Ireland Squad - Has anyones name been scribbled out yet?

So folks, there were many people complaining at some selections for the Scotland match. Many selected players were arguably 3rd/4th choice.

Will these players all get another chance? Or was that there chance? Did anyone by their performance play themselves off the plane? Did any players not do enough?

I believe all the backs from Saturday still are under consideration. Even Jones, i don't think we saw enough of him.

Who in your opinion, has potentially got their name scribbled out already? Or is everyone still in with a shout?

A reminder of the team:
Ireland: R Kearney (Leinster); A Trimble (Ulster), F McFadden (Leinster), P Wallace (Ulster), L Fitzgerald (Leinster); J Sexton (Leinster), T O'Leary (Munster); T Court (Ulster), S Cronin (Leinster), T Buckley (Sale), D Ryan (Munster), L Cullen (Leinster, capt), M McCarthy (Connacht), N Ronan (Munster), D Leamy (Munster).

Replacements: J Flannery (Munster), M Horan (Munster), J Hayes (Munster), M O'Driscoll (Munster), K McLaughlin (Leinster), I Boss (Leinster), F Jones (Munster).

Horan, Ronan, O'Driscoll are all with Munster as are Stringer and Varley. Tom Court is with Ulster.

Cian Healy is going to be at loosehead.

Sorry Stag, I was referring to World Cup Selection, not This weekends selection.

Remember, out conversation yesterday about me being a cuthroat? lol

You mean scribbled out as in not going to NZ yes??? Or out of the 1st French game????

Horan, Ronan, O'Driscoll, that's it for me baring injury.
If Fla puts in another 60min performance of some quality Varley can go on that list too.
I agree we need to see much more of Jones but with time constraints may not be able to see as much as we'd like.

Hayes is awfully close to that line too

Clive I would say McCarthy, Ronin and McFadden were outsiders to be on the plane anyway and none did enough to elevate their chances despite all having decent games.

Felix Jones didn't really get a chance to show what he can do but I think Kearney's assured performance is enough to rule him out.

The tight 5 all did enough to secure a spot on the plane and possibly Flannery and Hayes are another 50-60min of gametime away from joining them. I'd say Horan is out though.

Fitzgerald and Paddy Wallace did enough to secure their spots and Trimble might just have done enough too but maybe he needs a big game to be sure.

Sexton, TOL and Leamy are all certainties anyway.

Leamy isn't a certainty Rodders.

I still think Fitz needs a good performance if McF delivers one too.

Also Jones isn't ruled out cos we haven't seen Murphy or Earls at 15 yet.

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Leamy isn't a certainty Rodders.

I still think Fitz needs a good performance if McF delivers one too.

Also Jones isn't ruled out cos we haven't seen Murphy or Earls at 15 yet.

I'm afraid Leamy is Pete. Kidney clearly sees him as 5th choice backrower.

Fitz is way ahead of McFadden in the pecking order and if Kearney goes Jones and Murphy won't.

Jennings hasn't even played a game yet!! Taking Leamy rules out Jennings (if 1F is fit). Jennings has played much better than leamy this year and brings something that no other backrow brings which can't be said for Leamy

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Jennings hasn't even played a game yet!! Taking Leamy rules out Jennings (if 1F is fit). Jennings has played much better than leamy this year and brings something that no other backrow brings which can't be said for Leamy

I agree Pete but I believe Kidney will take Leamy before Jennings. Against Italy we were missing both Ferris and heaslip and Jennings still only made the bench. If Ferris is fit then Jennings won't go no matter what he does.

I would say everyone is still in with a shout.

Cutting someone now would have needed a complete balls up, and everyone did their jobs more or less. Not a great performance, but you couldn't single out anyone as having had a shocker or proving they should never have been selected in the first place.

I don't think that is a fair statement. He may well not go but I think if he performs the way we know he can DK may/should realise that he doesn't need a version of Sob or 1F just worse and that he may need something completely different.

Pete I'm not saying it is fair but I believe that will be what Kidney is planning.

Greybeard everyone is in with a shout but there are a number of players there who's only chance of selection is through injury to other players.

I'd say Kidney already knows 99% of his squad but needs to keep fringe players in the frame in case of injury or drastic loss of form.

What players are unlikely to get another start in a warm up?

McCarthy? Ronan? Ryan?

For me Kearney and Fitzgeralds performances have put Trimbles place in doubt nevermind McFadden.

A lot will come down to Murphy and Jones and how they perform.

In Trimble Bowe Earls Murphy kearney Fitzgerald, there is really no need for McFaddens and the value of his versatility is negated.

Clive I think most players will get some gametime still but I'd say a few have fallen off the radar a bit after the Scotland game and that was their big chance to put a marker down.

McFadden could still get in if D'arcy doesn't recover but I don't think the will happen.

I'd say Bowe, Earls, kearney are all certainties if fit so it's between Fitzgerald, Trimble and McFadden for two spots I'd say in which case McFadden is down the pecking order.

I don't think Murphy or Jones will get in either unless there are injuries. However Kidney might feel that Kearney can cover the wing and decide to take a 2nd full back and leave Fitzgerald or Trimble out.

There seems to be a big gap opening up in terms of what Kidney should pick and what people think he will.

For example, I think Leamy will go ahead of Jennings. Although he shouldnt.

Wallace will go ahead of McFadden, which he shouldnt.

Boyne wrote:There seems to be a big gap opening up in terms of what Kidney should pick and what people think he will.

For example, I think Leamy will go ahead of Jennings. Although he shouldnt.

Wallace will go ahead of McFadden, which he shouldnt.

Boyne

We have no evidence to suggest McFadden should go ahead of Paddy. Give the lad a chance at 12 to see how he gets on but McFadden hasnt impressed in the centre yet.

I think if we see the same back three as against England (in the 6N) to see is Earls is a viable option at 15. If he is, i think Jones should stay and start the Pro12 with Munster. If not then Jones deserves the chance to take the other 15 slot. I have no idea how Murphy is going yet. To be honest i think the only person we can categorically right off in Niall Ronan

We have no evidence to suggest McFadden should go ahead of Paddy. Give the lad a chance at 12 to see how he gets on but McFadden hasnt impressed in the centre yet.

Wallace has NEVER impressed anywhere for Ireland. Anywhere.

Boyne

The above statement is nonsense. He played very well on the tour down under a few seasons back and wasnt bad at all in our grand slam year. He isnt imo a world beater at 12 but we havent seen anything from McFadden to suggest he is either. I hope he gets the chance to though. It would be healthier for Ireland if our 12 was 25 odd instead of over 30.

Realisitically Wallace is always going as 3rd choice 10 so in reality McFadden is actually battling with Fitz

Boyne

Wallace has played well for Ireland at 12. Usually down under on summer tours against Australia and New Zealand. I'm a McFadden fan but he has never played well for Ireland in the center. I know he's barely had a chance, but there's no evidence for you to back up what you're saying. He wasn't particularly good at the weekend. So you can't say he should go instead of Wallace.

I think you're right about Jennings though. He's very underrated outside Leinster. What he enables the other backrowers to do is what makes him important. He doesn't stand out individualy. But look at the difference he made to Leinster when he came on the 2nd half of the HEC. He had a similar effect when he came on against Toulouse. But I think Kidney prefers Leamy. And the injury Jennings suffered has damaged his chances.

I was impressed with Ryan and Cullen. Very good backup to our starting locks. I think Ryan will go now. I like Trimble, Earls, Fitzgerald, Kearney, Jones, Murphy and McFadden. I'd have confidence in all of them but unfortunately they're not all going to make it.

Boyne wrote:

We have no evidence to suggest McFadden should go ahead of Paddy. Give the lad a chance at 12 to see how he gets on but McFadden hasnt impressed in the centre yet.

Wallace has NEVER impressed anywhere for Ireland. Anywhere.

Well apart from breaking our points in a game record against the Pacific Islanders and playing a key role in some of our best ever performances against the SH teams then you are probably right.

Standulstermen wrote:Boyne

The above statement is nonsense. He played very well on the tour down under a few seasons back and wasnt bad at all in our grand slam year. He isnt imo a world beater at 12 but we havent seen anything from McFadden to suggest he is either. I hope he gets the chance to though. It would be healthier for Ireland if our 12 was 25 odd instead of over 30.

Realisitically Wallace is always going as 3rd choice 10 so in reality McFadden is actually battling with Fitz

I pray he is in the squad as 3rd cover for 10.

People keep on bringing up a nonsensical SH tour when we were 40 points down to the ABs playing with 13 men. It was not a real test of ability. Its not a real match up. Please, leave it behind. Mick O Driscoll played a stormer for Munster vs the ABs. Nobody is clamoring for his inclusion.

And no, he didnt do much in the Grand Slam year. The stand out acts he performed playing for Ireland recently were:

1. Nearly BLOWING the Grand Slam by giving away THAT penalty.
2. BLOWING an overlap vs Wales last season.

His contribution has been more negative than positive and I would have Humphries covering the 3rd OH and not him.

It will take Paddy seriously f cking something up for some here to realize he is not good enough. By that stage it will be too late.

roddersm wrote:

Boyne wrote:

We have no evidence to suggest McFadden should go ahead of Paddy. Give the lad a chance at 12 to see how he gets on but McFadden hasnt impressed in the centre yet.

Wallace has NEVER impressed anywhere for Ireland. Anywhere.

Well apart from breaking our points in a game record against the Pacific Islanders and playing a key role in some of our best ever performances against the SH teams then you are probably right.

Again, this ridiculous SH tour excuse. And the PI's!!! Wow! Fantastic.

Look, I am being a little over zealous here perhaps, but I just cant believe all the faith being shown in him.

He will cost us dear. Everyone knows it.

Your getting your tours mixed up Boyne which doesnt actually help your argument. I agree with you that Paddy has made mistakes but bear in mind that the guy you are clamouring for just made the mistake that cost us our last game.....

Yes he did plenty in the grand slam season. The fact that he started the first 3 games (against the next two best teams; France and England) means nothing to you then i dont know.

Boyne wrote:It will take Paddy seriously f cking something up for some here to realize he is not good enough. By that stage it will be too late.

What like shooting out of the defensive line and costing us a match....er wait that was the other bloke..the one you said was the next BOD....

Anyway it was the other AB game I was thinking of, where he was up against Nonu and scored the try that almost won us the game. He also helped us almost beat Australia too by setting up BOD's try with a super pass that put Kearney into a gap. For such a bad player he's came up against the biggest and best centres around and rarely come of 2nd best.

I'll always remember that game against Aus in 08 I think where BOD broke down the right wing and Wallace raced up on his inside BOD gave the try scoring pass that hit the deck and nowhere near Wallace.

I always felt that if Wallace had scored that try and we'd beaten Aus in Aus Wallace would not be so hated.

I think he is a good player and that Boyne is well over the top

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:
I think he is a good player and that Boyne is well over the top

I accept he's never delivered an awesome performance for Ireland (bar against the PI's) but he has delivered a few good ones and has never been terrible as some have made out.

In my eyes he's a talented player, who's never quite fulfilled his potential but hasn't let anyone down either and he gets way too much stick. If Kidney and EOS didn't feel he brought something positive to the squad then he wouldn't be there.

As a 1st 5/8th type playmaker there is no other Irish player who comes close so he is in the squad on merit.

Can't see Jones being picked for the WC squad at all unless someone gets injured he hasn't a hope really. Though I'd imagine there will be at least one high profile injury in the warm up games. Nearly always is.

Murphy went off limping for the Tigers against Montpellier last night...........

Ireland need a 3rd OH cover, but more than ever they need centre cover with doubts over both starters, so they should leave the only one (apart from Darce) who starts 12 for his province behind?
Unless Kidney is brainless (which I doubt) - Wallace will definitely go.

I can't see Jones going. Kearney came through against Scotland showing enough skill and fitness. RK needs more game time so will be involved in two of the next three games. Earls is also likely to be tried at FB at some point. so there are very limited opportunities to "try" a tyro. There is no point in taking Jones to cover Kearney, as a one for one cover is unnecessary at FB when there are others who can cover. Jones has 20 minutes of an International warm-up under his belt in an unfamiliar team, he can't be considered as cover for any other position. Felix will be first back-up though in case RK gets injured as I can't see Murphy getting any chance to book his ticket.

Varley won't go. Flannery needs as much gametime as he can get, and with Best also needing significant minutes, the three hookers will be RB, JF, SC.

Ronan won't go. Personally I'd be really tempted to take six specialist backrows, but it will probably be 5 + Ryan. Either way Ronan (or Henry) won't be among them.