Ireland 9 - 20 England - Final Score - Post Match discussion.

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England gave themselves a confidence boost a fortnight before the World Cup as they condemned Ireland to a fourth straight warm-up defeat.

An early Manu Tuilagi try and two Jonny Wilkinson penalties saw England lead 13-9 at half-time, Ronan O'Gara landing three kicks in reply.

With Chris Ashton in the sin-bin, England stretched their lead with a Delon Armitage try.

That proved the final score as heavy rain made conditions tricky.

Five months after their humbling 24-8 defeat attempting a Six Nations Grand Slam in Dublin, England will take heart from their first victory in the Irish capital since 2003.

But the casualty rate of the warm-up programme escalated further, with both sides suffering more injuries days before departing for New Zealand.

Ireland saw David Wallace stretchered off and Jamie Heaslip also depart in the first half, while Hendre Fourie and Mark Cueto only lasted the opening quarter for England.

ENGLAND'S WORLD CUP FIXTURES
Continue reading the main story
v Argentina: 10 Sept, Dunedin
v Georgia: 18 Sept, Dunedin
v Romania: 24 Sept, Dunedin
v Scotland: 01 Oct, Auckland
Fourie - not in the 30-man World Cup squad - had only been drafted in as a late replacement after Nick Easter joined fellow back-rows Tom Wood and Lewis Moody on the sidelines, with James Haskell starting at number eight.

Fourie was heavily involved in England's opening salvo before two minutes of pressure came to nothing when Wilkinson's right-footed drop-goal from long range drifted wide.

But the visitors didn't have long to wait to get on the scoreboard. After a powerful scrum and pick-up from Haskell, England moved the ball left and a simple pass from Mike Tindall sent Tuilagi arcing round an out-of-position Keith Earls to score his second try in as many Tests, Wilkinson converting.

Ireland replied when Geordan Murphy fielded an aimless kick from Wilkinson and was blatantly impeded by Courtney Lawes as he tried to run it back, O'Gara landing the penalty.

But England's scrum power was evident as they pushed the Irish back on their own ball, giving Wilkinson the opportunity to make it 10-3.

Ireland refused several more kicks at goal, Eoin Reddan taking a quick tap penalty close to the England line, only to see Cueto intercept his scoring pass with two men outside him.

Tuilagi's impact on the game continued to be felt, particularly by Wallace.

The Ireland flanker carried the ball through Tuilagi's initial tackle but did not survive a second encounter with the Anglo-Samoan, being stretchered off with a knee injury as O'Gara was landing his second penalty for the high tackle.

England also lost Fourie - replaced by lock Tom Palmer with Lawes moving into the back row - and Cueto, with Armitage replacing the latter.

A marginal high tackle by Stephen Ferris on Lawes saw Wilkinson make it 13-6 in the 27th minute, and England should have extended their lead on the half-hour.

Tuilagi picked up a loose Ireland line-out in his own half and galloped 60m before Murphy collared him, but England butchered a clear overlap with poor passes from Wilkinson and Lawes, Chris Ashton and Ben Foden bawling their frustration.

IRELAND'S WORLD CUP FIXTURES
Continue reading the main story
v USA: 11 Sept, New Plymouth
v Australia: 17 Sept, Auckland
v Russia: 25 Sept, Rotorua
v Italy: 02 Oct, Dunedin
Referee Nigel Owens lectured England captain Tindall as the penalty count rose, then warned Tom Croft after a skirmish with Cian Healy on the floor.

Ireland finished the half in the ascendancy but the visitors kept out a wave of attacks to preserve their lead.

They should have been hampered on the resumption with Ashton was sin-binned, but O'Gara's penalty came back off an upright.

Instead England stretched their lead while down to 14 men as Tindall's beautifully-weighted grubber kick was gathered by Armitage to touch down, Wilkinson's conversion pushing them out to 20-9.

But it was a mixed outing for the celebrated fly-half, who over-cooked a penalty kicked to the corner and saw another pass go to ground.

As the heavens opened on the hour, neither side was able to sustain any momentum in the final quarter, despite Paul O'Connell's promptings for Ireland.

The hosts depart for the World Cup on the back of four straight defeats, England buoyed by victory two weeks before they take on Argentina.

Ireland: Murphy, Bowe, Earls, D'Arcy, Trimble, O'Gara, Reddan; Healy, Flannery, Ross, O'Callaghan, O'Connell, Ferris, Wallace, Heaslip. Replacements: Best (for Flannery, 50), Court (for Healy, 70), Ryan (for Heaslip, 35), Leamy (for Wallace, 22), Murray (for Reddan, 62), Sexton (for O'Gara, 62), McFadden (71).

England: Foden, Ashton, Tuilagi, Tindall, Cueto, Wilkinson, Wigglesworth; Sheridan, Thompson, Cole, Deacon, Lawes, Croft, Fourie, Haskell. Replacements: Hartley (for Thompson, 52), Stevens (for Sheridan, 57), Shaw (for Deacon, 62), Palmer (for Fourie, 21), Simpson, Flood (for Tindall, 75), Armitage (for Cueto, 21).

Yellow card: Chris Ashton (41)

Referee: Nigel Owens (Wales)

Attendance: 48,523

Bowe , Trimble , Wallace , Hayes i couldnt care less just get Darcy out of our team

AlynDavies wrote:What about Tommy Bowe alongside BOD?
Bowe had a decent season in the center for the Ospreys. I think he could compliment BOD really well.

NEVER! That man stays in the 14 shirt

You want a centre? Mcfadden...Wallace...have them.

I only saw the 1st try on the news but it seemed to me that D'Arcy was badly caught out.

Cari wrote:NEVER! That man stays in the 14 shirt

You want a centre? Mcfadden...Wallace...have them.

The logic being, if he's on the wing he's closer to you while sat in the stand?
Though he did play a lot of rugby in the center last season for the Ospreys

Thomond wrote:I only saw the 1st try on the news but it seemed to me that McFdden was badly caught out.

it was earls had to cover darcys man as darcy was flatfooted and tuillagi got on his outside shoulder

C'mon You Irish wrote:LOL you telling me Trimble would do any worse than Darcy in the centre , Darcy does NOTHING and that is not even an exaggeration he cant defend , makes no yeard when going forward all he does is constantly loses the ball

I would agree with dropping D'Arcy he's been poor but Wallace is the next in line and seeing how he's ahead of Trimble as a centre for Ulster wouldn't that suggest to you he'd be better there for Ireland.

Look i would rather have Trimble in thier as he offers a bit more of a physical presence but i would take Wallace just as long as we don't have Darcy in the team

Cumbrian wrote:
A point about the ref. I saw Ireland doing exactly the same as England at the breakdown for the majority of the game, yet they were penalised half as much. peed me off a bit.

I didn't see that much, but the one where an irish player (healey?) came right round the side followed by o'connell - leading to the earls dive - was ridiculous. thought owens missed a fair few forward passes as well but I do always seem to spot them more from the other team. odd that.

AlynDavies wrote:What about Tommy Bowe alongside BOD?
Bowe had a decent season in the center for the Ospreys. I think he could compliment BOD really well.

Bowe is a much better 14 than centre, is positioning was not as good as it should have been whenever he played there for the ospreys and he never looks entirely comfortable there.

Looking at the highlights on rte now, earls has put in a lot of tackles before the try. The try was a complete misreading by him and his footwork let him down, he had stepped in and couldn't readjust. But after the miss, the try should still have been stopped by bowe or murphy who's positioning was poor.
Trimble just blew a massive overlap, which ends up with reddan taking the stupid quick penalty which led to cueto intercept. The Irish backs passing has been appalling none of our players can pass on the run, earls has just had to take a murphy pass over his head having had to slow down and jump to collect it.

Wally just injured, he was playing excellently absolute disaster for Ireland, absolutely gutted, probably my favourite Irish player ever.

Just after showing the tuiliagi break, which ended with murphy tackling him, and darcy should have been diving on that ball he seemed to just back off and let tuiliagi claim it. He did something similiar last week and either he doesnt have full confidence that hes over his injuries or he doesn;t have the balls to do it and whichever it is, is equally bad.

D'Arcy has been poor for Ireland for the last 2 yeaars,it's strange because he's been very good for Leinster and you would think he could carry that form through.

We are struggling now and without some major improvement it's going to be another horrible WC experience.

We seem to be unable to convert pressure into scores at the minute,our attacking lineouts are either overthrown,crooked or taken into a maul which goes nowhere and then the ball goes to the backs.Then we either knock on,get isolated and give away a penalty or get pushed into touch.

The amount of times this summer we have lost the ball in contact is worrying,it is a basic enough skill to protect the ball when you are being tackled.

Well that was a reasonable performance and a decent result. The centres debate is over and I thought Tindall looked hugely improved and Tuilagi is a huge asset. Good to see an England side physcially dominant against Ireland after what happened in the 6 Nations.

Sheridan looked in great form. Stevens had played almost exclusively at LH for Sarries, but recently seems to have been struggling there. MJ may have to decide whether he wants a LH or a TH on the bench on that form, so we could yet see Corbs (who can play TH at a push).

I thought Wigglesworth did well, but would have liked to see Flood given 20 minutes to work with that centre partnership.

So, we set off in reasonable heart. I suspect that there is about two-thirds of a genuinely good England side there, and post-WC I expect us to kick on. In the meatime we'll have to rely on the fact we seem to cope quite well with the pressure of WC games.

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Any win in Ireland is accepted. I like it how the majority of Ire fans are quite gracious in defeat abd very realistic, but the Welsh for some reason seem to think they're a class above.

Funny how a scraped win at home against a weakend English side boosts the ego. Can't wait for the WC to knock them down a peg!

And? I could also add a, so what? You've gone totally off topic just to have a pop at welsh fans. Why didn't you just start a new thread, i'll even give you a title: Why i hate welsh fans and hope they won't go far in the world cup.

Good win for the men in white...only saw the hi-lights but it looked like ire didn't turn up until the last quater.

Having watched the game again, to be honest, I actually think that earls was decent beside the obvious massive f**k up. But the thing is, he really needs to stop being f****d around by munster, ireland and everyone. I've previously said it, and I truly believe it, no matter how well an Irish 13 plays he will always be criticised and deemed to have a poor game because he is not bod. I don't envy whoever takes over, but I think that an marshall earls partnership would work, they just have to be given a chance.

For the world cup, I would like a paddy-bod or bod-earls partnership but I doubt we will see it.

Also I take back my criticism of poc, he was unreal, fez was nearly as good, pity about the rest of the pack.

feckless rogue your absolutely spot on. most on here will shoot you down.

lets start from the top. kidney and backroom staff have to cop some serious flack. the output of our most talented ever generation of players in a green jersey is crap. has been since grand slam win. yes kidney has draughted in some new players but he is accountable for rudderless performances. we look directionless and i do not see a clear game plan. he also refuses to experiment in midfield one our serious problem areas

gaffney is a hugely overrated backs coach. we have been impotent behind the scrum both from first phase and in general since he took over. best back play i have seen from an irish side was leinster with knox and ireland with steady eddie. currently there are no dummy runners and trimble and bowe our biggest backs are not used to punch holes. we are also standing so flat. drico and darcy no longer have acceleration to play in this way.

forwards were smashed today big time. our lineout is in decline even with poc there. no longer the stegnth it was undee eos. we struggle to create dynamism and make yards in posession despite posessing good ball carriers. too many times forewards get the ball static in the ten channel and get smashed. just so predictable. look at how leinster use heaslip and sob in attack. aint that hard. wallace for munster too.

we need to find a gameplan and settle on a team quick. the ten debate is needlessly still open. midfield is not functioning but its a closed book.

and to think we gave deccie and the gang a contract extension. you couldnt make it up.

positives for wc, maybe aus and sth africa (if we get out of group) may underestimate us. well here is hoping. fair play to all going over to nz to support the lads. at least its an amazing country. i fear it will be like last world cup,amazing trip pity about rugby. lets hope injured players wre back for aus to add some ball carrying ability. even if they do i fear it is too late for kidney and the gang stumble on a game plan to use them.

if the dubs lose to donegal tomorrow im becoming a recluse

With regards to the centre partnership of Tindall and Tualaghi, i thought it would never work to be honest...But it certainly worked well today and the England team looked alot better for it.

What as happend to Ireland since the 6ns?..Who would of thought that Ireland would lose four games on the trot this august.

England barring a few injuries seems pretty much settled today and will go into the RWC with alot more confidence into the first game against Argentina.

Do Ireland have a history of going down hill fast come the world cup???

Ireland were crap in the 6N besides the England game.

Thomond wrote:Ireland were crap in the 6N besides the England game.

This. They were lucky to beat Italy. I think the win over England did them more harm than good.

tecphobe wrote:Darcy must go hes been worse than useless for 2 years now. However lets get things in to perspective if ireland had of kicked their points they could easily of won this match. There was a huge drop of in physicality from the 6 nations. Ireland need to peak for the match against Australia. The most worrying think for me was how quickly ireland lost alighnment and depth in the backs. I think ireland need to start with a wallace bod partnership in midfield as darcy offers nothing in attack and now his defense is starting to look suspect. The backrow i would imagine will be SOB Ferris and Heaslip .

The two of's in your second sentence should actually be "have". But the fact is that Ireland only missed one kick at goal. Ireland lost by 11 points, a kick is not worth 12 points. I'm not quite sure how you think that Ireland would have easily won that match. Ireland failed to score a point in the 2nd half.

dublin_dave wrote:feckless rogue your absolutely spot on. most on here will shoot you down.

lets start from the top. kidney and backroom staff have to cop some serious flack. the output of our most talented ever generation of players in a green jersey is crap. has been since grand slam win. yes kidney has draughted in some new players but he is accountable for rudderless performances. we look directionless and i do not see a clear game plan. he also refuses to experiment in midfield one our serious problem areas

gaffney is a hugely overrated backs coach. we have been impotent behind the scrum both from first phase and in general since he took over. best back play i have seen from an irish side was leinster with knox and ireland with steady eddie. currently there are no dummy runners and trimble and bowe our biggest backs are not used to punch holes. we are also standing so flat. drico and darcy no longer have acceleration to play in this way.

forwards were smashed today big time. our lineout is in decline even with poc there. no longer the stegnth it was undee eos. we struggle to create dynamism and make yards in posession despite posessing good ball carriers. too many times forewards get the ball static in the ten channel and get smashed. just so predictable. look at how leinster use heaslip and sob in attack. aint that hard. wallace for munster too.

we need to find a gameplan and settle on a team quick. the ten debate is needlessly still open. midfield is not functioning but its a closed book.

and to think we gave deccie and the gang a contract extension. you couldnt make it up.

positives for wc, maybe aus and sth africa (if we get out of group) may underestimate us. well here is hoping. fair play to all going over to nz to support the lads. at least its an amazing country. i fear it will be like last world cup,amazing trip pity about rugby. lets hope injured players wre back for aus to add some ball carrying ability. even if they do i fear it is too late for kidney and the gang stumble on a game plan to use them.

if the dubs lose to donegal tomorrow im becoming a recluse

You're underestimating step up to international level in terms of intensity and the different power levels players have if you think our forwards can make the same amount of ground as they do for leinster. I agree with the gist of what you're saying and I think it comes back to gaffney again. The attacking line is to flat so that when the ball is slowed down the take the ball static. When we are on top, like against england in march, it works as the players get quick ball so don't have to stop. Wally being injured is a massive blow because he is the best player we have at taking slow ball and still making ground and turning it into quick ball. I'm hoping that kidney is as ruthless as he was with tol and fitz, with gaffny and tells him to go eff himself during the world cup and just ignores him because it is ruining the whole gameplan. It doesn't help when reddan has a nightmare as that puts the forwards under more pressure.

On the lineout, I thought it went fairly well while flannery was on and I think we only lost one when best game on. We also managed to still one or two against a very tall english pack who were competing on every throw.

Well we turned down about 5 kickable penalties to go for lineouts or quick taps.We wouldn't do this in a 6N or WC game and who knows how it would have affected the game.

Maybe England would have upped there game and scored another couple of tries or maybe they would have stopped conceding penalties and given our attack a better chance to do something.It's all guesswork but it's still worth noting.

One thing people seem to forget when it come to kicking penalties is that after scoring one you loose territory. I've read plenty of people talking about 2-3 penalties that wouldn't have been given away in the same area if the first one had been kicked.

As O'Connell said it was the kickers choice as they didn't think they'd get it. He might be lying mind.

I'm not forgetting that,thats why I say it would have changed the game but who knows in what way.Hell he might have missed them all anyway.

Flannery is also a must start on our team. The intensisty he brings to our team is fuken immense and you saw when he went off how flat we went.

Him ,POC and ROG are the only Munster boys who have any heart

I think Best is still first choice. The scrum was more solid with Best on and i think that will sway Kidney. My own point of view is that i would be happy with either.

POC was very good as was Ferris but once Wally and Heaslip went off England knew where our threat was up front and doubled up on the aforementioned accordingly. The coaching has to come in for criticism. Gaffney looks like being the single biggest disaster for us going into this RWC. THis summer series has been a bit of a disaster in terms of momentum. It remains to be seen how it effects us in terms of match sharpness.

I thought Sexton was poor when he came on. Rather i should say if it was his call to kick so much then i thought he was poor. Whether by design or not the amount of ball he kicked away whilst we were chasing 2 scores is scandalous.

Positives for me:

POC was fantastic in a playing capacity
Murphy, Ferris, Flannery, Trimble were all pretty good
Set piece for the most part was good- scrum less so
Reddan box kicking and chase
Earls when given space he stepped well (winger trait)
Sexton showed he can kick corners very well.
ROG was pretty good just didn't have people playing well around him

Negatives for me:

Earls is not a 13 really, all good play was done when in space which you don't get at 13 generally.
Bowe, DOC, Ross were pretty poor
No creative attacking apart from Trimble break and he didn't pass on 4 v 2
Defense was much weaker than in recent months
Winning mentallity none existent
Coaching attitude and decision making
Wallace injury

Thomond wrote:Ireland were crap in the 6N besides the England game.

I'd pretty much agree with that I'm afraid, they showed little in the game against Wales and were slightly the poorer of 2 very bad teams.

Had a look at this game - have to say 2 average teams played a very low standard of rugby.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:I'm not forgetting that,thats why I say it would have changed the game but who knows in what way.Hell he might have missed them all anyway.

Sorry, it was more of a general comment. I seem to remember England quickly getting the ball after the lineout so Ireland didn't have repeat penalties they turned down in this game.

The comment about O'Connell was though. O'Gara must have said he'd was unsure he'd make them them from the touchline. I thought O'Connell's comment after the game was amusing. They lost lineouts because English players were playing them in the air. Pots, kettle and the colour black come to mind. The Munster/Ireland pair are two of the worst offenders of that and they generally get completely away with it. I remember the Northampton quarter final in the HEC and they were all over them at every lineout.

I think Rob B is a tad harsh here. You underestimate the physicality that both sides bring to the pitch and and that they will both prove difficult to beat in the RWC. But you have a valid point in the lack of attacking creative skills. Ireland were pretty poor throughout and the final 10 minutes were embarrassing as they appeared to be running the clock down when they actually needed to score. But England's defence was very good. England also showed a lack of class in attack several times with general poor passing to blame. However they did score 2 good tries.
Overall the standard was not great but not very low.

Pluses for England:
Sheridan played and survived and he made a difference. He adds to Eng's phyicality and to winning the the battle on the gainline. He may not be the best scrummager, but he does not tend to get bested by anyone. He certainly helps in dealing with the opposition hard men and Eng appeared better for his inclusion.
Haskell played alright and I thought he was a bit more dynamic than Easter at 8.
Surprisingly the centres went well which I was not that optimistic. Tindall at 12 has not worked before but this combo went better than anything else we have tried recently.
Armitage looks in good form and must be pressing for a starting place.
JW goal kicks

Concerns:
JWs poor kicking out of hand, passing and lack of a running threat
Poor passing throughout the team
Cueto's lack of pace (prior to being injured)
Number of penalties conceded

Overall a good confidence booster, but Eng need to offer a lot more skill in attack and with their tactical kicking to challenge in the RWC.

Rob B wrote:Had a look at this game - have to say 2 average teams played a very low standard of rugby.

Bit harsh, England did what they had to do in a fixture that they haven't won in for 8 years. Also, with an untried centre partnership. I agree neither team looked scintillating, but it's all about building some momentum back for the start of the RWC. We'll see what happens next month.

Probably a bit harsh but compare it with the earlier fixture AB v Wallabies - it was like watching a diff code. Massive difference in speed at least.

Rob B

Different match, different outlook & mentality.

Aus & NZ were gunning for silverware... a winner takes all match and one which has genuine RWC significance.

Eng & Ire were playing a world cup warm cup with the only incentive other than a win was tha no one/as few as possible would get injured.

The intensity of the 3N match was due to the stakes on offer.... the Ire team was near the same as the one that ripped Eng to shreds in March where the intensity matched that of yesterdays 3N match... why because it wasn't a friendly and their was nothing at stake.

Rob B wrote:Probably a bit harsh but compare it with the earlier fixture AB v Wallabies - it was like watching a diff code. Massive difference in speed at least.

I think the differance on the two games was the ref, Owens was a pedantic whistle happy one eyed tw@ who wanted to be the center of attention and ruin what could have been a better game(two irish players laying on th wrong side and not moving = penalty to ireland for england not releasing??) while GG will jump up and down on this screaming and pulling his hair in rage, Barnes had a bloody good and fair game, let BOTH teams get away with being off their feet 90% of the time in the rucks as long as the ball was presented quick and not slowed down to much, he let the game flow so it could be a quicker game and was pretty much inconspicuos(sp)

Also...

this Aus side is the same one that 12 months ago lost 2 back to back games home & away against Eng.
The players on both Aus & Eng are almost identical... Aus hasn't got that much better & Eng hasn't got that much worse...

Its just that players aren't ever going to hit every game at the same tempo.. players know wha are big games and what are lesser ones.

Did you see Aus vs. NZ earler in the tournament in NZ.... Aus were dire, no intensity no desire. Before anyone says Aus is so far & above then take a look at that match....

They are a good side and beat a full stength NZ team yes... but away from home they are less convincing and are beatable by all of the big 5 nations (3N + Eng & Fra). This is probably the first RWC since 99 where I think all members of the big 5 could take home the trophy.... there is no out & out candidate.

Can understand the different mentality yes. To be honest if W were playing AB for non silverware, they would still be trying to take each others heads off no doubt. I don't think those sides play easy on each other. England probably have a bit more time on their hands as they have a pretty easy group and path to QF. I just don't get Ireland and some approach of playing half hearted rugby if that is what is happening - not sure why 4 losses in ordinary games counts as preparation. Where is the preparation? They play USA next game and face Wallabies a week after that. Don't see what has happened to date puts them in a good light. I would have thought the best possible prep for them is put the best team on the park and play week in and week out and try and win everything to build some confidence and combinations.
I have read and written a lot about how close Ireland and Wallabies are and how their pool game will be a cracker. I have changed my mind though. If Ireland faced Wallabies last night I think Wallabies would have put 30 points on them and I think that is the difference between them now. Don't see what a game against USA is going to do to improve that situation.

Can't argue with that at the moment.

The Wallabies could absolutely smash us. I think a lot of Irish fans believe we are capable of one good performance,and if it is against OZ we would secure at least 2nd in our group. Italy could be a big threat to us. I think we would have a better chance of beating SA than OZ.

The only way that Ire stand a chance is if they put 60+points on USA and have their 'go to' men BOD & O'Brien back on full form.

A winning confidence will do wonders.

I also thought IRE had the game to possibly beat Aus.. they have a decent front 5 which did ok against a massive Eng pack.
Think its too late though.... they don't look confident and its shows how taking a couple of key players out the way makes all the difference.

I don't know if it's been mentioned already, but Cian Healy's delayed trip to NZ is possibly due to a damaged eye socket:

http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/rugby/2011/0828/1224303113810.html

Not sure what's happening with Heaslip.

Alyn - I'm not going to the world cup so me being anywhere near the pitch is irrelevant. As someone else has already mentioned, Tommy is very uncomfortable in the centre these days. His best performances are always at 14, and if it aint broke...I know he's been moved around with the Ospreys and it hasn't worked. Ireland have other, better options in the centre.

'Him ,POC and ROG are the only Munster boys who have any heart'

I think David Wallace might have something to say about that- consistently putting in great carries, tackling hard and competing at the breakdown. His storming run against Tuilagi and Fourie just before he got injured summed up his game mentality. And this is from an Englishman. Brilliant player, one of my favourites, and he will be sorely missed at the world cup.

bluestonevedder wrote:
'Him ,POC and ROG are the only Munster boys who have any heart'

I think David Wallace might have something to say about that - consistently putting in great carries, tackling hard and competing at the breakdown. His storming run against Tuilagi and Fourie just before he got injured summed up his game mentality. And this is from an Englishman. Brilliant player, one of my favourites, and he will be sorely missed at the world cup.

Totally agree

I can understand the Irish fans frustration, the team/squad just isn't really clicking at the moment, and despite the odd encouraging individual performance and plenty of talent to select from, the side just doesn't look like it's going to win games.

From 1 through to 10 I think Ireland is a very good side. Based on the warm-up games I think Cullen should probably start with POC but that the side is pretty settled now. Ferris will likely start at 6 now with SOB going to 7, Jennings on the bench. Might not please all fans, especially the Leinster brigade that think SOB at 7 doesn't give you balance, but given that the backs are woefully short on powerful carriers, I think you need SOB out there to bring some charge. I'd start Reddan and Sexton at halfback - Ireland need to play with tempo and up the intensity, and I think ROG is the better playing to come off the bench, where he can have more of a say in the closing stages if needed.

It's the midfield that the huge issue now for Ireland, and with D'Arcy and BOD having dominated this arena for so long, Ireland have completely neglected the task of ensuring a proper succession. Earls, despite what a number of Irish posters were saying to the contrary a few weeks ago, isn't cut out to play 13 at international level. He's far better out wide where his slick feet and accelaration can be just as deadly, but where his lack of poundage won't cost Ireland points. I think that of the two options at 12 in the current squad, Wallace and D'Arcy, Wallace has shaded it in the warm-ups, and should start. If Ireland can get BOD fit to play 13, and get Reddan, Sexton and Wallace play a high tempo and slick game, then they could look ok. Trimble and Bowe have to play on the wings and work extremely hard at getting into the line. They are Ireland's best ball carriers in the backs, and if the move is breaking down, you'd far rather one of those two had their hands on the ball rather than Wallace or Earls.

I think Australia will be too good I'm afraid, but Ireland should beat Italy well enough and make the QF. If the NZ conditions provide some rain and wind, then I guess Ireland will be well equipped to exploit that from 1 to 10, and either or Kearney and Murphy bring a solid act at 15. It's just a shame that an advantage line crossing machine like Downey wasn't even considered. Still, Kidney has picked Fergus McFadden instead, so he must be a better player based on something someone saw somewhere.

D'Arcy is the issue in the centres. Too long he has gotton by on reputation and his 'understanding with BOD'. Whilst he does play better with BOD, he is far from being in the form that deserves a starting position.

Murphy played well enough (showing that he also has the pace and conditioning) to retain the FB position in my eyes. Leave Bowe and Trimbal on the wings, Paddy Wallace to partner BOD in the centres with Reddan and Sexton at 9 and 10.

I know i sound like a broken record but that is where i feel the real issue lies and this is what i feel would bring the side some balance in attack.

Sheridan looked in great form. Stevens had played almost exclusively at LH for Sarries, but recently seems to have been struggling there

He didn't scrum that well at TH either. He was never a great scrummager before his ban but he seemed to have improved slightly since his return, his mobility is a benefit but against the likes of Argentina he's going to need to be better than that. Dan Cole cemented his position, a different ref may well have given him more credit for his work (not that he got it all his own way though).

I can't believe D'Arcy is still selected he really seemed out of his depth and wasn't keen to face up to the meaty English midfield. From what I saw of Leinster in the HEC he just doesn't seem an international standard player and it's strange to me he keeps hold of the jersey for province and country when the in form McFadden is around.

The lack of backline set plays is very frustrating a lot of the game the most exciting and innovative thing the backs did was a screen. We really need more.

I think what it really boils down to (in the backs) is

1) Lack of ball carrying options
2) Lack of dummy lines being run
3) Very few backs seem capable of breaking the line with ball in hand

TheGreyGhost wrote:Did Owens just give England a team warning, then blow them up for 2 more penalties and still no yellow?

I see the ghost is resorting to any small morsel he can to get a win over England. Trouble is England were the better team.

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:The lack of backline set plays is very frustrating a lot of the game the most exciting and innovative thing the backs did was a screen. We really need more.

I think what it really boils down to (in the backs) is

1) Lack of ball carrying options
2) Lack of dummy lines being run
3) Very few backs seem capable of breaking the line with ball in hand

It doesn't help when everything we are going to do is telegraphed. The try France scored against last week, Clerc picked a great line from fullback from out to in; Trimble was picking him up, but when he switched he became Sextons responsibilty. Hard to anticipate and very hard to defend. Our backs don't run intelligent lines- they are mainly far too flat to the gainline to really hit the ball at space at any kind of angle- but more important than that we are easy to anticipate. Trimble, Bowe, Earls etc. can all break the line, but not when it's obvious when they're gonna try and are well marked in advance. We're relying on crashing through half gaps to try and get a line break because there is no space being created for them to run into. We're not committing defenders and we're not surprising defences.

I have to agree D'Arcy gets an incredibly easy ride based on what he's done over his last seven test matches. The old D'Arcy magic is gone but he seems to get a free pass. Other players who play like that are savaged by the press and fans, but there seems to be a D'Arcy blindspot.

Not that I'm suggesting he should be; singling out individuals for special criticism is rarely productive in a team sport. I'm just becoming increasingly unsure if he still has that magic to ignite the men around him.