the first set 7-5, Alcaraz was a break up in the second only for Djoko to break back. In the ensuing tiebreak Carlos had an MP at 5-6 but Djoko saved it and took the match into a third set.
Both players needed various treatments in humid conditions. Alcaraz saved four MPs when Djoko served for the match in the third set but the Serb finally got over the line in another tiebreak on his 5th MP.
A match like this is bad news for anyone wanting to topple these two at the USO next week. Last night's encounter showed that Djoko is still the man to beat while it provided Alcaraz with more experience of just what it takes to come out on top in long, bruising matches.
After recovering from a break down to take the first set 7-5, Alcaraz was a break up in the second only for Djoko to break back. In the ensuing tiebreak Carlos had an MP at 5-6 but Djoko saved it and took the match into a third set.
Both players needed various treatments in humid conditions. Alcaraz saved four MPs when Djoko served for the match in the third set but the Serb finally got over the line in another tiebreak on his 5th MP.
A match like this is bad news for anyone wanting to topple these two at the USO next week. Last night's encounter showed that Djoko is still the man to beat while it provided Alcaraz with more experience of just what it takes to come out on top in long, bruising matches.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
That final last night between Djokovic and Alcaraz was other world stuff. Jaw dropping tennis being played..I have to say pre match I didn't see Djokovic pulling if off but what a comeback. Has any player saved match points more often and gone on to win key matches. Djokovic has done it so many times over the years.
I think this was a very important win for Novak. Had he lost I think it could have really hit his confidence playing alcaraz going forward. With Alcaraz on the up and novak moving closer to retirement this is a big win physically and mentally.
I think this was a very important win for Novak. Had he lost I think it could have really hit his confidence playing alcaraz going forward. With Alcaraz on the up and novak moving closer to retirement this is a big win physically and mentally.
slashermcguirk- Posts : 1382
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Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
It has been said that one of the characteristic features of the top four / three era was how competition between them pushed their levels ever higher as well as contributed to their longevity - creating an enormous multi-generational gap between them and the rest of the field. Del Potro briefly intervened but his body failed and Wawrinka intervened towards its later stages but he was only able to keep it up for a short period of time. Murray hung in there for 10 years but when it was his time to dominate his body failed him.
So the question will be with no-one pushing him what will happen to Alcaraz. He has arrived at the end of the Djokovic era with Federer retired and Nadal all but retired. He will benefit from Djokovic while Djokovic can keep going.
So the question will be with no-one pushing him what will happen to Alcaraz. He has arrived at the end of the Djokovic era with Federer retired and Nadal all but retired. He will benefit from Djokovic while Djokovic can keep going.
No name Bertie- Posts : 3688
Join date : 2017-02-24
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Slasher - Glad you brought up Djoko's MP-saving. He's done it at least three times against Federer and as you say there have been a number of other instances.
Not sure we've seen such a young v old rivalry before. Normally the young lions devour the old beasts. We certainly saw that with Sampras who was smashed at successive USOs by first Safin and then Hewitt.
A teenage Becker denied Lendl a Wimbledon title and, looking further back, a virile Connors destroyed an ageing Rosewall in the '84 Wimbledon title.
You rather hope Djoko can stick around for a while longer as doing so could well ensure more episodes of what is already a stunning story with Alcaraz.
You wonder if Rafa will be fit enough (or keen enough) to have a crack at the young champion.
Not sure we've seen such a young v old rivalry before. Normally the young lions devour the old beasts. We certainly saw that with Sampras who was smashed at successive USOs by first Safin and then Hewitt.
A teenage Becker denied Lendl a Wimbledon title and, looking further back, a virile Connors destroyed an ageing Rosewall in the '84 Wimbledon title.
You rather hope Djoko can stick around for a while longer as doing so could well ensure more episodes of what is already a stunning story with Alcaraz.
You wonder if Rafa will be fit enough (or keen enough) to have a crack at the young champion.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
Join date : 2011-02-14
Age : 74
Location : London
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Other notable match point saves for djokovic before going on to win:
Saved several match points vs tsonga at 2011 French open on that 42 match wining streak (I think saved 4)
Vs Murray in final of shanghai masters (I think 5 of them)
Vs monfils in I think Paris masters
Vs Federer in Wimbledon final and in semis of us open in 2010 and 2011
Vs Verdasco in a masters QF from memory too (about 4 or 5 saved)
There were several other matches too
Saved several match points vs tsonga at 2011 French open on that 42 match wining streak (I think saved 4)
Vs Murray in final of shanghai masters (I think 5 of them)
Vs monfils in I think Paris masters
Vs Federer in Wimbledon final and in semis of us open in 2010 and 2011
Vs Verdasco in a masters QF from memory too (about 4 or 5 saved)
There were several other matches too
slashermcguirk- Posts : 1382
Join date : 2011-05-31
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Thanks for that, Slasher.
Be interesting to see where Djoko and Carlos stand once the AO 2024 is completed in a few months time.
Djoko is pretty much bound to go back to number one shortly as he has no points to defend at the USO, while Alcaraz has 2,000 to defend.
But at the end of last season Carlos was injured and didn't play either the WTF or the 2023 AO. The USO is the next big thing for both of them, of course. But having beaten Djoko on a Wimbledon Centre Court the Serb had made his home, Alcaraz would no doubt dearly love to win in Melbourne, another "home from home" for Nole.
Must say I'm excited by this new rivalry which has taken away the rawness of the Rog retirement and Rafa's closeness to hanging up his racquet, too.
There are also signs that just as Alcaraz and Djoko are pushing each other new heights that Carlos's burst upon the scene is raising standards generally.
I've only seen a few highlights of the recent US hardcourt swing, but the likes of Paul and Hurkacz have been playing brilliantly. There have been some sensational rallies and guys have been prepared to come to the net more.
This, of course, is the great thing about sport. There are always new heroes to marvel at, even after we've been spoilt rotten in tennis by the extraordinary exploits of the Big Three.
Be interesting to see where Djoko and Carlos stand once the AO 2024 is completed in a few months time.
Djoko is pretty much bound to go back to number one shortly as he has no points to defend at the USO, while Alcaraz has 2,000 to defend.
But at the end of last season Carlos was injured and didn't play either the WTF or the 2023 AO. The USO is the next big thing for both of them, of course. But having beaten Djoko on a Wimbledon Centre Court the Serb had made his home, Alcaraz would no doubt dearly love to win in Melbourne, another "home from home" for Nole.
Must say I'm excited by this new rivalry which has taken away the rawness of the Rog retirement and Rafa's closeness to hanging up his racquet, too.
There are also signs that just as Alcaraz and Djoko are pushing each other new heights that Carlos's burst upon the scene is raising standards generally.
I've only seen a few highlights of the recent US hardcourt swing, but the likes of Paul and Hurkacz have been playing brilliantly. There have been some sensational rallies and guys have been prepared to come to the net more.
This, of course, is the great thing about sport. There are always new heroes to marvel at, even after we've been spoilt rotten in tennis by the extraordinary exploits of the Big Three.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
Join date : 2011-02-14
Age : 74
Location : London
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
I agree SFP, it's a cool rivalry building. I think Hurkasz has massively improved too, he was one point from beating Alcaraz and let's not forget the almighty scare he gave Djokovic at Wimbledon, he was so close to winning first two sets. His serve is lethal and unlike Isner and Co, he had some very good ground strokes and gets plenty of returns in play.
I am curious to see how the likes of Sinner and Paul get on at US open. Meanwhile what has happened to Auger Alliasime?
I am curious to see how the likes of Sinner and Paul get on at US open. Meanwhile what has happened to Auger Alliasime?
slashermcguirk- Posts : 1382
Join date : 2011-05-31
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
FAA seems to have dropped off the face of the earth. He had that amazing run with three quick titles last autumn - points that have, of course, meant that his ranking has remained quirkily high right thru this calendar year.
But he'll no doubt descend quite rapidly down the pecking order before the end of the season.
Another having a terrible season is Maxime Cressy who was as high as 31 last year and is now 114. Must be awful going on court wondering where your next win is coming from.
Meanwhile, injury-hit Jack Draper has made a welcome return to the winners' enclosure with a straight sets triumph in W-Salem tonight.
But he'll no doubt descend quite rapidly down the pecking order before the end of the season.
Another having a terrible season is Maxime Cressy who was as high as 31 last year and is now 114. Must be awful going on court wondering where your next win is coming from.
Meanwhile, injury-hit Jack Draper has made a welcome return to the winners' enclosure with a straight sets triumph in W-Salem tonight.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
Join date : 2011-02-14
Age : 74
Location : London
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Just been watching highlights of the epic Cinci final. Looked unbelievable with punishing rallies often won with stunning winners.
It's been pointed out that Djoko occasionally served and volleyed behind his SECOND serve, sometimes on key points. His spin meant Alcaraz, perhaps standing too deep, had to wait for the ball to arrive allowing Nole time to sneak in to the net for a volley.
Great to see them laughing and joking with each other at the presentation ceremony. Carlos does seem to be a nice, happy guy and both seem to be enjoying an almost father-and-son relationship.
It's been pointed out that Djoko occasionally served and volleyed behind his SECOND serve, sometimes on key points. His spin meant Alcaraz, perhaps standing too deep, had to wait for the ball to arrive allowing Nole time to sneak in to the net for a volley.
Great to see them laughing and joking with each other at the presentation ceremony. Carlos does seem to be a nice, happy guy and both seem to be enjoying an almost father-and-son relationship.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
Join date : 2011-02-14
Age : 74
Location : London
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
With the US open fast approaching, trying to think who are the legitimate threats to Alcaraz and Djokovic. I would put Alcaraz as the slight favourite to win the tournament overall, defending champion and his recent run of form suggest that. No doubt that Novak is very close behind, he has been incredibly consistent at the US open reaching no less than 9 finals but its the one you would have expected him to win more in his career, mind you a lot of players would happily take 3 US open wins! It is the the most unpredictable slam though and I do think part of that 3 wins from 9 finals at the US open is a result of a very long season. It feels like the one slam where a lot of the players are gassed, particularly those who are consistently reaching the finals and semi finals of most tournaments throughout the year, the same can be the case with ATP finals.
For me the danger men are:
Hurkasz - his serve is lethal and you could argue he is the one guy who has come closest to beating both Djokovic (couple of very close tie breaks at wimbledon) and Alcaraz last week holding a match point which was on his racket. He has the firepower to beat anyone on his day but probably needs a more clutch mindset to get over the line.
Sinner - Brilliant on his day and big firepower, I dont think he will fear anyone but my main issue with him is the inexplicable losses to lesser ranked players. If he gets on a run he can be very dangerous but he still hasnt shown enough consistently at slams to make me think this will be his slam to win, definitely has the potential
Medvedev - so dangerous on his day and he likes the US open having had his only slam win there but his form has been patchy this year. I dont see it happening but he has that akward game that many struggle against and if he gets his serve working well consistently, definitely a threat on hard courts
Zverev - I really did think this guy could win a slam and I do still believe he might win one or two but you feel he needs to do it the next year or two or the mental baggage will be too much. I see him as a big threat here to anyone but can he go all the way, just not sure, I would put him in the top 3 outside of Novak or Alcaraz capable of winning.
Tsitsipas - again a lovely player but I feel he is a bit flaky mentally in the very biggest matches at the slams. He has the shots to win one but I think his backhand gets broken down too often, Alcaraz and Djokovic in particular seem to like playing him these days so he will probably need someone to beat one of them to have his chance
Rune - Probably the player like least but very capable on his day and he is another genuine threat. He has shown in more recent slams that he is capable of going deep in slams but there is still a question mark for me with him on can he go all the way to a final just yet, one of those that could be prone to an early round lapse
Rublev - For me great firepower but lacks a Plan B when the ball bashing isnt getting it done. For me a very good player but not a great player and a bit one dimensional. Can hit a massive ball but I am not convinced of his slam winning credentials.
I think the likes of Fritz and Tiafoe will give USA a chance of a winner but I just dont see it happening. For me both still lack that something extra to bring them through in the latter stages of slams against the very best players. I question whether they can back it up match after match, they may take a big scalp along the way but dont see them having the consistency to go all the way. Ruud has reached the final in New York and other slam finals and while i can see him doing well, I cant see him having enough weopons against the top 2. Other power players capable of causing upsets but not winning tournament are Khachanov or Fokina.
For me the danger men are:
Hurkasz - his serve is lethal and you could argue he is the one guy who has come closest to beating both Djokovic (couple of very close tie breaks at wimbledon) and Alcaraz last week holding a match point which was on his racket. He has the firepower to beat anyone on his day but probably needs a more clutch mindset to get over the line.
Sinner - Brilliant on his day and big firepower, I dont think he will fear anyone but my main issue with him is the inexplicable losses to lesser ranked players. If he gets on a run he can be very dangerous but he still hasnt shown enough consistently at slams to make me think this will be his slam to win, definitely has the potential
Medvedev - so dangerous on his day and he likes the US open having had his only slam win there but his form has been patchy this year. I dont see it happening but he has that akward game that many struggle against and if he gets his serve working well consistently, definitely a threat on hard courts
Zverev - I really did think this guy could win a slam and I do still believe he might win one or two but you feel he needs to do it the next year or two or the mental baggage will be too much. I see him as a big threat here to anyone but can he go all the way, just not sure, I would put him in the top 3 outside of Novak or Alcaraz capable of winning.
Tsitsipas - again a lovely player but I feel he is a bit flaky mentally in the very biggest matches at the slams. He has the shots to win one but I think his backhand gets broken down too often, Alcaraz and Djokovic in particular seem to like playing him these days so he will probably need someone to beat one of them to have his chance
Rune - Probably the player like least but very capable on his day and he is another genuine threat. He has shown in more recent slams that he is capable of going deep in slams but there is still a question mark for me with him on can he go all the way to a final just yet, one of those that could be prone to an early round lapse
Rublev - For me great firepower but lacks a Plan B when the ball bashing isnt getting it done. For me a very good player but not a great player and a bit one dimensional. Can hit a massive ball but I am not convinced of his slam winning credentials.
I think the likes of Fritz and Tiafoe will give USA a chance of a winner but I just dont see it happening. For me both still lack that something extra to bring them through in the latter stages of slams against the very best players. I question whether they can back it up match after match, they may take a big scalp along the way but dont see them having the consistency to go all the way. Ruud has reached the final in New York and other slam finals and while i can see him doing well, I cant see him having enough weopons against the top 2. Other power players capable of causing upsets but not winning tournament are Khachanov or Fokina.
slashermcguirk- Posts : 1382
Join date : 2011-05-31
sirfredperry likes this post
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Slasher: Excellent post, if you don't mind me saying. As you say, for the last 15 years anything can/has happened at the USO.
I guess it's too much to ask for Djoko and Carlos to come thru to play another epic final. But few would be surprised if these two emerged as the title match contenders.
I keep coming back to the stat that no one has successfully defended their USO title since Rog in '08.
Meanwhile, the ATP have announced two new packages from 2024. First, players will get a guaranteed annual sum if they are in the top 250. Second, injured players will get a financial support package.
This is a step in the right direction. I would have preferred to see the guys at the very top - say the top 20 or 30 - getting NOTHING from this new deal as they are already earning riches. But as with everything else these days, the rich just seem to get richer.
I guess it's too much to ask for Djoko and Carlos to come thru to play another epic final. But few would be surprised if these two emerged as the title match contenders.
I keep coming back to the stat that no one has successfully defended their USO title since Rog in '08.
Meanwhile, the ATP have announced two new packages from 2024. First, players will get a guaranteed annual sum if they are in the top 250. Second, injured players will get a financial support package.
This is a step in the right direction. I would have preferred to see the guys at the very top - say the top 20 or 30 - getting NOTHING from this new deal as they are already earning riches. But as with everything else these days, the rich just seem to get richer.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
Join date : 2011-02-14
Age : 74
Location : London
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
Yes very good observation. Defending the US open has proved very challenging since Federers amazing run. It has thrown up so many different winners. Always find the contrast between Australian open and us open so interesting, very different hard court speed and bounce, also both taking place at opposite ends of tennis calendar, players maybe undercooked vs overcooked.
Bigger hitters have tended to do better at US open. Cilic, del Porto, wawrinka, thiem etc beyond the usual suspects who contend at all slams.
Bigger hitters have tended to do better at US open. Cilic, del Porto, wawrinka, thiem etc beyond the usual suspects who contend at all slams.
slashermcguirk- Posts : 1382
Join date : 2011-05-31
Re: Summer tournaments leading up to US Open 2023
With qualifying well under way for the USO, it's announced that this will be John Isner's last tournament.
Now 38, the big server has slipped down the rankings. I'm sure John is a really nice guy and he has made the absolute most of his monstrous height to have a good career.
But I, for one, will be pleased to see him go. Tourney after tourney he got by on the tiebreak, hardly ever breaking serve and sometimes hardly even reaching break point. In pre-tiebreak times he'd have won very few matches.
He'll always be remembered for the 11-hour struggle with Mahut at Wimbledon and for ushering in final-set tiebreaks at all the Slams following another marathon match a few years later with Anderson.
Now 38, the big server has slipped down the rankings. I'm sure John is a really nice guy and he has made the absolute most of his monstrous height to have a good career.
But I, for one, will be pleased to see him go. Tourney after tourney he got by on the tiebreak, hardly ever breaking serve and sometimes hardly even reaching break point. In pre-tiebreak times he'd have won very few matches.
He'll always be remembered for the 11-hour struggle with Mahut at Wimbledon and for ushering in final-set tiebreaks at all the Slams following another marathon match a few years later with Anderson.
sirfredperry- Posts : 7076
Join date : 2011-02-14
Age : 74
Location : London
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