Top 10 Test Openers Of All Time

First topic message reminder :

Here are my 10 best test openers in test history.

Hobbs
Gavasker
Hutton
Sutcliffe
Trumper
Boycott
Sehwag
Hayden
Gooch
Morris

I don't think Smith is to far off the list but as you say not quite up there yet. If he ups his average by another 5 I think he's a valuable candidate.

There were calls for Broad to be dropped after 3 bad tests in Sri Lanka. Places are valuable for England and he should of been scoring runs against Bangladesh's mediocre attack.

madforchelsea

No myth. Cook was in poor form last summer up until his ton in the last match.

The calls for his head were like you say, premature.

Stella wrote:Are there any other current openers who could make the list, maybe once they've retired?

G Smith is a very good player but not quite top 10 standard.

Gambhir is good but again not quite up there with Gavasker and co.

Going back in time. Not too many mentions for the great Greenidge and Haynes combo.

Team by team.

England:
Cook -already discussed
Strauss - very good player, not top ten obivously.

SA:
Smith - what you said
do they even have a second opener yet?

India:
what you said about Gambhir, Sehwag already discussed.

SL:
no way Dilshan or Tharanga will ever make this type of discussion IMO

Australia:
Watson - underrated, but never top ten
Hughes - hohoho!

no one else springs to mind, sure Tamim Iqbal's exciting, but he doesn't have a brain, Gayle doesn't care enough.

Watson in 5 years time maybe? Who knows. Out of that list apart from Cook I would Watsons the most likely.

Stella wrote:madforchelsea

No myth. Cook was in poor form last summer up until his ton in the last match.

The calls for his head were like you say, premature.

I was more rebuking the myth that seems to have got into people's heads that Cook had been struggling for ages. He hadn't, he had FOUR tests in which he didn't score many, then scored a ton (third match, pretty sure, fourth was Trott and Broad and some unsavoury incidents). Liam, seem to remember he wasn't helped by a couple of poor LBW decisions (out of three innings) in the Bangladesh series...

Trescothick?

Top 20, possibly.

Liam
Watson is a good player but I would rate Taylor, Slater ad Langer above him as an opener.

If England had a better opener I don't think Cook would of played in the 1st Ashes test. Thank god he did though.

Talking about in the future Stella.

Ok, fair enough.

Needs to start scoring tons and big ones.

Watson?Really?Good average but I have always believed openers should be able to score hundreds which Watson doesnt do.

Cook,Smith and Gambhir IMO.

Gambhir's record outside the subcontinent is MILES better than that of Sehwag.So I dont see why he is being written off while Sehwag is in the Top 10?

Stella wrote:

Going back in time. Not too many mentions for the great Greenidge and Haynes combo.

Both decent openers, but not all time greats IMHO. Greenidge was the more talented of the two.
Rated for the longevity of their partnership as much as anything else.

Hoggy_Bear wrote:

Stella wrote:

Going back in time. Not too many mentions for the great Greenidge and Haynes combo.

Both decent openers, but not all time greats IMHO. Greenidge was the more talented of the two.
Rated for the longevity of their partnership as much as anything else.

Cook or Sehwag?
Before commenting plz refer to my stats.

Hoggy_Bear
Yes, a great partnership but very good players only.

btw
Up for the top 10 fast bowlers tomorrow?

Shanky

Stats can be manipulated to suit any argument.

Yes Sehwag averages less in swinging conditions, but his averages in Pakistan, SL and Australia are all pretty healthy. Not many batsmen can claim to average over 60 in SL, Lara and Tendulkar are the only other two I can think off. Same can be said of Sehwag's records in Pakistan, average of 90.

Cook's record is marginally better in Australia, but Cook has played 4 extra Tests.

Stella wrote:Hoggy_Bear
Yes, a great partnership but very good players only.

btw
Up for the top 10 fast bowlers tomorrow?

Always up for decent cricket discussion Stella

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:Shanky

Stats can be manipulated to suit any argument.

Yes Sehwag averages less in swinging conditions, but his averages in Pakistan, SL and Australia are all pretty healthy. Not many batsmen can claim to average over 60 in SL, Lara and Tendulkar are the only other two I can think off. Same can be said of Sehwag's records in Pakistan, average of 90.

Cook's record is marginally better in Australia, but Cook has played 4 extra Tests.

Less??????????

His record in swinging conditions is ATROCIOUS.Cook's record in SL,etc may not be as good as Sehwag but they are still very healthy.Cook's record outside in Asia is FAR better than Sehwag's record outside Asia.Cook adapts better.

Hoggy
Not responding to me mate?

Cook or Sehwag?Plz refer to my stats.

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:Shanky

Stats can be manipulated to suit any argument.

Yes Sehwag averages less in swinging conditions, but his averages in Pakistan, SL and Australia are all pretty healthy. Not many batsmen can claim to average over 60 in SL, Lara and Tendulkar are the only other two I can think off. Same can be said of Sehwag's records in Pakistan, average of 90.

Cook's record is marginally better in Australia, but Cook has played 4 extra Tests.

Less??????????

His record in swinging conditions is ATROCIOUS.Cook's record in SL,etc may not be as good as Sehwag but they are still very healthy.Cook's record outside in Asia is FAR better than Sehwag's record outside Asia.Cook adapts better.

Sehwag is a flashy player, therefore when the ball oves around he's likely to fall early.

Cook is a more limited player and plays within those limitations. He values his wicket more than Sehwag.

Shanks

They would make for a good partnership, wouldn't they.

shanky
Sent a reply to your PM earlier.
Sorry, never even knew you'd sent it. Never check the things.

As for Cook or Sehwag. I reckon Cook is the better all-round opener, as you suggest, but Sehwag has raised the bar in terms of openers dominating bowlers on flat tracks.
So, on flat tracks, I'd pick Sehwag. Anywhere else, Cook.

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:Shanky

Stats can be manipulated to suit any argument.

Yes Sehwag averages less in swinging conditions, but his averages in Pakistan, SL and Australia are all pretty healthy. Not many batsmen can claim to average over 60 in SL, Lara and Tendulkar are the only other two I can think off. Same can be said of Sehwag's records in Pakistan, average of 90.

Cook's record is marginally better in Australia, but Cook has played 4 extra Tests.

Less??????????

His record in swinging conditions is ATROCIOUS.Cook's record in SL,etc may not be as good as Sehwag but they are still very healthy.Cook's record outside in Asia is FAR better than Sehwag's record outside Asia.Cook adapts better.

Sehwag is a flashy player, therefore when the ball oves around he's likely to fall early.

Cook is a more limited player and plays within those limitations. He values his wicket more than Sehwag.

And thats what an opener should do shouldnt he?Thats why Cook is better IMO.

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:Shanky

Stats can be manipulated to suit any argument.

Yes Sehwag averages less in swinging conditions, but his averages in Pakistan, SL and Australia are all pretty healthy. Not many batsmen can claim to average over 60 in SL, Lara and Tendulkar are the only other two I can think off. Same can be said of Sehwag's records in Pakistan, average of 90.

Cook's record is marginally better in Australia, but Cook has played 4 extra Tests.

Less??????????

His record in swinging conditions is ATROCIOUS.Cook's record in SL,etc may not be as good as Sehwag but they are still very healthy.Cook's record outside in Asia is FAR better than Sehwag's record outside Asia.Cook adapts better.

Sehwag is a flashy player, therefore when the ball oves around he's likely to fall early.

Cook is a more limited player and plays within those limitations. He values his wicket more than Sehwag.

And thats what an opener should do shouldnt he?Thats why Cook is better IMO.

Not really, Sehwag is a middle order player who was forced into opening. He proved so good at it, that all captains since have made him open. Look where he bats in first class cricket for Delhi, 4 or 5.

I always think that the most important criteria for deciding this are how effective they are/would be as a partnership, more so than for any other wicket. Some posters have, quite reasonably, chosen openers that never batted together and obviously there is no way of knowing just how well they would have jelled. For this reason I suggest that Haynes and Greenidge are the best ever opening partnership, if maybe not the best openers

Bradman

Hobbs and Sutcliffe surely the best partnership?

bradman99.94 wrote: For this reason I suggest that Haynes and Greenidge are the best ever opening partnership, if maybe not the best openers

Hobbs and Sutcliffe are by far the best ever test opening partnership, averaging around 20 runs per opening partnership more than any other pair of openers who have scored more than 1000 runs together.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/records/283663.html

yeah if you're looking for the best opening partnership it's hard to imagine anyone doing better than Hobbs and Sutcliffe

Yep, I think you're probably both right. Although I think I’m right in saying that they had more century partnerships than any other pair but opened far more often than any other. Maybe it’s a generational thing; memories of Haynes and Greenidge putting English bowlers to the sword are about the first I have of being old enough to take an interest in cricket. Perhaps a bit of remembering the hero worship got the better of me!

Hayden and Langer's record must be up there with most.

Hobbs and Sutcliffe are the top dogs when it comes to opening partnerships though.

If you simply go by stats, here are the top ten, based on batting averages (qualification 50 tests batting as opener):

Sutcliffe
Hutton
Hobbs
Sehwag
Smith
Hayden
Gavaskar
Cook
Langer
Boycott

As I also considered the quality of bowlers, my top 10 openers are (not in any order):

Sutcliffe
Hobbs
Hutton
Gavaskar
Greenidge
Gooch
Simpson
Morris
Hunte
Anwar/Boycott

Sehwag is a flat track bully.

Among the openers listed above, the one that faced the most dangerous bowlers throughout his career was Gooch as his career coincided with the golden years of WI fast bowlers. So, he gets extra points.

Boycott avoided (if you are from Yorkshire, you disagree; if you are from Lancashire, you agree) playing Lillee and Thommo at their best. So, he loses a few points.

Stella wrote:Trescothick?

Top 20, possibly.

Liam
Watson is a good player but I would rate Taylor, Slater ad Langer above him as an opener.

if trechothick had continued to play test cricket, i think he would have finished in the top 10 possibly, but now we will never know.

cricketfan90 wrote:

Stella wrote:Trescothick?

Top 20, possibly.

Liam
Watson is a good player but I would rate Taylor, Slater ad Langer above him as an opener.

if trechothick had continued to play test cricket, i think he would have finished in the top 10 possibly, but now we will never know.

Laughable, he was average at best.

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:

cricketfan90 wrote:

Stella wrote:Trescothick?

Top 20, possibly.

Liam
Watson is a good player but I would rate Taylor, Slater ad Langer above him as an opener.

if trechothick had continued to play test cricket, i think he would have finished in the top 10 possibly, but now we will never know.

Laughable, he was average at best.

you do talk some rubbish..

have u got anything to back your quote up?

cricketfan90 wrote:

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:

cricketfan90 wrote:

Stella wrote:Trescothick?

Top 20, possibly.

Liam
Watson is a good player but I would rate Taylor, Slater ad Langer above him as an opener.

if trechothick had continued to play test cricket, i think he would have finished in the top 10 possibly, but now we will never know.

Laughable, he was average at best.

you do talk some rubbish..

have u got anything to back your quote up?

Sure pal, just for you.

Trescothick with a low 40s average, 43.79. This is heavily boosted by an average of 110 vs Bangladesh.

Trescothick scored 14 Hundreds, 3 of which where against Bangladesh. He never scored a hundred vs Australia. Poor stats in matches played in Australia, West Indies, Sri Lanka and Pakistan.

Got to admit, I don't think Trescothick would have been anywhere near the top 10 even if he hadn't retired when he did.

Hoggy_Bear wrote:Got to admit, I don't think Trescothick would have been anywhere near the top 10 even if he hadn't retired when he did.

muchas gracias

Trescothick was better than average but not quite the great player some suggested he was when he retired from tests.
Top 10?
Maybe English openers only.

Stella wrote:Trescothick was better than average but not quite the great player some suggested he was when he retired from tests.
Top 10?
Maybe English openers only.

Possibl not even then.

Hoggy_Bear wrote:

Stella wrote:Trescothick was better than average but not quite the great player some suggested he was when he retired from tests.
Top 10?
Maybe English openers only.

Possibl not even then.

Well, in with a shout

by the way im not saying he should be in the top 10, im just saying that if he had a full internationla career he might have, especially with the form he has shown for somerset since retiring from international duty

You talk about Trezza's poor average in Aus,WI,SL and Pak.
How about Sehwag's terrible average in SA,NZ and England?

do we always have to go back to sehwag!

cf this thread is abt openers.so whats the big deal discussing abt sehwag?

dont worry

im not going into all this again, im not gonna argue over this, its pointless.

Ok mate.Even I will drop it now.
We shall not respond

is it ok mate?

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:You talk about Trezza's poor average in Aus,WI,SL and Pak.
How about Sehwag's terrible average in SA,NZ and England?

Sehwag averages a mighty 52 whereas Trescothick has lowly average of 43.

Sehwag's career lasted far longer than Trescos plus Sehwag has only ever been his best in India

I think Tresco should be in the top 10 but only just

We Are Number 1!!! wrote:

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:You talk about Trezza's poor average in Aus,WI,SL and Pak.
How about Sehwag's terrible average in SA,NZ and England?

Sehwag averages a mighty 52 whereas Trescothick has lowly average of 43.

But Sehwag is a flat track bully.He just cant play the moving ball.He is hopeless against it.