I'd have never believed that 20 years ago. . . .

First topic message reminder :

Simple enough really. What have been the biggest changes in rugby over the last 20 years. If you were told something about the modern game 20 years ago what would amaze you most. It could be that a Munster v Leinster fixture is capable of drawing in 80,000 fans. That after their World Cup win in 1987 the All Blacks still haven't manage to win another RWC trophy. Or even the amount of internationals who are born overseas.

Who knows. Its up to you. If you were told something about todays sport in 1991 what would have shocked you most?

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

AlynDavies wrote:[

What an odd statement...
Success is measured in Grand slams and Wales has won the same amount in 6 years that Ireland have since 1873!
For all Ireland "success" as you call it they have only 1 Grand slam in this golden generation and that generation looks pretty much over after this World Cup. Club successes go up and down, Ireland have had a few good years, but I doubt it will last when you consider the calibure and money that the French clubs are throwing around.
Finally when you talk about the raise of Irish rugby, and the demise of Welsh rugby it's worth noting we did beat them last time!

Since when did Grand Slams become the measure of success.If Italy get 3 wins a season for the next 5 6Nations have they not succeeded.

It's all relative and Ireland is coming from a position where rugby was such a minority sport that the vast majority of kids in the country never even touched a ball never mind had the chance to play it.These days it's still a minority sport but it's growing at a massive rate and there is no stoppping it,as I said before rugby has no real competition in Ireland,G.A.A. is both a summer sport and an amateur organisation while soccer is of a pretty low level and will never grow as all the best players move to England as soon as they show the slightest bit of potential.

Also you say you doubt our club success will continue since the French clubs are throwing so much money around.I think we'll only get stronger,there are more and more kids starting to play the game and I really don't think many people realise just how much growth potential there still is in Ireland.

Alan,
Those 2 x SLAMs are not a measure of long-term improvement, Im afraid. Look at the Welsh 6-N stats, in the last 11 years. They are not pretty. Hero to Zero - too many times. No long term consistency. Is that what you want? Wouldnt it be better to be realistically challenging for it each and every year instead? And then taking that consistency and belief into a RWC?

This Welsh obsession with SLAMS. Winning the 6-N and/or, being consistent in it, year on year, is the key to competing on the World stage. Also, just being happy beating the English once in a while - has to stop for ye to evolve and take on the SH, imo. Irish rugby has evolved from that small-mindedness. TF. Well, most of us have. Some still haven't got over the Famine. But phhok em. Just need to sort it out now with the French and the NH is ours. We have at club-level over the last 11 years - despite the massive financial disparity. 4 X HC wins, 6 Finals and endless QF's & SF's. Now for their national team.


It has to start with the Regions. Wales will then feed from their success. It never works top-down. Not long term anyway.
But you know that by now.

Sorry for hijacking this thread. It should be transferred to a "Wales - the regions and the Future?" article. But, I love Welsh rugby. Have some great Scarlets, Dragons and Os mates - who feel the same way. Want it to grow into a real World Power again. From base up. That's where Im coming from here.

Cymru ar Byth.

glamorganalun wrote:Risca:

I did not write the comment regarding Welsh rugby going backwards I quoted another poster. Since you are so keen to put a different post on regional rugby why don't you do it stating why regional rugby is working so well and why the crowds are flocking to see their regions (not) and why the Dragons and the other teams do so well in the HC.

I await your post with no interest.

I know what you wrote. You wrote the last line. My point is, you've written guff like "South of the M4 and this regions are clubs nonsense", but you do it without any substance.

Your end to your post just sums people like you up. Telling me to write a thread and then saying you aren't bothered. Nice one genius

Risca:

You were telling me to write a thread you thought up, I turned just it around on you if you are that interested or can't you not remember?

While you have your eyes closed I am concerned that our rugby is going down the pan e.g., the way our region's (some better than others) don't play any games around the region to promote the team the Ospreys being the best example playing at Aberavon and Bridgend (note :South of the M4), I see the Blues are playing Ponty pre-season that's a change for them but I suspect that could be a war and they are supposed to be part of the same region hence summing up what we have today. The quote by Alyn about Wales winning GS as a result of regional rugby is rubbish all the players were developed in club rugby, it is only now we are starting to see players coming through regional rugby (would they come through club rugby anyway?).

That there would be an European Rugby Cup and after 14 years neither Llanelli or Swansea (who had both just beaten Australia) would have won it.

Look Alun, try beating your ground sharing drum to a Dragons supporter and show me a ground worth hosting one. Any decent rugby person who lives in "Gwent" should know there is no stadium fit for purpose to host a game. I'm quite happy to let a "Gwent" based alleged rugby supporter live in their fantasy world that there is a stadium fit for purpose, because given transport and hospitality there is no other ground fit. Like I say, I'm quite happy to have the type of rugby supporters in "Gwent" not follow the Dragons, because they don't go to the Liberty either. So all they do is cut their nose off to spite their face. Good luck to them I say, cos they have no Regional Rugby to watch because they're bitter. As long as they're happy wearing their O's shirt around Gwent without attending any game, then good luck to them. They are the problem with the Regions. Bitter, without cause. As I say, if you were North Walian, you might have a case. In the South, you need to grow up, drop the South of the M4 rubbish and get behind a region. It isn't going to change, so stop being so bitter and get behind a region.

Attendances won't rise fully until the petty people like you wake up. I'd rather go "South of the M4" and watch a Region than not see any top class rugby (even if my Region are in the Amlin as you are so keen to point out).

Rev, for what its worth I think some teams are suited to regionalism more than others. To me the Scarlets are nowhere near a region. Ospreys and Dragons are. But thats what suits each of them.

Risca:

The crowds at the Dragons this season were less that 5K due to ground improvements, I am talking about vistiting teams like the Italians, LV cup so you hardly need a big ground for these games, it is about making an effort! Dave parade has hardly been a palace to visit over the years. I am not saying the Dragons are worse than the Blues and the Scarlets the fact is the crowds are poor for all 4 regions, something need to be done and not sit on your hands and blame others for not travelling from Bleanafon to Newport for a 6.30 kick off on a Friday night (cost, time, traffic and some poor teams in the league). This example is not North Wales but you are asking a lot for potential supporters from the heads of the valleys to support the city sides. Some blame has to go to the TV companies for earlly starts and Friday night games don't help crowds.

I wish all regions good luck next season, it may not sound like I mean it but i aways want a Welsh region to win and do well but it does not mean I think all is well in our game, this situation was created by the WRU.

roddersm wrote:That Ireland would win a GS and 3 triple crowns, regularly beat England and beat SA, France and Australia. Never thought any of it would happen in my lifetime.

Regularly beat Australia????

Rob B wrote:

roddersm wrote:That Ireland would win a GS and 3 triple crowns, regularly beat England and beat SA, France and Australia. Never thought any of it would happen in my lifetime.

Regularly beat Australia????

Try again....