Murray will beat Nadal

Murray did struggle wee bit in the heat of New YOrk for short time but there is going to be only one winner in the bottom half semi and that is going to be the last king of Scotland.

Roddick did not turn up for the quarters for whatever reasons there might have been. Nadal has not been tested in the whole tournament so far and his game is quite one dimensional. Andy will make him run him a lot and also targetting his backhand which Roddick did not do at all. Also if Nadal's first serve % dips slightly he will always be in danger of losing it.

Muray's game has looked far more complete so far in the tournament. I did not see Nadal coming to front or using a drop shot in the entire match against Roddick. A more versatile and talented Andy to win tomorrow.

Nadal to win 6-4 6-2 6-3
i.e. comprehensively.

I am a big Murray fan but have to disagree on a few things. Andy's form has been patchy throughout the tournament with peaks and troughs in nearly all of his matches. Now against the likes of Nadal, Federer and Djokovic he can't afford to have these peaks and troughs as he'll get ripped apart. Murray's game does match up well to Nadal's but there can be no lapses and he must take the game to the Spaniard. I hope I am wrong and that Murray can raise his game like he can but got a feeling that Nadal will win in four sets.

wow wrote:Murray did struggle wee bit in the heat of New YOrk for short time but there is going to be only one winner in the bottom half semi and that is going to be the last king of Scotland.

Roddick did not turn up for the quarters for whatever reasons there might have been. Nadal has not been tested in the whole tournament so far and his game is quite one dimensional. Andy will make him run him a lot and also targetting his backhand which Roddick did not do at all. Also if Nadal's first serve % dips slightly he will always be in danger of losing it.

Muray's game has looked far more complete so far in the tournament. I did not see Nadal coming to front or using a drop shot in the entire match against Roddick. A more versatile and talented Andy to win tomorrow.

I'm sure Murray would love to be as one dimensional as Nadal, then he would have 10 majors in the bank.

Not really, winning 10 majors is due to most of the surfaces being slowed down. Nadal has killed the tennis. A losing Andy, Golubev, Hasse or Dolgopolov is more watchable than a winning Nadal

And I am sure there are about 50,000 current and ex-tennis pros who would like to have the CV that Andy has in tennis.

wow wrote:Not really, winning 10 majors is due to most of the surfaces being slowed down. Nadal has killed the tennis. A losing Andy, Golubev, Hasse or Dolgopolov is more watchable than a winning Nadal

Laughable comment. He won the French because he amazing on clay, even this season when the balls where changed. He beat Federer at Wimbledon and Australia, so Nadal is pretty decent or Federer is over rated....

It is written in plain Englsih that Nadal plays boring tennis. All he does is that he keeps returning the ball and waits for opponent to make a mistake. Tomorrow is not far and we will see the result tomorrow. Nadal's first serve has not been holding up lately as well. Golubev showed the strengths of Nadal when he broke him six times.

Nope Nadal is one of the all-time greats of the sport so why are you so gleeful at the prospect of Andy losing? Hardly disgraceful what Andy is achieving in the sport and joined another elite club today.

wow wrote:It is written in plain Englsih that Nadal plays boring tennis. All he does is that he keeps returning the ball and waits for opponent to make a mistake. Tomorrow is not far and we will see the result tomorrow. Nadal's first serve has not been holding up lately as well. Golubev showed the strengths of Nadal when he broke him six times.

Murray's hardly serving like peak Federer is he?

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:

wow wrote:It is written in plain Englsih that Nadal plays boring tennis. All he does is that he keeps returning the ball and waits for opponent to make a mistake. Tomorrow is not far and we will see the result tomorrow. Nadal's first serve has not been holding up lately as well. Golubev showed the strengths of Nadal when he broke him six times.

Murray's hardly serving like peak Federer is he?

So? You do realise that Fed is seen by many as the greatest player of all-time. Is that who you feel Andy has to be measured against for you to attempt to make him look bad? Laughable.

What is We Are Number 1 talking about??

Nadals game is boring even the population of Spain are split between him and Roger...his OWN country!

Saying that, this Nadal will comfortably beat Murray or Federer...so we're pretty much hoping for a Djokovic final to keep it interesting!

CaledonianCraig wrote:

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:

wow wrote:It is written in plain Englsih that Nadal plays boring tennis. All he does is that he keeps returning the ball and waits for opponent to make a mistake. Tomorrow is not far and we will see the result tomorrow. Nadal's first serve has not been holding up lately as well. Golubev showed the strengths of Nadal when he broke him six times.

Murray's hardly serving like peak Federer is he?

So? You do realise that Fed is seen by many as the greatest player of all-time. Is that who you feel Andy has to be measured against for you to attempt to make him look bad? Laughable.

Just because the Scots have one decent sportsperson, you think he should be lauded King? Laughable.

Ah that is what I was looking for - that anti-Scottish sentiment.



Think it was the username that gave you away.

Just because the Scots have one decent sportsperson, you think he should be lauded King? Laughable.

That's the thing here, if Murray was an Englishman he would be getting constant criticism due to his choking of 3 finals and constant verbal diarrhea (etiquette)...but because he is Scottish and they've never had a history of sportsmen then they are perfectly happy with him

CaledonianCraig wrote:Ah that is what I was looking for - that anti-Scottish sentiment.



Think it was the username that gave you away.

Exactly England are number 1, you Scots can claim Kieswetter as half Scottish if you like?

Ooooh another one taking the bait. Caught a couple of English trouts here tonight.

Anyway off to bed now and looking forward to Murray playing in yet another slam semi tomorrow. I've lost count how many that is now. Night folks.

There's nothing English about the cricket team.

Irish, south Africans even the coach is from Zimbabwe and the bowling coach is Australian.

legendkillar wrote:There's nothing English about the cricket team.

Irish, south Africans even the coach is from Zimbabwe and the bowling coach is Australian.

Graham Gooch, batting coach, English.
Cook, Bopara, Patel, Swann, Broad, Anderson, Tremlett, Bresnan all born in England.

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:

legendkillar wrote:There's nothing English about the cricket team.

Irish, south Africans even the coach is from Zimbabwe and the bowling coach is Australian.

Graham Gooch, batting coach, English.
Cook, Bopara, Patel, Swann, Broad, Anderson, Tremlett, Bresnan all born in England.

Yawn

Still need johnny foreigners to help you win

Yawn

Still need johnny foreigners to help you win

Thought this was the tennis forum? Dear oh dear for an ex mod you aint very clever...

Josiah Maiestas wrote:

Yawn

Still need johnny foreigners to help you win

Thought this was the tennis forum? Dear oh dear for an ex mod you aint very clever...

Coming from someone who goes off topic more than most

legendkillar wrote:

Josiah Maiestas wrote:

Yawn

Still need johnny foreigners to help you win

Thought this was the tennis forum? Dear oh dear for an ex mod you aint very clever...

Coming from someone who goes off topic more than most

All in the name of love

Imagine few will get to this post, due to what's been posted prior to this/these comments!! Wow, quite the emotional entanglement going on!

Nadal played extremely well today, firing off all cylinders. First thing I wondered is, is this to make sure it was as decisive as possible, so as to conserve energy? If he can do that, when he puts his mind to it, then that's a great thing.

Roddick, to be fair, wasn't up to his possible standards - even in serving, his biggest, and "must have" weapon, when playing an opponent of this caliber, on such an occasion.

I have long thought that Murray is capable of a Major singles title. He can hit any shot, from anywhere on the court, and with his various wins over both Federer and Nadal, he has shown what he can do.

Today's coverage that I watched, was commentated by one of the Jensen brothers, not sure which. He basically rated Murray as: serve - reasonable, volleys - poor, and continued to say that he feels he has over achieved.

Looking at some of the match stats, he didn't have a large amount of winners, and Jensen's comments about his always reacting, counter-punching, etc., took on some real "life."

Unlucky as he may be, to be playing with Federer, Nadal and Djokovic, it does appear that whilst he has made some small strides, in terms of his arsenal of shots, and strategies, he really hasn't made the amount of progress he needs to, in order to strengthen his position in terms of winning a Major title.

He had Isner, a large, heavy man, tired after the first two sets - and yet even then, he didn't become very aggressive when he was given the opportunity, but instead allowed the match to be taken to him, on his opponents terms. He was very lucky not to be taken to 5, and indeed, taken in 5. That extra playing may well cost him dearly tomorrow.

I just wish he'd play that controlled agressive type of tennis, that he is capable of, but until he plays that way week in, and week out in the lesser tournaments - it's going to be very hard for him to do it in clutch moments, in the last or next to last match, in a Major tournament.

I don't write him off for tomorrow, as many seem to do; nor write him in, as a finalist, as others are wont to do. I do think he's going to need to play one hell of a match, all the more so, if the Nadal of today, shows up again tomorrow, firing as he did.

Thankfully, whatever happens in each of the semis, both winners will have a full day and most of another to recover, in order to put their "best foot" forward in the title match.

I hope that if nothing else comes from the 2011 US Open, that there will never again be a "Super Saturday" of the men's semis, followed the next day, by the final.

A major tournament is too important to put the players ability to bring their best games at risk, simply for ratings and corporate profit. I hope that hundreds of thousands of people will write to the USTA and ITF, as we, the spectators and "paying Public," also have a voice and it would add to the players, if strong enough.

Last time the top 4 got to the semis at Flushing, the No 2 seed won the event - my then favourite player, Stefan Edberg; hopefully this time will be a repeat so my current favourite player holds aloft the trophy. Vamos Rafa!

yloponom68 - I was a big Edberg fan too. Great to watch and a true gent

I think Murray has this one, I think this is the best surface for him to beat Nadal in a five setter. Rafa looked good against Roddick but Roddick isn't the same kind of threat at this tournament as he has been in the past.

Look for andy to be real aggressive on his second serve and get a few breaks and take this thing. He needs to do two things go after Rafa's second and hit a high percentage of first serves himself. That is always the struggle for murray, if he gets a high percentage of first serves in he can beat anyone, if he doesn't get a high percentage of first in he can lose to anyone.

Priesty wrote:yloponom68 - I was a big Edberg fan too. Great to watch and a true gent

How can one be a fan of Edberg and Nada?

socal1976 wrote:I think Murray has this one, I think this is the best surface for him to beat Nadal in a five setter. Rafa looked good against Roddick but Roddick isn't the same kind of threat at this tournament as he has been in the past.

Look for andy to be real aggressive on his second serve and get a few breaks and take this thing. He needs to do two things go after Rafa's second and hit a high percentage of first serves himself. That is always the struggle for murray, if he gets a high percentage of first serves in he can beat anyone, if he doesn't get a high percentage of first in he can lose to anyone.

I think you may be looking at this match up through rose coloured specs...

Nadal tends to have a high 1st serve percentage so even getting a look at a second serve can be a problem. Nadals 2nd serve is also pretty good! He again (this year) has the best winning percentage on 2nd serve

http://www.atpworldtour.com/Rankings/MatchFacts.aspx

Murray tends to get a low percentage of first serves in. Of course he would do better if he could get more in but the stats show that this is unlikely. He has a weak 2nd serve. He comes in at 64 on winning percentage on 2nd serve (fom the link above). It is Nadal that will target Murrays 2nd serve and chances are he will get more opportunities to do so.

That just one aspect of the match up were Nadal has the advantage...

Why not attatch a poll to this thread?

My money would be on Murray winning the poll and Nadal winning the match...

hawkeye wrote:Why not attatch a poll to this thread?

My money would be on Murray winning the poll and Nadal winning the match...

It really would make you if Andy was to get a win.

However fingers crossed that he will.

Hawkeye, fair points, Nadal does do a good job of defending his second serve and Andy has a weaker second serve which Rafa as well can exploit. But I don't know I have a gut feeling that nadal isn't going to win, this is the slam that he is probably most susceptible at and Andy says that he favors this surface over all others. Every dog has his day and I think that Andy may have that extra edge of motivation after his recent wimbeldon defeat.

Looking at the stats in a cool, unemotional and rational way I admit I will be very surprised if your Andy gets a win. I don't need to cross my fingers.

Hawkeye, he isn't my murray, Novak is my favorite. And certainly Andy will have to up his level to win this match. I think if Andy is in the high sixties for first serve percentage he will have a great shot at it. He does get more free points off the first serve then Nadal and this can be crucial. As in most big matches maybe the most important stat is that first serve percentage.

socal1976 wrote:Hawkeye, fair points, Nadal does do a good job of defending his second serve and Andy has a weaker second serve which Rafa as well can exploit. But I don't know I have a gut feeling that nadal isn't going to win, this is the slam that he is probably most susceptible at and Andy says that he favors this surface over all others. Every dog has his day and I think that Andy may have that extra edge of motivation after his recent wimbeldon defeat.

I know Murray says he likes this slam but if you look at his stats its not one were he's done particularly well. Nadal won it last year and he may be feeling extra motivated after his recent Wimbledon defeat.

Sorry. As Nadal says Murray is a very talented player.

Murray has the shots which can hurt Nadal. And should watch this video before playing today's match.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INUnajp6e8c

Nadal was scary good against Rod, Murray would need a miracle to make an impression in today's match

hawkeye wrote:

socal1976 wrote:Hawkeye, fair points, Nadal does do a good job of defending his second serve and Andy has a weaker second serve which Rafa as well can exploit. But I don't know I have a gut feeling that nadal isn't going to win, this is the slam that he is probably most susceptible at and Andy says that he favors this surface over all others. Every dog has his day and I think that Andy may have that extra edge of motivation after his recent wimbeldon defeat.

I know Murray says he likes this slam but if you look at his stats its not one were he's done particularly well. Nadal won it last year and he may be feeling extra motivated after his recent Wimbledon defeat.

Sorry. As Nadal says Murray is a very talented player.

Well he did win the Juniors title here and reached one final here and semi-finalist this year so that isn't too shabby a record is it? We know the strengths and weaknesses of both players and the players match up pretty well. Murray's second serve is his achilles heel and these mental lapses he has during matches and those often prove fatal to his chances and his strengths are his return of serve, stamina, array of shots and tactical brain. Rafa Nadal's sheer power and returning ability is his strength along with his supreme fitness and weaknesses are pretty hard to find but Andy does have a knack of finding them from time to time. Form-wise on this tournament alone I'd opt for Nadal as where he has a trouble-free route to the semi with improving performances Andy has been more patchy with him playing a game of brinkmanship against Haase and almost throwing it away against Isner intermingled with decent showing against Lopez and workmanlike against Young. Now people will know I am a big Murray fan but form wise I'd have to go for Nadal to win in four unless Andy can raise his game and cut out these infuriating mental lapses. If he can do that I'd be much more hopeful of a Murray win and he can do it as we saw in 2008 here and 2010 in Australia.

Jeremy_Kyle wrote:Nadal was scary good against Rod, Murray would need a miracle to make an impression in today's match

He is scary good if you let him dictate. Roddick's groundshots were not better than in my local club. We had exactly the same situation in Wimbledon..Murray was dictating and held his ground until his mouvement went and then Nadal was seen as playing very well and unstoppable. It's what happens if you give Nadal enough time to muscle the ball. Not many noticed that it was a clear drop of form from Murray. And then in the final Djoko showed again that Nadal coudl be contained if you keep running with him and more so if you were dictating.

Yesterday's match is no indication of how this pm match will pan out. We know however that Nadal is pretty fit and pumped up though.

Have to agree with Tenez, Roddick and Murray play such different styles that I don't think you can draw conclusions from Nadal's victory over Nadal to his matchup with murray.

Craig makes a good point there isn't much to be enthused about Andy's form so far.

Yes socal there is no point beating around the bush - Andy's form has been sporadic. Flashes of genius intermingled with mental blocks/lapses and dips in form but always just doing enough to win. He'll need a fully charged performance tonight to win.

Tenez wrote:

Jeremy_Kyle wrote:Nadal was scary good against Rod, Murray would need a miracle to make an impression in today's match

He is scary good if you let him dictate. Roddick's groundshots were not better than in my local club. We had exactly the same situation in Wimbledon..Murray was dictating and held his ground until his mouvement went and then Nadal was seen as playing very well and unstoppable. It's what happens if you give Nadal enough time to muscle the ball. Not many noticed that it was a clear drop of form from Murray. And then in the final Djoko showed again that Nadal coudl be contained if you keep running with him and more so if you were dictating.

Yesterday's match is no indication of how this pm match will pan out. We know however that Nadal is pretty fit and pumped up though.

Honestly I am still in shock around the Roddick match yesterday, I can't make up my mind as to why he played so poorly, embarassingly poorly I have to say. It may be he was tired/ little injured or just that Nadal played exceptionally well, better than in the last few months, or both.

Today will be obviously a completely different challenge for the Spanish bull. Everithing can happen, although, should Nadal start the match like it did yeasterday, with same cunning determination, there are little chances for Murray imo

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/tennis/14863601.stm

Murray says he can beat Nadal and so will he. Roddick made Rafa exceptionally good, Nalby and Golubev did expose him to little extent. If ANdy keeps up his A game this is going to be a 4 set win for Andy.

Sorry wow but we haven't seen enough of that A game here in New York. To beat Rafael Nadal you need your A game 100% of the time and Andy has been unable to produce that in any match so far at this US Open. Of course Andy will think he can beat Rafa and so he should as he has done it before but he needs to be fully charged with absolutely no mental lapses.

Craig, I think it comes down to Andy serving big and maintaining focus, really nothing exotic or secret about the formula for success. You are a much bigger Andy fan than I am, but I got faith in your boy on this one. Nadal outside the Roddick match hasn't looked good this summer either. So maybe it is a matter of whose form is least bad going into the tailend of this gruelling year.

wow wrote:Murray has the shots which can hurt Nadal. And should watch this video before playing today's match.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INUnajp6e8c

Who is that player in the red shorts and bandages? The scoreboard says Nadal but he isn't playing like Nadal. I have to admit if Nadal plays like that player Murray will definately have a shot.

Sorry social. I was presumptuous to say "your Murray".

No problem hawkeye, just saying if I am going to claim allegiance it wouldn't be to murray. But if novak doesn't get it I want murray to. Not so much because of animosity towards the other guys but because Roger and Rafa are closer in points to Novak and if Rafa doesn't defend Novak's gap at #1 increases. You made some good points, that caused me to pause, maybe my view isn't logical based on past history or current form, I just say I am going with my gut.

The one thing us Murray fans can take confidence of is that in their hard court clashes (it is mighty close with Nadal leading 5-4 on head-to-head). My only worry/problem is these mental blocks Andy goes through in matches - they are lethal to his chances. If he stays focussed and in the zone of course he can win but just got a bad feeling about this one.

Andy was pretty good in that FO semi only downside was his inability to convert BPs. Nadal will be playing like that player in red shirt and bandana. Murray has to play similar to how he beat him in 2008.
Good luck Andy. This will mean another 1000 ranking points gone for Nadal.

social. I can understand your reasoning. As a Djokovic fan I don't think you have much to worry about whoever wins on Monday.